PC piracy drove us to consoles, says Epic Games

Mike Capps, president of Epic Games - the studio behind the Gears of War franchise - has blamed piracy for his studio's recent preference for developing console-only games in an interview with Edge magazine. However, the developer believes that the market could begin to move back towards PC development in the near future.

Epic Games, who also developed the Unreal engine and Unreal Tournament franchise, released the first Gears of War on both the PC and Xbox 360 in 2007. However, the 2008 sequel Gears of War 2 was released exclusively on the Xbox 360. The third instalment in the series will also appear only on the Xbox 360 - something which the developer puts down to piracy on the PC.

As reported by CVG (via 1UP), in the interview Capps says that six years ago Epic "was a PC company and always had been," with just one PS2 title to its name - a port of Unreal Tournament. But now people complain on the company's forums that they hate the PC. "And now, if you read our forums," he said, "people are saying: 'Why do you hate the PC? You're a console-only company.' And guess what? It's because the money's on console."

"We still do PC, we love the PC," Capps says, before going on to say how the impact of piracy has "killed" many good developers, forcing them to change their business model.

Despite this, Capps believes a resurgence in the PC market may be coming. "There's certainly a light for PC gaming," he said. According to Capps, publishers are starting to "think their money's going to be shifting back to PC" due to people wanting to spend less time playing games due to the amount of media competing for their attention.

He concludes, "So maybe Facebook will save PC gaming - but it's not going to look like Gears Of War."

Report a problem with article
Previous Story

Facebook announces free mobile service

Next Story

Microsoft confirms new 64-bit Windows 7 vulnerability

135 Comments

Commenting is disabled on this article.

There is as much if not more Piracy on PS3 and XBox360 platforms than on PC based computers. Modded systems, downloadable or shared games. The truth of the matter is that there is more money to be had supporting platforms than on the PC at the moment. Epic is just usuing Piracy as an excuse.

Crappy console to PC ports kills PC gaming. The last few PC games I got were shooters, but over the shoulder with 'aim modes'. WASD with mouse is **** for over the shoulder.

Well, I wouldn't bother what Epic is saying. I lost faith in them long time ago. I'm a huge Unreal series fan, loved original and of course UT, with UT2004 being alright, after they realized that UT2003 was too much console port to pc, and it failed. I bought every Unreal game released, even the special editions, like the Anthology, and the like.

They have a great engine, and its going great for them, so its been fun Epic, good luck, and stay away from PC, and let the best devs make games for PC, you are not one of them anymore.

Anyway i think Epic should try to make less buggy games before complaining. I remember when Epic released the demo of unreal Tournament 3. I took the time to download it and install it just to realise the demo was not working at all. Went online on forums and people said i needed to install older nVidia drivers to make it works with my very capable 8800 GTS. WTF. Did Epic really tought i would un-install the last nVidia drivers to replace them with an older version just to run a demo ??? I un-installed the demo, did not try the game, did not buy it and did not play it at all. But for sure if i stilll wanted to buy it i would have downloaded a pirated copy before just to see if the final product was actually working ...

The eternal question of piracy:

Did quality dropped first?
or
Did lack of profits came first, thus came lack of quality?

I mean really. There was a tipping point, and the fact is, once developers went to console they saw profits soar. They also saw that profits is not that it can be. Can you fault the developers? Yes, they are bringing out crappy goods. But isn't pirating PC gamers also at fault? Of course you give less incentives. You really could liken to politics, the devs create politics that favours the console voters. But while PC voters hate it, the fact is they don't give enough benefits for devs to try and win them over.

In the end, this is an endless cycle of low quality DRM riddled goods and pirates. Is quite sad really though, pirates justifying their actions. They always claim low quality goods. But you telling me they will suddenly buy a new game if it is good? Pigs can fly. You may be voting with your wallet, but you are giving reason for devs to churn out what they churn out continually.


Second hand and pirate is different. At least in second hand, money was made sometime in history. Pirating did not. You are at least going to encourage those who buy new games to continue to buy new games. Whoever said second hand games are worse is basically just justifying their 10 dollar for online policy for their own profitable end.

Eddo89 said,

Second hand and pirate is different. At least in second hand, money was made sometime in history. Pirating did not.
Actually, from the developers standpoint, there's really no difference between second hand games and pirating. As last i checked, regardless of the fact that YOU payed SOME money for the game, the devs themselves don't get any of that cash from the sale. Just as how they didn't get any cash from someone who pirated it.

Edited by Blackhearted, May 20 2010, 12:39pm :

It is a shame about piracy but they need to keep up with the times. better cracks and patches call for better security on games. Halo 2 wasn't too bad in terms of security. as far as i know only the single play was able to be cracked.

I'm also with the people who think pc sales have gone down due to quality. For too long PC games have released as crap with developers thinking they'd just patch it at release. People get tired of that. I want a stable game at release not a beta.

Or the fact that most games are just terrible and people don't bother to purchase them. I found UT3 in the bargain bin at BB for $5.99 and it was one of the worse games I've ever purchased.

funny thing is.... consoles (more specifically Wii/XBox360) are actually even easier to pirate than a PC game because once the console is modified it's actually easier to get games working on a console than it is on PC since there is no game copying protection at all on the game discs. (i am mostly talking XBox360 here)

Piracy isn't why UT3 has such a poor internet community/userbase. There are maybe 500-700 people who play UT3 online at any time. Compare this against UT2004 which probably hit 5,000 people, and UT1999 which probably was upwards of 10,000 in its heyday (I dont think people really tracked numbers back in 1999-2000 so I dont know the actual number). If pirates really wanted to play UT3 online they would buy it, but the game is terrible.

Tokar said,
If pirates really wanted to play UT3 online they would buy it, but the game is terrible.
A friend of mine plays his copy online just fine.

Just did a quick search.

