Microsoft says Xbox One isn't getting new DRM policies

Microsoft famously backtracked on its previous plans to put in restrictive DRM policies on Xbox One games this summer. However, concerns that Microsoft is planning to put in new DRM restrictions surfaced over the weekend, in part due to the experience of one person who got his Xbox One earlier than Microsoft's Nov. 22 launch date.

André Weingarten, a student from New York state, was able to play a disc copy of "Call of Duty: Ghosts" offline in campaign mode, even though his Xbox One was banned from connecting to the Internet, over the weekend. However, he later discovered he was unable to play the game at all.

Microsoft Xbox executive Albert Penello later posted on the NeoGAF message boards that this was not a sign of a new DRM game policy for the Xbox One, but simply a consequence of the fact that the company is still not ready to debut the console to the public. He stated, "His build is now old. This is why we were saying we didn't want people on early - it's not done yet." He added, "When we launch, console will work exactly as you expect today on 360."

Source: NeoGAF via VG247.com | Image via Microsoft

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The problem is you can't trust anything these big companies says. They could very well just wait until they sell a bunch then pull this on everyone.

Recent news item seems to indicate no b3d support either? Wow. This one device is rapidly becoming only a Gaming box for me. Now I not only HAVE to keep my 360 connected for MCE, but I also have to keep my blu-ray player. Some might consider 3d a fad, but I have lots of movies that use it, and love it. I really thought the One would simplify my living room somewhat, but it sure sounds like it does almost none of what I expected beyond play games

It is possible his build still has the old DRM checks in it hence the issue. I believe part of the reason for the patch is to disable all the checks on the console for users.

I agree. XBox one is a disaster without media center extender capability. I have Media Center and use Xbox 360 extenders, and am planning to add one for the bedroom. My plan was to get an XBox One and move one of the 360s, but not now.
I don't even understand the strategy of plopping it in front of a cable box like Google TV. They are naive if they think the cable companies are going to give up that space willingly. Or that people are going to go through the hassle of running IR blasters, The first time it doesn't work when something important is on, they will disconnect it and never connect it again. And it will not work flawlessly, the Cable Companies will constantly be breaking the XB1 interface just because they can. They will make sure it fails.
Besides, most people are moving to a whole house solution and this looks like it was invented by college kids for their dorm room. People don't have one TV with one cable Box. They DVR most of what they watch and want to watch anywhere in the house. Live TV is something people watched a lot back in 2004, so that's almost quaint. I purposely DVR sports and watch it at least an hour after it starts. And it's not at all clear to me how you DVR things with the XB1 in the way.
I have no motivation to change my Media Center set up in favor of the ability to voice commands or wave my arms like an idiot at Live TV. I was already hoping for a Kinect free version. (Is Kinect Swahili for dust catcher?) but No Media Center Extender = No Xbox One.

Perhaps I am a glutton for punishment. I was dreaming of Media Center years before it came out, and it was the culmination of a dream from the XP to Win7 years. Now that dream is crumbling slowly away. I really hope there is a vision to properly supplant Media Center, because nobody seems to have anything as good for me as XP MCE was out of the box. Based on how the Zune software is being jettisoned without a decent Win8 substitute does not give me hope. I'm holding onto my Winphone7 as long as I can for that reason. Xbox Music was/is a real disappointment compared to Zune, so I hope they get it together soon. At any rate, I still plan to get the Xbox One soon after release like I did with the Surface RT... just to see how it evolves from infancy. I really hope within a year or two I can move my Media Center out of the living room, but unless there is access to my photo and video collection, a photo screen saver, music auto playlists, and DVR recording access, then the PC will remain my primary TV input, and the X1 will be sadly under-utilized. This does not seem too much to ask, and would in my opinion, make the Xbox One truly what they claim - The One input to rule them all. Fingers crossed.

brainsuck said,
The One input to rule them all. Fingers crossed.
Funny but my home theater receiver was already doing that job

Rudy said,
Funny but my home theater receiver was already doing that job

You can even use a TV with multiple inputs! And newer TVs and audio receivers support ARC (audio return channel) so the audio passes through the TV and back into the receiver.

mrp04 said,

You can even use a TV with multiple inputs! And newer TVs and audio receivers support ARC (audio return channel) so the audio passes through the TV and back into the receiver.

