microsoft

Microsoft to Terminate MSN Music DRM keys

James7   on 27 April 2008 - 17:22 · 41 comments & 16778 views

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Customers who have purchased music from Microsoft's now-defunct MSN Music store are now facing a decision they never anticipated making: commit to which computers (and OS) they want to authorize forever, or give up access to the music they paid for. Why? Because Microsoft has decided that it's done supporting the service and will be turning off the MSN Music license servers by the end of this summer.

MSN Entertainment and Video Services general manager Rob Bennett sent out an e-mail this afternoon to customers, advising them to make any and all authorizations or deauthorizations before August 31. "As of August 31, 2008, we will no longer be able to support the retrieval of license keys for the songs you purchased from MSN Music or the authorization of additional computers," reads the e-mail seen by Ars. "You will need to obtain a license key for each of your songs downloaded from MSN Music on any new computer, and you must do so before August 31, 2008. If you attempt to transfer your songs to additional computers after August 31, 2008, those songs will not successfully play."

View: Full Story at Ars Technica

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#1 ecotrojan on 27 Apr 2008 - 17:24
another reason why DRM is hopeless
(4 replies) #2 vetEmuZombie on 27 Apr 2008 - 17:27
Funny how this was the very issuie I brought up long, long ago when DRM was first implemented. I quote, "What happens when the company you bought the music from goes belly up?"

Guess now we know. You're screwed.
#2.1 bsquirle on 27 Apr 2008 - 17:36
(EmuZombie said @ #2)
Funny how this was the very issuie I brought up long, long ago when DRM was first implemented. I quote, "What happens when the company you bought the music from goes belly up?"

Guess now we know. You're screwed.

Yup same here, I dared to ask the question about iTunes but was hammered...
How could Apple stop supporting iTunes? Well just about the same way as MS stops supporting MSN Music now.
Time to wake up fellas, this is the very reason why I don't purchase music on-line.
#2.2 +Octol on 28 Apr 2008 - 03:41
(EmuZombie said @ #2)
Funny how this was the very issuie I brought up long, long ago when DRM was first implemented. I quote, "What happens when the company you bought the music from goes belly up?"

Guess now we know. You're screwed.

Not completely: you take your songs and burn them to a CD (a rewritable one will save you some money). You then rip them back into .MP3s or .WMAs or whatever. Your songs are now DRM free and you can delete the original DRM-infested files.

I believe this works with pretty much any DRM files.
#2.3 HalcyonX12 on 28 Apr 2008 - 04:20
MS didn't even go belly up, they just decided it's not worth it to them.
#2.4 noroom on 28 Apr 2008 - 10:19
(Octol said @ #2.2)
Not completely: you take your songs and burn them to a CD (a rewritable one will save you some money). You then rip them back into .MP3s or .WMAs or whatever.

You don't care about quality, do you?
(2 replies) #3 phiberoptik on 27 Apr 2008 - 17:31
Honestly how hard would it be for them to keep up a couple of clustered systems to just address the license verification on this stuff....
#3.1 bmaher on 27 Apr 2008 - 17:33
They should do that at the very least - or they could have paid for everybody who bought a track to re-download a drm-free version.

Not very great for those that just bought the music, knowing nothing about the DRM that controlled them, though. Way to **** on people, Microsoft.
#3.2 theyarecomingforyou on 27 Apr 2008 - 19:25
Exactly. Microsoft is not a company strapped for cash. The least they could do is keep the authorisation servers running but really they should offer DRM-free music as a replacement.
#4 +Digix on 27 Apr 2008 - 17:43
crap on your customers like soft serve ice cream going into a cone good one microsoft
(1 reply) #5 vetneufuse on 27 Apr 2008 - 18:04
This is why Activation and DRM need to die... what happens with a company goes under and their activation servers dont exist? say adobe (just saying since they use Activation) now I have a $600 copy of photoshop and can't use it if i can't activate it... all that money wasted... they claim they'd give patches to remove activation... but we know how this goes... when you go under thats the last thing you think about... as for DRM...
#5.1 kaiwai on 27 Apr 2008 - 19:36
(neufuse said @ #5)
This is why Activation and DRM need to die... what happens with a company goes under and their activation servers dont exist? say adobe (just saying since they use Activation) now I have a $600 copy of photoshop and can't use it if i can't activate it... all that money wasted... they claim they'd give patches to remove activation... but we know how this goes... when you go under thats the last thing you think about... as for DRM...


