NFC payments coming to McDonalds in the UK

McDonalds has revealed plans to install contactless payment technology in all of their UK restaurants this summer, The Mirror reports. Around £1.5 million is being invested into the scheme, which will see the system being placed in 1,200 restaurants. Jill McDonald, speaking to Your Money, said that the scheme "could prove a real tipping point for contactless payments in this country in the same way as us introducing free Wi-Fi did for internet on-the-go".

NFC technology has already seen success in London's Oyster card system but elsewhere in Britain has only been used in a few cases. Contactless payment systems have been installed in Caffè Nero and Subway, with further trials taking place in Boots and the Co-Op, but Visa Europe's Mark Austin believes McDonalds "could bring contactless to the masses".

Contactless is unlikely to completely replace chip-and-pin primarily for security reasons, as the system requires no identification for a payment to be authorised. In McDonalds' case, there is a maximum limit of £15 on contactless payments before a chip-and-pin reader will have to be used instead.

12 million NFC-enabled payment cards are out in the wild, but this figure is forecasted to rise to 25 million by next year. By having a big name like McDonalds announcing their support for the technology, a two-fold increase in cards by 2012 may not be as much of a stretch as previously thought. If rumours of Apple building the technology into the next iPhone come to fruition, it might not be too long before we see the payment pads alongside every chip-and-pin reader.

Report a problem with article
Previous Story

TechSpot: Thermaltake Armor A30 Mini Tower Case Review

Next Story

PC Pro becomes prophet of doom: Its the end of the net as we know it

48 Comments

Commenting is disabled on this article.

Jill McDonald, speaking to Your Money, said that the scheme "could prove a real tipping point for Fat Lazy buggers to just get fatter and lazier which really when you look at it it's a win win situation for us here at McDonald's the faster we get you out the door the faster we can serve some other Fat B@st@rd

In New Zealand, you can use a credit card at McDonalds without a pin or without signing, provided the transaction is under $30.

McDonalds isn't concerned about the security of your money, so NFC payments are therefore a way forward!

eilegz said,
this thing its old news at least in hong kong which everything use the octopus card

Yeah i remember that, it seems to work really well out there. I would be interested in some statistics about fraud/theft in Hong Kong.

saxondale. said,

Yeah i remember that, it seems to work really well out there. I would be interested in some statistics about fraud/theft in Hong Kong.

It would maybe depend on who made or ordered statistics on it...

GS:mac

There are places in Birmingham that could do this. especially the restaurants where you order you food from behind bullet proof glass (Smethwick). And if your worried about the pin thing have you ever been to an AMC cinema? You can steal anybodies card and put it in the machine to pay for tickets since they don't ask for a pin either.

MarkusDarkus said,
There are places in Birmingham that could do this. especially the restaurants where you order you food from behind bullet proof glass (Smethwick). And if your worried about the pin thing have you ever been to an AMC cinema? You can steal anybodies card and put it in the machine to pay for tickets since they don't ask for a pin either.

Is that even legal?
Those machines sure must use debit advice, otherwise this wouldn't work.
You still would need to have some proof of being allowed to claim the money from the bank account as owner of that machine...
Like signing the transaction... (as in giving an "autograph" )
Otherwise, take your own card, use it to your likings and later on order the money back... If thoe guys get ****ed about not receiving your money tell them to show proof they are allowed to claim it!
What do they have? Nothing!

It's their own risk...

GS:mac

Glassed Silver said,

Is that even legal?
Those machines sure must use debit advice, otherwise this wouldn't work.
You still would need to have some proof of being allowed to claim the money from the bank account as owner of that machine...
Like signing the transaction... (as in giving an "autograph" )
Otherwise, take your own card, use it to your likings and later on order the money back... If thoe guys get ****ed about not receiving your money tell them to show proof they are allowed to claim it!
What do they have? Nothing!

It's their own risk...

