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Ex-Microsoft employee: Free software will kill the company

Sam Symons   on 26 May 2009 - 22:22 · 130 comments & 14927 views

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CIO has posted an article about a man named Keith Curtis, a previous programmer for Microsoft, who has come out with the dramatic statement that free software will be the downfall of the Redmond company. Curtis, who was with Microsoft for 11 years, believes that free and open source software is technically superior to the proprietary alternative because it lets developers collaborate and innovate.

Curtis, a so-called Linux guru, apparently never actually tried the free operating system until after he left Microsoft in 2004, but he truly believes that as long as the software giant is dominant, then we will continue to live in, ""the dark ages of computing." Interesting, he also said that, "If Microsoft, 20 years ago, built Windows in an open way, Linux wouldn't exist, and millions of programmers would be improving Windows rather than competing with it."

So, how exactly will free software take down Microsoft? Curtis believes there are two ways this will happen. The first way is the belief that open source software is, as mentioned, technically superior. If everybody can contribute to software, then theoretically it will suit more needs. There are a few examples of this already in motion, apparently; the Firefox web browser, the Linux kernel which runs a wide variety of devices, including cellphones, and the point that Apple also uses a free kernel instead of a proprietary one. Secondly, Curtis thinks that the other potential threat is the fact that it's free. There are many ways that free software can be profitable to the companies that make it, but Microsoft does not rely on that, it relies on people purchasing its products.

It's unclear if, or when, Linux will take over. Curtis says that although software like Open Office does need some work, it is good enough for the vast majority of users. He said, "Even if Microsoft did embrace Linux, not only would it hurt their profit margins, they'd be forced to explain to customers why they should continue to pay for Office." If Microsoft had made Windows more openly about 20 years ago, Curtis thinks that Linux would not exist today, and programmings would be aiming at improving it as opposed to competing with it; he compares the situation to Microsoft "manning a leaky ship", and says that while Windows 7 is an improvement, it is still fundamentally flawed.

He's unclear on what Microsoft could do to stop this potential uprising of open source software. Bill Gates has been quoted to say, "It's easier for our software to compete with Linux when there's piracy than when there's not." He has an interesting outlook on things, and be sure to write back in the comments with your thoughts, too.

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(15 replies) #1 donBoomy on 26 May 2009 - 22:33
I don't even know what to say to that. Anyone?
#1.1 excalpius on 26 May 2009 - 23:03
Linux fan. EX employee. As such, his opinion is clearly biased, self-delusional, and therefore irrelevant.

Why is this on the front page?
#1.2 Foub on 27 May 2009 - 00:01
excalpius said,
Linux fan. EX employee. As such, his opinion is clearly biased, self-delusional, and therefore irrelevant.

Why is this on the front page?



Pot, kettle, black.......
#1.3 +Kirkburn on 27 May 2009 - 00:40
Foub said,
Pot, kettle, black.......

Indeed. It helps if commenters actually have an argument.
#1.4 GP007 on 27 May 2009 - 00:46
The argument would be that it's just his opinion, the same opinion that has been said by others since linux started, yet here we are in 2009, loads of people love Win7 at this point, and Office 2007 is doing great as well.

Plus there is loads of free and open projects being done on Windows every day. MS also has many things that are open for developers to use and so on.
#1.5 Lord Ba'al on 27 May 2009 - 01:10
Bill Gates has been quoted to say, "It's easier for our software to compete with Linux when there's piracy than when there's not."

Of course, without Windows being pirated so much, there would be a lot more Linux.
#1.6 Pam14160 on 27 May 2009 - 02:37
What century is all this going to take place???????
#1.7 C_Guy on 27 May 2009 - 05:15
The same one where people forget that they get what they pay for.
#1.8 jme621 on 27 May 2009 - 05:42
excalpius said,
Linux fan. EX employee. As such, his opinion is clearly biased, self-delusional, and therefore irrelevant.

Why is this on the front page?


cuz this is neowin v2, where editorials are fp and the real news is nowhere to be found.
#1.9 excalpius on 27 May 2009 - 06:59
jme621 said,
cuz this is neowin v2, where editorials are fp and the real news is nowhere to be found.


Thanks. That's all I was saying.
#1.10 Jugalator on 27 May 2009 - 09:08
excalpius said,
Linux fan. EX employee. As such, his opinion is clearly biased, self-delusional, and therefore irrelevant.

Why is this on the front page?

So because he likes the mindset of Linux, he is "self-delusional" and "irrelevant"?

How will Microsoft ever learn anything from the competition with stances like yours?
#1.11 Minimoose on 27 May 2009 - 11:05
Lord Ba'al said,
Of course, without Windows being pirated so much, there would be a lot more Linux.


People who don't want to pay for windows can download it, if they couldn't download windows, they might go for the other free (and legal) alternative.
#1.12 Amodin on 27 May 2009 - 12:29
Kirkburn said,
Indeed. It helps if commenters actually have an argument.


Truly indeed. I am a Microsoft user, and it can be nice, but I also like Linux. Do I agree with the guy? Hmm, not really. People are not educated enough in technology to know what is right, or even what is better or worse. They go for ease of use, and that is something that Microsoft has dominated for a long time. Linux at first was clearly NOT something you could simply install. Windows was easy enough for computer 'users' to install or upgrade. Am I saying Windows is better or worse? Of course not, but it sure can be easy.
#1.13 kizzaaa on 27 May 2009 - 12:34
Pam14160 said,
What century is all this going to take place???????


Haha yeah that's what I was thinking.
#1.14 Victor V. on 27 May 2009 - 15:53
Jugalator said,
excalpius said,
Linux fan. EX employee. As such, his opinion is clearly biased, self-delusional, and therefore irrelevant.

Why is this on the front page?

So because he likes the mindset of Linux, he is "self-delusional" and "irrelevant"?

How will Microsoft ever learn anything from the competition with stances like yours?

They don't need to learn, because they have a monopoly.
#1.15 toadeater on 27 May 2009 - 21:51
C_Guy said,
The same one where people forget that they get what they pay for.


How about the paid versions of Linux? How about Vista? I would not pay for Vista.
(15 replies) #2 Frank Fontaine on 26 May 2009 - 22:34
We have been promised for many years that Linux will take over, and it still isn't happening, and the reason for that is that Joe Average wants to just turn on their computer and have it work, altering software and programming are still specialist activities that most normal people just don't do.

I agree with the premise that parts of Windows should be more open however
#2.1 Marshalus on 26 May 2009 - 22:36
I think Microsoft has done a lot of open up parts of the OS over its history. While it's not 100% open source, they have (or have been forced to) open up a lot of the API and other elements to maintain a viable ecosystem.
#2.2 roblife on 27 May 2009 - 00:13
Marshalus said,
I think Microsoft has done a lot of open up parts of the OS over its history. While it's not 100% open source, they have (or have been forced to) open up a lot of the API and other elements to maintain a viable ecosystem.