ARC is only useful if you use the TV with a CAM module to receive the TV signal.

you do NOT want to use the ARC to send audio from HDMI inputs on the TV back to the receiver. firstly it introduces and ungodly amount of lag to the sound, secondly and most importantly, if you have a receiver chances are you have surround, or at least a soundbar with decent virtual surround. most TV's WILL convert any audio they send out on ARC or optical to stereo.

brainsuck said,
but unless there is access to my photo and video collection, a photo screen saver, music auto playlists, and DVR recording access.

Photo, music and video collection will be accessed through DLNA, works great, works on the 360 today as well. not sure why you would want a screen saver, but you can do slideshows.

So the is the result of the previous DRM policy in action!? Can't connect to live... can't play your games. Thank **** we got that changed.

No, this has nothing to do with the previous DRM. the previous DRM would let you play for 24 hours from the point you last had internet connection anyway.

DARKFiB3R said,
So the is the result of the previous DRM policy in action!? Can't connect to live... can't play your games. Thank **** we got that changed.

This actually sounds like the old Xbox 360 issue where you can't play your games until you update, but you can't update If you can't connect to live to do so.

HawkMan said,
No, this has nothing to do with the previous DRM. the previous DRM would let you play for 24 hours from the point you last had internet connection anyway.
Good point. So what really happened here? There is obviously code in place to restrict the user from accessing his games, whether that is automated or somebody flipped a switch, the fact that they can and will, is concerning.

DARKFiB3R said,
Good point. So what really happened here? There is obviously code in place to restrict the user from accessing his games, whether that is automated or somebody flipped a switch, the fact that they can and will, is concerning.

he never downloaded the "day one update",because that update was never available. therefore he was still on DRM firmware. after his xbox live block, 24 hours passed and he didn't re sync his licenses, thus him not being able to play the game anymore. if you look at his twitter, after the ban he was saying he was still able to play, not until later did he notice he no longer could play.

vcfan said,

he never downloaded the "day one update",because that update was never available. therefore he was still on DRM firmware. after his xbox live block, 24 hours passed and he didn't re sync his licenses, thus him not being able to play the game anymore. if you look at his twitter, after the ban he was saying he was still able to play, not until later did he notice he no longer could play.
Right, which is what I thought in the first place.

vcfan said,

he never downloaded the "day one update",because that update was never available. therefore he was still on DRM firmware. after his xbox live block, 24 hours passed and he didn't re sync his licenses, thus him not being able to play the game anymore. if you look at his twitter, after the ban he was saying he was still able to play, not until later did he notice he no longer could play.

No actually he did download the day one update, or an early version of it anyway. so the old DRM is not the issue.

seems more like an ssue similar to what GP007 describes, which also lines up with MS' statement on it.

HawkMan said,

No actually he did download the day one update, or an early version of it anyway. so the old DRM is not the issue.

seems more like an ssue similar to what GP007 describes, which also lines up with MS' statement on it.

thinking about it again,it doesn't make a whole lot of sense that the update still contained DRM,because it seemed like the firmware was in a pretty good state, which we know the polished state wasnt achieved until an october build, somthing the older DRM firmware probably wouldn't be in.

what really had me convinced though, was his statements after the block, where he stated how he could still play but other stuff like archievements was blocked. at this point, he is completely blocked from using the network and the game is still working. then at a later date, he states how he is completely blocked from launching the game.

vcfan said,

thinking about it again,it doesn't make a whole lot of sense that the update still contained DRM,because it seemed like the firmware was in a pretty good state, which we know the polished state wasnt achieved until an october build, somthing the older DRM firmware probably wouldn't be in.

what really had me convinced though, was his statements after the block, where he stated how he could still play but other stuff like archievements was blocked. at this point, he is completely blocked from using the network and the game is still working. then at a later date, he states how he is completely blocked from launching the game.

