Steve Jobs: Google's 'Don't Be Evil' motto is "bullshit"

Keeping in tradition with what happened after the release of the original iPhone, Steve Jobs held a meeting at the Town Hall in Cupertino following the release of the iPad, in order for employees to ask questions about the company and the new device. There has been much debate over the lack of Flash on the iPad, so as you'd expect, that was a strong talking point during the meeting, in addition to some less positive words about Apple's current ally, Google.

According to Wired, the question was raised as to whether or not Google was a serious competitor in the phone business. Jobs noted that the company very much wants to kill the iPhone, but Apple will simply not let them. He continued with this by stating that Google's 'Don't Be Evil' motto is "bullshit," which was met with a great amount of cheering from the employees. Jobs didn't stop there with the negative feelings, however – he stated that Adobe is lazy, as it doesn't support Flash due to it being rather buggy. Jobs believes that in the future, nobody will be using Flash, and instead stated that HTML5 will be come out on top. Apple is certainly doing its part to make this possible; the iPhone saw some criticism over the lack of Flash, and most recently, the launch of the iPad raised the issue once more. There has been a huge amount of debate over this lately, though too much to include in this article.

MacRumors has learned some rather interesting points from the meeting, in addition to Jobs' strong words; it was said that Apple will deliver "aggressive" updates to the iPhone platform that Google won't be able to keep up with. In addition to this, the upcoming iPhone update is "A+", and the new Macs this year will bring Apple to the "next level."

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Need pages, getting to the comments spot here can take forever on a slower connection. Is there a way I can set pages (like the old system) here? Anyway, In 4 years almost anything is outdated now. Disposable products are costing more and more each day, while at the same time programmers can hardly keep updates flowing. Flash is becoming a disaster, and seems to be holding out for MS dev info before doing anything new for anyone. Hardware will not catch up with software any time soon. If it does, most of us will not be able to afford it.

Apple is evil, iPhone sucks because Apple controls what you run in it, for exaple:
http://operation420.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=1310
There will be no Firefox for it.

Wow, Jobs ego and that of his company is...well, wow. What a crap attitude he has, seriously. I seriously hope Android takes over and makes Jobs eat his words...maybe then they will change their attitudes...doubt it tho.

well looks like we now know just how far the Steve Jobs reality distortion field is emitted how big was that town hall 16000+ square feet i wonder how many singularities steve had on his weetbix for breakfast

@smooth i wonder what jobs would like in it's place M$ SilverLight perhaps

My god...I actually agree with Jobs that Flash needs to die. Shame it probably won't happen though.

And that's no reason to exclude it from the iPhone and all its b****** children sharing its birth defects :P

What I don't like about Steve Jobs is that he is not a programmer/computer enthusiast like most of the readers here. Bill Gates, Steve Wozniak and the Macintosh team were really (just some of) the people who drove technology forwards. However, Steve Jobs actually had very little impact - he just cared about criticizing, and selling products for a higher price to get rich (and making it look like he was the one that came up with all the ideas). I hate his attitude, and believe that that was the reason why he was fired in the 80s - people just got sick of him, like I am. I read somewhere that he used to organize business meeting starting at 7:00AM in the morning, and later ones going until midnight - that must of frustrated the regular attendees. I think there is a lot of jealousy and anger in Steve Jobs. And I think Apple's iPad will be a failure. Bring back John Sculley anytime!

Finally, Apple gets something right. But if the motto is "bullsh---" then why would Stevie make Google the search engine of choice for Safari? Is it because Apple is evil too or is Stevie being a hypocrite?

Ya know, if I didn't agree with all of the anti-Apple hate i woulda taken offense. But, truth be told, all of this Apple Hate is 110% warranted.

Apple, if you're reading this, then you already know that you've fallen out of grace with folks on the leading edge of computing innovation.

This just makes me hate Apple even more. Jobs is a cocky business man that can't see past the bank. He doesn't care what consumers want. He just wants things done his way.

Benjamin Rubenstein said,
This just makes me hate Apple even more. Jobs is a cocky business man that can't see past the bank. He doesn't care what consumers want. He just wants things done his way.

Well, consumers buy his stuff, so he must be doing something right.

I think you should change your line to "he doesn't care what I, as a geek, want." And that's why we have competition.

"bull****" sounds better than "think different".

Apple should change their logo to a steaming turd, as I think it more accurately represents the company.