See this is the whole reason our greedy and fearful civilization is on the brink of extinction all the time. And this is why no one knows how the pyramids were built. When you figure out something you try to hide it and charge an arm and a leg and get rich so you can sit on your lazy ass and do nothing more and just rake in more money. So that is why I think that this article makes perfect sense. If the code is open you keep working on improving it. But if its closed. No one can look in it and actually see how stupid some of the ideas are in there. Also no one can see how many back doors you left open. Open source soon going to over take all these bad operating systems. I used linux before its getting to be a very good operating system and with ubantu having those awesome 3d effects its only time till no one will want to by windows. I think the only thing in the present that keeps windows alive is the gamers and the fact that most games are still %100 supporter only by windows. But once linux starts taking care of that bill can buy a cemetery lot for windows. Or just have it cremated and put it in a jar on top of his table.
#2.3 Marshalus on 27 May 2009 - 00:26
Heh, gaming is by far not the only thing keeping Windows alive.
#2.4 GP007 on 27 May 2009 - 00:53
The core parts of Windows is the only thing MS won't share, but large parts of the userlevel API's are open, how else do we get loads of free software on windows?

And people have no problem with finding bugs and telling MS, so they fix them, and so on. Correct me if I'm wrong but aren't there also old bugs in *nix here and there that no one cares about fixing so they don't get fixed? Or they get fixed way later? And with all the people theoretically looking at the code how is it we still get loads if not more bugs on linux than with say Vista etc?

All you're talking about is a theory that hasn't been really holding up, the plus side is that things are free, but not really free when you get right down to it. Companies still have to pay for support.

#2.5 Frank Fontaine on 27 May 2009 - 01:12
Marshalus said,
I think Microsoft has done a lot of open up parts of the OS over its history. While it's not 100% open source, they have (or have been forced to) open up a lot of the API and other elements to maintain a viable ecosystem.


Agreed, but I still believe there is more that could be done to increase interoperability even more
#2.6 DanielZ on 27 May 2009 - 01:38
The only reason that Linux hasn't gained much market share in the consumer market is that it's too complicated. Linux ought to have "stupid moron" mode, where everything is disabled and candied over to have the ease of Windows.
#2.7 V9s on 27 May 2009 - 11:33
roblife said,
See this is the whole reason our greedy and fearful civilization is on the brink of extinction all the time. And this is why no one knows how the pyramids were built. When you figure out something you try to hide it and charge an arm and a leg and get rich so you can sit on your lazy ass and do nothing more and just rake in more money. So that is why I think that this article makes perfect sense. If the code is open you keep working on improving it. But if its closed. No one can look in it and actually see how stupid some of the ideas are in there. Also no one can see how many back doors you left open. Open source soon going to over take all these bad operating systems. I used linux before its getting to be a very good operating system and with ubantu having those awesome 3d effects its only time till no one will want to by windows. I think the only thing in the present that keeps windows alive is the gamers and the fact that most games are still %100 supporter only by windows. But once linux starts taking care of that bill can buy a cemetery lot for windows. Or just have it cremated and put it in a jar on top of his table.



And that is why you'll never understand how a business works.

Microsoft is a Company, it doesn't give a rat's ass about you trying to improve its software. Its primary concern is to earn PROFIT and MAKE SHAREHOLDERS HAPPY.
#2.8 briangw on 27 May 2009 - 12:14
Marshalus said,
Heh, gaming is by far not the only thing keeping Windows alive.


That and the business need for productivity apps.
#2.9 Nihilus on 27 May 2009 - 13:35
roblife said,
See this is the whole reason our greedy and fearful civilization is on the brink of extinction all the time. And this is why no one knows how the pyramids were built. When you figure out something you try to hide it and charge an arm and a leg and get rich so you can sit on your lazy ass and do nothing more and just rake in more money. So that is why I think that this article makes perfect sense. If the code is open you keep working on improving it. But if its closed. No one can look in it and actually see how stupid some of the ideas are in there. Also no one can see how many back doors you left open. Open source soon going to over take all these bad operating systems. I used linux before its getting to be a very good operating system and with ubantu having those awesome 3d effects its only time till no one will want to by windows. I think the only thing in the present that keeps windows alive is the gamers and the fact that most games are still %100 supporter only by windows. But once linux starts taking care of that bill can buy a cemetery lot for windows. Or just have it cremated and put it in a jar on top of his table.


Our civilization is constantly on the brink of collapse? I must have missed that.

And no one knows how the pyramids were built because they wanted to keep it secret, presumably to "get rich"? So I take it they just asked all the slaves that worked on them to keep quiet, eh? Maybe built a big fence to stop everyone within a few hundred miles from taking a peek?

You also seem to believe Microsoft has left "back doors" in the code, which strikes me as a little unlikely. Powerful as they may be, I can hardly see them risking everything so they can gain remote access to your enormous pr0n collection.

Also, you can run quite a few windows games on linux using wine. Almost anything opengl based will work fine, and most dx9 games work relatively well now. Unfortunately games are not the only thing keeping Windows alive.

Lurk moar plz.
#2.10 LaP on 27 May 2009 - 13:53
Frank Fontaine said,
We have been promised for many years that Linux will take over, and it still isn't happening, and the reason for that is that Joe Average wants to just turn on their computer and have it work, altering software and programming are still specialist activities that most normal people just don't do.

I agree with the premise that parts of Windows should be more open however


Linux is not harder to use than Windows.

The reason why it doesn't get more popular is gaming. Don't look any further. Each time someone ask me where they can get an illegal copy of Windows and i tell them if they don't want to pay they should just install Linux they tell me "But, will i be able to play [insert a casual gamer game like The Sims here] ?"

Don't live in the past. Linux used to be a pain to install and use. But current distro line Ubuntu are as easy as Windows to install and use. A girl who know **** about computers at my job installed it and use it cause she did not want to pay for Windows and doesn't play game at all.
#2.11 +curme on 27 May 2009 - 14:50
Marshalus said,
Heh, gaming is by far not the only thing keeping Windows alive.


For me personally, gaming is the only reason I will be getting Windows 7.
#2.12 Victor V. on 27 May 2009 - 15:56
Price is the reason I will be getting Windows. I can't afford to buy a mac, and I don't have the patience it takes to configure Linux to be *just* as easy to use as Windows.
#2.13 ScottKin on 27 May 2009 - 21:04
roblife said,
....If the code is open you keep working on improving it. But if its closed. No one can look in it and actually see how stupid some of the ideas are in there...


That's a rather large assumption there, @roblife. Do you, personally, think you can sift through the codebase for Windows and actually show anyone where something "stupid" is in the codebase? On the flip-side, I can fairly-well say that, based upon the number of Devs, STEs & SDETs in the Core OS division, as well as the peer review and bugbashes that such "stupid" code is either non-existent or has been deeply pruned from the codebase these days.

