Report: Windows 8.1 Update 1 defaults to desktop on startup

WZor.net has been leaking a number of screenshots in the past few weeks showing off some of the features that Microsoft is reportedly putting into Windows 8.1 Update 1. Today, the site is not only posting up some new images from a recent build, but it has also revealed that it makes a PC start to the desktop UI by default.

If the site's report is indeed accurate, this would be a complete 180 compared to the launch of Windows 8 in October 2012, when users had no choice but to start up a PC with the Modern UI Start screen. The release of Windows 8.1 allowed people to go into the operating system's settings after it was installed and change it so that a PC boots to the desktop UI. This new tweak for Update 1 means that Microsoft has now realized that most Windows 8 and 8.1 users prefer the desktop interface to the Start screen.

WZor.net has posted a few more screenshots from the latest build that show how the pull-down menus look for the Microsoft Account and Power icons in the upper right corner of the Start screen. Update 1 is expected to be released sometime later this quarter, with a recent report claiming it will be released to users on March 11.

Source: WZor.net | Image via WZor.net

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Microsoft is not changing windows 8 but, for the fact a desktop or laptop will now boot in to the desktop and the start menu is back. If people hate it then change it back to metro screen.

Personally I could careless Windows 8 sucks and I will never use it. I see Windows 8 as a PR stunt to get people to buy the Windows phone.

People are buying Window Phones? I saw one person with a windows phone 2 years ago and they still have it. Then 3 weeks ago the bartender at the local had the big phablet windows phone. Those are the only 2 windows phones I have ever seen in my life.

All of my customers will be thrilled to hear this, well maybe. I don't think they so much mind that it doesn't boot to the desktop, they just hate the start screen. Every customer i've talked to with the exception of maybe 2, hates windows 8.

Then there is that one customer of mine who bought a new computer with windows 8 and finally after 14 support calls (most of which I didn't charge him for) finally just put on him Classic shell.

It's times like that where i would like to send him over to a "Certain someone" and let him bug the **** out of him 14 times. Maybe he can convince him how awesome windows 8 is.

People will say "Isn't this your job?" .. yes it is, but having someone call you 14 times of which you aren't getting paid for most of them, because $21.40 x 14 would be $300 worth of phone support.

Curious, but why did it take 14 calls and a $300 loss for you to finally decide on a Start menu replacement to shut him up? Surely by now that should be SOP when you encounter someone who's rabidly anti Start screen. A single call, don't like the Start screen, here you go, Classic Shell or Start8 or whatever, end of story, don't bug me again about this or you pay. Simple. I would fire any employee in a heartbeat if he offered $300 worth of free phone support on my time/dime.

Edited by Romero, Feb 2 2014, 7:20pm :

So, my Xbox boots to a Start Screen.
My Windows Phone boots to a Start Screen.
My PC is now going to boot to the desktop, because, why?

Dot Matrix said,
So, my Xbox boots to a Start Screen.
My Windows Phone boots to a Start Screen.
My PC is now going to boot to the desktop, because, why?

Hard to say. We'll see if this leak has any truth to it, seems that some have reported inconsistencies in whether boot to desktop is a default behavior or not.

"Update: Microsoft is still testing and tweaking this update, and we're told you can't always replicate the boot to desktop changes."

http://www.theverge.com/2014/1...-boot-to-desktop-by-default

Atlantico said,

Hard to say. We'll see if this leak has any truth to it, seems that some have reported inconsistencies in whether boot to desktop is a default behavior or not.

"Update: Microsoft is still testing and tweaking this update, and we're told you can't always replicate the boot to desktop changes."

http://www.theverge.com/2014/1...-boot-to-desktop-by-default

Which is why it should all just boot to the Start Screen. It makes no sense to destroy that unity.

xWhiplash said,
For the billionth time, Xbox or Phone != PC.

It makes sense that the user experience is consistent over all platforms, that is the One Microsoft policy. Agree or disagree, I'm sure Microsoft would be thrilled to hear your opinion on the matter.

However, Windows does run on Tablets, Laptops and PCs. Same exact OS. Three different form factors. There's bound to be consistency needed between those three, running the exact same OS, if not them and the phones and consoles.

Oh and ≠
It's easy to write on computers in 2014

Dot Matrix said,
So, my Xbox boots to a Start Screen.
My Windows Phone boots to a Start Screen.
My PC is now going to boot to the desktop, because, why?

Maybe because a PC has a desktop and the others not, you tell us Einstein.

Okay buddy, tell me how to write the not equals sign? I do not have that on my keyboard. And if you are talking about Alt + 1234 or some of those types of characters, you can forget it. I am not going to research it to make a post. Obviously you do not program. != is valid.

Atlantico said,

Oh and ≠
It's easy to write on computers in 2014

huh? Anyone who knows logic on computers knows != is not equals

Borix said,

Maybe because a PC has a desktop and the others not, you tell us Einstein.

So, what's the difference between my XBox and my desktop? They both run the same hardware.

Dot Matrix said,
My PC is now going to boot to the desktop, because, why?
Because, whiners.