In the case of Adobe they've actually got an statement/promise to the public that if they were to stop supporting activation that they would provide an update so that you wouldn't need to activate it. Sure, it isn't legally binding but it would be a PR nightmare fro hell if they screw end users over.

Its funny with activation, it was tried with node locking on the UNIX machines such as SGI, SUN, HP and IBM - and it never work. I find it funny that they're trying it again after the UNIX old school gave up on it years ago.
(1 reply) #6 petrossa on 27 Apr 2008 - 18:26
like no one de-drms his songs the second you dl it. Always strikes me that everyone everywhere is holier then thou and wouldn't dream to crack/pirate/de-drm or whatever. First thing i do when i rent a dvd is to rip it to disk to get rid of all the annoying trailers/theft crap.
When i pay and dl an item with drm i remove drm immediately.

So it really amazes me if there's many out there that are really taken by this altowell foreseeable event.
#6.1 shockz on 27 Apr 2008 - 19:32
(petrossa said @ #6)
like no one de-drms his songs the second you dl it. Always strikes me that everyone everywhere is holier then thou and wouldn't dream to crack/pirate/de-drm or whatever. First thing i do when i rent a dvd is to rip it to disk to get rid of all the annoying trailers/theft crap.
When i pay and dl an item with drm i remove drm immediately.

So it really amazes me if there's many out there that are really taken by this altowell foreseeable event.


I doubt the average user even knows what DRM is let alone a drm remover.
#7 OblivionStalker on 27 Apr 2008 - 18:59
Why don't people order the music from retail shops? They can always copy that one for backup.
#8 hjf288 on 27 Apr 2008 - 19:00
Or you could play it and capture it then re-encode?
(3 replies) #9 chooser on 27 Apr 2008 - 19:01
Or just strip the drm with FairUse4WM or some other ripper
#9.1 Liquidfox on 27 Apr 2008 - 19:06
(chooser said @ #9)
Or just strip the drm with FairUse4WM or some other ripper


Yeah, but how many home users know how to do that?

Thankfully, people like Valve have got this in mind. They said should they ever stop supporting steam, all games that have use steam will no longer require activation or communication with their servers...
#9.2 PureLegend on 27 Apr 2008 - 19:48
(Liquidfox said @ #9.1)
Yeah, but how many home users know how to do that?

Thankfully, people like Valve have got this in mind. They said should they ever stop supporting steam, all games that have use steam will no longer require activation or communication with their servers...

No they don't.
#9.3 nX07 on 28 Apr 2008 - 02:40
(PureLegend said @ #9.2)
(Liquidfox said @ #9.1)
Yeah, but how many home users know how to do that?

Thankfully, people like Valve have got this in mind. They said should they ever stop supporting steam, all games that have use steam will no longer require activation or communication with their servers...

No they don't.


But they may in the event they close up shop.
#10 +James7 on 27 Apr 2008 - 19:24
Interestingly, an older article posted here on Neowin at http://www.neowin.net/news/main/06/11/03/m...g-down-for-zune says:

Microsoft will continue to support the DRM files purchased through the service after its closure.


The original article from MSN Music is no longer available...
(4 replies) #11 on 01 Jan 1970 - 00:00
#11.1 +aniv on 27 Apr 2008 - 21:42
If I had stuck the probe of an Oscilloscope in your rear, the spelling mistake pattern would probably follow a sine function.
#11.2 +chconline on 27 Apr 2008 - 21:59
I fail to see how your "$200" of music had to do with you using a Toshiba Gigabeat rather than a Zune, and how your "kickass computer" with an E8400, P5N-D, 8800GT has anything to do with this.
#11.3 chooser on 28 Apr 2008 - 01:27
(chconline said @ #11.2)
I fail to see how your "$200" of music had to do with you using a Toshiba Gigabeat rather than a Zune, and how your "kickass computer" with an E8400, P5N-D, 8800GT has anything to do with this.


I think he meant the zune software
#11.4 Shiranui on 28 Apr 2008 - 02:12
(SirDarkness said @ #11)
Sorr I have a little built up anger and I am sure it has spilled into my gramer. And for now I am too lazy to goto 2 dif sites to install the spell checker...