GS:mac

Yes, because you ordered over the phone/internet and picked the tickets up at the booth its classed a CNP (customer not present) transaction. Its no different than ordering over the internet except they have improved things in that aspect such as online verification.

It's all down to Risk. Whether it's the cinema or McDonalds their assuming that a very low number of transactions will get recalled so it's balancing the risk that say 1 in 50 will get queried as opposed to a greater and quicker turnaround in sales. a maximum of £15 loss on some food isn't that great if 50% of their customers are paying by card and it takes twice as long to process as cash or chip and pin.


I'm guessing NFC is similar to Paypass we have here (from Visa and MasterCard). There's a company that sells little sleeves that you can slide your card in so that it can't be read (and you slide it out when you want to use it)

Rudy said,
I'm guessing NFC is similar to Paypass we have here (from Visa and MasterCard). There's a company that sells little sleeves that you can slide your card in so that it can't be read (and you slide it out when you want to use it)

Which makes the places close to cashiers the best place to record that data... People have to pop it out...

GS:mac

Glassed Silver said,

Which makes the places close to cashiers the best place to record that data... People have to pop it out...

GS:mac

I'm not saying it would be 100% foolproof but even the old magnetic strip wasn't. That's why credit card company will give you your money back if your card gets cloned.

Rudy said,
I'm not saying it would be 100% foolproof but even the old magnetic strip wasn't. That's why credit card company will give you your money back if your card gets cloned.

Indeed...
All I'm saying it adds insecurity for little more convenience...
Seriously... I at least always take out my wallet, because that's where I keep the receipts (in chronological order, so whenever I need to return something, I'm sure to have the receipt with me and find it fast...)
Also, sometimes the cashier might ask you for personal identification... (age or the like...)

NFC is highly overrated!

GS:mac

Rudy said,
I'm not saying it would be 100% foolproof but even the old magnetic strip wasn't. That's why credit card company will give you your money back if your card gets cloned.

Chip and pin isn't 100% foolproof, yet the banks are very arsey about helping you if you have any problems with that (their view is that it is 100% secure).

WelshBluebird said,

Chip and pin isn't 100% foolproof, yet the banks are very arsey about helping you if you have any problems with that (their view is that it is 100% secure).

Eventually they'll have to come around and realize it's not

Rudy said,
Eventually they'll have to come around and realize it's not

They've been sued in Germany if I remember correctly and they still hold up that position, just to scare people off who try to claim their rights...

GS:mac

richardsim7 said,
It's not like people can do you in for thousands, unless you're REALLY stupid - I thought NFC has a limit of £10

Still...
A proper fraud attempt gets something out of this, too...
And be it just a fraudsters usual daily purchases of low value... saves him quite some money over the time...

GS:mac

saxondale. said,
In terms of security, this is a step back. Is it so hard to put a 4 digit pin in???

+1 one of my new cards is contactless, tbh I don't want it

saxondale. said,
In terms of security, this is a step back. Is it so hard to put a 4 digit pin in???

It's still wirelessly transmitted which ALWAYS includes risks...
I hate to say it, but NFC will always be less secure than good old cash or debit cards...
It just HAS to because by opening a door to convenience you AUTOMATICALLY open a door to insecurity...

I don't get what's so hard about getting out your debit card and type some numbers or give the cashier a nice autograph hehe

GS:mac

Glassed Silver said,

It's still wirelessly transmitted which ALWAYS includes risks...
I hate to say it, but NFC will always be less secure than good old cash or debit cards...
It just HAS to because by opening a door to convenience you AUTOMATICALLY open a door to insecurity...

I don't get what's so hard about getting out your debit card and type some numbers or give the cashier a nice autograph hehe

GS:mac

Less secure than debit cards, sure, but cash? I don't see how that's really possible. If someone takes your cash, it's gone. You can't "stop" it and it's very difficult to prove its your cash and not someone else's. Sure, I guess you could argue that the whole wireless aspect of NFCs means it's easier for someone to take your card, but at least you have a chance of getting the cash back once you report it to your bank. With real money, it's just Gone.