IMHO, this reply from @roblife is just a post from someone who likes Linux enough to drink deeply from the Kool-aid bow.

BTW - the words are "ubuntu", not "ubantu", and "supported" not "supporter". You also might want to try to add something in your posts that many people call "punctuation" - it really helps people understand what you're trying to convey to the reader. Whenever I see run-on sentences, I shake my head and sigh.
#2.14 ScottKin on 27 May 2009 - 21:09
GP007 said,
The core parts of Windows is the only thing MS won't share, but large parts of the userlevel API's are open, how else do we get loads of free software on windows?

And people have no problem with finding bugs and telling MS, so they fix them, and so on. Correct me if I'm wrong but aren't there also old bugs in *nix here and there that no one cares about fixing so they don't get fixed? Or they get fixed way later? And with all the people theoretically looking at the code how is it we still get loads if not more bugs on linux than with say Vista etc?

All you're talking about is a theory that hasn't been really holding up, the plus side is that things are free, but not really free when you get right down to it. Companies still have to pay for support.


A very estute reply! In fact, there are a few bugs in UNIX that have been there for over 30 years old that were fixed just recently - specifically, how UNIX handles null pointer exceptions. This was not a major news item because most of the population has heard of Microsoft and Windows but has no idea what Linux is; hence, a news article or report about a problem with Windows has bigger "news legs" than one about UNIX.
#2.15 ScottKin on 27 May 2009 - 21:16
V9s said,
And that is why you'll never understand how a business works.

Microsoft is a Company, it doesn't give a rat's ass about you trying to improve its software. Its primary concern is to earn PROFIT and MAKE SHAREHOLDERS HAPPY.


Do you live in a cave?! Are you isolated from the rest of the world?! Yes, Microsoft does care about it's profitability and bottom-line costs, but on the other hand it *does* care about input from it's customers and users. I take it that you've never heard about their Useability Studies, where they take random people and show them a new piece of software, examine how they use it, take their suggestions and show these reports to the developers, right? Or the thousands of Beta Testers, TAP testers and other companies that get advanced looks and usage of Microsoft products in order for Microsoft to understand what their users want, like, dislike and suggest changes to their products.

Next time, know a little bit more about what you're posting about before you make outlandish and obviously mis-informed comments - it's makes one look very foolish.
(5 replies) #3 martinDTanderson on 26 May 2009 - 22:36
If Windows had been made openly 20 years ago, Microsoft would not be one of the largest and richest companies out there.

For good or ill...
#3.1 roblife on 27 May 2009 - 00:23
So instead of giving it for cheap to nigerians so they can make up schemes to rip of people why dont he make it open source now. He made all the money on us. Now its time to give back to society. Open windows and lock the doors. The back doors. Instead of just giving your money to charity.
#3.2 rm20010 on 27 May 2009 - 00:40
Giving money to charitable organizations is a bad thing? Huh...
#3.3 +Kirkburn on 27 May 2009 - 00:42
roblife said,
So instead of giving it for cheap to nigerians so they can make up schemes to rip of people why dont he make it open source now. He made all the money on us. Now its time to give back to society. Open windows and lock the doors. The back doors. Instead of just giving your money to charity.

... what?

I can't tell if that's racist, selfish, stupid or a combination of all three. Actually, nah, I'm going with the last one.
#3.4 GP007 on 27 May 2009 - 00:54
roblife said,
So instead of giving it for cheap to nigerians so they can make up schemes to rip of people why dont he make it open source now. He made all the money on us. Now its time to give back to society. Open windows and lock the doors. The back doors. Instead of just giving your money to charity.



What is it with all this talk about backdoors? Calm down and take the tinfoil hat off.
#3.5 ScottKin on 27 May 2009 - 21:22
roblife said,
So instead of giving it for cheap to nigerians so they can make up schemes to rip of people why dont he make it open source now. He made all the money on us. Now its time to give back to society. Open windows and lock the doors. The back doors. Instead of just giving your money to charity.


I'm sorry that I have to reply to one of your comments again, @roblife - but this is even a more ignorant post than then one I just replied to.

The deal for Microsoft software went to the Nigerian GOVERNMENT, not to the citizens. Again, check your facts before you post!

How does "closing the backdoors" keep Nigerian 419 Scams from being sent? Show us!

In case you haven't heard, The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation donates hundreds of millions of dollars to fight AIDS and Malaria. Get a clue!
(6 replies) #4 dagamer34 on 26 May 2009 - 22:44
Free software will probably never go mainstream because consumers will always want to hold someone accountable for software not working. Paying a company money is supposed to be an incentive for the software you pay for to work. Besides, free software suffers from the fact that it presents people with TOO many choices, thus making none of them easy to use. And I just find that the fit and finish is never there enough to make a product worthwhile.

Don't get me wrong, software like Firefox is amazing, but I don't see companies switching to applications which businesses have usually paid for just to save a few bucks.
#4.1 Beaux on 26 May 2009 - 23:36
dagamer34 said,
Free software will probably never go mainstream because consumers will always want to hold someone accountable for software not working.

Consumers can't hold Microsoft accountable for Windows not working. Microsoft just sends you to the forums to try to get answers, or they tell you that you need to reinstall the operating system.
#4.2 roblife on 27 May 2009 - 00:27
Right on brother this guy actually thought he could hold microsoft responsible for anything? If the europian union could not and still trying. And microsoft keeps laughing at them. To microsoft we are just bugs hitting their windshield. They just get annoyed that we put a stain on it and they have to squirt windshield fluid to was us off.
#4.3 GP007 on 27 May 2009 - 00:57
So all the knowledge base and other forums run by and updated BY MS staff and programmers is pointless and doesn't help? Sorry, but are you being serious here? And how are they not accountable when they fix things that people have problems with?
#4.4 Frank Fontaine on 27 May 2009 - 01:13
Not to mention they offer payed support businesses that includes technical support reps that can be called out at a moments notice.
#4.5 wakers01 on 27 May 2009 - 15:03
Microsoft has crappy support? That's news to me. The support I recieve is usually spot on. Plus I had to use on of my companies MSDN support calls at 3 in the morning once. They had a very knowlegable tech on the phone with me in minutes (they actually had to wake one up because there wasn't one currently there who could handle my problem), and he spent the next 2 hours troubleshooting my issue to get me up and running again.

@ roblife
The EU suit is bull**** and you know it. Microsoft can't bundle IE with Windows but Apple can put Safari with its OS? Nobody is forcing consumers to use IE, they can install Firefox or Opera or Chrome or whatever browser they want (I use Firefox myself).
#4.6 Victor V. on 27 May 2009 - 15:58
Firefox is amazing? Firefox has an amazing extensibility capability, for everything else I can provide you dozens of browsers that work better and are closed source.
(2 replies) #5 darkmanx21 on 26 May 2009 - 22:46
Based on the title, Free anything will kill any company. Defeats the purpose of making money. I understand the ad-driven business model, but it can't be a viable solution all the time.
#5.1 SVG on 26 May 2009 - 23:01
darkmanx21 said,
Based on the title, Free anything will kill any company. Defeats the purpose of making money. I understand the ad-driven business model, but it can't be a viable solution all the time.