"Jobs believes that in the future, nobody will be using Flash, and instead stated that HTML5 will be come out on top." -- If that weirdo can do anything to speed that up (for all platforms), I'll never doubt his god status again. lol

IntelliMoo said,
"Jobs believes that in the future, nobody will be using Flash, and instead stated that HTML5 will be come out on top." -- If that weirdo can do anything to speed that up (for all platforms), I'll never doubt his god status again. lol

The only thing wrong with striving to erase Flash from the face of the Earth is that it would simultaneously erase a massive library of games. Thousands upon thousands of clever and creative flash games exist all over the internet, and very few still have their developers interested enough in rewriting them to keep them alive.

apple if your smart you should add support for all the common formats to be competitive but i do agree with 2 of his statements and that is how flash is crap and the new HTML5 will replace buggy flash with something like HTML5 that does not the issues flash does.

Jobs is right about Adobe though. Flash isn't worth **** IMO. It is so damn buggy it drives me up the wall. Playing a YouTube flash video shouldn't cause my CPU usage to skyrocket like it does. When I play them using HTML5, it stays steady.

Hurmoth said,
Jobs is right about Adobe though. Flash isn't worth **** IMO. It is so damn buggy it drives me up the wall. Playing a YouTube flash video shouldn't cause my CPU usage to skyrocket like it does. When I play them using HTML5, it stays steady.

unless you are using a macbook or a mac, that is hardly the case. Even a netbook can handle flash intensive sites. I am on a 1.86 GHz core 2 duo lenovo tablet. I can run 4 720p HD streaming flash movies at the same time without a hickup!

Hurmoth said,
Jobs is right about Adobe though. Flash isn't worth **** IMO. It is so damn buggy it drives me up the wall. Playing a YouTube flash video shouldn't cause my CPU usage to skyrocket like it does. When I play them using HTML5, it stays steady.

unless you are using a macbook or a mac, that is hardly the case. Even a netbook can handle flash intensive sites. I am on a 1.86 GHz core 2 duo lenovo tablet. I can run 4 720p HD streaming flash movies at the same time without a hickup!

zagor said,

unless you are using a macbook or a mac, that is hardly the case. Even a netbook can handle flash intensive sites. I am on a 1.86 GHz core 2 duo lenovo tablet. I can run 4 720p HD streaming flash movies at the same time without a hickup!

I'm using a Q6600 with 8GB of RAM. It isn't my system. It also happens on my notebook. I didn't say that flash wasn't working and was dragging my system down, I said it causes my CPU usage to skyrocket.

Hurmoth said,
I'm using a Q6600 with 8GB of RAM. It isn't my system. It also happens on my notebook. I didn't say that flash wasn't working and was dragging my system down, I said it causes my CPU usage to skyrocket.

Are you on a MAC?
my humble system is running windows 7. And, right now 1 hulu window is running, along with another youtube HD movie. Max CPU usage is %41!

Hurmoth said,
I'm using a Q6600 with 8GB of RAM. It isn't my system. It also happens on my notebook. I didn't say that flash wasn't working and was dragging my system down, I said it causes my CPU usage to skyrocket.

you must be using a MAC :-)
1 hulu (high quality) + 1 youtube HD = max % 41 CPU usage on my system...

zagor said,

Are you on a MAC?
my humble system is running windows 7. And, right now 1 hulu window is running, along with another youtube HD movie. Max CPU usage is %41!
No, I'm running Windows 7.

Don't assume I'm running a Mac.

zagor said,

you must be using a MAC :-)
1 hulu (high quality) + 1 youtube HD = max % 41 CPU usage on my system...

News flash (hey, it's a pun!): Not everybody is running Flash 10.1 yet. It's a beta product.

the bottom line is android scares the sh** out of apple. it's the newest craze and is dominating the market fast. i just bought a hero and i love it. it is by far the iphone killer IMO. and.....it has flash!

smooth3006 said,
the bottom line is android scares the sh** out of apple. it's the newest craze and is dominating the market fast. i just bought a hero and i love it. it is by far the iphone killer IMO. and.....it has flash!
I've tried using Android, but it still seems to me to have some issues. I couldn't put my finger on it exactly, but I'm holding out on Android. Maybe one day, but for now I'm perfectly happy with my iPhone. I think there's to many people who are just anti-Apple for whatever reason to enjoy the device. To many fanboys out there.

I'm glad, in the case of technology, I'm not one of them. At least I can see the benefits of Google, Apple and Microsoft.

I know the issue you have with Android, cuz I have it, too: it's outdated. Literally.

The vast majority of Android devices on the market are running very old versions of the OS, and users have no way of upgrading it on their own without rooting. And the industry is designed to revolve around the 2-year contract model so much so that firmware is updated for a few months after release before they all just give up and hope spending year two with no updates whatsoever will frustrate you just enough that you feel like you have no choice but to buy a whole new phone.