There's already an option in 8.1 so who cares what the default is, but obviously for some people locating and checking that box and hitting OK is such a huge chore. I mean, obviously only people with an advanced PhD in CompSc can manage such an intricate manoeuvre.

Just give it up and focus on something else. Let the default be flipped, why let it bother you? You do the steps it takes to turn it off and get back to the Start screen, unless you think it's too hard as well? Until Microsoft puts in place an option screen for everything during install (at which point people will no doubt complain about how they need to answer so many irritating questions before getting to use the OS) one bunch of people will always "win" out over the other when it comes to what the default setting is. Don't look at it as if you "lost" the battle against Metro haters. Let it go and be happy as long as the choice is still there.

P.S. Device detection during install is another solution but that still won't satisfy those like you who prefer booting to the Start screen on a desktop.

If the "source" is claiming that Windows will boot to desktop by default on *all devices* then I have to question the common sense of people who take such complete tosh seriously.

No way, no how, will a Windows tablet start up in Desktop by default. Ever.

That being said, it would be very smart if the default would depend on what kind of computer one is using. A person with his tower and non-touch monitor would default into desktop, etc.

That's just smart thinking and a natural evolution of the OS,

For those who want to see a complete disaster of an OS and how it mixes touch screen elements in a stupid way into a desktop system, look no further than the Mac OS X. That's by far the most mind boggling idiotic UI that is currently offered to desktop users.

Features moved wholesale from a touchscreen OS to desktop where touch isn't even an option: Mac OS X

People whine incessantly about the "teleport" effect when the Windows key is pushed in Windows 8.x but have they ever tried the Mac? Open a program an you may be teleported into the program's "full screen" mode without ever asking, cut off from the desktop, cut off from all familiar desktop interface and menus. Just by opening a program, but not all programs. Just some programs, and depending on how that program was set to behave. It makes Windows 8 look like a masterpiece of UI engineering.

Not to mention the Mac OS X behavior of not quitting apps when the user tells it to, but does it in its own time, whenever it feels like it - and that it will quit an open app even if the user does not. It's quite amazing it it's awfulness and is somewhat offensive to use.

When making a case against Windows 8, do yourselves a favor and don't point to the Mac as a better example of "how it should be done" because goodness knows the reverse is true.

Atlantico said,
If the "source" is claiming that Windows will boot to desktop by default on *all devices* then I have to question the common sense of people who take such complete tosh seriously.

No way, no how, will a Windows tablet start up in Desktop by default. Ever.

That being said, it would be very smart if the default would depend on what kind of computer one is using. A person with his tower and non-touch monitor would default into desktop, etc.

That's just smart thinking and a natural evolution of the OS,

For those who want to see a complete disaster of an OS and how it mixes touch screen elements in a stupid way into a desktop system, look no further than the Mac OS X. That's by far the most mind boggling idiotic UI that is currently offered to desktop users.

Features moved wholesale from a touchscreen OS to desktop where touch isn't even an option: Mac OS X

People whine incessantly about the "teleport" effect when the Windows key is pushed in Windows 8.x but have they ever tried the Mac? Open a program an you may be teleported into the program's "full screen" mode without ever asking, cut off from the desktop, cut off from all familiar desktop interface and menus. Just by opening a program, but not all programs. Just some programs, and depending on how that program was set to behave. It makes Windows 8 look like a masterpiece of UI engineering.

Not to mention the Mac OS X behavior of not quitting apps when the user tells it to, but does it in its own time, whenever it feels like it - and that it will quit an open app even if the user does not. It's quite amazing it it's awfulness and is somewhat offensive to use.

When making a case against Windows 8, do yourselves a favor and don't point to the Mac as a better example of "how it should be done" because goodness knows the reverse is true.

Fullscreen is an option set by the USER on a mac. This behaviour is now copied by MS.
Don't talk crap bout things you no nothing about!!

Microsoft flipping about again, if true.

Personally, I prefer launching to Metro, but whatever, so long as I can choose to launch to Metro by default on my desktop and my tablets, then I don't care what the default is.

I agree, as long as the choice is there for the user to decide who cares what the default is set to? I rarely agree with most of Windows' default settings anyway. A bout of tinkering is the first thing I do after every fresh install.

It will be nice to see some re-emphasis on the desktop. I would love to see enhancements such as synchronization of my desktop icons and taskbar apps across my Pc's for example. Or how about a system refresh option that will lift; not just the Metro apps, but the desktop apps too, and put them back after a refresh. Wishful thinking there.

I gave Win 8 the benefit of the doubt the whole way through this journey, and most of the changes they are making were most certainly on my hit list. At the top of my list was the lack of an X to close an app Window. Just not intuitive to swipe down the length of a 30" screen, even though it looks kind of cool when it is happening.

My experiment has concluded that at my desk I use the mouse, and keyboard and the desktop, and on my tablet and even the laptop I use Metro. Maybe Ballmer could end his career by running around the stage when he splits chanting, "discoverability, discoverability, discoverability"!