Unless it is left in place for this situation to keep unauthorized xbox from being used till launch.

alright, from the horses mouth, there isn't even DRM built into the original firmware. hawkman you are correct

albert penello

We still have two more weeks before launch - the console is in a pre-release state. We are doing regular updates - I personally took one a few minutes before he posted. His build is now old. This is why we were saying we didn't want people on early - it's not done yet.

This behavior is only because we are in pre-release. When we launch, console will work exactly as you expect today on 360.

For sure this has nothing to do with requiring a connection. There is no "DRM removal" in the Day One update because none of the consoles were ever built with that stuff in it.

This also has nothing to do with COD. The Day One update just brings the SW up to date with the latest versions vs. what's on the box. But there is no 24 check in, that's for sure.

edit: so now the guy replies,and says he was trying to play the game while connected to the internet. when he disconnected, hes now able to play offline,so offline is indeed working.

Edited by vcfan, Nov 12 2013, 12:19am :

vcfan said,
alright, from the horses mouth, there isn't even DRM built into the original firmware. hawkman you are correct

edit: so now the guy replies,and says he was trying to play the game while connected to the internet. when he disconnected, hes now able to play offline,so offline is indeed working.

So it's like I thought, the box found a internet connection and checked for a system update, it found that there was one but because the guy can't connect to live to get the update in the first place the system won't let him play his game (sorta like what the 360 always does where you have to update the dash first or the game before you can play). Without a internet connection this check doesn't happen and the system just plays the game without knowing any better.

It will be nice when both these consoles are out so people can start flipping out at reality instead of made up pre launch situations that aren't real.

Here one more
This has always been a tough one as the cable co's control what will and won't work on their network. I am also really disappointed that the XB1 won't support Media Center, though at launch it also won't have the Time Warner App which we also use. The method of integrating live TV into the XB1 is not great using IR blasters and hdmi pass through but given that the XB1 is a PC at it's core the ability to use network tuners to stream live TV would be very easy to accomplish had MS wanted to go that route. As others on this thread do we use 360 and even a few Linksys boxes as extenders around our house and have for many years. I was looking forward to replacing the 360's with the 2 XB1 Day ones we pre-ordered but now I'm starting to see that their is no plan to move this forward other than stick with what works. Very disappointing. Come on MS you can do this rather than risk alienating what is a very loyal fan base utilizing your products.

I'd like the option for a tuner that is controllable through HDMI-CEC. Not everyone has (or wants) a slow, clunky set-top box with an IR blaster sitting in front of it.

I'm also very disappointed Media Center isn't being supported, since it is the only solution that integrates a fast, set-top box-like experience with the Xbox, and permits storage (beyond the tiny 160-320GB HDD in a traditional cable STB), archival (via DVD, Blu-ray, or offline HDD), and editing of recorded TV (via Movie Maker). It's an amazingly complete solution that works well. A real shame to see it going away.

Edited by xpxp2002, Nov 11 2013, 4:02pm :

Neogaf is simply getting ridiculous

Having a hissy fit cause a guy that got a console 2 weeks early can't play right now cause he got a beta OS version that expired when he signed into Xbox Live 2 weeks before any consumer was supposed to be on the network. Maybe that's why MS did not want anyone on the network right now. It's not done and they are pushing non final patches to test consoles that expire before launch. Christ are MS allowed to finish thing before launch or do people just want to have hissy fits now?

People are literally tripping over themselves at Neogaf to find something to complain about when it comes to the Xbox one.

The problem though is Execs at Xbox like Albert are wasting time on a Sunday night bugging devs as to what is going on just to quiet the screaming masses of Sony Fanboys that flock to Neogaf

Here is the deal, the console comes out on the 22nd their are also lots of places that have Xbox one kiosks to play. Unlike Sony their are lots of videos of the UI and games running on actual retail units. Either try it out their watch the vidoes or wait till it is released.