And the worst part is the group of users who seem to be okay with this. There are even a few people right here on NeoWin who will jump up and say "Why should they release updates anyway? They're PHONES, not computers. You don't have a right to new versions forever."

These people need to die cold and alone. The reality is, smartphones are trying to outgrow being "just phones". They WANT to be the mobile computing revolution, and it's happening. Web browsing has advanced dramatically, gaming has evolved (and that first gen PSP is still getting updates today, so there's a precedent for updates right there), and dozens of new, innovative functions are popping up on smartphones all the time.

But how can this growth/revolution occur if something is holding it back? Using iPhones as an example, if iPhone OS 4 was to include multitasking, would the original and 3G iPhones be able to handle it with an user-acceptable level of performance? I doubt it. Would you then recommend that Apple caters to these users by producing OS updates specific to each iPhone, e.g. iPhone OS 4 without multitasking for 1st and 2nd gen. iPhones? I could argue, then, that the time, money and effort spent on doing so would still hinder the growth/revolution. What I'm saying is, eventually you have to cut the cord. (Not that I believe this would be the sole reason in discontinuing support, because obviously Apple is also trying to make money.)

talking about BS Mr. Jobs...what about the blatant lie that Apple is the world's largest mobile devices company in the world? Hm?

A look at this article perhaps will shine some light on who is actually the world's largest!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/rorycellanjones/2010/01/nokias_quiet_comeback.html

ManosK said,
talking about BS Mr. Jobs...what about the blatant lie that Apple is the world's largest mobile devices company in the world? Hm?

A look at this article perhaps will shine some light on who is actually the world's largest!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/rorycellanjones/2010/01/nokias_quiet_comeback.html

Considering Nokia only released their quarterly earnings on Thursday, the day after Jobs got up on stage, it probably wasn't a lie the moment he said it.

Simon said,
Considering Nokia only released their quarterly earnings on Thursday, the day after Jobs got up on stage, it probably wasn't a lie the moment he said it.

Apple has never been the world's largest mobile company lol. It's been Nokia for YEARS now.

And I find it pretty pathetic that Jobs throws in the figures of desktops, laptops, iphones, ipods, etc into one thing to pretend they are the biggest.

Edited by -Razorfold, Feb 1 2010, 12:49am :

/- Razorfold said,

Apple has never been the world's largest mobile company lol. It's been Nokia for YEARS now.

And I find it pretty pathetic that Jobs throws in the figures of desktops, laptops, iphones, ipods, etc into one thing to pretend they are the biggest.

Laptops, iPhones, and iPods are mobile devices, though.

majortom1981 said,
Wow what a hypocrite. This coming from the same company which puts out the buggy and bloated software known as itunes.
iTunes is hardly bloated. Buggy on Windows is definitely true, but it is pretty damn good on OS X.

Hurmoth said,
iTunes is hardly bloated. Buggy on Windows is definitely true, but it is pretty damn good on OS X.

If I wanted to use a piece of software that claims to be a media player, yet, after 9 versions, still can't monitor folders (no, that single monitored folder doesn't count) then I would use it on a Mac.

Edited by neo158, Feb 1 2010, 1:45am :

neo158 said,

If I wanted to use a piece of software that claims to be a media player, yet, after 9 versions, still can't monitor folders (no, that single monitored folder doesn't count) then I would use it on a Mac.


Oh ****, because double-clicking a few files is SO DAMN HARD. Are you serious?

Elliott said,

Oh ****, because double-clicking a few files is SO DAMN HARD. Are you serious?

Yes I am serious, even Windows Media Player monitors folders and has done since version 7.

Why should I have to "import" the 34GB of music I have, when monitoring folders is a simpler option.

I just don't understand why is it so hard for Apple to get iTunes to do the same thing!!

Yawn. Steve Jobs, Please come up with something creative. iPad is crap, that's just too obvious. The only creative device I have seen from them is the iPhone, but then again, that was just good marketing, just like the iPod. I just don't see what these Apple Fanboys like about the products. They're not amazing, they tend to have a lot of bugs, and all they ever really show off is how 'stylish' and 'cool' these products claim to be. Hype is all it is... and the iPad is the beginning of the dying fad known as Apple. Yes, I am going to be blasted for saying this, but, I will never see Macs as a real threat to Windows. The only real success stories they have are the iPod and iPhone anyways.