Looks like Microsoft are finally making positive progress towards Windows 9. Great to see

If it detects a PC/Desktop and boots to desktop, and boots to metro on a tablet, then that is one of the things I can cross off my list of things that are broken with 8/8.1

Edited by Anarkii, Jan 31 2014, 2:58am :

All we need now is a Start Menu and then we are cooking. I know a few folks who go out of their way to skip the Start Screen and the Windows Store

Great... they f up my desktop experience. Now they'll f up my tablet experience. Microsoft is made up of a bunch of bozos.

I'll wait for the release version before commenting, because unlike you I'm not going to assume that the OS won't detect the type of device and configure defaults accordingly. Also, I'm sure choices will be provided so one can always turn these off on a tablet.

You make a good point, I am making an assumption here. I'm basing it on their previous decisions to make things more restrictive in this current OS (my opinion).

Going by these very changes I'm hoping they've learnt their lesson about the drawbacks of being too restrictive and removing choice from users' hands. As long as there is choice I am happy, and I don't give a rat's a** what the default setting is. I disagree with so many Windows defaults anyway and change them after installation, so what're a few more?

Now put those touch metro start menu squares into a small window that takes up just as much as a phone screen would, and we have a proper interface for launching applications on a PC in addition to the Desktop.

This is good for enterprise adoption on desktops. Until you can completely control all aspects of Modern UI with GPOs, you need to be able to help users avoid as much of it as possible.

I'm agitated. It feels like Microsoft doesn't know what they want to do, and that to me is more troubling than them having a clear direction.

I realize they may have HAD a clear direction, but their direction should be in the way of what people want, not against. Just like with the Xbox decisions, I really wish they had surveyed more people or something. It seems they're not connecting well enough with their audience. Why create something or announce something only to have to change it later on? Bleh.

(inb4 hurr durr u hate ms!! I like Windows 8.1 and the Xbox One now)

dead.cell said,
I'm agitated. It feels like Microsoft doesn't know what they want to do, and that to me is more troubling than them having a clear direction.

I realize they may have HAD a clear direction, but their direction should be in the way of what people want, not against. Just like with the Xbox decisions, I really wish they had surveyed more people or something. It seems they're not connecting well enough with their audience. Why create something or announce something only to have to change it later on? Bleh.

(inb4 hurr durr u hate ms!! I like Windows 8.1 and the Xbox One now)

So they can get everything ironed out for Windows 9? Windows 9 should be epic! =)

Scabrat said,
So they can get everything ironed out for Windows 9? Windows 9 should be epic! =)

I hope so! Good bad good bad seems to be the ongoing trend. Here's hoping Windows 9 will be something I want!

Scabrat said,

So they can get everything ironed out for Windows 9? Windows 9 should be epic! =)


If they make windows 9 just like windows 7 but with the new file explorer, task explorer, better performance and newer standards support that windows 8 have nearly everyone will love windows 9.

dead.cell said,
I realize they may have HAD a clear direction, but their direction should be in the way of what people want, not against.
Seems to me they're doing these things precisely because it's what people in general wanted and complained about incessantly.

As for surveying more people, nothing signals that you lack all sense of direction than designing by committee, or worse, based on a free-for-all gaggle of disparate voices all voting for different things. If they weren't confused before, they surely will be if they switch to a crowd-sourced design philosophy. In any case, the most vocal people are either company haters or those who can never be classified as your average Joe clueless user sitting at home, neither of whom represent the vast majority of their non-enterprise customers I'm sure.

Romero said,
Seems to me they're doing these things precisely because it's what people in general wanted and complained about incessantly.

As for surveying more people, nothing signals that you lack all sense of direction than designing by committee, or worse, based on a free-for-all gaggle of disparate voices all voting for different things. If they weren't confused before, they surely will be if they switch to a crowd-sourced design philosophy. In any case, the most vocal people are either company haters or those who can never be classified as your average Joe clueless user sitting at home, neither of whom represent the vast majority of their non-enterprise customers I'm sure.


Well, they seem pretty clueless otherwise. 8.1 and the continuous updates seem to be due to listening to public feedback so... /shrug

Personally, I think they need to think out their philosophies in design a bit better. Windows Phone they did a pretty awesome job with. Windows 8 on the other hand... a lot of it just doesn't make sense. There are settings even between 8 to 8.1 that moved around or seem to be more difficult to get to because... hell, I don't even have a good answer for some of the changes.

It's a bit disappointing as a Windows user. Still, I have hopes for 9 at least.

dead.cell said,
Personally, I think they need to think out their philosophies in design a bit better.
I agree with you here. Seems to me they've never had someone responsible for maintaining strict UI consistency and adherence to guidelines across all aspects of the OS. Heck, if you look beyond Windows the situation's even worse. One of the worst offenders by far has always been the Office team. They almost never follow MS' own UI guidelines (which third party app developers are also supposed to follow) and always end up with some sort of non-standard UI. Of course now things like the ribbon are semi-standard in the OS too, so perhaps one can make a case for them being the forward-thinking ones.

Good. Perhaps Microsoft is starting to realize that you can't optimize for all devices at once. Different experiences for different formats is what Apple and Google are doing, and for good reason.

I would like device-specific UI layers too, but I also prefer Microsoft's approach of having a single base OS across different form factors. That way I can still run my desktop apps on a tablet if I want, or carry the tablet around, dock it and use my desktop apps as usual with a larger screen. Far, far more preferable to the OS X/iOS split. Once Microsoft brings about more API parity between Windows, Windows RT+Phone, XBox etc. it should be a huge boost to app developers too since their creations will run unmodified on various devices.