Splinter Cell Conviction PC = 12,000 seeds and 65,000 leachers.
Splinter Cell Conviction 360 = 3,000 seeds and 12,000 leachers.

To be honest, I think that the DRM in PC games pretty much proves PC gaming is dying.

Smashoid said,
Just did a quick search.

Splinter Cell Conviction PC = 12,000 seeds and 65,000 leachers.
Splinter Cell Conviction 360 = 3,000 seeds and 12,000 leachers.

To be honest, I think that the DRM in PC games pretty much proves PC gaming is dying.

Or that xbox360 users don't know how to customize their platform and get what they want? It's all about perspective. Statistics mean nothing when you let your bias blind you. According to what you posted, there are only 15,000 people that want the game on 360 that don't have it legit yet. 77,000 on PC that don't have it legit yet. Where is the bigger market? You tell me...

Ill pay for a game that deserved to be paid for; Half life series, star craft, warcraft, modern warfare, call of duty,etc. The rest...I guess its a ****ty buzz for them.

PC piracy drove us to consoles, says Epic Games

then, is Epic planning to abandon xbox360 (where the piracy is also running rampart) and turning all their release to PS3?.

I would take a PC any day over any console for playing games. The graphics are also better on a PC, as long as you have the latest graphics card, unlike what some have said here.

TC17 said,
I would take a PC any day over any console for playing games. The graphics are also better on a PC, as long as you have the latest graphics card, unlike what some have said here.

I think you just pointed out the major reason why console games sell better. You buy a console once and you will get at least 5 years worth of gaming on it without having to worry about upgrading. The same cannot be said of PC gaming.

Anyone is a fool who thinks PC's would have more pirating than Consoles. There is just as much or more on consoles.

Its more like they didn't make money off of their crappy games, so they had to come up with this excuse. Console users will play just about anything. PC users will be more intelligent about their choices.

PC users also can't return a game, or resell it once they buy it, so they have to be picky about the game before they buy it. Console users at least have the ability to resell it to Gamestop, or maybe even return it.

TC17 said,

PC users also can't return a game, or resell it once they buy it, so they have to be picky about the game before they buy it. Console users at least have the ability to resell it to Gamestop, or maybe even return it.

#1 reason piracy started on PC. No Return Option , EVER. If we had the ability to return software, more purchases would be made. But for PCs, it is, buy and own forever, no matter is it works or doesn't. Because of that attitude toward us at the beginning, we had to pirate software to test. If they could treat us like real consumers, we might become their consumers.

Stupid console lovers. Real gaming only happens on the PC. Screw Epic for their stupid reference to "Facebook will save PC gaming". Are you for serious? Lucas Arts have learned this lesson with Force Unleashed.

Anyways, first solution to stop PC pirating - lower prices to acceptable levels, remove horrible DRM which detracts from the user experience (I'm looking at you Ubisoft) and make a decent game at launch. Now, my favorite DRM is by Steam activation, I kinda like that, not having to be on the internet and hoping to hell it doesn't drop out. I don't see why more game developers follow suite. (I'm sure many might disagree with Steam though).

Billus said,
Stupid console lovers. Real gaming only happens on the PC. Screw Epic for their stupid reference to "Facebook will save PC gaming". Are you for serious? Lucas Arts have learned this lesson with Force Unleashed.

Anyways, first solution to stop PC pirating - lower prices to acceptable levels, remove horrible DRM which detracts from the user experience (I'm looking at you Ubisoft) and make a decent game at launch. Now, my favorite DRM is by Steam activation, I kinda like that, not having to be on the internet and hoping to hell it doesn't drop out. I don't see why more game developers follow suite. (I'm sure many might disagree with Steam though).


I like Steam myself when it comes to stricter DRM's. I usually have a reason or another to format every few months and Steam's way allows me not to have to call customer service to inform them that I am in fact a legit customer that paid for their game every time I format.

Let's see, Gears of War was an awfully buggy port for the PC (like a year after console release too) and pretty much all other PC games they've done have been multiplayer online games that require a valid CDkey to play so they must be bought.

In any case I get the cracks for PC games I've bought because then I don't have to stick the DVD in the drive for no good reason and the games usually also run better. Considering copy protection is circumvented all the time, why spend any money on that beyond a simple key check or something?

Ease of use is one of the reasons why I buy more games for the PS3 than I do for the PC. Another reason is that multiplatform games usually come out way earlier on consoles. Often the PC ports are also bad, as mentioned by AJCrowley. Battlefield Bad Company 2 is a prime example. I was shocked how bad the PC version was compared to the smooth as butter PS3 version.

Epic Games is still around? Figures. Don't buy games anymore, their copy protection crap is so hard to deal with. Gave up. Download games maybe. (legal downloads)

He's full of **** -- everybody bought the Unreal series games, if they weren't making much money recently, maybe they just stopped making games worth buying on the PC. Come to think of it there hasn't been a decent UT game since 2004, and the 2007 release (most recent) wasn't as popular...

On a related note -- id Software makes plenty of PC games and they work well and run well. They aren't leaving the PC platform but EPIC is, which says a lot between the two of them. ID Tech 5 is going to rock and EPIC is really scared about it.

Hercules said,
On a related note -- id Software makes plenty of PC games and they work well and run well. They aren't leaving the PC platform but EPIC is, which says a lot between the two of them. ID Tech 5 is going to rock and EPIC is really scared about it.

You could add Valve to that list as well.

Hercules said,
On a related note -- id Software makes plenty of PC games and they work well and run well. They aren't leaving the PC platform but EPIC is, which says a lot between the two of them. ID Tech 5 is going to rock and EPIC is really scared about it.

the last id game i played was doom3 and it was garbage. buggy and didn't run well besides the awful gameplay. id does have a following for their multiplayer oriented games though.

treemonster said,

the last id game i played was doom3 and it was garbage. buggy and didn't run well besides the awful gameplay. id does have a following for their multiplayer oriented games though.

