Six reasons Microsoft will continue to lose market share

Microsoft has positioned itself at the top, a top that is targeted by hundreds if not thousands of companies. They have spread themselves from their core identities and they are opening themselves up for a loss of market share. For this article market share is defined as a broad term where Microsoft will lose users from its user base to its competitors.

Reason #6: The Juggernaut
Microsoft has always been viewed as the corporate beast that it is. It's always easier to degrade those that are on top than those who are up and coming. Microsoft is in a position of corporate and personal dominance. With total control of the Windows environment and the Microsoft Office platform, they can determine exactly when users are able to upgrade. People, in general, like choice and as it stands at this current time there is no competitor to Microsoft Office that is widely accepted. It can be argued that Open Office is a competitor but it has not been taken as serious as Microsoft Office has been. It's easy to target those on top but it's even harder to please all of those below you.

Reason #5: Lions, Tigers and malware Oh my!
It's a simple idea that if you're going to try and destroy something you target the largest audience; Microsoft has the largest user base of any software company. When a hacker or cracker decides to target a group it makes the most sense to target the Windows platform as it dwarfs all of the other competitors. Microsoft works diligently to combat these threats but with an ever changing environment it's nearly impossible to thwart all tangible threats. Also, the tech world expands rapidly which creates more drivers, languages, protocols, and lines of code to be written that are expanding the possibilities of vulnerabilities in software. Microsoft has to work twice as hard as the hacker or cracker does to keep them out, defense is much harder than offense, predicting as opposed to directing makes Microsoft's job endless.

Reason #4: Google
Google is no longer the underdog and is now a behemoth of a company, a company with a large pocketbook and resources. Google grew up right before many of our eyes. Starting out small and blooming into the massive corporate empire it is today. One thing Google has been able to maintain is that its name has never been tarnished by poor quality products, not to mention most products are free. It's the free mentality of Google that is the threat to Microsoft. Google has dominated the online landscape and is now moving into more traditional Microsoft territories. With the launch of Google Chrome and Android, Microsoft finds itself on the offensive against free products. While it is true that IE does not cost the user anything; the powerful and well trusted name behind Chrome will eventually give it the leg up on its Microsoft competitor. Android is a new mobile phone OS that Google is distributing for free as compared to the pay for OS, Windows Mobile. Free to a manufacturer of cell phones is a lucrative idea as they are able to have a greater margin of profit per handset sold. Google continues to slowly dig into Microsoft's market share on several different fronts with free products that are of high quality.

Reason #3: Open Source
The open source community continues to grow. From an OS offering of Ubuntu to the web browser Firefox; the community backed programs are beneficial and free option to the consumer. It's these types of initiatives that as they mature will become direct threats to Microsoft's offerings. One could argue that open source projects are vulnerable and inferior and that argue is made only by those who have never tried the products. There isn't much to be said about open source other than its free, community backed, growing daily and is quickly becoming a viable alternative to Microsoft.

Reason #2: Vista
Regardless of what state Vista is in today it launched to a very rocky start. When Microsoft lowered the initial PC requirements it shot itself in the foot. It allowed many users to install Vista on laptops that were not suited for the OS. It also gave users a very negative notion of Vista as compared to the rock solid performance of Windows XP. Today Vista has matured enough to become a well usable and stable OS but the consumer has already decided, regardless of its current state, that Vista is not acceptable. Microsoft has sold boatloads of copies of Vista but it would have sold a lot more if initial public reaction was that it was the hot new OS that everyone needs.

Reason #1: Apple
Although we said last week that OSX would never become mainstream, Apple has taken a huge leap in marketshare in the wake of the Vista fiasco. Apple saw an opportunity to advance its market share and directly attacked Microsoft's most recent offering. It's these attacks, or advertisements for OSX, that landed Apple at the number 1 spot. No other company spends millions of dollars to directly reduce Microsoft's presence in the home PC market like Apple does. It is also the best option, in terms of an OS, available to the consumer for a problem free PC experience. Apple has built itself on the legacy that "it just works" for there hardware and operating systems. If Microsoft produces another big blunder with Windows 7, Apple may be able to take a considerable stake in the market share.

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Like many have said, microsoft is here to stay and will never be put out of business. The business world is still widely using microsoft products and that will also never change because of the relationships, name recognition, and ease of extension that nobody else can dream of offering.

Microsoft has so many divisions and products that all are very cheap compared to the competition and well built. Just take a look on their msdn subscription page if you have an account and you will see the broad scope of their many products.

I'm not a fanboy and don't like everything they make completely, but after seeing what they offer in the development world compared to the others, its a no brainer. The .net framework is a thing of beauty and the c# language has revolutionized the development and business world. If you look at it on a macro level with tech having many billions of jobs higher than most other industries, the majority of the development shops out there are there because of microsoft and they will never get rid of what they need to survive. The job market needs microsoft and wishing for "their DOOM" is asking for a longer downturn than the hell hole we are already in.

Anyone claiming down with microsoft is IMO, no different than the crazies out there that won't pay their taxes but still take the benefits or the ones that want anarchy because its a cool fad and they won't get put down by the MAN by swiping their discount cards at the grocery store.

P.S, Vista has a bad rap from the past, but it and its children will be what is used in the future despite the humorous adds from a company that is like a begger on the street asking for people to buy its 100th revision of an OS that most people don't want.

On Visual Studio Express: It runs the gamut. It's not just VB; it's C++/C#, Java, even (*yeeks*) SQL (SQL Server Express). It doesn't just have a *similar* IDE as their professional tools; it's the SAME IDE. (No migration curve whatever.) Even scarier (for competitors of VS Express) is that you aren't even remotely limited to MS back-ends (even with SQL); you have Oracle, Borland, MySQL, Sybase, even DB2. Cost: none.