Problem is.... there arent the good quality apps on Windows that you can get on android or mac... if they had all of those great apps it would give you a reason to use the Metro screen.

NerdyTech said,
Problem is.... there arent the good quality apps on Windows that you can get on android or mac... if they had all of those great apps it would give you a reason to use the Metro screen.

I have found the app selection perfectly fine. What apps and features am I missing out on then? =)

If they'd done this from the beginning, Windows 8 might have made a better impression. Windows 7 went down a storm and then they turned around and blew it. But just as the ropey launch sunk Vista, this did the same with 8.

Now they just need to push out Windows 9 and put this one to bed.

And stop goofing up.

Jeez Microsoft.

Notice that the OneDrive name has replaced the SkyDrive name of the SkyDrive tile in the start screen screenshot of Windows 8.1 Update 1.

I seriously doubt this. Doesn't make sense. If you're going to boot to desktop, why have Metro at all? Just scrap it, stay with the antiquated UI of yesteryear and call it a day.


That being said, the most I see them doing is giving people a choice, not completely strapping on roller skates.

This is great news if true, took them long enough to realize the errors of their initial judgment though. This is the way it should have been from the get go!

What I would like to see is the Start screen showing the actual time; I would say either way on the left or the right upper side of the screen.

Raa said,
Then do not use.

It's mine. I'll use it if I like. This is not the way forward. You get to dictate how the OS I use is designed and I don't. Unacceptable.

Eric said,

It's mine. I'll use it if I like. This is not the way forward. You get to dictate how the OS I use is designed and I don't. Unacceptable.


Well, it works both ways, doesn't it?

Lord Method Man said,
Then just stick with Windows 8 if you want Windows 8.

Why? It was fine the way it was. I'm not the one expecting a different OS from what was designed.

Eric said,

Why? It was fine the way it was. I'm not the one expecting a different OS from what was designed.


Others did not; what is the problem with having options to "tailor" the OS the way you like it? Customizability was what made Windows successful.

Eric said,

Why? It was fine the way it was. I'm not the one expecting a different OS from what was designed.


Then quite clearly the solution is you should have the option to use it how you want, and I should have the option to use it how I want.

Jarrichvdv said,

People who don't like Metro also voice their opinion very clearly, so he's also entitled to share his.
Who's stopping him?

ozzy76 said,
Who's stopping him?

Harsh reactions like 'Then do not use' are very direct and may cause the poster of the comment to not want to voice his opinion any more on this site, which'd be unfortunate.

Jarrichvdv said,

Harsh reactions like 'Then do not use' are very direct and may cause the poster of the comment to not want to voice his opinion any more on this site, which'd be unfortunate.

Agreed. But remember it works both ways - hence my follow up post.

You guys CANNOT be serious right? What did YOU guys tell us when Windows 8 first came out? "Just use Windows 7" and WE have been saying "It was working perfectly fine before". How does it feel to be on the other side now?

Jarrichvdv said,

Harsh reactions like 'Then do not use' are very direct and may cause the poster of the comment to not want to voice his opinion any more on this site, which'd be unfortunate.
Not sure if I'm being trolled with this answer; reading opposing viewpoints and engaging in healthy discussion about a wide variety of topics (video games, software, sports, etc) is what makes forums so popular and active on the Internet.

ozzy76 said,
Not sure if I'm being trolled with this answer; reading opposing viewpoints and engaging in healthy discussion about a wide variety of topics (video games, software, sports, etc) is what makes forums so popular and active on the Internet.

Not trolling you, and I was spreaking specifically about the comment of Raa.

Here's an idea Microsoft..... when you first set up the PC/Tablet *ask* the user if they want a touch interface or a desktop interface. Then tailor the experience thusly:

Tablet: all the metro goodies and start screen
Desktop: standard desktop with a normal start menu

Litespeed said,
Here's an idea Microsoft..... when you first set up the PC/Tablet *ask* the user if they want a touch interface or a desktop interface. Then tailor the experience thusly:

Tablet: all the metro goodies and start screen
Desktop: standard desktop with a normal start menu

this +100000000 billion trillion

metro even the first win 8 version was fine for TOUCH devices, but it sucked major ass on desktop with a moue and keyboard.

Either have an automated process where touch devices go to Start screen, desktop pcs boot to desktop. or better ask the user/have an easy control panel option to switch between the 2.

i like have many programs running simultaneously on my dual 2560x1440 screens, i dont want a full screen of color for a music app!!!

http://i.imgur.com/huB0Inl.jpg

This.

* Exclusive use Off = Windows 8 as we know it now, both start screen and the desktop applications.

* Exclusive use On as Windows 8 Modern UI Style = No Desktop access, Metro only applications.
* Exclusive use On as Classic Desktop = No Metro applications, no start screen Just the desktop with a start menu. Back just as we had in Windows 7.

If Microsoft had included this simple toggle from the outset, Windows 8 probably would have steam rolled Windows 7.