I enjoyed Doom 3, it was lovely and atmospheric and looked gorgeous. It did need a supercomputer to run it though, and it was missing a decent multiplayer.

Let's be clear here -- lost sales do not equal people who wouldn't have bought the game anyway.

This is RIAA logic. It is fail there, and it's fail now.

Hercules said,
Let's be clear here -- lost sales do not equal people who wouldn't have bought the game anyway.

This is RIAA logic. It is fail there, and it's fail now.

This is the truth, they're just trying to lay the smack down on consumers so there's justification for ACTA and more revenue will flow with this mentality instituted.

Hercules said,
Let's be clear here -- lost sales do not equal people who wouldn't have bought the game anyway.

This is RIAA logic. It is fail there, and it's fail now.

+1
People who pirate games would not necessarily have bought the game in the first place. Give the consumer a good overall experience along with solid games for PC (a la Valve and their Steam platform), provide incentives for those who buy games, keep it patched, and don't overcharge, and people will buy your games.

Treat consumers like pirates, overcharge for games($60 is way too much for PC games), then charge more for content that should and could have been included in the first place, and people will pirate your games.

If you can't sell on the one platform that is no crap in (just about) EVERY home in NA and EU, you aren't doing it right. Lazy asses!

Hercules said,
Let's be clear here -- lost sales do not equal people who wouldn't have bought the game anyway.

This is RIAA logic. It is fail there, and it's fail now.


I totally agree. Yet they get away with this BS all the time.

This is such a crock.

I'm a long time PC gamer, and I pay for almost all of my games.

However, a couple of experiences recently have me considering a boycott of certain publishers. For example:

Splinter Cell Conviction - awful DRM. The game frequently locks up, mid play, because it can't contact Ubi's DRM servers. Even a single check at the beginning wouldn't be so bad. This is a classic case of treating legit customers like pirates, while pirates don't have to deal with this crap once the game is cracked (which rarely takes long). Upon opening a support ticket with them regarding this, they sent me back a standard form response for "internet connection problems", when I told them that I'd appreciate if they actually read my questions and answered them, they ignored me, then closed the ticket. Also, the game is just buggy as hell.

Battlefield Bad Company 2 - another one, bought and paid for. Again, buggy as hell, no support for Microsoft game pad (which would be useful for flying helicopters), poor joystick support, and no joystick throttle control support. This is a classic case of "developed for console, half heartedly ported to PC". The Battlefield games have historically been for PC, and none of the previous ones have given me this level of trouble, this is just sloppy.

Modern Warfare 2 - no dedicated servers, another game that was very obviously ported from console with little consideration for PC users.

With the above becoming the norm, and the perks of PC gaming gradually disappearing (such as free map packs and updates being replaced by pay-for-DLC), I'm really losing my patience. From now on, I'll buy games from developers that give due consideration to PCs, which are the most expensive platform, and therefore, the home of the most hardcore gamers, and SHOULD be a focus for developers. These half assed console ports with over the top DRM, I shall not pay for any more.

Mekun said,
So theres no piracy on consoles? Piracy is rampant on consoles.Who has there head in the sand?

Piracy on consoles is not as bad as it is on the PC. The PS3 cannot even run pirated games at this time. Even on the 360, it's not so simple as burning a DVD for your friend. There has to be some sort of mod to the console, and that's hardly something the general populace can do. Some will get others to do it for them. Others will buy said console just for the fact that they know they can pirate on it. Most will simply buy games as intended. All it takes on the PC the majority of the time is to download a torrent. And then, that file could just be given to a friend, usually without any extra work.

Edited by NeoTrunks, May 19 2010, 6:13pm :

NeoTrunks said,

Piracy on consoles is not as bad as it is on the PC. The PS3 cannot even run pirated games at this time. Even on the 360, it's not so simple as burning a DVD for your friend. There has to be some sort of mod to the console, and that's hardly something the general populace can do. Some will get others to do it for them. Others will buy said console just for the fact that they know they can pirate on it. Most will simply buy games as intended. All it takes on the PC the majority of the time is to download a torrent. And then, that file could just be given to a friend, usually without any extra work.

Have you looked at craigslist? xbox360 can be modded for about 25.00

Try again.

Mekun said,

Have you looked at craigslist? xbox360 can be modded for about 25.00

Try again.

You're not disputing my point. I already covered that in my post. How does that make it rampant? I know several people with different consoles, and I only know of two people that have a Wii set up to play games off of a hard drive. Going to someone on Craigslist makes it no more rampant than the mod chips for the PS1 and PS2. Yes, it happens, but it's not something that everyone could easily do or even know about.

NeoTrunks said,

You're not disputing my point. I already covered that in my post. How does that make it rampant? I know several people with different consoles, and I only know of two people that have a Wii set up to play games off of a hard drive. Going to someone on Craigslist makes it no more rampant than the mod chips for the PS1 and PS2. Yes, it happens, but it's not something that everyone could easily do or even know about.

But you offer no proof that its not except you have a few friends. Really thats your basis?

Mekun said,

But you offer no proof that its not except you have a few friends. Really thats your basis?

Considering that the same people have easily pirated PC software and games, I think it's a good educated guess. Again, I am not saying it doesn't exist, but only that it's not as rampant nor as easy as it is on the PC. What exactly is your point other than being belligerent?

NeoTrunks said,

Considering that the same people have easily pirated PC software and games, I think it's a good educated guess. Again, I am not saying it doesn't exist, but only that it's not as rampant nor as easy as it is on the PC. What exactly is your point other than being belligerent?


Sorry i didnt mean to hurt your feelings, I thought i was talking to an adult.

NeoTrunks said,

You're not disputing my point. I already covered that in my post. How does that make it rampant? I know several people with different consoles, and I only know of two people that have a Wii set up to play games off of a hard drive. Going to someone on Craigslist makes it no more rampant than the mod chips for the PS1 and PS2. Yes, it happens, but it's not something that everyone could easily do or even know about.