Google is not a threat to Microsoft at all right now. On the search front, perhaps, and maybe advertising. Otherwise, I'd rather laugh at the idea. Google makes *no* money from any of their 'products' other than search. Everything they do is tied to advertising and that's the only way they make any money. They keep putting out free products which are neat and cool, have good technology in them, but make them NO MONEY. If they help push advertising then that's great -- but mostly, they make no money other than through one area. Which is why they released Google Chrome...

IE8 is going to have a more broad platform for building applications from. This is done for the same reason Google made Google Gears, that you can run your Google apps without being on the internet. The problem with that is, that their products largely suck -- especially if you read the reports comparing Google Docs to MS's online offering (also free). It's a night and day comparison, and rightly so -- MS has a lot of experience building Office and having a better online version is rather logical. However, IE8 also is going to have the ability to do what -- BLOCK ADVERTISEMENTS. Take a look at what they demoed: http://www.technewsworld.com/story/64337.html?wlc=1227631199

Now think about this... a company who has 90%+ of the computer OS market, is releasing a browser that reaches almost the same audience, that has built-in ad block capability. Who will they hurt? Google, duh. The ONLY WAY Google makes money is advertising. Imagine if MS released a browser that allowed you to block ALL GOOGLE ADS. Their revenue would be in the TOILET.

That's just Google. Now go to Apple. Apple has a nice OS that's cute and fun to use, and is very well designed as a whole. The problem is, they have NO ENTERPRISE SOFTWARE. MS makes money because they have a wide open API, easy IDE (Visual Studio) and the ability to create applications for FREE (Visual Studio Express). Even the express versions of their IDE are amazing, and better than anything Apple puts out. They give you a SUITE of products, starting from Windows, then Office, then Sharepoint, then BizTalk, then Systems Center (which is another suite itself), then Exchange (email, collaboration), then they base everything off of SQL Server, and add even more around all that for CRM (MS Dynamics), for collaboration (Groove), for unified communication (Live Communications Server), and MORE. Apple can't touch 1% of that, and enterprises know it.

Additionally, with Apple you have ultimately only ONE vendor to deal with. And if you're a business, you know that you don't want to screw yourself by locking into a single vendor. MS gives you the option to move vendors while using their core OS for any number of vendors. Dell, Gateway, Lenovo, IBM, Sun (yes, SUN!), Acer, and lots more if you want to buy desktops, laptops, or servers. Apple has well -- just Apple.

In the end, it comes down to software. It's cheaper, faster, and easier to make software on Windows, but there are obvious drawbacks. But if you're in the business of making money, and you want to get client licenses sold, the best way is for making enterprise grade software. The software Apple doesn't have the staff or engineering to make right now, because they are busy making their iPods and iPhones and iMacs. And as said earlier, most people that buy a Mac ultimately put a copy of Windows on it anyway. And since THOSE guys pay the full price and not the OEM price (which is what you pay when you buy from Dell or whatever), MS actually makes more money off of the Apple users of Windows than anybody else.

Apple might steal a few customers on the consumer level, but until they have an enterprise strategy that encompasses messaging, collaboration, and more -- they simply don't have a chance against MS yet. I like competition -- it's good -- but it's ridiculous to think Apple is going to overtake MS, or is even CLOSE to the number one reason.

Apple steals consumer level customers from MS (at a low level). MS steals enterprise level customers from SUN, IBM, and others. And the latter has a bigger pay base and longer contractual terms and larger investments... so who do you think is really winning?

Look at the P&L statements for both companies, look at their employed base of employees, and you'll see I'm right. I don't hate Apple (I had a Macbook before I sold it -- wasn't using it), but I'm a realist who thinks that if you want to beat MS, you have to beat Office and Exchange, not Windows. The OS is a delivery platform for applications. If you make a great delivery platform but have no packages to deliver, then what the hell is the point at all?

Most of all, Microsoft has been in the OS business since forever, google is a new entrant. I'm wondering how dumb it would be to pose Google as a threat to Microsoft's OS market share. LOL

Well, even though things dont look good for microsoft for the near future, you are forgetting one thing. This is only the US market they talk about. Apple, no matter what will never be able to make it in the rest of the world, ex - Asia, South Asia, MiddleEast, Africa, China and maybe even Japan. They will always be no. 1. Do you know how much the mac mini costs back in those countries? - atleast $1000. which is ridiculous!

Microsoft has many niches that Google cannot compete in. One, the Surface computer; which i think is a way into the future. Google docs, are for losers who don't want to spend a just a little cash for a good office suite. Google docs is unheard of out side north america and other than a few european countries. People will always use MS Office. - don't believe me.. check the statistics off google for yourself! :)

Windows will never die down. I am into opensource, and i wish microsoft would cater their products accordingly, but again, all we do focus on this website and many others are the fact that when you compare the open source community to the whole world using personal computers. THEY DONT GIVE A RATS ASS!. They've gotten used to windows and they like to use windows. Trust me, consumers hate change to certain things. And because of that no way can Ubuntu, especially apple or the Linux community will ever dominate the reach microsoft has.

So yes right now Andriod and a few competitive products are out there; which is good for the consumer, but they will never EVER be able to dominate outside this continent!.

I'd like to know why Microsoft still doesnt sell the Zune outside teh USA and Canada. I'd buy one immediately if they sold them in Europe. I can't be the *only* one who feels that way either!

wdowell said,
I'd like to know why Microsoft still doesnt sell the Zune outside teh USA and Canada. I'd buy one immediately if they sold them in Europe. I can't be the *only* one who feels that way either!

Cant you go online and have a Zune shipped to you?

techbeck said,
Cant you go online and have a Zune shipped to you?


That's what I would do. Is that illegal or something?

Open Source my be accepted and good for individuals or for small businesses, but it has a long way to go for the corporate world. Its not accepted corporate and it needs to be better supported and be able to compete with all the commercial software.

techbeck said,
Open Source my be accepted and good for individuals or for small businesses, but it has a long way to go for the corporate world. Its not accepted corporate and it needs to be better supported and be able to compete with all the commercial software.


But still the small business is a good market i'm sure MS doesn't want to lose a part of it.