Unfortunately, as it stands, Windows 8 is a mess that Microsoft are using to try and force their latent ecosystem on to everyone before it's too late for them... and in doing so might be their downfall.

Litespeed said,
Here's an idea Microsoft..... when you first set up the PC/Tablet *ask* the user if they want a touch interface or a desktop interface. Then tailor the experience thusly:

Tablet: all the metro goodies and start screen
Desktop: standard desktop with a normal start menu

+infinity for choice! some people on here are so anti-choice it's scary...

I've been a Windows user for years (and some years more) and there are a lot of settings and options that could be visible to the user but nooo.

Then there are these new 'features' like Libraries. The idea is great but the implementation is too simple (and stupid) and I end up wasting my time disabling it. In Windows 7 the only way to hide the Libraries line in explorer (if you don't use it) is to edit the registry (if memory serves). What the *?! In Windows 8 it can actually be hidden with a switch!

The same goes for Homegroup. I always share all my drives completely anyway so it is useless for me. But it can actually be disabled with the mouse even though there aren't any options for it. No registry tweaks required. Bet you didn't know that, did ya?

And WHY couldn't they include an OPTION to use the old desktop/start menu OR the new stuff in the first place? WHY was it removed? I actually like the Modern UI but it just isn't for a desktop PC. So I have bought Start8 to do the job. How hard can it be to add one more switch on the initial setup screen with a description text/image for it? Or maybe the start menu was so enormous that it would have taken up too much space? Start8 is about 14 mb. Obviously too difficult to implement.

Why it is so unthinkable to include some form of GUI for editing advanced settings and give users more customization options?

I really love Windows, I really do, but it drives me nuts to always tweak hidden stuff that should be simple on/off switches on the control panel. I hate it.

CAP-Team said,
Maybe if we complain long enough Microsoft will give us Aero Glass back too

I sure hope so. The Windows 8 visual style is too bright/colorful and quite distracting. Windows proper shadows to hint at layering and depth.

Could be worse.

Could be the all blinding white and horrible primitive looking graphics of Office 2013. Even with a browser looking at images of office 2013 I want to lower the brightness on my monitor and missed the classy gradients and crisp textures of office 2010.

I really hope Windows 9 does not follow the same visual guidelines as Office 2013 with no color, no distinctiveness between the ribbon and the work, and so minimalist it looks like EGA PC jr style graphics.

If they ever did that, and I doubt they would, I hope it would be the version that was used in the CP of Windows 8. The pixelated rounded corners drove me nuts for six years.

CAP-Team said,
Maybe if we complain long enough Microsoft will give us Aero Glass back too

I would lose all hope in humanity in general. And MS. Glass was fine, I really liked it. But its time has passed.

Good to see a gradual move back towards the desktop for non-tablet users. It's just as well Sinofsky is gone - I don't think he would have allowed this kind of backpedaling.

This will likely be the case for non touch-first devices only.

I think Microsoft finally accepts the fact that there are two experiences on top of the same OS. One for touch-first devices, the other for desktop oriented computing.

Finally.

Odd that they would do that. The vast majority of people love Metro and the Start Screen and its just a small vocal minority of trolls on Neowin who don't like it...

Lord Method Man said,
Odd that they would do that. The vast majority of people love Metro and the Start Screen and its just a small vocal minority of trolls on Neowin who don't like it...

You sir made me laugh so hard I spit my drink out. Bravo!

Lord Method Man said,
Odd that they would do that. The vast majority of people love Metro and the Start Screen and its just a small vocal minority of trolls on Neowin who don't like it...

I don't 100% agree with that, I've came across a lot of average people that just hate how it's laid out now.. and they aren't people on tech blogs or sites like this, they are people that just want things to work how they knew it worked. I've heard a lot and I mean a lot of average desktop users start asking how they get windows back to how XP and 7 was because of various reasons... mainly they don't like how the new start screen works..

Lord Method Man said,
Odd that they would do that. The vast majority of people love Metro and the Start Screen and its just a small vocal minority of trolls on Neowin who don't like it...

I hope you just forgot the /s..

neufuse said,

I don't 100% agree with that, I've came across a lot of average people that just hate how it's laid out now.. and they aren't people on tech blogs or sites like this, they are people that just want things to work how they knew it worked. I've heard a lot and I mean a lot of average desktop users start asking how they get windows back to how XP and 7 was because of various reasons... mainly they don't like how the new start screen works..

I know people at work who have switched to LibreOffice at home because they hate the ribbon so much.

They love the way things were in the gold old days with XP, IE 6/8, and Office 2003. Windows 7 was too scary with all the ribbons and no menus with things like explorer and wordpad etc. Windows 8 HA they just go back to their XP boxes after returning them.

People really do not want anything different and I have not met a single person besides myself and those on neowin who like the ribbon or Metro. I am still looking too.

I feel MS caved in obviously as the paying customers just do not want to switch. I wonder if the menu will come back with office 2014 too?

sinetheo said,

I know people at work who have switched to LibreOffice at home because they hate the ribbon so much.

They love the way things were in the gold old days with XP, IE 6/8, and Office 2003. Windows 7 was too scary with all the ribbons and no menus with things like explorer and wordpad etc. Windows 8 HA they just go back to their XP boxes after returning them.

