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You crybabies need a timeout, bad Apple!!!

Ads are usualy made for all people to understand... but you failed to get it. Sad.

Right. Because ads are used to make people who don't understand technology to believe things that aren't true.

Even if the Mac is made mostly from PC part, the OS is where the action is. If OS X -is- in fact more stable, less crash and less virus prone, that's something better than any Windows release.

I'm a Windows user, it's been a long while since I've seen my PC crash, but I do need my Anti-Virus and anti-spyware and anti-blah blah... You know the deal.

I do have a Macbook, with NO anti-whatever and never had a single problem.

So, this add got a little something true in it.

Until virus and malware writers finally decide that attacking the mac is in their best interests, then you'll be running your anti-virus, anti-spyware and anti-blah blah... You know the deal.

i suggest we all laugh this one off
http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/015047b2f...-hunters-jennie

meet Jennie

That's the thing. OS X isn't any more stable than Windows. And the only thing making it less prone to viruses is the fact that no one writes viruses for them. Simple as that.

That's a false statement! Have you ever try to run Linux on a PC?

Same here!

Except it's not a Macbook, it's a Vista PC. But everything else after "Macbook" applies.

yap, not enough potential "victims" so no one cares.

That's the thing because of what OS X Is developed off of it is in fact more stable and less virus prone. First off being that it's a closed platform reguardless of if apple uses generic PC parts they can create rock solid drivers for their systems. Meaning none of those pesky driver conflicts and issues. If microsoft did the same thing then sure they could create a more stable operating environment. As far as the actual development goes it's developed off of Unix which in general is less prone to viruses and doesn't have as many security holes as Windows does. Now sure if people really wanted to make a virus for the Mac then we would see more exploits but no where near as many as windows. Quite frankly the argument that no one has an interests in making viruses for the mac is complete BS you really think that there isnt someone out there whos been working his ass off to become known as the first actual mac virus creator?

These "viruses" you claim have been released for mac are complete FUD maybe to some extent they are a virus but no where near what PC's have. They don't self replicate send them selves to other uses self exectue and create a nucense.

You may want to look at the facts on this one... MacOS X is more stable than Windows. However there are reasons behind this. Look at the amount of hardware Apple has to support vs. Microsoft. Apple is still a closed-hardware platform. Can you really blame Windows for having an occasional crash or two when they've got no unified hardware base, and they've got every manufacturer turning out hardware thats supposed to work with Windows. Lets not even go into interoperability between these pieces of hardware...

Hey, if you want stability, look at Debian Linux.

-----

As for viruses, people are trying to write viruses for the mac. I believe that unless they can circumvent the standard method of making a system-wide change, they would require account privilege elevation to install. I would expect this is why Linux viruses are so rare.

The whole virus argument has always been "well, noone bothers making viruses for Mac because noone uses them". I believe that is no excuse now.

Apple is now a prime target because they have (so far) been apparently untouchable. Add to this the growing user-base. In the past couple of years there have been a number of attacks against Mac's, showing that the OS can still be circumvented. They normally turn up at the white-hat security conferences. Apple (fortunately) do jump on these almost instantly and you'll see the OS is patched within a couple of days of the exploit being found. Likewise there have been a couple of small viruses that have come out for mac, but from what I understand they don't really work particularly well, and are so lame that they've been deemed 'little or no threat'. I think we will see increased activity in this realm in the coming years, and with 10.6, I expect there will be new exploits with the new technology used.

I believe that the same reasons that viruses don't really exist for Mac is the same reason that they don't exist for Linux. Now there is a MASSIVE target, seeing how a large percentage of the worlds web-servers (I'd say at least 40%, but please correct me if I'm wrong), are running Linux in some shape or form.

In the days of Windows 98, I would say Apple had a case for being more stable. That's not the case anymore. MacOS X is no more stable than Windows. As with any computer, quality of hardware and drivers are paramount for the stability of the OS.

It's anecdotal evidence, but I've had less crashes on all my Windows-based computers combined (2 Vista laptops, 3 XP workstations, 1 Server 200 than I have on my one Mac mini. I can then cite friends and family who use nothing but Macs and all their stability issues. On that experience alone, I can laugh at OS X and stability being in the same sense.

I've found the opposite. I've got a iMac desktop thats on 24/7, and a Macbook Pro. I've only ever had a handful of crashes. to be honest I hardly ever have to restart the desktop. My PC on the other hand was crashing fairly regularly, but that was due to a driver issue in conjunction with Windows Vista and high RAID array throughput. now thats fixed its stable again. PC's and Mac's are getting more stable, but I would still say that the Apple closed hardware platform is more stable.

LMFAO! It's too ****ing funny to even start talking about it!

And never mind that Mac do crash and Macs do get viruses. Let's just all drink the Apple-brand kool-aid.