The corporate world is what it is. Big and extremely bulky. I work for a big corporation so i know what it is. Our web developpers (php) would be far more effective using Eclipse with php tools (or Aptana to get some support) than Dreamweaver. But our corparation prefer to pay big money for Dreamweaver because our technical support know the software. Making them understand that while Dreamweaver is good as a WYSIWYG HTML editor it's not the best tool to do php coding is an impossible task.

I worked for a small business before and they were a lot more receptive to open sorce software or cheap commercial alternatives. Not enough to accept Open Office but defintely enough to accept web graphics designers to use Gimp instead of the extremely expensive Photoshop or web developpers to use Eclipse with php tools. In fact except for Office 2003, Windows XP and Windows Server 2003 (apps server for remote access) almost everything else was open source inside the small cie. The web server was installed over a Linux box using Apache.

The biggest threat to Microsoft is open source softwares.

As a developper myself i've never been very positive about open source software. After all i need to pay my bills. So for the most part i've always used commercial softwares i paid for (since i have the money to pay for). But lately i decided to give open source softwares another try since i can't spend as much money on computer software as i used to. That was the first time i seriouly tested open source softwares since my days at school.

I must say that open source softwares came A LONG WAY. I've been impressed by Open Office 3. There's just absolutely NO REASON for the average user to pay for MS Office. Even small PME should took a serious look at Open Office 3. I did try a couple of complexe Word documents on it and all displayed 95% correctly and the 5% wrong was always cosmestic errors easy to repair. And anyway average users should think about using open standard instead of word files.

Gimp is a very good raster graphics editor. Inkscape does the job as a vector graphics editor. And Eclipse is definately an awesome IDE and a powerful web code editor too.

The price asked for computer softwares is just silly these days. Back when computers were 2000-3000 it was okay to spend 1000$ and more on softwares. But these days you can get an ok computer for around 500$ so i think more and more people like me will decide to look for alternative when they will realise they spend 2-3 times more money on softwares than the computer itself.

The day companies will look at Open Office is not tomorrow. But Ms still should see it as a threat specially since Open Office 3 looks more like old MS Office than MS Office 2007 does.

Where is the source that shows Microsoft is even losing market share? I know it's an editorial, (and a bad one at that,) but if you're going to base your point on Microsoft "losing market share" you should talk about that some at least, not just shoot flames out your rear.

i really want to know... exactly how well is apple doing outside of the US? all the stats we see are for market share in the states.

Microsoft in danger from Google? Even remotely? Please, use Google as a threat to Microsoft once all of their software or services come out of Beta stage. I think with Google Mail, though, that's never going to happen.

This post seems completely pointless and a blatent, biased attack on the worlds most well know company. It forgets a hell of a lot, Microsoft doesn't only develop Microsoft Office, Windows and Internet Explorer. You've got Dell as well, and let's not forget the Microsoft Xbox 360, that is competing very well.

Microsoft definitely does have a monopoly, but that's not bad, as they're making the most of it. People underestimate them, and there's a definite stigma around, why can't there just be some sort of harmony, people who have Macs shouldn't winge saying 'omg, windows is so ugly, and there's so much malware', it's ridiculous and too open to counter-attacks.

New Scientist was right, it is instinct to always fight and disagree with others.

traxor said,
This post seems completely pointless and a blatent, biased attack on the worlds most well know company.


**gasp**

I hate these types of articles.

#6 You have to think why is Microsoft in the top position today and have been for well over a decade. They are on top for a reason.

#5 Since using Vista, I haven't had a single instance of malware or single virus infection.

#4 While Google certainly has deep pockets, where are they today in terms of broad competition? Do they have a competing Client OS? Server OS? Sure they have Google apps but seriously, the only real competition for Microsoft Office is OpenOffice and I don't see mass adoption even though it's free.

#3 Open Source is a viable alternative, but more so in the consumer market. Ubuntu, Firefox and OpenOffice are excellent for free software but I just can't see many businesses making the switch from their tried and tested apps, especially when so many rely on Active Directory, Group Policy and Internet Explorer for their corporate intranet.

Open source might be free but there would still be a huge cost involved in making the switch to deploy it. Users are also comfortable with Windows; the vast majority would need training to even be able to use a new OS.

#2 The reason Vista is considered a dud is because of sensationalist journalists sitting behind their Macs with years of preconception before even beginning these articles.

A lot of these online journalists get paid depending on how many hits their article gets, so they write uninformed crap! It's cheap but effective. Then before you know it, it's suddenly the "in thing" to bash Vista and you get misinformed people jumping on the bandwagon when most of them haven't even used the software.

As for system requirements, are you going to get the best out of Vista with only 512 MB of RAM, of course not. You can get 2 GB for just over £20 these days so there is no excuse.

Sure Microsoft made a couple of bad decisions along the way and Vista isn't perfect but I'd like to know what software that is!

I've worked in the IT industry for years and used computers all my life and I can honestly say that Vista is the best OS I've ever used. Very stable, secure, easy to use, compatibility issues? No, all my software just works. Vista is a godsend for IT Administrators; it's a joy to deploy using WDS.

I have a copy of Vista Ultimate x64 on my PC which I can install unattended from a separate partition, a "one touch" installation. I have all my personal settings restored via registry tweaks and xml files, all my applications are there ready on first logon. Could I do that with any other OS? Doubt it.

#1 Apple is a great company and makes some excellent products. However, Macs will always be locked down and never anywhere near as customisable as a PC. Then there's the huge cost difference in buying a comparable Mac compared to a PC, you're essentially paying for a brand name.

The fact that Apple even developed Boot Camp is surely an endorsement of Microsoft's products.

You have to ask yourself why does Apple advertise its computers where they mention the competition more than they do their own product?

jamesclarke555 said,
I hate these types of articles.

#6 You have to think why is Microsoft in the top position today and have been for well over a decade. They are on top for a reason.

The most lucrative licensing scheme ever conceived.

That's it.