Sony has barely shown anything and they are launching the PS4 in 4 freaking days.

This whole "insider" cboat leaking crap just to make MS look bad is getting silly.

Edited by swanlee, Nov 11 2013, 2:07pm :

Here is something else to think about
Xbox One seems like a semi-disaster to me. I could understand the XboxOne if it had gone completely digital with no bluray (no physical media at all) and no hdmi in and was simply a cutting edge game/media streaming device (amazon, netflix, etc). The could rationalize no media center by saying that the future is streaming and local media centers, physical media, and cable boxes are dinosaurs ready for extinction.
But instead, they throw on a hdmi in port for cable box hookups and a lame tv guide overlay while simultaneously dropping Media Center. They might as well add an 8 track player to the thing. In addition, the thing is 100 bucks more expensive and less powerful (slightly) then its competition.

At this point in time you have to keep the disk to also sell it as a movie player. The overlay features are the coolest thing to come out for a console ever. That's the main reason I pre-ordered it. It opens up a huge amount of potential applications.

Next Generation hopefully. Too many people with slow internet at this time and some even have caps. When games are 50+ gb you have to have alternative delivery mechanisms for those that cannot handle that.

I don't see that as an issue. If you have a slow or no Internet, you don't buy equipment intended to go on the Internet. A Roku is probably a bad idea too. Really if it wasn't for bluray movies, they probably would have gone without it. You can still sell games on USB sticks.

Spicoli said,
At this point in time you have to keep the disk to also sell it as a movie player. The overlay features are the coolest thing to come out for a console ever. That's the main reason I pre-ordered it. It opens up a huge amount of potential applications.

The overlay is stupid. The XB1 can't DVR, it's just going to pass commands to your cable box. So you'll have two menus over each other. And it'll probably suck. It communicated via IR, so you need to have an IR blaster or hope your kinect IR blaster reaches the box. And then most boxes only have power toggle IR commands not distinct power ON/OFF commands. I tried getting my HTPC to control my TV and audio receiver using IR blasters but they just work so terribly.

This makes me nervous as a customer. They say things are not ready yet...it is just a few weeks away! These things should have been ready a LONG time ago in case they find any issues. You do not make things live when it is so close from a major launch.

It might be fine, just as a customer it makes me nervous about purchasing their product with all the flips, turns, and things not being ready.

xWhiplash said,
This makes me nervous as a customer. They say things are not ready yet...it is just a few weeks away! These things should have been ready a LONG time ago in case they find any issues. You do not make things live when it is so close from a major launch.

It might be fine, just as a customer it makes me nervous about purchasing their product with all the flips, turns, and things not being ready.

They said at the time of the 180 that the changes would require a day one update to the console. The OS version that's baked onto the early manufactured units have the old DRM technology, and won't know how to recognize disc-based games as valid to play offline without the update. Nothing more should be read into this.

xWhiplash said,
It might be fine, just as a customer it makes me nervous about purchasing their product with all the flips, turns, and things not being ready.

You also have to remember that they are going to work with partners like Comcast, Time Warner, Sky and a number of others who may not be ready with those services or might not even want to turn them on until they are ready with the marketing. There's little worse than pushing a product whose services are not ready for implementation as the internet has shown us throughout the prelaunch.

Long time ago = a month at least. That way they can see if there are any issues going from a testing/staging environment to the live environment BEFORE launch. And you can make sure it is established in the actual environment that people will be using.

Drewidian said,

You also have to remember that they are going to work with partners like Comcast, Time Warner, Sky and a number of others who may not be ready with those services or might not even want to turn them on until they are ready with the marketing. There's little worse than pushing a product whose services are not ready for implementation as the internet has shown us throughout the prelaunch.

That is the thing though, they should have had these ready before launch. Things like this + PS4 blu-ray update makes me feel that both companies should have waited until next year to release their console.