Well, where I live you can buy a modded console for no extra cost and you can get games very cheap (3 bucks/game or 6 for a launch title). And around here everyone that has a console (except ps3) has it modded (most download xbox games from torrent and burn on a dvd).

sviola said,

Well, where I live you can buy a modded console for no extra cost and you can get games very cheap (3 bucks/game or 6 for a launch title). And around here everyone that has a console (except ps3) has it modded (most download xbox games from torrent and burn on a dvd).

Piracy is rampant where you live then . I can concede that. It's different over here in the states, though. Is the situation the same with PC games and apps over there?

Mekun said,

But you offer no proof that its not except you have a few friends. Really thats your basis?

Oh my god, stop with this crap. The man is right. Console piracy is far less, and chipping/modding a console is something only a handful percentage of console owners do. Whereas a MASSIVE percentage of PC owners pirate stuff. That's a fact. Stop trying to argue for the sake of arguing your point. Which is not valid.

Even though it's out in the open now, there will still be people stuck in denial. How much more obvious can it get, folks? Thanks to the thieves, PC gaming is on life support.

bjoswald said,
Even though it's out in the open now, there will still be people stuck in denial. How much more obvious can it get, folks? Thanks to the thieves, PC gaming is on life support.

which is why blizz and valve are the biggest gaming companies in the world right?

bjoswald said,
Even though it's out in the open now, there will still be people stuck in denial. How much more obvious can it get, folks? Thanks to the thieves, PC gaming is on life support.

What a bunch of BS.

Anyone is a fool to buy a console, not only are the games crap compared to a good multiplayer PC game, their games cost double what a PC game costs.

bjoswald said,
Even though it's out in the open now, there will still be people stuck in denial. How much more obvious can it get, folks? Thanks to the thieves, PC gaming is on life support.

As I mentioned further up, the games companies have done just as much to damage PC gaming as the pirates ever did, if not more. Releasing buggy unfinished games with a "release now, patch later" attitude, and cramming the CDs full of invasive DRM that treats me as a potential pirate rather than somebody who just bought their product.

Lets not forget that the pirates don't have to put up with DRM. They are happy at home playing a version of the game with the crapware patched out of it. DRM is a direct attack on the people that actually pay for the games, not the pirates.

TC17 said,

What a bunch of BS.

Anyone is a fool to buy a console, not only are the games crap compared to a good multiplayer PC game, their games cost double what a PC game costs.

I buy my games used at Blockbuster for £10 - £15 And you may say a game costs much more, but only a few pounds or dollars here and there. But a console costs a couple or hundred dollars/pounds while a game capable PC costs a TON more. Consoles are better for gaming in my opinion. My PC is a workhorse... if I want to play games, I jump onto my couch, and play on my large screen TV.

Spirit Dave said,

I buy my games used at Blockbuster for £10 - £15 And you may say a game costs much more, but only a few pounds or dollars here and there. But a console costs a couple or hundred dollars/pounds while a game capable PC costs a TON more. Consoles are better for gaming in my opinion. My PC is a workhorse... if I want to play games, I jump onto my couch, and play on my large screen TV.

Not sure how a large screen TV has any effect on whether you game on a console or pc but ok.

SputnikGamer said,

Not sure how a large screen TV has any effect on whether you game on a console or pc but ok.

Why did you even reply? I didn't say it had any effect. I said that's what I do.

Spirit Dave said,

Why did you even reply? I didn't say it had any effect. I said that's what I do.

I was bored. Needed a good argument. Speaking of TV's, what do you have? I am on the market for a TV in the 32-40 inch range but not sure what to get. Its for my Xbox360

It takes more effort to succeed on the PC than to succeed on consoles, to succeed on the PC you need:

1. Well optimized game that runs on wide range of hardware.
2. Solid online experience and community.
3. Good support for the game after release, free patches and some minor upgrades.

Not every game developer is good enough to meet that criteria, they instead blame their bad sales on piracy, look at Blizzard and Valve, they're stacking money and their games are almost all PC exclusive, or at least designed for PC audience in mind and later ported to consoles.

i buy games to support the devs. i bought all the unreal games. feel like crap now because epic devs aren't making more pc games with the money. should have just pirated and earned their betrayal.

Consoles have a huge playerbase and you can get paid alot of money for being exclusive (or even paid develop on there console, i.e. stopping them being exclusive to another console).

Its nothing to do with piracy, just about money. Well, i lie, they tend to ditch the PC when switching to console based as they think that people who would of bought the game on console may pirate it for the PC instead if its available.

There's still a huge PC market and a huge potential PC memberbase to try to tempt into gaming. I think we may see a rise in PC gaming as recently there arnt many games which are pushing the hardware anymore and most developers are now making there games as 'old PC' friendly as possible. So a PC bought today will likely be able to play the latest games for the next 10 years (even though as time goes on you'll be slowly switching from ultra graphics setting to minimum). Rather than the old way, that you needed to upgrade every 2-3years and alot of people were unsure weither the latest games would play on there PC.

Ya, and we all know Epic made such wonderful games like Unreal, and Unreal 2, and Unreal 2000, and Unreal 23949394393. Sorry, I didn't like Unreal to start with, I was more of a Doom/Quake kiddy then. Unreal always seemed just too generic to me. Good Bye Epic, I never played your crap anyway. Hell, I never pirated their crap anyway, wasn't worth it.

Zerosignull said,
Yeah lets face it here. GOW on the PC was a completely bug free A class experience

because it wasn't on console. how long did it take for the first patch to come out... not very if i recall correctly. not sure what your point is.

SputnikGamer said,

because it wasn't on console. how long did it take for the first patch to come out... not very if i recall correctly. not sure what your point is.

the original Gears of War was on the console?