LTD said,


The most lucrative licensing scheme ever conceived.

That's it.


I'll take that licensing "scheme" with the ability to upgrade my hardware... not just my memory and hard drive... ALL my hardware. For me, few things beat the joy of firing-up a computer I just built.

On #4 and why there aren't more users of OO. The driving force behind the lack of penetration of OO is the one app OO lacks - e-mail. Notice that even the officially wimpiest version of Office, Home and Student Edition, addresses this with not Windows Live Mail, but the still-reigning heavyweight e-mail champion of the planet; none other than Microsoft Outlook. Outlook is actually the least-changed application in all of Office from the all-star that was Office 2000/XP (for a very good reason; why fix what isn't broken?); it's also a painless migration from almost any other mail application (even Thunderbird or Evolution). While many Neowinians think about Outlook as strictly an Exchange client, most Outlook users (going all the way back to Outlook 95) could care less about Exchange, as they use Outlook as a POP3/SMTP mail client (at which Outlook excels; arguably, it could be the easiest POP3/SMTP client to use, and that includes the open-source and free *competition*, such as Evolution and KMail). I actually *do* use OO (not just in openSuSE, but in Windows, despite also having Office 2007 Enterprise) primarily as an exporter (I still find Word the better choice for document generation; however, OO is good for handling esoteric exports, such as PDF, from Word documents); however, OO's lack of a decent e-mail client (in fact, the lack of a decent alternative to Outlook on Windows as a whole) is a major issue for quite a few users to considering OO.

PGHammer said,
On #4 and why there aren't more users of OO. The driving force behind the lack of penetration of OO is the one app OO lacks - e-mail. Notice that even the officially wimpiest version of Office, Home and Student Edition, addresses this with not Windows Live Mail, but the still-reigning heavyweight e-mail champion of the planet; none other than Microsoft Outlook. Outlook is actually the least-changed application in all of Office from the all-star that was Office 2000/XP (for a very good reason; why fix what isn't broken?); it's also a painless migration from almost any other mail application (even Thunderbird or Evolution). While many Neowinians think about Outlook as strictly an Exchange client, most Outlook users (going all the way back to Outlook 95) could care less about Exchange, as they use Outlook as a POP3/SMTP mail client (at which Outlook excels; arguably, it could be the easiest POP3/SMTP client to use, and that includes the open-source and free *competition*, such as Evolution and KMail). I actually *do* use OO (not just in openSuSE, but in Windows, despite also having Office 2007 Enterprise) primarily as an exporter (I still find Word the better choice for document generation; however, OO is good for handling esoteric exports, such as PDF, from Word documents); however, OO's lack of a decent e-mail client (in fact, the lack of a decent alternative to Outlook on Windows as a whole) is a major issue for quite a few users to considering OO.


Office Home and Student does not include Outlook. Office Standard is the least expensive suite that includes it.

Reason 6: To be honest I doubt the majority of users care less about how some media and tech followers perceive the company. MS has had this "evil" badge for over a decade and it hasn't stopped sales.

Reason 5: I think malware imho is less of an issue than it was several years ago and PC's on average are better equiped to handle it. Also market share is not that big a factor as the article made out. The old OS's were just inherently less secure and easier to hack and thus why they were. Regardless of the size of the market share, if an application theoretically had zero flaws then it wouldn't be breakable regardless of how many people tried.

Also Macs and Linux have a large enough market to make releasing malware for them a viable option if you want to do mass damage. Linux in particular given it powers so many servers. Anyone who successfully took out a large portion of either OS would receive alot of attention so I wouldn't say the incentive isnt there.

Reason 4: Google competes with MS in only a few of their markets and not MS's primary ones of OS's and Office applications (barring the web based text writer). Infact the only markets I can see Google really hurting MS would be Search, advertising and mapping. Mobile OS may be added to that list in due time. In others like webmail, IM and browsing MS has them covered.


As mentioned above too, MS may loose some market share in certain markets but they are big enough to usually cover the R&D to get back on track eventually and secondly they are continuing to turn over larger profits despite any perceived threats or signs that they are sliding.

I also think the competition has to be rather weary. Vista's criticism may have ultimately done more to help MS than it did to hurt them. To me it seems it got them actually thinking about how they make software and position it and they seem pretty hell bent on not going through that old cycle again. Things such as the XBox have improved in leaps and bounds and will do alot more to strengthen the companies name than hurt it. Vista ultimately may have been the kick in the back MS needed.

I can't believe the trolling has made it onto the front page. What prompted this article to be published - no related news or anything?

As for the points made ... meh, I can't be bothered to give my 2 cents as it's very late. Needless to say Vista bashing is so old now, and MS bashing is even older. Give me MS software over Google BETA junk (mostly) any day.

TRC said,
Exactly, this isn't news. It's an opinion piece, and flame bait.

Neowin is happy with this article because it got a lot of page hits.

thenonhacker said,
Neowin is happy with this article because it got a lot of page hits.


It's an EDITORIAL. It's not news. It's supposed to be an "opinion piece."

As for the flamebait accusation, to be fair, there was a Mac related article by the same author last week.

LTD said,
It's an EDITORIAL. It's not news. It's supposed to be an "opinion piece."

As for the flamebait accusation, to be fair, there was a Mac related article by the same author last week.

Both the Mac and Vista articles posted have been said before is several other post on Neowin. These are nothing new.

Poor article, I'm sorry, but a great way to get people conversing. ;)

Almost all of Microsoft's revenue comes from the corporate sector. Microsoft is the back office nerd making everything tick -- jobs that you and I would find insanely tedious. They were born out of producing software to increase productivity and the world would be lost without them. Granted, they're not the coolest kids on the block, and many of us would like to see them go down, but unfortunately, they're here to stay for the foreseeable future.

Whilst there are other rising stars, they're far from a threat to Microsoft's core business.

They've all got their niches... and they dominate them.