Things can be just as bad rushing to FINISH (what should have been finished a while ago) just weeks before launch.

xWhiplash said,

That is the thing though, they should have had these ready before launch.

Why? There's a relatively long pipeline for building and delivering hardware, so it makes perfect sense to push software at the end. They even did that for the Mars rover as it's delivery time was even longer than USPS.

xWhiplash said,

That is the thing though, they should have had these ready before launch. Things like this + PS4 blu-ray update makes me feel that both companies should have waited until next year to release their console.

Things can be just as bad rushing to FINISH (what should have been finished a while ago) just weeks before launch.

Why? Forcing you to go online and download a patch is a great way to force everyone to sign a updated TOS

Its just the PS4 Fanboys trying to raise more doubts about the Xbox One. The reality is that the PS4 is just a modest upgrade over the PS3. Yes it can do 1080P games, adds sharing, and will have remote play, but it does very little that is new.

The Xbox One on the other hand will make a seamless living room entertainment experience that perhaps when optimized may play 1080P 60f/s games, provide what will probably be the best TV experience, Skype in the living room, Fitness lifestyle games, seamless multitasking, and in the end may be subsidized by cable/satellite companies for $99 - $199 down on a 2 year contract with free Xbox Live. Which may be the game changer for the living room experience.

The PS4 fans don't have a way to compete with the Xbox One, and they know it.

Funny, you sound like a commercial yourself or as some would say a MS fan boy. I don't really care because I have problems with both consoles. Sony has a history of smacking customers around, but it's important to realize, so does MS, they just do it slightly different ways.

Merson316 said,

1080p 60fps? Yes, I will. Haha.

maybe you didn't get the memo yet, but the ps4 version has major frame rate issues. Read the joystiq review.

Merson316 said,

Enjoy Ghosts in 720p.

It looks way better on Xbox One in my opinion. Saw the compare video?
There is more color saturation on the Xbox One making the experience better.

The Xbox one will need a separate device to record shows, to play 3d blu rays, to stream video and audio over the network, to tune to air/cable/satellite channels... And although you have a built in guide for listings in the US, it's useless elsewhere. It has a guide for TV but not for your DVR so you still have to search the shows you recorded manually. It's not really an all-in-one device.

Merson316 said,

1080p 60fps? Yes, I will. Haha.

The point that everybody is missing here is that even though playstation cando 1080P 60FPS, it cannot render huge amount of graphics with at any second because of hardware limitation. That's a flop because the future gaming is on cloud where you can do insane amount of graphic rendered on the cloud servers (where none of the consoles on the hardware side are capable of rendering) on 1080P 60PFS. and that's where XBONE will shine because of its reliable cloud infrastructure

Merson316 said,

1080p 60fps? Yes, I will. Haha.

lol yeah somone hasnt read any of the latest news about COD. Ghost on ps4 suffers from major choppiness prolly due to the fact they tried to keep it 1080p as the same issues are not near as bad to not even there on the XO. So yeah enjoy your 60fps while your not moving. I could care less because i will not be playing ghost.

But all I WANT is for better graphics. I don't want gimmicky motion controls. I don't want voice controls. I don't care if the Xbox One can pass through HDMI, my TV has 4 ports. I don't care if it has a TV Guide, I don't pay for ridiculously expensive cable. I just want to play games in a higher resolution than last gen!

That said I'm still picking both up, but I really wish I wasn't forced to pay $150 for a Kinect that I'm probably not going to bother setting up.

mrp04 said,
But all I WANT is for better graphics. I don't want gimmicky motion controls. I don't want voice controls. I don't care if the Xbox One can pass through HDMI, my TV has 4 ports. I don't care if it has a TV Guide, I don't pay for ridiculously expensive cable. I just want to play games in a higher resolution than last gen!

That said I'm still picking both up, but I really wish I wasn't forced to pay $150 for a Kinect that I'm probably not going to bother setting up.