People really do not want anything different and I have not met a single person besides myself and those on neowin who like the ribbon or Metro. I am still looking too.

I feel MS caved in obviously as the paying customers just do not want to switch. I wonder if the menu will come back with office 2014 too?


I didn't like the Ribbon initially, so I skipped Office 2007. By Office 2010 it set in they weren't going back though so I upgraded from 2003 to 2010 (64bit). I don't like the current Metro either so I have no plans to buy Office 2013 but I'll probably get whatever the next version is after they've refined it further. I have no plans to purchase Windows 8.x because of Metro but there is a good chance I'll get Windows 9. That said I did go from Win98SE to Win2k instead of ME and I did buy Vista so I'm perfectly happy jumping on board early if I like what they're offering.

At work they there is no chance they are going to buy Windows 8.x because of Metro on the desktops and I'm pretty sure they're going to stay with Office 2010 as well. A whole new UI is something they don't want people to have to learn on the job and we have ZERO touchscreens on desktops nor any plans to add them. (We do have touchscreens on mobile devices but we went all Android after MS broke compatibility in the Windows Mobile -> Windows Phone break) For servers the UI is not but so important, so we stay current.

neufuse said,

I don't 100% agree with that, I've came across a lot of average people that just hate how it's laid out now.. and they aren't people on tech blogs or sites like this, they are people that just want things to work how they knew it worked. I've heard a lot and I mean a lot of average desktop users start asking how they get windows back to how XP and 7 was because of various reasons... mainly they don't like how the new start screen works..

Yep me too, and when I say a lot of people I basically mean everyone I've talked to about windows 8.

Lord Method Man said,
Odd that they would do that. The vast majority of people love Metro and the Start Screen and its just a small vocal minority of trolls on Neowin who don't like it...

False!!

Lord Method Man said,
Odd that they would do that. The vast majority of people love Metro and the Start Screen and its just a small vocal minority of trolls on Neowin who don't like it...
Ouch! You might want to talk with the general populous who hate Metro like it's cancer.

JHBrown said,
Ouch! You might want to talk with the general populous who hate Metro like it's cancer.

And you might want to fine tune your sarcasm detector.

Lord Method Man said,

And you might want to fine tune your sarcasm detector.

Normally a sarcastic comment is noted with some sort of symbol. My sarcastic radars failed to pick up your sarcasm. Sorry

JHBrown said,
Ouch! You might want to talk with the general populous who hate Metro like it's cancer.

Comparing Metro to cancer is wrong on so many levels dude. First of all, why are you getting so worked up about it? It's nothing major. It's a god damn app launcher.

Jarrichvdv said,

Comparing Metro to cancer is wrong on so many levels dude. First of all, why are you getting so worked up about it? It's nothing major. It's a god damn app launcher.
Cancer is a pain in the arse. I've had 2 family members pass from complications. Modern/Metro is that kind of pain in the arse. Secondly, I'm not sure how you could figure that I'm "worked up" over Metro. When I post, I'm normally in my pool, working on my cars, playing with daughter, and just enjoying life while not being deployed. You seem a little worked up bud.

Edited by JHBrown, Jan 31 2014, 10:14am :

Here is the cornerstone on the problem with Metro and desktop, how are you going to get people to buy Metro Apps When the desktop already provides them for free? Because it seems like the same logic is behind title bars on the new Metro apps. Why would someone want a Metro app when they have a free desktop app that already provides the same functions (and sometimes more.)

I've said it before and I'll say it again, I don't the think Microsoft can ignore the desktop app portion of their app store. They could try and write these Metro apps in their own desktop version of the same app. They could try and get third party developers to go through their desktop app store. I think that is the only way to clear the segregation of Desktop and Metro. They could keep the same style, but the platforms are fundamentally different. You just can't ignore the market for what was already free. You got to work with it. It can't be that hard to write a desktop version of these Metro apps? I think they want this to be one market, but it just isn't.

The unique part about Metro application is their usability. Their are out of the box designed to be chrome less, the content is showing off to you directly. Not to forget, they are touch friendly. This can be done with desktop too but requires a lot more effort. This is also why I decided to pay $2.50 for mobile.HD instead of installing VLC on desktop.

As developer is writing some specific applications in the Metro environment much easier because of the WinRT API. That API is a To get an image from a webcam in the desktop are you spending more time writing code (Probably around 100 lines). In WinRT is that done in two lines.

Microsoft is doing this to get people to buy Metro Apps. Even if it is free on the Metro part of the store are you going to choose the one that has a resizable window or the one that only runs full screen?

Can't they just make the thing detect if it's a touchscreen or not? On touchscreen devices default to the Start Screen otherwise default to the Desktop. It's probably just as annoying to default to desktop for touchscreen users as it is to default to the Start Screen for keyboard/mouse users.

Asmodai said,
Can't they just make the thing detect if it's a touchscreen or not? On touchscreen devices default to the Start Screen otherwise default to the Desktop. It's probably just as annoying to default to desktop for touchscreen users as it is to default to the Start Screen for keyboard/mouse users.