:sigh:

What about the newly discovered iBotnet? or the fact that the Mac was the first to be hacked, again, at the CanSecWest contest?

Those never happened in Apple land.

Shh.

And that's not even bringing up the hardware issues or design flaws that they seem to have had lately with the Macbooks.

I am so sick and tired of this. Enough with the lies and rumors. I run Vista and Windows 7 RC on all of my machines and I NEVER crash. My Win 7 RC machine doesn't even have virus protection and I don't get viruses or malware. If you're smart about what you do and where you do it then you won't get infected.

Oh yeah, and my PC's do what I tell them to do, all the time, every time. Take that Steve Jobs!

Its a lawsuit waiting to happen - they have essentially claimed a Mac doesn't crash have viruses of cause headaches.

When the statement was said the Mac should have left - they do crash, they do have viruses (although few) and they do cause headaches.

They stated that the PC crashes, not that the Mac doesn't.

The Mac did not walk off - so yes they did.

No, hotdog is right, they never made the claim Mac doesn't. You just inferred that that's what they said.

That whole ad campaign is just properly placed words and implications, it never did make much sense.

they talk about computer and PCs- which macs are, so when all computers/PCs have to leave for crashing the Mac should also as they have done in the past and continue to do so. If they said "all non mac pcs/computers" or all "windows pcs" leave if you crash - then yes like you said they would be only stating that PCs that crash have to leave (allbeit there would still be clear implication a mac does not crash but yes techncially it would be true then) However at the moment its about PCs and computers as a whole crashing.

Unless they are claiming the Mac is not a computer!?

This is the best part though. Notice how after the intro, PC asks her what she wants? Then she's faced directly at PC as she states what she wants whilst Mac stands on the sidelines watching? Then PC leaves and says "she's all yours Mac" implying although not admitting that Mac is none of those faults. Now if they had Mac say "I'm not like that", then it's no longer ambiguous.

This is why I love politics, law and marketing; it's all a play on words and how you deliver it.

Last edited by splur on 14 May 2009 - 05:02

1. Good argument
2. Only hardcore gamers or geeks or nerds want these, it's not a necessity. A good computer is something you build usually, or something good out of the box. And keep in mind that Macs are probably much more customizable than you think. But IMO, it serves no good in changing RAM, then changing the video card, then changing the motherboard, then your processor becomes incompatible and you have to change it, etc. Just buy one computer, and stick with it, or just upgrade the RAM. Or build your own.
3. Everyone is looking for cheap and functional stuff, in every single domain. You always have to make a compromise between both, Apple chose the functional way, PCs vendors chose both ways. Most Macs are not overpriced for what you get IMO. The Mac Mini maybe, but not the rest. You have to look at it as a whole though, not just processor, ram, HD and video card. There's a lot more than that that makes a computer functional.

Lastly, your bullets are good for Microsoft, not Apple. In the marketing domain, you'll never say "hey I get no virus at all, but I'm not compatible with most engineering apps!", you'll obviously skip the last part. MS will makes ads about what they do better than Apple, and Apple will do the ads for what they do better than MS.

Totally agree with you!

Yeah but you have to see it thru american mentality bigger and cheaper is better: cosco, cars, fast food, high fructose corn syrup, PCs...at the end you have to buy what you need but also what you can afford, and people posting the MS-Apple war should get real they, both are in the selling business. Regular persons should stick with PCs, geeks and gamers to build the ultimate machine with weird OS's, and the ones in between who really want to get the best of both software and hardware and have the money for it well.... a Mac (just dont rub it on the PC guys face)

by the way i love Win 7, not quite there yet but searching is on spotlight tail.

1. I have never seen a computer being compatible with any software..it's the software that is compatible with the OS. True, there is less software for OSX, but when you are hungy, you only need 30 dishes on a menu, no difference if there are 1000, as you will surely find something for your taste.
2. yeah, if you are a geek, 99% people don't care about that
3. so Fiat is better than Mercedes because it's cheaper? They both drive you from point A to point B, don't they? Have you ever driven a Mercedes? If you can't afford it, it doesn't mean it sucks

And no, I'm no fanboy, I actualy use mac (home), windows and linux (both full-time at work for development). I'm just amazed by your ignorance. Never diss things you haven't really tried.

Apple do ads based on old stereotypes that no longer apply rather than what is better than Macs, they also generalise everything. As pointed out above, they do crash, they do have viruses (although few) and they do cause headaches.

Microsoft on the other hand hit it cleanly and simply - cost. Although yes some studies show macs aren't that overpriced for what you get, most people do no need a mac at that price. A simple laptop for a few hundred dollars will suffice to go on the internet and word.... insert joke.... Its not like the paper-clip needs a $2000 laptop to help you.