Thats exactly what I have been wondering all the time.. Free software companies cannot get as much revenue to aid professional testing of their softwares in office-like environments, etc.. Microsoft or any other profitable software company will always have an upper-hand with the trained personnel and R&D owing to the money they get in return
#5.2 GP007 on 27 May 2009 - 00:58
Someones gotta be making money to pay for those ads right? Free "everything" doesn't work.
(7 replies) #6 Bri- on 26 May 2009 - 22:48
It's really humbling to read such an open-minded opinion from someone from Microsoft. As much as I love some of Microsoft's products, I have to agree that open source software is the way of the future. Technology that anyone can contribute to and manipulate to serve individual needs will ALWAYS be superior to a closed, proprietary standards. I can't speak for anyone else, but for me, personally, I'm sick of having to eat from Microsoft's plate and dig around for alternative programs to do what I need to do, and literally pay the developers for my attention. I am in no way advocating piracy, but I would much rather use programs I know I'm free to manipulate to make life easier, and so would a lot of other people. Linux really has begun to become a much more appealing alternative, and I think it's only a matter of time before the whole world gives it the attention it needs. "Kumos" to Curtis for taking us one step closer.
#6.1 excalpius on 26 May 2009 - 23:05
Um, he's neither "open minded" nor "from Microsoft". He's an EX programming contractor and an unabashed open source advocate.
#6.2 superhuman on 27 May 2009 - 00:01
Bri- said,
Technology that anyone can contribute to and manipulate to serve individual needs will ALWAYS be superior to a closed, proprietary standards. I can't speak for anyone else, but for me, personally, I'm sick of having to eat from Microsoft's plate and dig around for alternative programs to do what I need to do, and literally pay the developers for my attention.


If technology, ideas were freely shared like you said, the world would be in chaos and there would be no incentive to innovate. Why?

1. You have to recognize that there are many f^ckup people out there with dangerous mind. Letting having access to "technology" could lead to disasters. Example: North-Korea with its nuclear toys. Hey, nuclear technology nowadays is to produce electricity, not bomb. Look... Or another example, spyware, virus, phising scam artists. All those exploit "technology" are shared and contribute, aren't they?

2. if there were no competition in creating new technology, there wouldn't be any new innovation for u to use. Take a look at Linux. How long ago was it built? Today 2009, Linux looks the same. There is nothing change fundamentally that makes computer users scream out loud except for improved GUI in an effort to spread it around the world. Nice effort, but, it is not that impressive. Instead, today, you have many different version of linux competes against each other. Companies try to make money on it through training and support or donation. Give me a break!

If everything can happen easily like you wished, it would be great. But, the fact is just like communism, it doesn't work in reality.
#6.3 +Kirkburn on 27 May 2009 - 00:44
excalpius said,
Um, he's neither "open minded" nor "from Microsoft". He's an EX programming contractor and an unabashed open source advocate.

Neither of those point dispute whether he's "open minded" or "from Microsoft".
#6.4 excalpius on 27 May 2009 - 07:03
Kirkburn said,
Neither of those point dispute whether he's "open minded" or "from Microsoft".


You just failed reading comprehension 101.

EX contract means he is not currently from Microsoft.

And being an unabashed open source advocate (in his own words!) immediately makes it clear he is no longer open minded about Windows.

Q.E.D.
#6.5 vetmarkjensen on 27 May 2009 - 11:46
excalpius said,
...
And being an unabashed open source advocate (in his own words!) immediately makes it clear he is no longer open minded about Windows.

Q.E.D.

Oh, so your premise is that he was an Open Source advocate before he even tried it for the first time?

It all makes sense now....
#6.6 +Kirkburn on 27 May 2009 - 15:43
excalpius said,
You just failed reading comprehension 101.

EX contract means he is not currently from Microsoft.

And being an unabashed open source advocate (in his own words!) immediately makes it clear he is no longer open minded about Windows.

Q.E.D.

He worked for MS for many years. He knows how MS works.

He has an opinion. He, unlike you, knows how opinions work.
#6.7 ScottKin on 27 May 2009 - 21:37
Kirkburn said,
Neither of those point dispute whether he's "open minded" or "from Microsoft".


Actually, they do dispute his "open minded"-ness or his previous relationship with Microsoft.

Since he has been an Open-Source advocate for quite some time, and not a new "convert" to F/OSS, the article paints the picture of him being a very-recent convert to F/OSS. The rendering of him being an Ex-Microsoft employee is an out-right lie - he was a CONTRACTOR to Microsoft, which does not allow anyone any benefits as a Microsoft employee. "from Microsoft" denotes that one is or was an employee of Microsoft...which he was not.
#7 BigBoy on 26 May 2009 - 22:52
Yeah... in related news: free stuff is always bad for companies that try to sell stuff.

That is deep. Sometimes I susprise myself!
(1 reply) #8 SVG on 26 May 2009 - 22:58
Microsoft making profit from their intellectual property seems alright to me.. They've released a lot of APIs over time and continue doing so.. But thats just my opinion
#8.1 GAM on 27 May 2009 - 08:46
SVG said,
Microsoft making profit from their intellectual property seems alright to me.. They've released a lot of APIs over time and continue doing so.. But thats just my opinion


That is just BS. Microsoft grabs open source software, massage it a bit to use their own underlaying APIs (like Win32), make it proprietary, and then release it as their own. That is why they are never first with anything.
(3 replies) #9 Glendi on 26 May 2009 - 22:58
lol, Now that he doesn't work there he brings this stuff.
#9.1 +Kirkburn on 27 May 2009 - 00:45
Glendi said,
lol, Now that he doesn't work there he brings this stuff.
Do you think he'd do it while still at MS? Sounds like a quick way to lose your job.
#9.2 excalpius on 27 May 2009 - 07:03
Kirkburn said,
Do you think he'd do it while still at MS? Sounds like a quick way to lose your job.


The "article" makes it clear he hasn't worked there for 5 years...
#9.3 +Kirkburn on 27 May 2009 - 15:44
excalpius said,
The "article" makes it clear he hasn't worked there for 5 years...

Well done. Not sure what that has to do with my quote, but well done.
#10 Dhalamar on 26 May 2009 - 23:20
Sure free is good but with money you can get some proper Research and Development going on.
(1 reply) #11 rakeshishere on 26 May 2009 - 23:25
"while Windows 7 is an improvement,it is still fundamentally flawed."