Exactly.

mrbester said,
What about the new PCs with both? Which should it default to?

The start screen. The desktop is almost useless on tablets aside from Outlook on the Surface. Other than that, there is really very little reason to be on the desktop.

mrbester said,
What about the new PCs with both? Which should it default to?

I thought that was pretty clear, I'll try to clarify further. If it has a touchscreen (no matter if it has a keyboard/mouse also or not) then default to the start screen, that's what they want to push and it works great for touch (or so I hear.) Otherwise (i.e. no touch screen) default to the Desktop.

mrbester said,
What about the new PCs with both? Which should it default to?

Detect if you have a Touch screen and ask you to confirm.

Asmodai said,
Can't they just make the thing detect if it's a touchscreen or not? On touchscreen devices default to the Start Screen otherwise default to the Desktop. It's probably just as annoying to default to desktop for touchscreen users as it is to default to the Start Screen for keyboard/mouse users.

We don't know if that's not what it doesn't do right now, for example the new right click context menus only work when the system detects a mouse is being used for the right click. That means they are in fact checking to see what input methods are on the system and being used. If you have touch then go to the start screen first, if not go to the desktop, either way they should make it a easy option to change if you have a hybrid device with both, or just as when it starts for the first time.

Xenosion said,

The start screen. The desktop is almost useless on tablets aside from Outlook on the Surface. Other than that, there is really very little reason to be on the desktop.

I have used a Convertible Tablet since 2002 and I strongly disagree. I use the stilo much more than I use Touch. Granted this is just the way that I use it.

"We don't know if that's not what it doesn't do right now, for example the new right click context menus only work when the system detects a mouse is being used for the right click."

This is a pretty roundabout way of saying "the new right click context menus are shown on right click". You can't right click with touch, after all.

Actually, I right click with touch all the time, by pressing and holding until, voilà!, the context menu pops up. On the desktop, of course.

Fritzly said,

I have used a Convertible Tablet since 2002 and I strongly disagree. I use the stilo much more than I use Touch. Granted this is just the way that I use it.


This isn't 2002 and most tablets don't have styli. Even on a Surface Pro I would doubt I'd change my habits from pure touch on the Surface RT.

I am afraid you are missing the best feature of a Tablet: the,ability to use it a notepad, writing and,drawing among other things and as Bill Gates envisioned. In other,words a much more complete experience than the applesque approach.

Fritzly said,
I am afraid you are missing the best feature of a Tablet: the,ability to use it a notepad, writing and,drawing among other things and as Bill Gates envisioned. In other,words a much more complete experience than the applesque approach.

You're out of touch. I didn't mention anything Apple. In fact the only thing I've mentioned is Surface tablets because that's what I use. You're basically basing your entire perception of tablets on one from more than a decade ago. Interfaces/UIs have changed. Apps are a thing now.

Fritzly said,
Can you use handwriting on an iPad? No, you cannot, on a Surface Pro you can.. Simple as that...

So then what the hell is your point? Are you trying to tell me that the Surface Pro is the only device worthy of being called a tablet?

Xenosion said,

So then what the hell is your point? Are you trying to tell me that the Surface Pro is the only device worthy of being called a tablet?

Not at all, my point is that the any device using a MS OS like W7 and W8 exploit the full potential and deliver the Tablet experience as envisioned by Bill Gates. Something that other so called Tablets do not because they lack the handwriting capability

Fritzly said,

Something that other so called Tablets do not because they lack the handwriting capability

So then, yes, that is what you're saying and I'd tell you again that you're living in 2002 where apps, touch, and interfaces didn't exist like they do now. But I'm just repeating myself and you're contradicting yourself so I'm done.

Xenosion said,

So then, yes, that is what you're saying and I'd tell you again that you're living in 2002 where apps, touch, and interfaces didn't exist like they do now. But I'm just repeating myself and you're contradicting yourself so I'm done.

For your information mouse, keyboard, touch, stilo, voice and even gestures are just different ways to interact with your device and have all existed for a long time. If you are unable to handle different way to input... Well, to each his own.
And yes, you are done: similis cum similibus

Fritzly said,

For your information mouse, keyboard, touch, stilo, voice and even gestures are just different ways to interact with your device and have all existed for a long time. If you are unable to handle different way to input... Well, to each his own.
And yes, you are done: similis cum similibus


Xenosion said,

apps, touch, and interfaces didn't exist like they do now.

And no longer we write using cuneiform characters although we still write... So what?
Anyway enjoy what you are able to use...
Over and out.

Well thats a step backwards. I actually never use the Metro screen much other than at windows boot.

It's nice to hit the power button and login then have the weather and news scrolling in front of you. OFC once i have seen this i go right to desktop and not use it again untill PC next restart.

Also before metro i used to just have an RSS feed / gadget on desktop to get the info i want that metro provides. (just making use of whats there)

I agree and will be one of those changing it back if this is true. I can only think of about 7 or 8 modern apps that I use (excluding games), both on my non-touch desktop and touch laptop. But on both, I love logging in and immediately seeing tweets, emails, news & sports headlines, the stick tickers, Flipboard, Reddit, etc.

Vester said,
Well thats a step backwards. I actually never use the Metro screen much other than at windows boot.