I'm a windows user but in regards to B, that only really applies to the hardware. Customizing the OS is a whole other thing. Sure you can do so much but for a complete customizable experience you probably wouldn't go mac or windows.

As others have pointed out though most users probably don't care. Infact giving most users too much choice or power might even be a bad thing at times where a closed environment makes the transition from one system to another a lot more seamless due to lack of customizations.

The whole point of the laptop hunter ads is to get a computer that is just right for YOU.

The difference is, how often do you see Mercedes make adverts that rip on the 95% of the population that cant afford one?

You can't compare this with cars, the fiat and the mercedes doesn't have the same engine. You can get a pc with the exactly the same cpu, ram, hdd that a macbook got, cheap...

That is what they are saying but I wonder if Apple runs some sort of antivirus on their systems like symantec; my gut says they do.

Oh they crash. I had to wipe my buddy's hard drive once because OSX would boot for about a minute and then crash, sending a fantastic error about the partition being corrupt. Funny thing was you could boot the Windows XP partition with boot camp and it would work fine, so it was something that happened in OSX.

-Spenser

So hold on, you're trying to say a crash and a total lockup (freeze) aren't the same? The few times i've had XP crash it'd lockup first till the built in response timers kicked in and it'd finally blue screen with whatever the error that locked it up in the first place was.

I'd much rather get an error and a crash then just have the damn thing freeze without knowing what the hell the problem is.

I'd rather get neither but I do understand you're point. Chasing down a problem when the computer is randomly freezing is annoying. Just give me an error code to Google damnit!

And you wiped it instead of doing an archive and install?

Honestly, I'm no Apple fanboy, but if Apple really showed OS X's features and how easy they are to manage and recover versus Windows, that alone would sell it. They really need to focus on its strengths instead of giving airtime to Windows. Sure, it freezes and has it's own quirks, but I prefer using OS X to Windows any day. Although, I do have to say that Windows 7 is looking pretty good. I'm glad that MS borrowed ideas from the dock. They've got a good implementation that I actually use. Well, I use it because I don't have Quicksilver for Windows.

Perhaps but Windows 7 will change this entirely. People have actually got it loaded in only 512MB and the min spec of 1 GB is quite usable.

That's very subjective sir. I hear die-hard Mac fans say "no mac without 2GB of ram" all the time these days. Your point is kinda invalid. Vista works just fine.

Also .. bigger screen? Uhhh .. last time I checked there were MORE form factors in the PC world vs the mac world. You can have anything from 3,5" ~ 7" (UMPC), 7" ~ 10" (netbook), 11" ~ 13" (subnotebook), 13" ~ 16" (notebook), 16" ~ 21" (big ass notebook).

With apple it's just 13", 13", 15", 17". That's it.

I ran and used win7 beta on 768MB just fine.

In Vista not enough? Im running 2GB fine in Vista.

More Apple BS.

I thought you could never have enough RAM... >>

That would be a useless ad, gamers make up only a small fraction of computer users. Gaming is not an issue for consumers.

lol

lol, riiiiight. The gaming industry is only ginormous...

Which rock have you been living under?

An Apple one.

I don't think they really want to meet win7 at this time. It's easier to take pot shots at Vista forever.

What would a company choose, the cool guy or office types?

I would choose the cool guy...

The one most suitable for the job as only a bad employeer will base an interview only on looks

Then you are not a company.

I think it's pretty clear Apple is not trying to court the business environment. They're going square after the consumer market.

Apparently Apple decided to choose boring office look types only!!!

Your windows installation slowed slightly because you did more things and installed more things. Its only a fair comparison if you did the same on both.

Doesn't stand a chance? huh? I've got this 6yo XP install that performs the same like it did back then, if you want to install loads of apps and have them autorun at startup and then run them in the background to slowdown your initial install, that's your own fault.

I ran the win7 beta for 2 months and it worked the same, and I had around 10 or so apps installed. But I don't just let them do whatever they want and run whenever they feel like it.

As for AV, sure I have one installed, but do I scan every day? no. It's just there, at the most it autoscans my email. I know others who don't run any AV and just use a good firewall/router. If you wanna go around download god knows what from god knows where, that's also your fault.

Windows 7 works fine without antivirus.

I can tell you from my own experience that Mac OS X has not slowed down after 2 years of use with lots of programs installed, uninstalled and installed again. It genuinely keeps at speed, and with updates from Apple, has even performed faster than the first day.

You know, you can save yourself the trouble of typing long random crap by just saying your an apple fanboi and that windows suck. Because all your posts pretty much say the same thing.

But anyway, I'll feed the troll and laugh in your face saying that W7 doesn't stand a chance without proper AV. Especially if we're referring to x64 version.

Anyway, enjoy your overpriced 3-year old PC disguised as something new and innovative.

