OK so here's the question "what does it take to kill the 32bit platform and Microsoft's Windows Vista OS, not even a year out of its beta code"?
Answer: 4GB ram + GPU with on board memory
I take an alternative and purely speculative look at the Vista 32bit 4GB Memory limit. And why it may become the most compelling reason to upgrade to Windows 7 (Vienna) and an answer to why Microsoft allowed Vista to take 5 years of development to get to RTM
View: Is Vista x86 a Trojan Horse after-all?
Answer: 4GB ram + GPU with on board memory
I take an alternative and purely speculative look at the Vista 32bit 4GB Memory limit. And why it may become the most compelling reason to upgrade to Windows 7 (Vienna) and an answer to why Microsoft allowed Vista to take 5 years of development to get to RTM
View: Is Vista x86 a Trojan Horse after-all?
And why would Vienna be any different? It's in x86 and x64 too.
And why would Vienna be any different? It's in x86 and x64 too.
Vienna is only going to be for x64 as far as I'm aware, hence the writer missing out x64 intentionally for this article.
Hope that makes sense?
Lame article and has no real reasoning for the rant against windows7. The rant against win7 will be the fact it will lag behind multi core designs and designs like fusion. The other rant against win7 will be, that its the same old windows and thats partly due to no competition!.
Sad
And why would Vienna be any different? It's in x86 and x64 too.
Vienna is only going to be for x64 as far as I'm aware, hence the writer missing out x64 intentionally for this article.
Vienna is also available for x86. As per this neowin article
http://www.neowin.net/index.php?act=view&id=41591
Hope that makes sense?
Assuming you're talking to me, please mention in my post where I talk about XP x64.
But thumbs up still, that's what neowin is all about
That said, since I wouldnt really be upgrading components in my laptop it's probably best for the time being to sit on the 32 bit version.
It has been in development since XP was released. Google: "Blackcomb".
Vista is MS's way of raking in a few more billion $$$ in the meantime. Bill Gates thanks you all for your contributions to the Church of the BSOD.
While i agree this is the common limit for all 32bit OS you miss the point of the item -
The workaround/patch is Windows 7 and the willingness and ability of MS to get developers and manufacturers focused and serious on Vista 64bit driver support.
If MS came out today and said Vienna will be x64 only then everyone has 3 years to prepare in full knowledge that 32bit apps & drivers ant gonna kick it no more.
And while we wait for 64bit what of the computer world.
Performance doubles every 24months - so in 2 years BEFORE Vienna arrives we will have 8 cores & 8-16GB RAM & MultiTB HDD
Which leaves no option but to go Vista 64bit. What confidence does that give to us?
Would you bother to upgrade if you couldn't use it fully with your shiny top end hardware or software you brought a few weeks back - That's one reason a lot of people have jumped ship back to XP
And the big one. What should we consumers do in the mean time stick to 3GB ram and not upgrade for 3 years? or maybe go DDR3 but never go past the magic 4GB limit or risk the hit and miss nature of Vista x64 support
That just seems like a backwards step. MS need to think about what they are gonna do with Vista x64and if Vienna is going to sort out the current quagmire that is the 64bit world
no, the "workaround" for your imaginary problem is installing vista x64 ...
Why don't you try asking the thousands of happy users of Vista x64 who have successfully taken the time to do a 10 minute Google search/call their hardware manufacturers and find their drivers?
I mean hello living under a rock much.
Also I just want to note that all my equipment has x64 Vista drivers including my Bluetooth dongle, and TV Capture Card. It's seriously viable to be using x64 now. The only issue I have with it is the lack of stable video codecs that work under x64. And many peopla are already working on that right now!
i wish they had done so for vista. It's the better platform and who better than Microsoft to push people into using it
ps. using the neowin frontpage for self-promotion really isn't cool
"So clearly Vista x86 is already at its memory limits" - what % computers have 4gb plus?
"Quad SLI/Crossfire is around the block, 4 1GB cards" - how many people will have this?
"Vista not seeing more than 3.X GB is real today" - for who exactly?
"If the 4GB limit is so obvious why bother with making Vista x86 then?" - because most people don't need 4GB ram? because compatibility is important? because many pc's are not 64bit capable?
The only people who will struggle with the memory limits of x86 vista are a very small minority for whom the problem has already been answered in the shape of x64 vista.
x86 vista is for the vast majority who have a fairly standard PC which is not going to struggle with the x86 limits for many years.
"Vienna/ Windows 2010" "Its Gonna be 64bit" - Wrong, Microsoft now says it will be the final Windows version to ship in both 32-bit and 64-bit versions. PT's windows 7 faq
Anyone who needs the latest hardware is going to go with the OS that can support it. Right now that's the 64bit version of XP, Vista, etc. Sticking with x86 XP and Vista is foolish if you have more than 4gb of total memory but your average end user - MS's biggest audience - doesn't care, will never know and doesn't need all of that.
Besides, some people install Vista on 32bit hardware. That's why you need an x86 version.
The main problem here is lack of driver support from hardware manufacturers who are cranking out hardware faster than their dev teams can support it. This is creating a bottleneck in the industry, but that is a whole seperate issue.
As a result most of a 3 to 4 GB RAM stick will not be addressable at all.
The newer Intel/AMD chipsets uses higher addresses for video memory in 64-bit mode
As a result 3 to 4 GB RAM stick will become addressable.
I don't see what this has to do with Vista or Vienna or any OS for that matter.
vista is win 6
vienna is win 7.