All s/w have their own flaws and downsides. Just use what fits your needs. I use windows because i want to get my work done asap and in a better way
#11.1 excalpius on 27 May 2009 - 07:04
Windows 7 still does about a million things better than Linux, so I think it's worth a $100 or so...ahem.
#12 mmck on 26 May 2009 - 23:29
If everybody can contribute to software, then theoretically it will suit more needs.


Everybody can contribute to software on Windows just not the core OS - to achieve what you want on Windows who really needs to be altering the OS code??? And then using the OS used to run a phone to compare against a desktop: saying "it works on phones - it will work on desktops" is crazy, and then looking at Apple they sell the OS on so that's again a non comparison.

Unless Microsoft cut funding to develop OS market share I do not see it declining anytime soon, Linux needs to massively catch up with Windows (for the everyday consumer) before it will be close to having huge impact.
#13 EdgarJ on 26 May 2009 - 23:32
Well for OS I prefer to Pay. I prefer to pay for MS Office etc. But when are for other programs, not.
#14 skynetXrules on 26 May 2009 - 23:35
of course if windows is open , we well have ton of win distro !

and the endless fun of incompatibilities
(13 replies) #15 superhuman on 26 May 2009 - 23:38
just a gutted loser, lost the mind. What kind of society would you choose?

1) All are Open source Free Software => No Money => No Job => No Food => Hungry => Die.

2) All are Paid Software => Have Money => Create Jobs => Have Food => Living => Have wife/husband+kids => Get old => Die

#15.1 roblife on 27 May 2009 - 00:31
All your arrows point to die so whats your point?
#15.2 +Kirkburn on 27 May 2009 - 00:56
superhuman said,
just a gutted loser, lost the mind. What kind of society would you choose?

1) All are Open source Free Software => No Money => No Job => No Food => Hungry => Die.

2) All are Paid Software => Have Money => Create Jobs => Have Food => Living => Have wife/husband+kids => Get old => Die

Open source does not = no money.
#15.3 GP007 on 27 May 2009 - 01:01
You first get old before you die instead of dying quick and young? You really missed the point?
#15.4 superhuman on 27 May 2009 - 06:55
Kirkburn said,
Open source does not = no money.


Open source itself = no sale = no money

What you can earn from open source is desperate money for providing support and perhaps begging for donation. This does not make any sense in economic stand point. In a cash economy, following open source just limit yourself and waste your life while other people is making money. Open source is only good for educational purpose, a play ground to practice and improve your skills.

Or to say the other way, open source is only good for the user because they use it "free" (actually not really free since they spend time to download and pay for the internet fee). Open source is not good for a developer. It is just like communism. Saying is great, but in reality it is not. Open source is like an all-you-can-eat buffet without charge. They just eat, they don't cook or contribute. Eventually, the chef or the owner will do either thing like:

1. Cook the same thing, no creation, reduce quantity & quality

Or

2. Run out of money and close the restaurant

Or

3. Just simply give up. Get a life.

Last edited by superhuman on 27 May 2009 - 07:11
#15.5 ichi on 27 May 2009 - 10:07
superhuman said,
Open source is not good for a developer.


Open Source allows fast development of ad hoc applications (certainly faster than reinventing the wheel all over again), which are paid for.
It works both for companies doing development for third parties, and in house devs.

So Open Source can be good for developers, as they get paid for their job.
That doesn't mean though that Open Source is the be-all and end-all of software development in absolutely every situation.
#15.6 tiagosilva29 on 27 May 2009 - 11:26
#15.7 superhuman on 27 May 2009 - 12:04
ichi said,
Open Source allows fast development of ad hoc applications (certainly faster than reinventing the wheel all over again), which are paid for.
It works both for companies doing development for third parties, and in house devs.

So Open Source can be good for developers, as they get paid for their job.
That doesn't mean though that Open Source is the be-all and end-all of software development in absolutely every situation.


In this case, companies and developers, who use existing open source code to modify and develop for their own use, are in the "user" category. The original developer of the opensource code mentioned above receive nothing in return. As I have said, OSS is only good for user, not the original developer after all. Then, the cycle move on. The lose of one is the gain of another.
#15.8 ichi on 27 May 2009 - 13:36
superhuman said,
In this case, companies and developers, who use existing open source code to modify and develop for their own use, are in the "user" category. The original developer of the opensource code mentioned above receive nothing in return. As I have said, OSS is only good for user, not the original developer after all. Then, the cycle move on. The lose of one is the gain of another.


You seem to assume that all FOSS projects begin in someone's basement.
Code worth using can come from someone coding in his free time, or from a paid developer at some corporation like say, IBM (which isn't contributing code for the sake of it, they are getting a return on their investment).

Devs doing in house development could fall in the "user" category, but companies getting contracts for ad hoc projects do not.
#15.9 Nihilus on 27 May 2009 - 13:48
roblife said,
All your arrows point to die so whats your point?


I think we'd all like an arrow that doesn't, negligible senescence seems a little ambitious though. Even for an open source project.
#15.10 smooth_criminal1990 on 27 May 2009 - 14:15
open source != no money as it happens, its not disallowed to charge money for your open source software (see Red Hat/SuSE Linux enterprise among others)
#15.11 +Kirkburn on 27 May 2009 - 15:46
superhuman said,
Open source itself = no sale = no money

So, taking the obvious example:

Firefox. No money? Uh, no. They have revenue.
#15.12 superhuman on 27 May 2009 - 18:22
Kirkburn said,
So, taking the obvious example:

Firefox. No money? Uh, no. They have revenue.


Like I've said, the only way they get money by begging for donation/contribution or charge money for support. These are just marginal. Like a person living on a cup of water or cocacola, not steak or lobster. The main product itself doesnot bring in revenue.
#15.13 Nihilus on 27 May 2009 - 23:10
superhuman said,
Like I've said, the only way they get money by begging for donation/contribution or charge money for support. These are just marginal. Like a person living on a cup of water or cocacola, not steak or lobster. The main product itself doesnot bring in revenue.


You must admit, $75 million is quite a lot of cocoa.

http://arstechnica.com/open-source/news/20...-12-percent.ars
(1 reply) #16 Patchou on 26 May 2009 - 23:46
Technically superior? come on... I agree the open-source model does work for some programs, but certainely not a majority. Guess what, developers are humans and humans need to eat, buy clothes and have somewhere to sleep in.

As for the "many ways" a software can be profitable when distributed free, if that was that easy, don't you think a lot more companies would use that model? A lot of developers create free software to get experience and add things on their resume in order to find a job. If the software world was a free world, do you really think all those developers would keep on doing this? There's no magic, you don't make money out of nothing and until we live in a Star Trek world, we'll need things like money to have a life and we'll need companies like Microsoft to create the software most of us use every day.