I'm not saying I disagree with what you're saying about NFC cards being a security risk, but I think it's probably still safer than carrying around wads of cash.

Kushan said,

Less secure than debit cards, sure, but cash? I don't see how that's really possible. If someone takes your cash, it's gone. You can't "stop" it and it's very difficult to prove its your cash and not someone else's. Sure, I guess you could argue that the whole wireless aspect of NFCs means it's easier for someone to take your card, but at least you have a chance of getting the cash back once you report it to your bank. With real money, it's just Gone.

I'm not saying I disagree with what you're saying about NFC cards being a security risk, but I think it's probably still safer than carrying around wads of cash.

Okay, I was probably not very clear about it...
I actually mean it like this:
Always carry a ridiculous low amount of cash (because sometimes you will just not find a way to pay with a debit card (cabs, tickets for buses, super low amounts to pay in small shops (or hotdog stands and such)) -> rest is debit... that way your money is pretty much in one place and you're not like... SH** I want to order this online and I like a few bucks on my bank account that I actually have... just not on my account...

I would NEVER carry too much money for longer than just transportation...
OR wear it in a belt with a zip on the inner side when travelling and not wanting to pay the extra cash for foreign ATM use (on debit cards... with cc this is usually not a problem...)

GS:mac

saxondale. said,
In terms of security, this is a step back. Is it so hard to put a 4 digit pin in???

I don't think difficulty is the reason for this it's lazyness !!!

In terms of convenience it's much better, although the £15 limit could be lower.
Also what about Oyster cards, should they have a pin too?

acnpt said,
In terms of convenience it's much better, although the £15 limit could be lower.
Also what about Oyster cards, should they have a pin too?

Your oyster card isn't your BANK. I don't have thousands of pounds loaded onto my oyster card.

saxondale. said,

Your oyster card isn't your BANK. I don't have thousands of pounds loaded onto my oyster card.

Indeed...
Usually I would charge my Oyster for a couple of bucks only every week or so or for a day to get the day flat...

There are enough charging stations.

GS:mac

saxondale. said,

Your oyster card isn't your BANK. I don't have thousands of pounds loaded onto my oyster card.

You can, if you get a Barclaycard Onepulse card, which is Credit Card + Oyster + Contactless.
...and yes, you are fully covered for Contactless fraud, as well as chip & pin.

acnpt said,

You can, if you get a Barclaycard Onepulse card, which is Credit Card + Oyster + Contactless.
...and yes, you are fully covered for Contactless fraud, as well as chip & pin.

Yep and that's not just an oyster card. You're now talking about something else.

Glassed Silver said,

Okay, I was probably not very clear about it...
I actually mean it like this:
Always carry a ridiculous low amount of cash (because sometimes you will just not find a way to pay with a debit card (cabs, tickets for buses, super low amounts to pay in small shops (or hotdog stands and such)) -> rest is debit... that way your money is pretty much in one place and you're not like... SH** I want to order this online and I like a few bucks on my bank account that I actually have... just not on my account...

I would NEVER carry too much money for longer than just transportation...
OR wear it in a belt with a zip on the inner side when travelling and not wanting to pay the extra cash for foreign ATM use (on debit cards... with cc this is usually not a problem...)

GS:mac

I think this is the idea... it is meant to replace small amounts of cash. Instead of carrying around that fiver for something to eat... you just use your card and you pay as quickly as cash (literally its swipe and off you go). Therefore it's as safe as cash... and just as quick.

f1d said,

I think this is the idea... it is meant to replace small amounts of cash. Instead of carrying around that fiver for something to eat... you just use your card and you pay as quickly as cash (literally its swipe and off you go). Therefore it's as safe as cash... and just as quick.