It still has issues with it randomly loosing your save points

Zerosignull said,

the original Gears of War was on the console?

It still has issues with it randomly loosing your save points

Yes original Gears of War was on console and GOW was just as buggy on console as it was on PC. Again I say, not sure what your point was when the game sucked on both systems just as bad.

So far, I think that the only console that hasn't been hacked to play pirated games is the PS3. It's probably the best bet if you're trying to make sure that every one of your games being played was actually purchased.

NeoTrunks said,
So far, I think that the only console that hasn't been hacked to play pirated games is the PS3. It's probably the best bet if you're trying to make sure that every one of your games being played was actually purchased.

it was hacked back in January.

NeoTrunks said,

Not to the point that you could actually boot up a copied game, though, right?

The first step is getting into the base system and then build an OS from there. The PS3 base system was hacked. Now people are working on the rest. The PS3 is no longer the unhackable system.

SputnikGamer said,

The first step is getting into the base system and then build an OS from there. The PS3 base system was hacked. Now people are working on the rest. The PS3 is no longer the unhackable system.

Ok, so there still isn't any piracy on it yet, and it will takes ages for the mods/piracy to go mainstream on it.

SputnikGamer said,

The first step is getting into the base system and then build an OS from there. The PS3 base system was hacked. Now people are working on the rest. The PS3 is no longer the unhackable system.

You need to stop spreading BS. While the OS has been hacked there's no way to run pirated games on the PS3 right now.

Rudy said,
You need to stop spreading BS. While the OS has been hacked there's no way to run pirated games on the PS3 right now.

Hence the "Now people are working on the rest." bit.

TCLN Ryster said,

Hence the "Now people are working on the rest." bit.

Glad someone knows how to read an entire paragraph and realize each sentence is there for a reason.

Rudy said,
You need to stop spreading BS. While the OS has been hacked there's no way to run pirated games on the PS3 right now.

I am confused so I am going to break this down in a way that I, and hopefully you, can fully understand. We will exam this together sentence by sentence. It will be a learning experience!

Your statement: "You need to stop spreading BS. While the OS has been hacked there's no way to run pirated games on the PS3 right now. "

So for your statement to be true, anything I said simple has to be untrue. Here is may statement: "The first step is getting into the base system and then build an OS from there. The PS3 base system was hacked. Now people are working on the rest. The PS3 is no longer the unhackable system."

Now lets start by breaking it down by sentence since you seem to have a problem comprehending a paragraph and how it each sentence relates to it.

1. The first step is getting into the base system and then build an OS from there.
Here is the article that says the base system was hacked.
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=232564
That means the first sentence holds true and the person who did it says he only has access to the base system and is still working on more which means he is making a fully working OS for it.

2. The PS3 base system was hacked.
See above

3. Now people are working on the rest.
May just be him, may be more. No way to really tell until the next news comes out. But again, the sentence still holds true.

4. The PS3 is no longer the unhackable system.
See sentence 2.

Now that we have established each individual sentence is true. Lets put them together and see what happens. This shall be fun!

The system was hacked, someone is working on expanding to a full working operating system. When that happens, free games. Not a very long jump in logic was it.


Edit: Sentence 3 might in fact not be true. The person who did this also did the iPhone hack. This person is unusually bright and might not even be a human. Do aliens fall into the "people" category?

Edited by SputnikGamer, May 19 2010, 8:52pm :

Jen Smith said,
... and there's no piracy on consoles?

DO you think it's ANYWHERE near as bad as it is for PC? No. Not even close. I can hop on bittorrent, download a game pre-cracked and install it straight up on a PC. For a console like the PS3 or 360... I have to jump through various hoops, installing modchips, hacking firmware, flashing chips, etc. It's far less prevalent on consoles as they are far more locked down and have much better security features built in (bar Wii).

It's far less of an issue, and certainly nothing that's going to greatly eat at your profits. About 95% of players on a consoles will be genuine copies. For a PC, it can hit lower than 40% in many cases, and PC game sales usually don't even hit the heights of console sales in the first place, and they sell for less money. It's just not a profitable business to sink millions into developing a game with basically no chance to recoup it.

Edited by ~Johnny, May 19 2010, 5:55pm :

Rudy said,
Actually on the PS3 there's none right now

Google something before you post absolute statements that are easy to disprove. One came out in January.

~Johnny said,

DO you think it's ANYWHERE near as bad as it is for PC? No. Not even close. I can hop on bittorrent, download a game pre-cracked and install it straight up on a PC. For a console like the PS3 or 360... I have to jump through various hoops, installing modchips, hacking firmware, flashing chips, etc. It's far less prevalent on consoles as they are far more locked down and have much better security features built in (bar Wii).

It's far less of an issue, and certainly nothing that's going to greatly eat at your profits. About 95% of players on a consoles will be genuine copies. For a PC, it can hit lower than 40% in many cases, and PC game sales usually don't even hit the heights of console sales in the first place, and they sell for less money. It's just not a profitable business to sink millions into developing a game with basically no chance to recoup it.

Almost every person I know with a 360, either has it modded, or has a modded one in addition to their regular one..

I'm one of the few that don't, and that's just because I don't play many games in general.. It's not worth the trouble.

Saying Piracy is the problem is a copout. Games are coming with DRM that makes the legit users unable to play, and the ones with the pirated one all the more able.. ( Have to be connected all the time to play.. **** that ****.. If I buy I game I wanna be able to play it where ever I am, not just when I'm online. ).. Apart from Steam, I stopped buying games that had any more than a single offline serial I could just enter and play.. if I have to connect, or validate my computer, or other bs. Sorry, no.

You make a game that's worth it, and you make it so it's not a pain to install, and people will buy it.. The more you make crap, and lock it down, the less people are gonna be interested in getting the legal copy.

SputnikGamer said,

Google something before you post absolute statements that are easy to disprove. One came out in January.