Last edited by Patchou on 26 May 2009 - 23:53
#16.1 excalpius on 27 May 2009 - 07:05
+100 (bonus points for actually being a software developer)
#17 Delmont on 26 May 2009 - 23:59
I don't know why this guy gets any press besides maybe off of slashdot and nowhere else. This guy is a joke.
#18 NXTwoThou on 27 May 2009 - 00:01
The first thing that made me discount everything the guy was saying is that he started off by indicating he's a programmer.

For someone to even go into the field, they should have an indepth feel for how computers work. When there is a problem, they can work around it, or figure out how someone wrote what they are working with and work within those confines.

When we get a computer, we go for the power machines. We rarely even bother looking at what's on sale at Best Buy.

Because of those two things, A) we're out of touch of what 95% of computer users experience when they use the software we create("Works fine on my machine!", and B) think somethings pretty cool when joe user thinks something is cumbersome and ugly("You must have clicked the wrong thing!" "You can do that if you go down to preferences, advanced, TentPole.Mudflap.CornHit.Enable and set to 0".

These are _not_ the people you should trust to predict the future. These are _not_ the people that should and try sell joe user anything. Argh!
(14 replies) #19 +bob21 on 27 May 2009 - 00:07





Can anyone spot a pattern emerging ? Simple problem with the question posed by the article. If the open source development process is so vastly Superior to the proprietary one if it can turn water into wine as its proponents claim , Why does open source software Always mean inferior software ?

Why is Photoshop so vastly superior to GIMP, Why does Premier smash virtualdub into a million pieces, Why is Office 2010 in a completely different class than Open Office . Why is it that proprietary software dominates virtually every FOSS alternative there is ?

I know the penguin heads are going to rush in and yell firefox as loud as they can and I'll admit that's the exception simply because it's impossible to charge for and hence pay for the development of a superior propriety browser.

FOSS has its place just like freeware but its no threat to proprietary software .

Last edited by bob21 on 27 May 2009 - 00:20
#19.1 +Smigit on 27 May 2009 - 00:30
Thats the problem IMHO. People love to throw the words "Firefox" and "Linux" out there, but for the most part those are applications that are in the minority. Being open source and allowing for people to view the code is one thing, actually getting people to volunteer their time to the project is another. A great deal of open source apps wouldnt have the infrastructure to handle large volumes of feedback even if they were to get it.

Honestly, proprietry and open source can co-exist just fine.
#19.2 GP007 on 27 May 2009 - 01:05
Lets not forget people, firefox gets money. The mozila org gets donations and support money from companies and or people. THEY DON'T CODE FIREFOX FOR FREE! Just cuz they give it out for free is a different story.

Cut the money flow to mozila and firefox is going to dry up quick and go nowhere.
#19.3 Frank Fontaine on 27 May 2009 - 01:17
Doesn't always work like that. MySQL is a fantastic product and it is totally free, IMO its just as good as MS SQL Server
#19.4 some_guy on 27 May 2009 - 01:30
i totally agree with you bob. open source has its innovations... but most of the time they are not as significant as the innovations that come out from proprietary software.

in addition, i think the problem with many open source programs is that they try to mimic closed source programs. theres no innovation there... and really, most of the time i attempt to use the open source alternatives, it really comes across to me as sub-par.

firefox... i don't see it as a huge innovation as what people portray it to be. sure it has its extensions... but thats about it. firefox to me was a success due to microsoft's pitfalls with internet explorer. if IE was good from the start, i dont think firefox would have ever existed.
#19.5 S3P€hR on 27 May 2009 - 09:13
Frank Fontaine said,
Doesn't always work like that. MySQL is a fantastic product and it is totally free, IMO its just as good as MS SQL Server


First of all, MySQL is not free at all as in enterprise version you have to pay $599 to $4,999 per server per year to get product support. secondly, MS SQL in account of stability and scalability is not even comparable with MySQL. Everybody knows that MySQL, well free version which is in your mind is just good enough for starters. it doesn't even come with a simple management studio and propper tools. on the other hand Free version of MS SQL which is just for developers has a decent Management studio.
#19.6 ichi on 27 May 2009 - 10:11
S3P�hR said,
MySQL is not free at all as in enterprise version you have to pay $599 to $4,999 per server per year to get product support.


And there you are, confusing Free (FOSS) with free (no cost).
#19.7 GP007 on 27 May 2009 - 12:15
ichi said,
And there you are, confusing Free (FOSS) with free (no cost).


And where exactly is the difference? The whole point of Free (FOSS) is that it "costs" nothing for you to use, and it gets worked on for free.

Yet in many cases, the well known FOSS projects out there do get money in some form from donations and or support from other IT companies. IBM for one, google tosses out some money as well, and so on.

The debate is all about cost and nothing more.
#19.8 Magallanes on 27 May 2009 - 13:36
S3P�hR said,
First of all, MySQL is not free at all as in enterprise version you have to pay $599 to $4,999 per server per year to get product support. secondly, MS SQL in account of stability and scalability is not even comparable with MySQL. Everybody knows that MySQL, well free version which is in your mind is just good enough for starters. it doesn't even come with a simple management studio and propper tools. on the other hand Free version of MS SQL which is just for developers has a decent Management studio.


Currently i am moving a project from sqlserver (express) to mysql because the so called "stability" is just a myth. I have around 30 system running with sqlserver (patched) and around 3 or 4 are become corrupt (more that 10%), instead i am not having trouble with mysql.

And the second point is the new "management studio" is annoying, is way inferior and less functional than the old "query analyzer"
#19.9 smooth_criminal1990 on 27 May 2009 - 14:18
GP007 said,
And where exactly is the difference? The whole point of Free (FOSS) is that it "costs" nothing for you to use, and it gets worked on for free.

Yet in many cases, the well known FOSS projects out there do get money in some form from donations and or support from other IT companies. IBM for one, google tosses out some money as well, and so on.

The debate is all about cost and nothing more.


Free as in FOSS means it is open source and (probably) obtainable at no cost, where as free as in freeware means its closed source and distributed at no cost.
#19.10 shhac on 27 May 2009 - 14:36
I see what you did there!
VirtualDub hasn't been active since what, 2004? you're not comparing it to an equivalent 2004 distribution of premier. Sorry was thinking of VirtualDubMod.
What version of GIMP is that?
Why're you comparing PowerPoint to Writer?

I know that proprietary software tends to be better, but in my opinion this is because it's normally the developers only job.
At the same time, you'll also find that open software tends to support more formats and newer standards of those formats (outside of static image manipulation anyway).

But next time, please make better comparisons.
#19.11 ichi on 27 May 2009 - 15:34
GP007 said,
And where exactly is the difference? The whole point of Free (FOSS) is that it "costs" nothing for you to use, and it gets worked on for free.


No, the point of FOSS is being able to modify and redistribute the code.
When we get contracts to develop custom applications or customize existing apps you can bet it costs them money.
#19.12 GreyWolfSC on 27 May 2009 - 16:11
Magallanes said,
Currently i am moving a project from sqlserver (express) to mysql because the so called "stability" is just a myth. I have around 30 system running with sqlserver (patched) and around 3 or 4 are become corrupt (more that 10%), instead i am not having trouble with mysql.