Microsoft = Corporate Systems
Google = Information Resources/Services
Apple = Creative/Entertainment Sector
IBM = B2B/Back Office
Sun Microsystems = Doing an AOL. :P

Reason #6: The Juggernaut
Everybody hates the big guy, it happens in Coporate America and it happens in sports. The media dubbed the Dallas Cowboys as "America's Team" and the public dubbed them as "America's coke heads and wife beaters". The Point, the public is vicious on the big guys.

Reason #5: Lions, Tigers and malware Oh my!
If I had Cheetos fingers and reaked of Funyun's, I'd target Windows too.

Reason #4: Google
Google has an amazing search engine, but eventually they will spread them selves to thin and begin to fall.

Reason #3: Open Source
The day the Open Source Community has a viable support option and migration path for companies living on Windows is the day they can be taken seriously in Corporate America.

Reason #2: Vista
Dead horse, we freaked out about WinME and we went postal over WinXP at first. Sure Vista has had it's problems and nobody can deny that even if they have had a flawless experience. Windows 7 appears to the answer at this stage, unless they fail miserably... I can only imagine the blogs if that were to happen.

Reason #1: Apple
When Apple's prices come down, they are a competitor. Until then, they have no place in Corporate America.

I work in an environment where we have 70,000+ Windows based PC's, moving to Linux is not viable. Not today at least, Apple would put the company under completely with their prices.

TRC said,
Would his points be any less valid if he had said the corporate world instead?

His points are extremely valid and I agree with him 100%.

Mikeyx11 said,
You are yet another fine example of an ignorant American thinking the entire world exists only of America.


Another fine example of stereotyping Americans. Thanks!

Mikeyx11 said,
You are yet another fine example of an ignorant American thinking the entire world exists only of America.

Mikey, I'm sorry if you think I'm saying "only America" matters. I am speaking from my personal experiences. But as TRC said, some of my points can apply to the Corporate Environment through out the world.

You could have just pointed that out instead of calling me ignorant.

RAID 0 said,
Another fine example of stereotyping Americans. Thanks!

Did I say all Americans think that way? No?

zeke009, I agree with all your points and I know they are applicable to the world and not just the US, but I just get fed up with the amount of comments by people who talk about America as if it is the only country on Earth.

Mikeyx11 said,
Did I say all Americans think that way? No?

zeke009, I agree with all your points and I know they are applicable to the world and not just the US, but I just get fed up with the amount of comments by people who talk about America as if it is the only country on Earth.

Understandable

This article is lame.

Microsoft, as another commenter said divides into 4 businesses. The OS business goes up when they have a good OS, and down when they release a crappier one. Personally, Vista is good but not like XP. XP is just phenomenal. If Windows 7 turns out to be a big improvement, Microsoft earns back the trust it lost and all becomes stable, again.

Whoever said Microsoft is slowly dying is a complete ****.

Love how people like to claim Apple is being negative by simply pointing out Vista's flaws, this isn't politics, this is computing and in computing flaws are just that flaws, and Vista has many still, I should know I have 2 Vista machines.

The only reason MS is still considered big is because of their Corporate/Business and Consumer Services divisions, those two prop up the other 2 failing businesses.

z0phi3l said,
Love how people like to claim Apple is being negative by simply pointing out Vista's flaws, this isn't politics, this is computing and in computing flaws are just that flaws, and Vista has many still, I should know I have 2 Vista machines.

The only reason MS is still considered big is because of their Corporate/Business and Consumer Services divisions, those two prop up the other 2 failing businesses.


LOL, MS sold more copies of flawed Vista than Apple has users, I wish my company would fail like that.

z0phi3l said,
Love how people like to claim Apple is being negative by simply pointing out Vista's flaws, this isn't politics, this is computing and in computing flaws are just that flaws, and Vista has many still, I should know I have 2 Vista machines.

Like when PayPal blocked Apple Safari as the browser to use when making secure transactions?

First off - I like Ubuntu and use it daily and I admit OSX is the prettiest Unix around

but....
Reason #6: The Juggernaut
MS may be a beast but they wont dry up immediately like a Yahoo situation. They got their fingers in too many pots.
(Zune, MSNBC, Windows (Home and IT), Xbox,..)
They may but it wont be a night/day transition

Reason #5: Lions, Tigers and malware Oh my!
This battle will always be around and although the problems of Malware and viruses will persist, so will companies that specialize in stopping that. But honestly, I havent been hit with anything. Friends have but nothing that wasnt fixed in moments
*feel a "foot in mouth" sensation coming on

Reason #4: Google
[sarcasm] Umm... ok... May as well say eBay too or any big internet company [/sacasm]

Reason #3: Open Source
Open source is great...however they is really no "Cadillac" open source product that a "closed source" application needs an adapter for. Maybe codecs. But put it this way, Open Office (great product, it is awesome) is not 100% perfect. Meaning, I have a spreadsheet that looks normal with excel but isnt formatted right in Open Office. I could look at the code and try to find the flaw and fix it but I wasted a weekend to find the problem which I could be doing something else. Deploying the fix to 100 workstations would be a task too. Also - god forbid - if I had to explain to my mother on what to do......forget about it.

Reason #2: Vista
Either you like it or you dont... I could go on but as the Borg say futile

Reason #1: Apple
*See reason #2

This is a horrible article as it considers Microsoft as 1 big company. Microsoft isn't.

MSFT themselves devide themselves into 4 cores businesses:

- Consumer desktop (Windows)
- Corporate / Business (Windows server, Exchange, Hosted services, CRM etc)
- Consumer services/product (Think of Zune, Xbox etc)
- Online services (Think of advertising, Windows Live etc)

To say Microsoft is "failing" in some of those areas, granted. However to say the company is failing overall, what a non-statement.

Oh and Vista-bashing is sooooo 2007

They also have:

- Hardware (Optical Mice, Ergonimic Keyboards)
- Research & Development (Microsoft Research)

Microsoft has the diversification advantage, I can't see the reason why the Entire Microsoft will fail if Zune fails.