Just disable the option at the taskbar

winrez said,
I really hope not this would be a pain on a tablet

I would have to sell my mom's tablet and get her an iPad. She doesn't use the desktop, way too complicated for how she uses a computer. Her last computer was an iPod Touch and she expects similar ease of use and touch responsiveness.

I think I would be done with Windows as well. Maybe switch over to Android if Microsoft has given up this quickly on the consumer market. I have almost no use for desktop anymore (it syncs our fitbits and updates harmony remotes). Basically once those companies make Metro apps that sync I was ready to delete the desktop tile for good.

I shudder at the thought of installing any software on the desktop because it sneaks in all kinds of adware and extraneous toolbars and programs. Also slows down the computer and boot times the more stuff you install on desktop. Shifting support back to desktop is a death march for MS. Modern devices do not slow down or boot slower from installing apps. Only a matter of time before all consumers realize Windows desktop is an obsolete relic. If they don't move to Metro then those consumers will move to iOS and Android. If MS has retreated to desktop then it's no different than BlackBerry putting out phones with keyboards.

I'm a diehard and my patience with MS is wearing thin. The PC sales are dying because that style of computing is outdated.

So you're saying that you're ditching Windows because now Microsoft is putting too much emphasis on desktop? Wow, there's no pleasing some people. Solution: Get an RT tablet.

Avatar Roku said,

I would have to sell my mom's tablet and get her an iPad. She doesn't use the desktop, way too complicated for how she uses a computer. Her last computer was an iPod Touch and she expects similar ease of use and touch responsiveness.

I think I would be done with Windows as well. Maybe switch over to Android if Microsoft has given up this quickly on the consumer market. I have almost no use for desktop anymore (it syncs our fitbits and updates harmony remotes). Basically once those companies make Metro apps that sync I was ready to delete the desktop tile for good.

I shudder at the thought of installing any software on the desktop because it sneaks in all kinds of adware and extraneous toolbars and programs. Also slows down the computer and boot times the more stuff you install on desktop. Shifting support back to desktop is a death march for MS. Modern devices do not slow down or boot slower from installing apps. Only a matter of time before all consumers realize Windows desktop is an obsolete relic. If they don't move to Metro then those consumers will move to iOS and Android. If MS has retreated to desktop then it's no different than BlackBerry putting out phones with keyboards.

I'm a diehard and my patience with MS is wearing thin. The PC sales are dying because that style of computing is outdated.

So much of what you said is an outright lie its almost pathetic. Installing software that are not "modern apps" does not slow down the computer anymore than "modern apps" Any software could "sneak" in adware and toolbars and such. If you aren't smart enough to avoid those things then yes a tablet does sound like the better option for you. So a desktop is obsolete huh? How the hell do you think the people writing "modern apps" are doing it? With a ****ing windows phone? Through ios? No, its done on a COMPUTER with a DESKTOP using software that does not lend itself to a touch paradigm.

winrez said,
I really hope not this would be a pain on a tablet

Why not make this an option?? How hard is it to select how you want your PC to boot??

"Any software could "sneak" in adware and toolbars and such."

No, Windows store apps are isolated so they can't mess with the browser or other apps.

corrosive23 said,
So much of what you said is an outright lie its almost pathetic. Installing software that are not "modern apps" does not slow down the computer anymore than "modern apps" Any software could "sneak" in adware and toolbars and such. If you aren't smart enough to avoid those things then yes a tablet does sound like the better option for you. So a desktop is obsolete huh? How the hell do you think the people writing "modern apps" are doing it? With a ****ing windows phone? Through ios? No, its done on a COMPUTER with a DESKTOP using software that does not lend itself to a touch paradigm.

I do all my programming on Xbox One with Kinect.

duk3togo said,

Why not make this an option?? How hard is it to select how you want your PC to boot??

It probably will be an option. Like, it defaults to desktop. You can change this already to do that. I think they just are changing the default boot and keeping start the same. They may, however, also give the option to use a Windows 7 Start if you would like as well. More options I think =). I dont think they are taking any away.

Avatar Roku said,
I'm a diehard and my patience with MS is wearing thin. The PC sales are dying because that style of computing is outdated.

I just read that the tablet market's growth is slowing down already. That didn't take long. And PC sales are far from dying, that's where MS makes its boatloads of money without, be it corporate or average customers.

And why the heck wouldn't this be optional? It is now, only the default will be changed but I guess every little thing is drama-material these days and fewer and fewer people are able to think rationally.

winrez said,
I really hope not this would be a pain on a tablet

Obviously tablets will go to the Start Screen. Windows detects touch displays, and this guy leaking the images obviously don't have touch input, so for him it's defaulted to desktop.

Basically if you have touch = Start screen/Metro
No touch = Desktop

If you don't have touch input but want it to boot to the Start screen, then you can change the boot option since 8.1 anyway. So either way this is a non-issue and only a good thing.

Avatar Roku said,

...Modern devices do not slow down or boot slower from installing apps.

Yup, no such issues on Android with that. No Sir!
/s

Avatar Roku said,

I'm a diehard ....

No sir, I'm not buying that at all!