Decaytion said,
Yawn. Steve Jobs, Please come up with something creative. iPad is crap, that's just too obvious. The only creative device I have seen from them is the iPhone, but then again, that was just good marketing, just like the iPod. I just don't see what these Apple Fanboys like about the products. They're not amazing, they tend to have a lot of bugs, and all they ever really show off is how 'stylish' and 'cool' these products claim to be. Hype is all it is... and the iPad is the beginning of the dying fad known as Apple. Yes, I am going to be blasted for saying this, but, I will never see Macs as a real threat to Windows. The only real success stories they have are the iPod and iPhone anyways.

Yeah, I really think the competition was well ready for this next iProduct, having already products that will appear to be in direct competition and that are actually quite decent looking.

dead.cell said,

Yeah, I really think the competition was well ready for this next iProduct, having already products that will appear to be in direct competition and that are actually quite decent looking.

I imagine it'll be something like laptop computing ages back. Though Apple wasn't first to the game, many Mac users felt like Macbooks somehow did something completely new and revolutionary. Even now, the same attitude shows up in how they can't simply say "macbook" anymore, instead going out of their way to make it clear that it's a "unibody macbook", as if that one feature has somehow become a selling point despite doing nothing to improve the ownership experience.

Apple has once again come late to a game with their iPad, and any criticism is shrugged off because the hardware and the OS don't matter this time--it's "all about the apps". Apple is putting a mediocre product on the market in hopes that their image and culture will attract enough developers to do all the actual work in creating a successful platform.

I hate APPLE TO....

But I like bananas hahaha

apple is a bit crap in the openess of the iPhone like flash it's stupid how they never supported it and they can't use html5 as an excuse cus say it's been 4 years since first release was html5 even conceived then and if it was it would have be built up and standardized so using it as an excuse is crap.

I wish they'd make there phones full bluetooth compatibility and a drive space to to receive and send music and videos to any phone cus what is the f'ing point in it. Maybe there playing up to the phone companies so your burning up your mms plans sending contacts and crap cus you can't bluetooth it, who knows.

iPad looks a bit crap cus for a device that size that you put in an onboard gfx chip like a 4670 taking 256- 500MB of say 1GB ram and have some decent games on there. Wack gta on there obviously not gta4 cus that needs like a cray to run it haha, gta3 when your in car steer with the device accelerate and decelerate by tipping it be wicked. To close minded dumbo's hmm I'll stop now hahaha

my 2 cents

Magallanes said,
So apparently Google Nexus is eroding the sales of Iphone.

Probably not, considering the Nexus One is pretty much the poorest selling major (i.e. hyped up) Android phone to date.

Apple your been evil not aloowing fair competition on your mobile platform, a competitor comes along and Apple just things, ho god we could lose out here and just blocks it. *******.

It seems like Apple has a "my way or highway" type of attitude in regards to technology and innovation. Personally I would have to say that I tried your way and it's not the greatest so I'd rather take the highway and get to where I need to go a lot quicker.

neufuse said,
When HTML5 can do everything flash can then we will talk....

+1

I don't get why half of you are banging on about HTML5. Yes its good, yes flash is bad. But the reality is this:

1. HTML5 isn't even complete at the moment, features are still being added/removed.
2. Tons and tons of websites use flash, they aren't all going to suddenly upgrade overnight.

So for now we're stuck with flash whether we like it or not, so why leave it out. The reason has got nothing to do with how flash runs (flash lite runs dam well on mobile devices and can do most of what reg flash can) but instead apple will lose a huge amount of money if flash worked on the iphone.

Edited by -Razorfold, Jan 31 2010, 4:17pm :

+1
And for those of you who use things like floppy drive and IE6 as a comparison... seriously I'm LMAO.

IMO it all comes down to revenue, without flash/silverlight they'll lose some sell, lose some $. On the other hand if those are supported, their revenue will drop from their app store.
If the former loss is greater than the later, that's when they'll bring on flash support.

Edited by bestbuy, Jan 31 2010, 5:42pm :

The reason why Apple doesn't support flash and keeps blaming Adobe, it may not be so obvious for most people but the truth is, the most beautiful invention of our times "iTunes", a well thought out idea done in the apple Labs, concealed from us for many years until January 9, 2001[napster didn't exits during this time and their weren't plans of making a device that connects to it to sync your media files] itunes/ipod revolution, so what would happen if apple actually supported flash on their mobile devices......idk but all i can tell you is that apple rules, and their working on making a quicktime live encoder which will in real time decode flash on any site and display it to you [sarcasm but it is true]

/- Razorfold said,
I don't think a triple facepalm can describe how much fail there is in this post.