Have you ever considered actually learning how to spell and put together coherent sentence?
#12 SoupDragon on 27 Apr 2008 - 22:09
As I've said before, DRM doesn't work and can be defeated by a 3.5mm to 3.5mm audio cable.

This does not affect anyone badly.
#13 Thrawn on 27 Apr 2008 - 22:29
Humn... I'm sure they're within their contractual rights, but they should get sued on some comsumer protection basis.
(3 replies) #14 Foub on 27 Apr 2008 - 22:36
Its easy to remove these sort of "protections". After all, they never actually worked out in the first place.
#14.1 +James7 on 27 Apr 2008 - 22:44
Well, most people, as has been said, don't know how to do these things. Plus, it's not actually legal to do them. Since Microsoft originally said they would continue providing keys, and now they've gone back on their word, the least they can do here would be to 'unDRM' the files for people. I'd be angry if I'd paid that money.
#14.2 Foub on 28 Apr 2008 - 01:03
(James7 said @ #14.1)
Well, most people, as has been said, don't know how to do these things. Plus, it's not actually legal to do them. Since Microsoft originally said they would continue providing keys, and now they've gone back on their word, the least they can do here would be to 'unDRM' the files for people. I'd be angry if I'd paid that money.


I bet a lot of people are mad as well about losing money to Microsoft for something they bought.
#14.3 petrossa on 28 Apr 2008 - 06:11
It's legal everywhere but the usa to de-drm. Its legal in the greater part of europe to download ip if it's for personal use only.

I think most people who know enuf to dl songs and have the equipment to play them also know how to crack/de-drm/torrent and all. Hell, my father (77) knows about how to, my son knew when he was about 15.

(4 replies) #15 .fahim on 27 Apr 2008 - 22:53
Also the reason I don't like the idea of buying music online (as well as the fact that I like it at full CD quality i.e. lossless and not using lossy compression!.

Can you not license your tracks to a computer, burn it onto disk and re-rip without drm?
#15.1 +James7 on 27 Apr 2008 - 23:09
Yes, that is what the article goes on to say. But I don't know if it's legal. Plus, you take a rubbishy lossy file and do that, you've got an even more rubbishy lossy file on your hands.
#15.2 petrossa on 28 Apr 2008 - 06:14
it's legal everywhere but usa. I myself use Daniusoft which gives a very high quality output, i cant hear the differen ce between the orignal, but then again i am already married for some years
#15.3 InsaneNutter on 28 Apr 2008 - 07:03
Would you be bothered if that was legal or not? If I had bought anything of there I would be making sure it had no DRM on it by August 31st. You paid for it, now your been denied access to it if you ever change or re format your computer.
#15.4 madkingsoup on 28 Apr 2008 - 10:01
(InsaneNutter said @ #15.3)
Would you be bothered if that was legal or not? If I had bought anything of there I would be making sure it had no DRM on it by August 31st. You paid for it, now your been denied access to it if you ever change or re format your computer.


And that's been the whole DRM con from the start: you're actually buying a licence to play the music rather than a copy of the music itself.
#16 +njlouch on 28 Apr 2008 - 09:05
Surely part of the purchase contract includes the ability to authorise your DRM crippled music to play it as per the terms you downloaded it.

This is why I won't buy music online. The system just doesn't work long term.
#17 madkingsoup on 28 Apr 2008 - 09:56
Does this article only apply to the US store? I'm pretty sure that in the UK, it's just franchised name, run by Nokia.
#18 Havin_it on 28 Apr 2008 - 11:26
Somebody call Ralph Nader!

Seriously, I would looooove to see Ralph (or the DoJ, or any consumer champion with a lawyer or two) go after Microsoft for this. Somebody ought to be out there fighting for the rights of MSN Music's put-upon users. Y'know, both of them...

At the very least, I hope it gets enough media coverage to reach the ears of anyone considering buying anything from the Zune store.
#19 Screaming Slave on 28 Apr 2008 - 13:18
I have an iTunes Store account and actually bought a few songs. I have long since replaced them, but I understand how people would be frustrated over something like this. Granted it's Microsoft this time, but Apple and the rest of the DRM Nazis are soon to follow. Amazon's DRM-free MP3 service looks promising enough, though.
#20 +shawncm217 on 22 May 2008 - 03:15
From TechRepublic, regarding the DMCA: "There are some exemptions, such as circumventing copy protection of programs that are in an obsolete format for the purpose of archiving or preservation."

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