Please point me in the right direction because I can't find anything about it

Yes, I think I forgot to add the [sarcasm] tag on my original post As far as "jumping through hoops" though, I kind of disagree there. The only one that was tricky was my old original XBox, as I went the softmod route and had to do a hot-swap with the hard drive. My Wii was a piece of cake, maybe 15 minutes, one time deal. My daughter's Nintendo DS is absurdly easy, doesn't even need a mod. My brother in law says his 360 took all of 10 minutes. (Cannot comment on a PS3 though, zero experience there, but as I read it it's not crack-proof either.) If anything, I found consoles much easier to run *ahem* homebrew software; once it's modded, you're done. Download, burn, play. Just as easy, if not easier, than the PC, as once the unit is done, that's it. No hunting for cracks or whatnot.

Edited by Jen Smith, May 19 2010, 6:44pm :

SputnikGamer said,

Google something before you post absolute statements that are easy to disprove. One came out in January.

May I ask that you also kindly Google before you post absolute statements which are easy to disprove. As of now, it is still not possible to pirate games on the PS3.

~Johnny said,

DO you think it's ANYWHERE near as bad as it is for PC? No. Not even close. I can hop on bittorrent, download a game pre-cracked and install it straight up on a PC. For a console like the PS3 or 360... I have to jump through various hoops, installing modchips, hacking firmware, flashing chips, etc. It's far less prevalent on consoles as they are far more locked down and have much better security features built in (bar Wii).

It's far less of an issue, and certainly nothing that's going to greatly eat at your profits. About 95% of players on a consoles will be genuine copies. For a PC, it can hit lower than 40% in many cases, and PC game sales usually don't even hit the heights of console sales in the first place, and they sell for less money. It's just not a profitable business to sink millions into developing a game with basically no chance to recoup it.

Well, even for non tech people, it is quite easy to get pirate games...where I live it only takes a 10 min bus ride to downtown and pay 3 dollars for a game (6 if it just launched). As for the console, you can either get a modded one at the same places for no extra cost or pay 20 dollars to have it modded (with a 3 month warranty from the mod shop... ). Of course, a launch title around here cost 150 dollars (a guitar hero sort of game would cost around 500 dollars), so you get why people pirate games.

I, particularly, don't have a console and buy all my games from steam.

Piracy is still an issue for consoles, just not as big of an issue as on the PC, not to mention the market for used console games cutting into their profits. PC piracy is an excuse for them to make more money. Console games are cheaper and less complicated to develop than PC games due to console specified hardware and software. Its not even a good strategy, the large majority of pirates arent exactly going to be rushing out to buy a console now. Goodbye Epic, you're dead to me.

Only console gamers are dumb enough to pay for DLC, they can't get away with that on the PC. It's obviously more about milking customers than piracy.

buckhole said,
Only console gamers are dumb enough to pay for DLC, they can't get away with that on the PC. It's obviously more about milking customers than piracy.

It is true.

+1 Only noobsticks will continue to cough up money for things PC gamers have had, for free, since DOOM. Epic was always a second tier shooter anyway after the original UT, no big loss there.

Edited by Dashel, May 19 2010, 8:40pm :

buckhole said,
Only console gamers are dumb enough to pay for DLC, they can't get away with that on the PC. It's obviously more about milking customers than piracy.

Yeah, well, with this attitude, wouldn't then the developers just go consoles?

buckhole said,
Only console gamers are dumb enough to pay for DLC, they can't get away with that on the PC. It's obviously more about milking customers than piracy.

total bull****, the mw2 stimulus pack has been 1st place on steam top sellers until they released the sega pack, now its second, just like the mw2 boycot pc gamers are all talk no action

Consoles are sooo much easier to pirate. All you have to do is 1 hack and your good for MOST games. Non of this crack per game crap.

Really? I didn't think the PS3's were that easy to hack for pirating games although admittedly I've never really tried either.

Tim Dawg said,
Really? I didn't think the PS3's were that easy to hack for pirating games although admittedly I've never really tried either.

That's because the games are so dang big.

I was referring to the 360

and lets not forget the Wii, that is so easy to pirate games it's hilarious. You can use upload all the games iso's to an external hard drive and play them all off that.

Edited by warwagon, May 19 2010, 5:52pm :

That is such a cop out! MW2 had an insane amount of piracy for the CONSOLE prior to it's worldwide release. The money is with consoles right now. They're "cheaper" and more user-friendly. People have strayed from PC gaming because of advertising and how easy it is to just get a console and be able to use any game for it.. PC gaming is still strong but it's not how it used to be.

Money is with console, that's why you change from a PC gaming company to a Console gaming company.. Not because of piracy. Piracy is just as bad on the console as it is the PC, if not even worse. Duh.

Cupcakes said,
That is such a cop out! MW2 had an insane amount of piracy for the CONSOLE prior to it's worldwide release. The money is with consoles right now. They're "cheaper" and more user-friendly. People have strayed from PC gaming because of advertising and how easy it is to just get a console and be able to use any game for it.. PC gaming is still strong but it's not how it used to be.

Money is with console, that's why you change from a PC gaming company to a Console gaming company.. Not because of piracy. Piracy is just as bad on the console as it is the PC, if not even worse. Duh.

piracy is just the consumer friendly way thing to say. as a dev or a pub you can easily blame all of your problems and lack of PC support on on piracy.

"PC piracy drove us to consoles, says Epic Games"

"...And guess what? It's because the money's on console."

insert facepalm here

Deathray said,
"PC piracy drove us to consoles, says Epic Games"

"...And guess what? It's because the money's on console."

insert facepalm here

+1, It's not about PC Piracy, it's about the fact that PC gamers demand a certain level of quality and functionality that console users don't even have the option of getting due to the limitations of the consoles by design. Frankly, it takes less to develop for console, which means more profit from the same sale.

vaximily said,

+1, It's not about PC Piracy, it's about the fact that PC gamers demand a certain level of quality and functionality that console users don't even have the option of getting due to the limitations of the consoles by design. Frankly, it takes less to develop for console, which means more profit from the same sale.