And the second point is the new "management studio" is annoying, is way inferior and less functional than the old "query analyzer"


Run it unpatched then complain. You're not using it as intended, designed, or licensed. I created an entire textile inventory and control system with thousands of users using SQL Server and it worked fine.
#19.13 Sewje on 27 May 2009 - 17:17
Virtualdub is a Windows application made for a very specfic task... I thought it was available for Linux till I moved to Linux and realised it was made for Windows only.
As for GIMP, I have switched over to it from Photoshop, theres was nothing I could do in Photoshop I couldn't do on GIMP. Not saying GIMP is better yet but it has everything I needed to get the job done!, it doesn't have to be better.

Linux is only trying to bring computing available to everyone, thats not to say software that runs on the OS MUST be free!

Last edited by Sewje on 27 May 2009 - 17:26
#19.14 S3P€hR on 27 May 2009 - 20:44
Magallanes said,
Currently i am moving a project from sqlserver (express) to mysql because the so called "stability" is just a myth. I have around 30 system running with sqlserver (patched) and around 3 or 4 are become corrupt (more that 10%), instead i am not having trouble with mysql.

And the second point is the new "management studio" is annoying, is way inferior and less functional than the old "query analyzer"



I am not here to argue comparing MS Sql and mysql. The point is nobody code or support for free. software and DBMS should have price in order to have a decent efficiency as well as support. regular update and support? nop, even query tool is a third party which you will never know about possible security flaws or deficiencies. of course if you pay for better 3rd party management tools such as automated backup features or whatever at your scope, you will have less corrupt. about the management studio, with all respect I completely disagree with you . as a programmer I think its a superior and more functional than any other old tools for MS SQL. may be you comparing its express edition with full version I think and yes full version have more functions than that in express ...
#20 Shiranui on 27 May 2009 - 00:26
He's just bitter after they fired his ass.
#21 GreyWolfSC on 27 May 2009 - 00:26
I'm not holding my breath.

Microsoft has created Web sites where developers can use free code and collaborate, and the latest is called CodePlex. While it shows that Microsoft understands the benefits of free software, this site mostly contains tiny add-ons to proprietary Microsoft products.


This statement tells me he has no idea what he's on about.
#22 Max1978 on 27 May 2009 - 00:30
It's just like communism - if only there is no property, and the means of production belong to everyone (meaning, no one in particular), everybody will "contribute" for the common good.

I think it run counter to the trend that to produce high quality products, very deep labor specialization is needed, which is possible to achive only through equity ownership. For instance, companies like MS and Apple spend tons of money on usability studies, creating high-specialized professions that deal with these issues alone. The same can be said about vertical and horizontal integration. You just can't achieve the same depth when you move to the OSS model - since there is no direct monetary or equity compensation, the OSS only attracts a few "superstar" developers, but nothing more. All the "boring" stuff that makes up the other 90% of what makes a product valuable to the customers is simply not there.
#23 TC17 on 27 May 2009 - 01:51
They have been saying this for many years now. It will never happen until Linux has the ability to run all windows software. Especially when it comes to games.
#24 ChrisJ1968 on 27 May 2009 - 02:18
This is just news because a former MS employee opens their mouth. what?, to scare MS?
#25 VIVIsectVI on 27 May 2009 - 02:18
Linux is the Chicago Cubs of the computing world. Every year is "the year of Linux on the desktop", and every year, it catches up a bit to a Windows version from the decade before.

Irony is, I'm posting this, from a Dell Studio 1737 laptop, running Ubuntu 9.04...and trying to figure out why it won't wake from suspend...like the oh-so-horrible Vista does easily. Linux is a nice toy, but thinking that Microsoft has anything to worry about, other than in the server arena, is laughable at best. Says a lot when you can't even give away a product for free.
(2 replies) #26 Alley Cat on 27 May 2009 - 03:00
Curtis thinks that Linux would not exist today, and programmings would be aiming at improving it as opposed to competing with it; he compares the situation to Microsoft "manning a leaky ship", and says that while Windows 7 is an improvement, it is still fundamentally flawed.


minWIN is not enough for a fix for Windows 7, going onwards. It is a bloated piece of crap, like installing a 50cc engine in an 18 wheeler.

VIVIsectVI
Irony is, I'm posting this, from a Dell Studio 1737 laptop, running Ubuntu 9.04...and trying to figure out why it won't wake from suspend...like the oh-so-horrible Vista does easily.

I have never had an OS that can wake up from suspend. Windows 98, XP. Ubuntu no one can wake up, so I have to pull the power cord.
#26.1 smooth_criminal1990 on 27 May 2009 - 14:27
Alley Cat said,
minWIN is not enough for a fix for Windows 7, going onwards. It is a bloated piece of crap, like installing a 50cc engine in an 18 wheeler.


Irony of THAT is Windows 7 can even run well on netbooks with like 1.3GHz processors and 512MB of ram...oh well, guess theres no pleasing some people.
#26.2 +Kirkburn on 27 May 2009 - 15:51
Alley Cat said,
minWIN is not enough for a fix for Windows 7, going onwards. It is a bloated piece of crap, like installing a 50cc engine in an 18 wheeler.

So you don't know what MinWin (or a meaningful analogy) is, then.

Alley Cat said,
I have never had an OS that can wake up from suspend. Windows 98, XP. Ubuntu no one can wake up, so I have to pull the power cord.

So you don't know what a power button is, then.
#27 C_Guy on 27 May 2009 - 05:12
Curtis, a so-called Linux guru, apparently never actually tried the free operating system until after he left Microsoft
in 2004


Ahhhhh, so someone is bitter that he lost his job. No problem but this is really more of an immature and horribly misinformed rant than "news". Microsoft isn't going anywhere, nor should they.

Gee I can't imagine why a person as unprofessional and immature as this would be let go from Microsoft. Hhmmm... let me think.
#28 k7of9 on 27 May 2009 - 06:39
People have been saying that Redmond will fall because of OSS for what...10 years now? Linux was ready for the desktop years ago according to Linux evangelists. This story seems to be nothing else than yet another claim by one who has "seen the light"

Look, I have nothing against Linux. In fact I run Ubuntu on one of my PC's and I like it. A lot actually. But naming innovation as one of the key aspects of OSS is a bit...ridiculous really. There is not a lot of innovation to be seen in Linux really. Just look at how many of the applications are basically clones of their Windows counterparts in terms of looks and functionality. One of the few true examples of innovation for me has been the new Gnome Shell that is being worked on. It remains to be seen however when this will show up and how people will react to it.