People love the idea that Microsoft will fall.

The Neowin writers are geniuses for tickling the readers with more pro/anti-Microsoft articles.

So, let's see, we have seven things we say will be Microsoft's doom... let add:

Reason #8: Buying Yahoo Entirely.
Yahoo is an albatross and will drag MS down if they buy all of Yahoo. Yes they should just buy search.

If these points bring any truth, this would mean more competition (lower prices for one) and that Microsoft would listen even more to their costumers. aka... a good thing.

Its funny how most of the posts on the front of Neowin lately is either MS or Apple related. This is because people jump in to these threads to bash both companies and thus visit Neowin more. This is another useless thread...

Vista got a bad rap because a lot of morons tried to use it and didnt know what the hell they were doing. I never had a problem with Vista on the many Pcs I installed it on. Yes, there are othe reasons why they got a bad rap...but hey, we all know what these are already.

Apple is advancing their market share, yes. One of the ways they are doing it by bashing MS and Vista. I like the advertising MS is doing where they make no referance of Apple. They also have some new ads that tell stuff about Vista nad what it can do. Something Apple should be doing instead of being negative. People dont like negativity and this may end up back lashing on them. Tell us what OSX can do. Where are these commercials? People buying OSX because of the Apple commercials are morons...they are illinformed and buying something because the TV says so. Hey, Bush says we are not in Iraq because of the oil...it must be true! He wouldnt Lie!! I am not bashing Apple at all as I own apple products...just my opinion...like it or not...I dont care :)

Malware..yes...to be expected since MS owns most of the market share. If apple keeps growing the way it is, we will be seeing an new post on Neowin... "Six reaons Apple will continue to lose market share". I havnt had any malware on my systems in severl years...I know how to use my computer...now, my family's systems are another story....

Microsoft has much more software and hardware support than Apple or Linux. We have more choices of software to install, hardware to use, and games to play. If Apple and Linux dont start supporting software and hardware more, then they will continue to lose in this area.

I do think IE is a joke and IE8 will probably blow ass as well. To many damn popups and there are much more options and things you can do with FireFox. I used to use Netscape (nutscrape) back in the day before AOl took it over and screwed it up. Then I switch to IE until I found IE Tab for FF...never looked back since.

Also, do I even need to comment on how Apple was hacked the fastest followed by Vista?

techbeck said,
Its funny how most of the posts on the front of Neowin lately is either MS or Apple related. This is because people jump in to these threads to bash both companies and thus visit Neowin more. This is another useless thread...


kettle black?

techbeck said,
Its funny how most of the posts on the front of Neowin lately is either MS or Apple related. This is because people jump in to these threads to bash both companies and thus visit Neowin more. This is another useless thread...

True, true. You and I are playing right into it, but... oh well.

Vista got a bad rap because a lot of morons tried to use it and didnt know what the hell they were doing. I never had a problem with Vista on the many Pcs I installed it on. Yes, there are othe reasons why they got a bad rap...but hey, we all know what these are already.

Vista got a bad rap because its performance was horrid. Look, people benchmark this stuff all the time and have proven that even a simple operation like copying files takes longer on Vista than it does on XP - on the same machine. I've tried Vista myself and felt that it was very "bumpy" compared with XP - things took longer, it didn't feel as responsive, and I was getting errors for operations that had previously worked just fine with XP. I've heard similar complaints from other people who I wouldn't classify as "morons" - I'd even go so far as to say that they were computer-literate.

Of course, my and your experiences don't really amount to anything in the bigger picture. If you're happy with Vista, keep using it. It was debilitating enough that most people wanted to go back to XP or switch over to Linux/Mac OS X entirely.

Apple is advancing their market share, yes. One of the ways they are doing it by bashing MS and Vista. I like the advertising MS is doing where they make no referance of Apple. They also have some new ads that tell stuff about Vista nad what it can do. Something Apple should be doing instead of being negative.

Of course Microsoft won't mention Apple in their advertisements - that'd be helping Apple. Everyone knows Microsoft, which is why jokes can be made and people get it. Jokes about the "blue screen of death" have even broken out of the tech community. Apple is a smaller company, and while I'd imagine that everyone knows about them by now, why should Microsoft give them air time and publicity when they're the ones paying?

Apple isn't really being all that negative, either. Their ads are simple and mildly amusing. The negativity comes off in a "cutesy" manner. It sounds like you want them to say what OS X can do in terms of a feature list or some such thing; the average user doesn't care about that. I feel bad admitting that I remember some of these ads, but they had an ad about Time Machine and they also had an ad about how Macs communicate more easily with peripherals. They didn't give you a run-down or feature list, but they were creative enough that I'd say most people got the point. It kept attention and interest about computers, a subject that many people find somewhat cryptic and inaccessible. People really just want something that works - most people don't share your and my enthusiasm for tinkering around with the systems. Hence, Apple's simplicity and overall message that "it just works" is very appealing.

On the other hand, nobody cares if Microsoft is bashed because it's so common. It's kind of like how advertisements that mock traffic or other driving pains don't incite fury because people want to defend their city planners, road workers, or automakers - traffic is traffic, gas prices are as prices, they're just something you deal with when you're trying to drive to get somewhere. Microsoft Windows, as of now, is just the OS you have to use when you're computing.

Malware..yes...to be expected since MS owns most of the market share. If apple keeps growing the way it is, we will be seeing an new post on Neowin... "Six reaons Apple will continue to lose market share". I havnt had any malware on my systems in severl years...I know how to use my computer...now, my family's systems are another story....

You're probably right about the reason why Microsoft has more malware at this point, but it doesn't matter - the fact is that Apple isn't actively being targeted, and that's an attractive point to many people.

I've bolded the part of your sentence that is worrying. An attitude like that is what gets you into trouble. I consider myself to be very computer-savvy, and yet I was always half-paranoid and wondering whether something had somehow gotten through.