What you are saying is that what you WANT is a ps4. People need to start thinking of Kinect like you would a CPU or MOTHERBOARD its not FORCED on you its PART of the system and how MICROSOFT wants the experience to be. You are never going to make everyone happy. If all you want is gaming then great there's something called ps4 that will suit your needs fantastically. If you want more than that guess what??? There's this thing called xbox one that will work for you! You demand 4k resolutions?? There's this thing called a PC and its perfect for you! Isn't that great how that worked out?

Houtei said,
What you are saying is that what you WANT is a ps4. People need to start thinking of Kinect like you would a CPU or MOTHERBOARD its not FORCED on you its PART of the system and how MICROSOFT wants the experience to be. You are never going to make everyone happy. If all you want is gaming then great there's something called ps4 that will suit your needs fantastically. If you want more than that guess what??? There's this thing called xbox one that will work for you! You demand 4k resolutions?? There's this thing called a PC and its perfect for you! Isn't that great how that worked out?

The Kinect is no way like a CPU or motherbaord. It is just a stupid motion control accessory that you don't need for any of the GOOD games. It's for the GIMMICKY games like Kinect Sports. I only wish the XB1 didn't have exclusives that I like because if it didn't then I would skip it. I'm actually going to list both my PS4 and XB1 on craigslist on the first day to see if any fool wants to pay a $100 markup and if not then open them. The XB1 would dominate the PS4 if they didn't bundle the stupid Kinecct and sold it for $350 instead.

mrp04 said,

The Kinect is no way like a CPU or motherbaord. It is just a stupid motion control accessory that you don't need for any of the GOOD games. It's for the GIMMICKY games like Kinect Sports. I only wish the XB1 didn't have exclusives that I like because if it didn't then I would skip it. I'm actually going to list both my PS4 and XB1 on craigslist on the first day to see if any fool wants to pay a $100 markup and if not then open them. The XB1 would dominate the PS4 if they didn't bundle the stupid Kinecct and sold it for $350 instead.

But your thinking of it in terms of what "YOU" want and what "YOU" think is needed or gimmicky. Microsoft had a specific experience they wanted and KINECT is vital to that experience whether you or anyone else likes it. So yes to them it is JUST as important as the CPU. Got to stop thinking inside a box and comparing everything and thinking it has to be like this because im use it to and wont change.

Houtei said,
But your thinking of it in terms of what "YOU" want and what "YOU" think is needed or gimmicky. Microsoft had a specific experience they wanted and KINECT is vital to that experience whether you or anyone else likes it. So yes to them it is JUST as important as the CPU. Got to stop thinking inside a box and comparing everything and thinking it has to be like this because im use it to and wont change.

Just wait and see. There won't be any killer app for the Kinect. It's going to cost them a lot this generation.

Shame that Ghost is a terrible game and no one cares, the game even runs badly on a high end PC with a Titan. IW are terrible devs since after MW2, they recycle the same **** year after year. Atleast Treyarch try new things.

mrp04 said,

The XB1 would dominate the PS4 if they didn't bundle the stupid Kinecct and sold it for $350 instead.

they will dominate the ps4 with or without Kinect. 28 million people went out of their way,and paid $150 for the original Kinect. it was the fastest selling consumers electronics device in the world.

vcfan said,
they will dominate the ps4 with or without Kinect.

No it won't. You're just posting what you want to happen because you have extreme bias.

Both consoles will do fine.

vcfan said,

they will dominate the ps4 with or without Kinect. 28 million people went out of their way,and paid $150 for the original Kinect. it was the fastest selling consumers electronics device in the world.

And like the Wii before it people realized it's a stupid waste of money and has been collecting dust since 2 weeks after the purchase. Wii U sure sold a lot, huh? And it's built off of the gimmick that is the Wii.

Not really, you can take a disc anywhere and give it away or sell it as many times as you want. Each disc can be played in a separate system at once. If it's all locked to one console that needs internet verification, you are limited in each of those scenarios.

Its just a way to keep people from using the XO early and complaining about crap not finished yet.

Also I feel these day one updates are nothing but a way to make everyone agree to the TOS