No. Ask it to people who installed the leaked copy of iWork 2009

I think this is a real problem with the opponents in both camps. These ads are not meant for anyone who uses sites like Neowin. These advertisements are meant for our parents, grandparents and computer illiterate friends who constantly nag us to fix their PCs, etc.

Which is why it is so unethical. Apple are misleading these people into believing Macs cannot gain viruses and that Macs don't crash, which is of course 100% incorrect. I'm appalled, I really am.

Albeit not as often/many

Because it doesn't pay well to virus writers to attack such a small target. Few yes, but the point still stands, it DOES have them.

Not that a Mac user would care for why.

That's an ad hominem response. The fact that the user base isn't large enough to warrant targeting is a selling point, as the end result is a lack of self-installing viruses.

I concur.

It's actually great example. Ordinary users with zero knowledge will believe it's true. But other producers including MS, so as customers who faced crashed and viruses (and there are a lot of them on MacOSX) can easily sue Apple for uncovered false.

Actually, it's genius advertising for a mediocre product. The only problem is these ads haven't advanced or changed since this started.

They make absolutely no direct claims, having two separate subjects where claims they make can't be easily separated. Not only that, the subjects are people. If they have the PC guy say "I suck", the viewer will automatically assume the ad is also saying "Macs rule" even though that isn't said. It also uses "PC" to encompass all non-Mac computers, specifically Windows which isn't even a "computer", but it never specifies this forcing the viewer to make that conclusion. "Personal Computer" is a term can include Macs as well.

And for someone who isn't tech-savvy, they'd eat this up in a second. From a business and marketing aspect, Apple pulled the right strings. But they should work a little harder on improving and lowering the price of their products rather than spending all their money on advertising.

I agree. This "negative marketing" as it's called gets tiresome fast.

Advertise your own products, don't attack the competitors.

A little off topic, but the same applies during political elections. I get seriously turned off by politicians who spend their marketing budgets attacking their competitors rather than promoting their own policies.

Exactly.

but still....it's made by Apple?

Unless you are looking for a computer that is small and portable and so has a small screen. In which case didn't they just loose that whole market?

Yep. *Hugs EeePC*

It's just a joke for firefox lol, my antivirus blocked it.

You may wish to remove that link. It takes advantage of Firefox, and when you re-load the browser, Firefox wants to revisit the pages that it last left from.

To resolve it, I needed to delete a ton of files in my Firefox profile directory.

I also tried it in a Linux VM, and it has the same results, so it's not an OS problem.

Most people don't have to eat a **** sandwich to know they won't like the taste.

That is the dumbest thing I ever heard...... *waits for a smart person to respond*

You've said all that better than I could

she didn't, how about that.

Yes they do. Obviously you are a normal user (such as Megan) who does not touch settings, install much programs, mess around with drivers, etc.

Sorry bro but u got me all wrong.Right now im workin with h**kintosh and u should know that u have to get ur hands dirty with lot of drivers if u run h**kintosh. And I do adobe and lots of other suites too but no prob so far.
And sorry for making this page heavy(cue to image)

Yeah, mind editing that out. Doubt anyone here cares much for that cludge you call a desktop. And as for running a hackintosh; great, you can follow directions. That doesn't mean your some tech-savvy pro. What do you mean you 'do adobe and lots of other suites'? Use them? In a work environment? Or downloaded them off bittorrent so you could put lense flares on your forum sig blocks.

Your sentence structure seems to indicate you believe most potential users will be abnormal?

These ads which are aimed at potential users are just that not tech suav.

Maybe you and me are both abnormal. Dont know if you actually know what abnormal means.

Hey dont spit at the moon or else it will comeback to ur own face.

If most PC users weren't like that, McAfee and Norton would be out of business.

Since I switched 4 years ago, I've yet to see any evidence of either. I still enjoy Windows, but it's easily 5x the hassle compared to OSX.

Since leaving home and having my own Windows laptops for nearly 4 years, I've never seen a virus and had very few crashes.

It all comes down to how a user uses their operating system. There are more viruses for Windows as it has been targeted more, but Macs are still prone to viruses and that is why I am so appalled.

I love Macs, I think the hardware is fantastic and the operating system has a lot of benefits, but outright lying in an advert is unethical, in my opinion.

I don't understand how people can like something which blatantly lies in this way?

As I say, their products are that good that there are ethical ways for Apple to advertise which would be just as effective.

and if you though this wasn't a threat to PC then you probably wouldn't have replied, round and round we go.

No apple is just bashing Microsoft which in turn makes them seem immature. There only bitter because they have a lower markter share and that there hardware cost so much that not everyone can buy it but you can build a mediocre pc for £300 but a mac is like £600 for like a mini.

good one! XD