Microsoft has much more software and hardware support than Apple or Linux. We have more choices of software to install, hardware to use, and games to play. If Apple and Linux dont start supporting software and hardware more, then they will continue to lose in this area.

Very few people care to build their own systems, so no, Apple won't lose market share in this area. And it's funny you should say that Windows supports more hardware, when we've established that Vista runs like crap on older systems Linux may not shine in the "new hardware" department but it now has Microsoft sorely beat in support for older hardware.

Of course, techies like you and me generally aren't concerned with older hardware. It's a concern for people who don't want to upgrade from the computer they "just bought" four years ago.

Also, do I even need to comment on how Apple was hacked the fastest followed by Vista?

We could argue over the reasoning for this, but the big point is this: nobody cares. You and I both agree that Microsoft currently has the most malware after it, and thus regardless of the reasons (which the average person doesn't care for) it's a turn-off.

Ledgem said: "Vista got a bad rap because its performance was horrid. "


Well stop using that old 486 PC you dumb, and buy a new laptop from Costco, it's cheap yet powerful, you know? /sarcasm

Ledgem said,
Ledgem said:
You're probably right about the reason why Microsoft has more malware at this point, but it doesn't matter - the fact is that Apple isn't actively being targeted, and that's an attractive point to many people.

I've bolded the part of your sentence that is worrying. An attitude like that is what gets you into trouble. I consider myself to be very computer-savvy, and yet I was always half-paranoid and wondering whether something had somehow gotten through.

I dont get spyware, malware, virus or anything bad on my PC. I am not an idiot and I do perform daily scheduled virus scans and periodically use a few spyware programs to make sure my machines are clean.

techbeck said,
I dont get spyware, malware, virus or anything bad on my PC. I am not an idiot and I do perform daily scheduled virus scans and periodically use a few spyware programs to make sure my machines are clean.


How do you know for sure you are clean given that no spyware program or antivirus program can catch everything?

James7 said,
How do you know for sure you are clean given that no spyware program or antivirus program can catch everything?


He has to nuke the entire hard drive from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.

LTD said,
He has to nuke the entire hard drive from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.

I know its clean because I use a few different virus programs and spyware programs to scan my machine. For example..

Virus - AVG, Norton, Trent Micro Housecall
Spyware - Spybot, Hijackthis, Lavasoft, Trend Micro Housecall

I only use one virus/spyware scanner per week but at least once a month I use everything to verify my system is ok.

I havnt had to "nuke" my PC for several years and it is still running like when I originally set it up.

Will MS lose market share? yes probably, how much? 5%-10%? does it matter? no because the final figure is that sales are increasing, not decreasing, MS sold more even tho they lost some market share because the market is bigger.

Regarding Reason #1, Apple selling alot of macs yes, but OSX share only increased marginally in the US... why? windows... Apple are even trying to counter the situation by focusing on the OS and not the old mac vs pc approach.
People buy macs because of hype and eventually run windows on it.

I doubt it. It's not like Microsoft software is getting worse, it's actually getting better. Google, cmon. They are massive but only in search and ads, yet to find the next breakthrough and they also depend on Windows. Vista, it sells regardless, XP was out for ages, Windows 7 will triumph from early impressions. Open Source, a good thing that Microsoft are dipping their toes in and are opening up to other platforms, not an issue on marketshare as the OS is concerned. Firefox is awesome and deserves it's ever increasing share. Malware etc. Vista is the most secure OS around. Defender and soon to be free Virus protection from MS, sorted. Apple, too expensive, will always have a small marketshare, they like it. Enterprise. The end.

You underestimate Google and the importance of online services. That's where the "mindshare" is. That's what controls media and information. The OS is irrelevant in this regard as long as you've got the means to access the info/media from some type of device or connection. You can even use online applications as an alternative to desktop ones if you have a cheap PC or console or something. All the PC has left after that is 3D gaming and high-end multimedia apps; office, email, productivity apps can all be used remotely or online.

Microsoft has so far completely failed in the online world in all of its initiatives, unless you count the XBox. The primary users of MS services are clueless noobs from third world countries who fall for the advertizing/hype. Everyone else knows that MS ****s customers over at every opportunity and that MS is not a trustworthy company. Send an email from Hotmail and people think you're someone's grandparent or a little kid, send one from Gmail and they think you're cool. Even Yahoo is still doing better online than MS.

toadeater said,
You underestimate Google and the importance of online services. That's where the "mindshare" is. That's what controls media and information. The OS is irrelevant in this regard as long as you've got the means to access the info/media from some type of device or connection. You can even use online applications as an alternative to desktop ones if you have a cheap PC or console or something. All the PC has left after that is 3D gaming and high-end multimedia apps; office, email, productivity apps can all be used remotely or online.

Microsoft has so far completely failed in the online world in all of its initiatives, unless you count the XBox. The primary users of MS services are clueless noobs from third world countries who fall for the advertizing/hype. Everyone else knows that MS ****s customers over at every opportunity and that MS is not a trustworthy company. Send an email from Hotmail and people think you're someone's grandparent or a little kid, send one from Gmail and they think you're cool. Even Yahoo is still doing better online than MS.


Mindshare; feh. How much did mindshare help Netscape against a determined Microsoft and IE 3.0? (Consider this: I was a Netscape user, on Windows, that switched to IE 3.0, and bundling wasn't the reason; if it were, I would have stayed with Netscape, which I got from my ISP at the time.) Notice that at that time, it was Netscape, not Microsoft, that had the browser mindshare; worse, IE 2.x was rightly considered a joke. Mindshare is largely irrelevant with products outside your normal markets.