It takes less to develop for a console and it gives a better result in the end.

I wouldn't call that “limitations of the consoles”. I would call that “uniform hardware”. It's very simple to develop games for just one type of hardware (for instance the PS3). But on the PC, good luck. You need to know which video cards you're gonna support, what specs each of them offer, what processor, how much memory, etc. Just this is a long process where you end up losing money.

vaximily said,

+1, It's not about PC Piracy, it's about the fact that PC gamers demand a certain level of quality and functionality that console users don't even have the option of getting due to the limitations of the consoles by design. Frankly, it takes less to develop for console, which means more profit from the same sale.

I don't think it takes less, being that a lot of the premise technology and hardware is similar. As soon as hall consoles are hooked up to the internet, as most are now, you will see patches there as well.

PsykX said,

It takes less to develop for a console and it gives a better result in the end.

I wouldn't call that “limitations of the consoles”. I would call that “uniform hardware”. It's very simple to develop games for just one type of hardware (for instance the PS3). But on the PC, good luck. You need to know which video cards you're gonna support, what specs each of them offer, what processor, how much memory, etc. Just this is a long process where you end up losing money.


i disagree about the end result being better.

anytime i play a shooter on a console all i can think about is how much better it would be on a PC. how much better it would look, how much more fun and easy to get in multiplayer would be.

it just costs less to develop for consoles, especially for the long out of date 360.

not to mention many of these console only devs refuse to sell their games on steam or d2d, which would give them a bigger cut of the profits and probably a rise in sales, not the least of which is due to drm or the fact that game stores tend to only order enough copies of pc titles to fill preorders.

PsykX said,

It takes less to develop for a console and it gives a better result in the end.

I wouldn't call that “limitations of the consoles”. I would call that “uniform hardware”. It's very simple to develop games for just one type of hardware (for instance the PS3). But on the PC, good luck. You need to know which video cards you're gonna support, what specs each of them offer, what processor, how much memory, etc. Just this is a long process where you end up losing money.

It is not that MUCH complicated, most likely the same code they write will run on most video cards.

Deathray said,
"PC piracy drove us to consoles, says Epic Games"

"...And guess what? It's because the money's on console."

insert facepalm here

Maybe it's that because they were exclusively PC, when piracy pushed them to console, and they realized they did better there? Poor word choice, I'm gonna leave it as.

treemonster said,

it just costs less to develop for consoles, especially for the long out of date 360.

And how is that? Most multiconsole games are basically the exact same in game play on the ps3 and the 360 with the 360 in most cases having slightly better graphics, so i can't see how that is outdated

Both the PS3 and 360 fully support all current technologies game developers use when developing games so neither could possibly be outdated, or well they are just now catching up with motion controls, but that's just so old now

As for the piracy, well get your brains working and create a pirate protection that doesnt bother the paying customers. Also, UT3 is mostly multilayer, piracy can't have been half as bad as for some other games

vaximily said,
It's not about PC Piracy, it's about the fact that PC gamers demand a certain level of quality and functionality

I think its both. But it is very true about quality. PC version usually gets lower ratings an more bashing from PC gamers than its Console alternative. I guess this is the reason why user ratings and comments are disabled for some PC games during marketing campaigns.

Leonick said,

And how is that? Most multiconsole games are basically the exact same in game play on the ps3 and the 360 with the 360 in most cases having slightly better graphics, so i can't see how that is outdated

Both the PS3 and 360 fully support all current technologies game developers use when developing games so neither could possibly be outdated, or well they are just now catching up with motion controls, but that's just so old now

As for the piracy, well get your brains working and create a pirate protection that doesnt bother the paying customers. Also, UT3 is mostly multilayer, piracy can't have been half as bad as for some other games


Well if you compare console to PC
Consoles are wayyyyyyyyyyyy outta date
I just look at the graphics on consoles and nearly throw up
YUCK


zeta_immersion said,
get a life man, as if there is no piracy for consoles?

I suspect his life is very good. And PC piracy, if you're ignorant enough to not realise this, is FAR worse than console piracy.

Spirit Dave said,

I suspect his life is very good. And PC piracy, if you're ignorant enough to not realise this, is FAR worse than console piracy.

And if you are smart enough to read, you should know zeta never said that it wasn't worse on PC, he simply stated that it also exists on consoles.

Edited by SputnikGamer, May 19 2010, 5:49pm :

Spirit Dave said,

I suspect his life is very good. And PC piracy, if you're ignorant enough to not realise this, is FAR worse than console piracy.

I;m not sure but where I live console piracy is a million times worse. Consoles needs no cracks and crazy **** like that, just a modded console and the game which is much easier to get to play than on PC.

zeta_immersion said,
get a life man, as if there is no piracy for consoles?

you are so... i loled for 1 hour and now i can't see straight

Edited by Sebianoti, May 19 2010, 6:40pm :

SputnikGamer said,

And if you are smart enough to read, you should know zeta never said that it wasn't worse on PC, he simply stated that it also exists on consoles.

lol ... the implication of his sentence suggested that he was in fact comparing the piracy on PC's to the piracy of consoles. Or he'd not have brought up piracy on consoles in a PC piracy related news article. Your post fails. My post still stands.

Spirit Dave said,

lol ... the implication of his sentence suggested that he was in fact comparing the piracy on PC's to the piracy of consoles. Or he'd not have brought up piracy on consoles in a PC piracy related news article. Your post fails. My post still stands.

His post is comparing a state of existence, not degree of existence. Does piracy exist on PC, yes. Does it increase on consoles, yes. You are the the one that put your bias into it.