There's definitely advantages to OSS I will not deny that. In fact I use a lot of OSS apps, also on Windows. There are also disadvantages, but these aren't mentioned or acknowledged here. One is the fact that the OSS community is totally apposed to blending with closed source software, making things that should be very easy for the user harder than it needs to be. Open Source is not the holy grail and closed source software is not evil. Secondly, developers will work on what they want to work on. That way new stuff will be added and compatibility will be broken, leaving year old bugs in the source because noone is interested in fixing them because there's more fun stuff to do as well.

If everybody can contribute to software, then theoretically it will suit more needs.

This has been said for years by many, many people. Of the people saying it I wonder how many actually DO contribute. By far the largest part of the bigger software projects is being worked on by paid developers from Novell and the likes. All this "community driven" talk is romanticizing the thing.
#29 carmatic on 27 May 2009 - 08:45
if only there was more of a connection between the developer's ability to see the source code , and the user's experience to use it easily....

so i am guessing firefox isnt a good example of open source software, because open source software in general isnt good?
#30 Airlink on 27 May 2009 - 08:48
In other news, Chicken Little says the sky is falling.
Fried chicken at 11.
#31 SpyCatcher on 27 May 2009 - 11:20
IMO his statements have more to do with jealousy than they do open source.
#32 P1R4T3 on 27 May 2009 - 12:24
Well, Windows 7 looks pretty solid and is loved by almost everyone who tried it. Microsoft still has some way to go.
(1 reply) #33 shhac on 27 May 2009 - 12:31
Sam Symons said,
[...] continue to live in, ""the dark ages of computing." Interesting, he also said [...]
I spy two erratum here. Double opening quote and a grammatical error, "Interestingly" would be preferred.
#33.1 +Kirkburn on 27 May 2009 - 15:53
shhac said,
I spy two erratum here. Double opening quote and a grammatical error, "Interestingly" would be preferred.

Click the "Report a problem" link just above the article - that gets it straight to the editors
#34 wakers01 on 27 May 2009 - 15:18
This whole open source vs proprietary debate reminds me vaguely (I said vaguely) of communism vs capatalism. Sounds like a bunch of techno-hippi idealists who want the whole world to help each other so everyone can have the best software. That's crap! If you have a good idea, good product, good service, then you want to get paid for it so you can make the best life for yourself possible. That's ok. If you want the doohicki I created, then you have to pay for it. If I just give it to you, then what? You make it better and give it to Ted, who makes it better, and so on? Wrong! I give it to you, you make it better, you give it to Ted who breaks it and brings it back to you to fix: this continues add-nauseum until you have a few people working their asses to please everyone else and getting nothing in return. You don't want to pay for an operating system? Fine, build your own, but quit whining about how you think it should be open source so everyone can improve it when what you really mean is you want it to be free.
#35 mikiem on 27 May 2009 - 16:24
I think that, FWIW, the ex-MS guy is simply saying what he likes best -- that his opinions should be given no more, nor less weight than anyone's. It's not really an indictment of MS, or Windows, but rather a statement of what OS he likes best today. Indeed, if Linux had been the 1st out the gate favorite a couple decades ago, Microsoft could have been the underdog. Please consider...

If the same resources had been spent on Linux rather than Windows over the years, Linux would look & act much more like the OSes out of Microsoft & Apple. You can debate whether the core of one is inherently better than another, but it's the development resources & the way they were applied, that resulted in the major OSes we have to choose from today. You can point out that Linux never had tremendous manufacturer support for drivers & such, since that had quite a lot to do with how resources were spent, the direction of development, and the growth rate & numbers of users... at the end of the day though this is more a VHS vs. Betamax sort of affair, pointing out once again that life's often unfair, & decisions made by a relative few can have far reaching consequences. What if the folks making hardware couldn't ignore Linux years ago, not having any alternatives?

You can debate open source vs. closed -- each has it's pluses & minuses -- but you can't argue that Linux & Windows have evolved in different directions for much of their life, & those directions were determined not just by whomever was in charge, but by the consensus of the user community. What if today's typical Windows user never had Windows as a choice? Wouldn't they still demand much of what Windows offers from whatever OS? What if meeting those demands required stepping away from open source ideals? You could even debate whether open source would have happened the same way -- how much of it was/is reaction to the MS way of doing biz. As the underdog upstart, might MS have been the open source champs?
#36 BavonWW on 27 May 2009 - 18:25
Penguin heads I like that! It's the first time I've heard it. Anyway this discussion is academic; R&D costs money, Open Source is low-budget, always will be due to it's underfunded, unfocused and unaccountable nature.
Free software? After that you'll want free hardware. Not going to happen....
#37 dimithrak on 27 May 2009 - 20:38
This article is just an opinion. It will never happen. You think Microsoft is gonna let it happen? NEVER! LMAO
(3 replies) #38 ScottKin on 27 May 2009 - 21:52
After reading the entire CIO article, I can unequivically state that this article on Keith Curtis is nothing more than a fluff-and-comb PR piece for his book. The questions were leading, planned and poised in a way to support the author's points. The piece from CIO fits right-in with Neowin's mantra about "unprofessional journalism".

In the "interview", what really made me laugh was this comnment from Mr. Curtis:

"...The biggest difference between Windows and Linux is that free software contains thousands of applications, installable with one click, and managed as one set. A Linux operating system includes all the obvious stuff like a spreadsheet, Web browser and instant messaging. But it also includes tools for making pictures and music, server software and development tools.

Since when is a Spreadsheet program part of the Operating System!?! Linux itself (the Linux OS) does not include things like OpenOffice, image editing and music - that's the purvey of the various distributions of Linux. How this person remained as a contractor for 10 years at Microsoft is beyond me.
#38.1 hotdog963al on 27 May 2009 - 22:57
What exactly is "The Linux OS" to you? :/
Do you know that it comes in *many* distrubitions, most of which include Open Office. That's what he is talking about.
#38.2 Solid Knight on 28 May 2009 - 04:52
He fails to mention what happens when you want software that isn't in your repository to be installed it can potentially lead to some horrible consequences.
#38.3 ichi on 28 May 2009 - 10:06
Solid Knight said,
He fails to mention what happens when you want software that isn't in your repository to be installed it can potentially lead to some horrible consequences.


And you fail to mention that installing any untested software on any OS can lead to horrible consequences.
#39 hotdog963al on 27 May 2009 - 22:56
He's got a point.
If you can't see it, you should take that Vista box out of your pants and start seeing sense.

If I couldn't pirate, I'd be using Linux + Opensource.
#40 Solid Knight on 28 May 2009 - 03:27
Since Free Software runs on Windows it would only serve to entrench Windows further. Free Software is not exclusive to Linux. People need to wake the hell up and see how things really work.
#41 Aquarian on 31 May 2009 - 21:38
...Not as long as the odds of recovering from a Linux crash/hang is at best on a par with that of Windows'.

And this is coming from someone striving to steer clear of Windows as much as possible.

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