Google's online services: they actually present a rather nasty problem for Google, in that they have to now face the rather ugly prospect of malware created to attack, or worse, created by, Google Apps. (This is one reason why Google Apps are not widely advertised OR gaining much in the way of traction in the enterprise.) GMail/GoogleMail is still not widely pushed (it's so under the radar, even long after its launch, that it stopped being funny three years ago), GTalk even less so. I actually have a GTalk account that I hardly use; the same applies to GMail; in most cases, I use Yahoo Mail, Yahoo Messenger, or the POP3 account from my current ISP, even on openSuSE (from which I'm posting these words) via the open-source apps Pidgin (Y! Messenger) and Firefox (Y! Mail). POP3? I have two open-source options (Evolution and KMail), and could even run Outlook (via Crossover Pro). Notice that there's not a single Google application or service listed anywhere.
Not even Microsoft can succeed at *everything*; in fact, neither can Apple. (Remember .mac, now rebranded MobileMe? The rebranding wasn't just about embracing the popular-with-the-moneyed-classes iPhone; the service was moribund without the ability to embrace non-Mac clients. Among the other changes was to open the service up to decidedly non-Apple (read: W-i-n-d-o-w-s) driven hardware and make it free. MobileMe is getting mindshare; however, it's now a loss-leader for Apple.)
The various online initiatives that Microsoft has failed at can rightly be called Microsoft's *only* real failure since Windows ME (unlike some, I don't see Vista as a failure, since I've been using it as primary OS since it was in beta and still do today; while I also run openSuSE on the same hardware, Novell's Linux distribution is a secondary OS); if anything, their continued trying again is keeping Microsoft humble (which a good thing, as hubris can bring down even the largest company; just look at GM).
What nobody has even remotely commented on is Microsoft's second-longest-running (and mostly under the radar) success story: the peripherals/hardware division. What started with the humble Microsoft Mouse (which actually predates Windows!) has morphed into an octopus that includes keyboards, webcams, gaming peripherals, and even networking hardware. In just about every case, plug it in and it works, even on non-Microsoft operating systems, such as the aforementioned openSuSE (I'm actually using a Microsoft Internet Keyboard to type these words; it's backup is the Natural Keyboard Elite, also from MS. Mice? Sorry; Microsoft's IntelliMouse PS/2 is my pointing device of choice, with a second one as its backup.).

Screwed over? Please; I feel FAR from screwed over in my many years of using Microsoft's software AND hardware.

toadeater said,
You underestimate Google and the importance of online services. That's where the "mindshare" is. That's what controls media and information. The OS is irrelevant in this regard as long as you've got the means to access the info/media from some type of device or connection. You can even use online applications as an alternative to desktop ones if you have a cheap PC or console or something. All the PC has left after that is 3D gaming and high-end multimedia apps; office, email, productivity apps can all be used remotely or online.

Microsoft has so far completely failed in the online world in all of its initiatives, unless you count the XBox. The primary users of MS services are clueless noobs from third world countries who fall for the advertizing/hype. Everyone else knows that MS ****s customers over at every opportunity and that MS is not a trustworthy company. Send an email from Hotmail and people think you're someone's grandparent or a little kid, send one from Gmail and they think you're cool. Even Yahoo is still doing better online than MS.

Oh, please. Google is an intergalactic privacy meltdown aiting to happen. Microsoft hasn't "failed in the online world" as you put it. Do you have even the slightest idea how many people use Windows Live services? Even Hotmail? I use my Gmail account as a trash account ONLY.

toadeater said,
The OS is irrelevant in this regard as long as you've got the means to access the info/media from some type of device or connection. You can even use online applications as an alternative to desktop ones if you have a cheap PC or console or something. All the PC has left after that is 3D gaming and high-end multimedia apps; office, email, productivity apps can all be used remotely or online.

Microsoft has so far completely failed in the online world in all of its initiatives, blah blah blah blah blah.

First, the Web is a horrible platform for many applications. Not only are you limited by your UI (the browser is the most restrictive UI to develop for), but your entire application hinges upon connectivity. It isn't reliable.

Second, the real money is in the business realm, and any business that cares about the privacy and security of their information will not use online applications in place of MS Office or other productivity apps.

And Microsoft has completely failed on the Web front? Really? Now you're stretching it. Hell, Microsoft has the most popular and used browser in the world. They have one of the oldest and most successful Web mail services. The only online service Microsoft has trouble with is their search.

Let's face it, the declining quality of Microsoft's software, especially Windows has been contributing to their downfall lately. If Windows 7 turns out to be another Vista, then it will hurt them even further.

Last time I checked, it's Yahoo's Market Share that's dropping, and it's Google's fault.

[sarcasm]
Let's expand Reason #4:

Reason #4a: Amazon.com
Amazon is such a behemoth of a store front, OMG Microsoft will be crushed!

Reason #4b: Wikipedia.com
Wikipedia.com is FREE and OPEN it will soon eat all the traffic of Encarta.com, and lead to Microsoft's fall!

Reason #4c: Digg.com
Digg is getting more and more users because it is a central ideal place to get all the leet news, MSN and MSNBC will be bound to total EPIC FAIL!!!

[/sarcasm]


Never underestimate Microsoft, people. Yes it's fashionable to hate Microsoft, but let's be realistic here. Microsoft will go to greater ends like Nintendo did changing itself from selling Playing Cards to selling the NDS!

Perhaps, but Microsoft's time has passed. They already made it big, now its time to hit the ground hard. Its down from here, how far down depends on the quality of software/hardware they put out.

TRC said,
I suppose everyone is going to switch to Linux or OSX? Yeah right...

Like it or not Microsoft isn't going anywhere.

LOL "THE DAY OF DOOM HAS COME FOR MICROSOFT!!!"

Dream on! ROFL

Last time I checked, Sun Microsystems laid off 6,000 workers and now is bundling Windows Live Toolbar with their Java installer.

thenonhacker said,

LOL "THE DAY OF DOOM HAS COME FOR MICROSOFT!!!"

Dream on! ROFL

Last time I checked, Sun Microsystems laid off 6,000 workers and now is bundling Windows Live Toolbar with their Java installer.


Even a couple of market share percentage points lost to a competitor, regardless of who it is, prompts serious questions from management and stakeholders. At any point in time that small loss can signal the start of something much more serious. It's no laughing matter and certainly not to be taken lightly.