Glendi said,

I;m not sure but where I live console piracy is a million times worse. Consoles needs no cracks and crazy **** like that, just a modded console and the game which is much easier to get to play than on PC.

I never realized how big the console piracy is until I got an Xbox 360 last year. There are tons of places here which sell games for $3.5 or $4.0 (even with a printed cover and case!).

On the other hand, PC piracy is almost done individually on each home.

Maybe by comparing figures, they would be almost equal.

Sebianoti said,

not really... i understand! they lose money a lot of money on PC

The reason they lose alot of money on the PC is twofold...

Firstly because they think it's acceptable to release half-finished, buggy games on the PC in a "release now, patch later" attitude. Secondly, treating customers as potential pirates is also a major culprit of declining sales.

I will never buy another PC game that includes invasive DRM that treats me as a potential pirate rather than a loyal customer. I will also not buy another PC game on the day of release. I will wait for reviews and a patch or two before doing so. I will not pay for the privilege of being a beta tester for companies unwilling to devote the necessary resources into testing their game sufficiently prior to release.

Fix these two issues Epic (and the rest of you games publishers), and you'll get a customer back.

TCLN Ryster said,

The reason they lose alot of money on the PC is twofold...

Firstly because they think it's acceptable to release half-finished, buggy games on the PC in a "release now, patch later" attitude. Secondly, treating customers as potential pirates is also a major culprit of declining sales.

I will never buy another PC game that includes invasive DRM that treats me as a potential pirate rather than a loyal customer. I will also not buy another PC game on the day of release. I will wait for reviews and a patch or two before doing so. I will not pay for the privilege of being a beta tester for companies unwilling to devote the necessary resources into testing their game sufficiently prior to release.

Fix these two issues Epic (and the rest of you games publishers), and you'll get a customer back.

Think of Starcraft 2. There is a massive beta community and testing has been huge. However, I still believe that a patch will be released soon after the release of the game. It's just the nature of the beast in a more advanced development cycle that we live in now.

ccoltmanm said,

Think of Starcraft 2. There is a massive beta community and testing has been huge. However, I still believe that a patch will be released soon after the release of the game. It's just the nature of the beast in a more advanced development cycle that we live in now.

Not the greatest example, yeah there will probably be a patch after SC2 launches but only because Blizzard is awesome with supporting their products, not because SC2 will be buggy. I have both SC2 Beta and Gears of War PC, SC2 *beta* is far more of a polished product than Gears of War PC retail release. In fact you can't even run Gears of War PC fresh off the disc without jumping through some hoops to get the patches installed first.

Epic has failed miserably with their PC releases of both Gears of War and Unreal Tournament III and now they are trying to blame their failure on pirates. Both games had pathetic dumbed down multiplayer options that is acceptable on a console but not on PC, that is why they sold so poorly. I mean look at how horrible the Windows Live features are, Epic is full of ****. I have zero interest in their products now.

Edited by Treemonkeys, May 19 2010, 6:46pm :

TCLN Ryster said,

The reason they lose alot of money on the PC is twofold...

Firstly because they think it's acceptable to release half-finished, buggy games on the PC in a "release now, patch later" attitude. Secondly, treating customers as potential pirates is also a major culprit of declining sales.

I will never buy another PC game that includes invasive DRM that treats me as a potential pirate rather than a loyal customer. I will also not buy another PC game on the day of release. I will wait for reviews and a patch or two before doing so. I will not pay for the privilege of being a beta tester for companies unwilling to devote the necessary resources into testing their game sufficiently prior to release.

Fix these two issues Epic (and the rest of you games publishers), and you'll get a customer back.

You would still need to pay for the game. Therefore doing the above is pointless. Only those who lack common sense would buy something free - piracy would still be logically preferred.

You just want a more finished, no DRM product so you wouldn't have to crack it when you pirate it.

Udedenkz said,

You would still need to pay for the game. Therefore doing the above is pointless. Only those who lack common sense would buy something free - piracy would still be logically preferred.

You just want a more finished, no DRM product so you wouldn't have to crack it when you pirate it.


The only PC game I've ever pirated is one that I already owned but had lost the disc for, and that was Star Trek Bridge Commander. I can afford games, I just choose not to buy them if they're riddled with DRM (Red Alert 3, Settlers 7, Bioshock 2, etc) or widely known to be buggy as hell. Apps on the other hand are a different kettle of fish... I've got things like Dreamweaver and Photoshop that I use for dabbling in a bit of web design. I "aquire" them free of charge because I can't afford them, therefore there's no lost sale

TCLN Ryster said,

The reason they lose alot of money on the PC is twofold...

Firstly because they think it's acceptable to release half-finished, buggy games on the PC in a "release now, patch later" attitude. Secondly, treating customers as potential pirates is also a major culprit of declining sales.

I will never buy another PC game that includes invasive DRM that treats me as a potential pirate rather than a loyal customer. I will also not buy another PC game on the day of release. I will wait for reviews and a patch or two before doing so. I will not pay for the privilege of being a beta tester for companies unwilling to devote the necessary resources into testing their game sufficiently prior to release.

Fix these two issues Epic (and the rest of you games publishers), and you'll get a customer back.

+1

Treemonkeys said,

Not the greatest example, yeah there will probably be a patch after SC2 launches but only because Blizzard is awesome with supporting their products, not because SC2 will be buggy. I have both SC2 Beta and Gears of War PC, SC2 *beta* is far more of a polished product than Gears of War PC retail release. In fact you can't even run Gears of War PC fresh off the disc without jumping through some hoops to get the patches installed first.

Epic has failed miserably with their PC releases of both Gears of War and Unreal Tournament III and now they are trying to blame their failure on pirates. Both games had pathetic dumbed down multiplayer options that is acceptable on a console but not on PC, that is why they sold so poorly. I mean look at how horrible the Windows Live features are, Epic is full of ****. I have zero interest in their products now.

This 100%