Nah... We'll probably not see a hot dog stand offer this method of payment...
And... Cash is universal... NFC is not... The cash I carry, I do it for the odd case cashiers won't accept my debit card because the value of purchase is too low or they don't offer it...
More like when they don't offer it...
So... I guess NFC must have LOOOOOW transaction fees to convince sellers of accepting it rather than cash, which usually people carry around either way...

But I totally see a lot for NFC for sellers: Less money in-house = less being robbed...
etc...

Call me old fashioned, but I'm out on this one, unless MAGICAL stuff happens and I totally get convinced whyever...

GS:mac

f1d said,

I think this is the idea... it is meant to replace small amounts of cash. Instead of carrying around that fiver for something to eat... you just use your card and you pay as quickly as cash (literally its swipe and off you go). Therefore it's as safe as cash... and just as quick.


You'd think that but all the restaurants i eat at in China town in London only accept cash apart from one.

saxondale. said,

You'd think that but all the restaurants i eat at in China town in London only accept cash apart from one.

and If you were to go over their books you'd soon find out why they're cash only much easier to cook a book if all you take is cash

Athlonite said,

and If you were to go over their books you'd soon find out why they're cash only much easier to cook a book if all you take is cash


As long as the food's good, i don't care how the take payments

if someone steals your card which has NFC they could just do lots of little transitions with out using your pin.

i think cards should have biometrics but if it can be put on the small card I don't know

halo2k27 said,
if someone steals your card which has NFC they could just do lots of little transitions with out using your pin.

i think cards should have biometrics but if it can be put on the small card I don't know

They don't even need to steal your card, just pass by you close enough to read your card from your pocket/bag. Saw this done already for some experiment.

Teebor said,

They don't even need to steal your card, just pass by you close enough to read your card from your pocket/bag. Saw this done already for some experiment.

Ouch

Teebor said,

They don't even need to steal your card, just pass by you close enough to read your card from your pocket/bag. Saw this done already for some experiment.

Clone your card just by walking by you anywhere. That would have to be some crazy algorithm they'd have use to keep out those trying to clone but as with anything, it only lasts so long before it's cracked.

I think the cards should have a small photo of the owner that pops up on the screen so the employee can see who the owner of the card is and if it's not that person, than they don't serve you. Which can probably also be removed and changed if cloned?

dogmai79 said,

Clone your card just by walking by you anywhere. That would have to be some crazy algorithm they'd have use to keep out those trying to clone but as with anything, it only lasts so long before it's cracked.

I think the cards should have a small photo of the owner that pops up on the screen so the employee can see who the owner of the card is and if it's not that person, than they don't serve you. Which can probably also be removed and changed if cloned?


Well yessir!

GS:mac

dogmai79 said,

Clone your card just by walking by you anywhere. That would have to be some crazy algorithm they'd have use to keep out those trying to clone but as with anything, it only lasts so long before it's cracked.

I think the cards should have a small photo of the owner that pops up on the screen so the employee can see who the owner of the card is and if it's not that person, than they don't serve you. Which can probably also be removed and changed if cloned?

There is a video of guy walking around and then telling people what they credit card numbers are. Pretty crazy.

halo2k27 said,
if someone steals your card which has NFC they could just do lots of little transitions with out using your pin.

I think a pin is required after a few purchases, and randomly.

farmeunit said,
There is a video of guy walking around and then telling people what they credit card numbers are. Pretty crazy.

You can actually buy wallets with built in faraday cages now. Saw one on ThinkGeek and thought man those people are paranoid... yeah, not anymore.

halo2k27 said,
if someone steals your card which has NFC they could just do lots of little transitions with out using your pin.

i think cards should have biometrics but if it can be put on the small card I don't know

Nope - I believe it is every 3 transactions and then randomly as well your pin is requested.

The most someone could "get away with" would be £30 in most cases as well, as most shops have the limit of £10 - not sure why McDonalds is different. And even then you wouldn't be out of pocket as the bank would normally pay up.