Answer: 4GB ram + GPU with on board memory
I take an alternative and purely speculative look at the Vista 32bit 4GB Memory limit. And why it may become the most compelling reason to upgrade to Windows 7 (Vienna) and an answer to why Microsoft allowed Vista to take 5 years of development to get to RTM
is any body else offended by this?
just read it again... is this reporting??
"the most compelling reason to upgrade to Windows 7 " ?? are you some sort of retard?? how the hell do you know that windows 7 is gunna be any better
how can you be compelled to upgrade to a non existent product
"cheap shoes the most compelling reason to upgrade to rocket boots" (does that make any less sense?)
NOB try doing some proper journalism this is a joke
Bleak
If you're going to post a comment, you could at least say something more than +1
Also as others have mentioned, this problem only affects a VERY small minority of computer users anyway. I mean anyone with a requirement for 4gb of ram cannot be considered mainstream and will likely have need for the 64bit version of Vista for other reasons.
Not only does the author not have any clue about how computers work (The 4Gb limit is because of 32bit addressing, as many people have pointed out), but he pulls random "facts" out of nowhere, such as the one about where you should have 1Gb of RAM per CPU Core - where the hell did that come from? x86 CPU's don't steal ram from other CPU's, nor do they require their own chunk, they all use the same memory.
What's more, he claims that Microsoft's solution to this is to upgrade to the NEXT windows OS....uhhh...well, what about Vista x64? It's available RIGHT NOW to ALL vista owners at the measly cost of shipping, I'd say that's damn nice of Microsoft.
Seriously, I'm actually surprised that this kind of article can get on the front page, there are far better ways of bringing up issues to do with the uptake of x64 OS's.
There is nothing ****ing wrong with Vista. Deal with it.
Most people that bitch about it haven't even used it.
As for the writer of this "news story", the guy is just a moron.
There is nothing ****ing wrong with Vista. Deal with it.
Most people that bitch about it haven't even used it.
As for the writer of this "news story", the guy is just a moron.
Pip'
FYI I've been running Vista since January and am now running x64.
I have never seen a single BSOD or experienced system instability with Vista. Sure, there are minor annoyances with the OS but XP is no different.
As I said before, there is nothing wrong with Vista.
There is nothing ****ing wrong with Vista. Deal with it.
Most people that bitch about it haven't even used it.
As for the writer of this "news story", the guy is just a moron.
Pip'
Read it again because you have no clue what you're saying and the next time you want to try talking trash over the internet, remember how immature it makes you look in the first place. If you still go on to talk trash, learn how to spell.
Typical NOT Tycpical
Tried NOT tryed
Term NOT therm
I don't talk trash on the internet. I just point out the ignorance and immaturity of others.
Have A Nice Day
Pip'
Pip'
I think the most obvious thing is this; the market is moving to laptops and I doubt we'll see machines with 16 cores, 12gb of memory and a super-duper graphics cards given the space constraint, power concerns and cooling that come with it.
Like I said previously, Windows Vista provides all the frameworks for Windows 7 to be build on; don't be surprised to see slight increase in memory usage as more manage code is used, but at the same time, I doubt it'll be hitting the heights the original author said.
This was nothing more than a rant. A very pathetic rant to be honest. It also showed an abuse of his position to post a rant on something that he obviously doesn't understand and tried to hide it as an "editorial".
this is completely untrue! I'm running Vista x86 and x64 on two machines that only have 1GB of DDR 400 memory, and it runs perfectly fine. No stutters or hitches...
Once again, another untrue statement. I also have a machine with an intel Quad core 6600 with 4 GB of RAM, but while building and installing it I limited myself to 1GB for safety purposes. Guess what, the system ran just as smooth and I almost forgot about the other 3GB of RAM sitting on the side.
Are you nuts? what is your source / where are your performance graphs to support this?
Quite simple really... not everyone is capable of running x64. Take my laptop for instance... without Vista x86, I'd be stuck on XP.
Glassed Silver:mac
Ingredients: 100% Sarcasm
They should add a drop down link on the "Main" link called "Inaccurate News"
Right off the bat, he ****es up by getting his "math" wrong:
"Simple Maths: 4GB RAM - GPU RAM - System RAM/ROM = Total Ram usable by Windows Vista" (Translation: The author is clueless)
The "GPU RAM" (what the rest of us call video ram or just VRAM) is dedicated to the video card and has no bearing whatsoever on how much RAM is usable by Vista. Windows can't use VRAM to run programs, OK? Deal with it. I don't know what the hell "System RAM/ROM" means, but I assume he's talking about the memory needed up by the operating system. Way to use industry-standard terms there, buddy. NOT!
Then, he makes some blitheringly stupid remark about how the more cores you have the more RAM you need. Ummm... what are you smoking, dude? The two have nothing whatsoever to do with one another. Perhaps he's confusing L2 cache memory with RAM? Sure, it's nice to have a ton of RAM on a multi-core system, but it's definitely not a requirement.
Then, he claims that the more video RAM you have on your video card, the less usable system RAM Vista has. Again, I want to know what he was smoking when he wrote this. That one is just un-****ing-believable.
Look, Danny-boy: This kind of unprofessional journalism is just plain embarrassing. OK, so you wanna post an opinion piece on your blog that's more rant than editorial? That's your right. But don't post it to the front page news her on Neowin. You make the site look bad when you do that. I don't want to see Neowin turn into the tech-news equivalent of the Fox Noise Channel here.
Perhaps he should have submitted it to Valleywag instead, they post just about anything.
Last edited by Flint2 on 02 Aug 2007 - 18:34
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