+1

Edited by Lw011, Jan 31 2010, 4:22pm :

Ok let me do some explaining:

the most beautiful invention of our times "iTunes", a well thought out idea done in the apple Labs

There is nothing amazing about itunes, apart from the appstore, and especially not on Windows. It's probably one of the worst coded windows applications there is.

heir weren't plans of making a device that connects to it to sync your media files] itunes/ipod revolution,

I could sync my media from my computer to my mp3 player well before the ipod came out. It wasn't something new like people made it out to be.

idk but all i can tell you is that apple rules, and their working on making a quicktime live encoder which will in real time decode flash on any site and display it to you

Wow isn't that smart, let's get rid of a "hated" product thats possibly slow and laggy..and instead we'll replace it with an even more hated product thats worse. Great thinking there.


Edited by -Razorfold, Jan 31 2010, 4:59pm :

Lw011 said,
The reason why Apple doesn't support flash and keeps blaming Adobe, it may not be so obvious for most people but the truth is, the most beautiful invention of our times "iTunes", a well thought out idea done in the apple Labs, concealed from us for many years until January 9, 2001[napster didn't exits during this time and their weren't plans of making a device that connects to it to sync your media files] itunes/ipod revolution, so what would happen if apple actually supported flash on their mobile devices......idk but all i can tell you is that apple rules, and their working on making a quicktime live encoder which will in real time decode flash on any site and display it to you [sarcasm but it is true]

I really hope you forgot the "/sarcasm"

The lack of flash is just plain stupid for the iPad and the iPhone. Users should be able to make their own decisions about what runs on the devices they paid for.

Shadrack said,
The lack of flash is just plain stupid for the iPad and the iPhone. Users should be able to make their own decisions about what runs on the devices they paid for.

I agree with that part: "Users should be able to make their own decisions about what runs on the devices they paid for.". But the lack of Adobe Flash support is somehow understandable, the future is a proprietary plugin free Web. It's not the current reality with all of those companies trying to push their own software to the Web users. Microsoft and Adobe are two of the main obstacles towards a free Web. It's a good move from Apple (in my opinion) not to include support for Adobe Flash as default in their devices, what's not so good is the absence of a modular OS that let's the user choose what they want to install. And no, not all apps should come from the "app store". Also a user should have the choice about what OS they want to run on their devices.
Good news for "jailbreaking", I gues...

Steve Jobs screwed the pooch with the iPad. But he is right about the Google mantra being bull****.

How is Schmidt's views on privacy not evil?
"If you have something that you don't want anyone to know, maybe you shouldn't be doing it in the first place."

schwit said,
Steve Jobs screwed the pooch with the iPad. But he is right about the Google mantra being bull****.

How is Schmidt's views on privacy not evil?
"If you have something that you don't want anyone to know, maybe you shouldn't be doing it in the first place."


+1. He's right about Google.

I agree with what he's saying about HTML5, it is the future and it'll be nice to get away from Flash, but they should STILL include it.

I agree, its a bit like the micro-SIM card slot in the iPad, this may be the future but right now basicly no phone operators use it.

J400uk said,
I agree, its a bit like the micro-SIM card slot in the iPad, this may be the future but right now basicly no phone operators use it.
but no one will use them unless someone starts

Rofl. Apple, Steve Jobs, Ipad, Iphone.. all still a big Joke. I'm glad this type of content is posted. It brings people that know what they're doing together even more. It leaves the poor ignorants alone in the corner wondering why their product doesn't "do what everyone elses does."

The reason things aren't and won't go so well is that "What works" has already been patented and poor Stevie can't figure out a way around it. Not to mention that when cut your customers off from thinking for themselves they start looking elsewhere for the answer.

Watch the movie "Pleasantville" A World of drones that were shown how to think for themselves.

VoX said,
Rofl. Apple, Steve Jobs, Ipad, Iphone.. all still a big Joke. I'm glad this type of content is posted. It brings people that know what they're doing together even more. It leaves the poor ignorants alone in the corner wondering why their product doesn't "do what everyone elses does."

The reason things aren't and won't go so well is that "What works" has already been patented and poor Stevie can't figure out a way around it. Not to mention that when cut your customers off from thinking for themselves they start looking elsewhere for the answer.

Watch the movie "Pleasantville" A World of drones that were shown how to think for themselves.


...I don't know what the **** you just said. I think you're living in some alternate reality where the iPhone isn't a huge success.

Edited by Elliott, Feb 1 2010, 7:51pm :

Leaving flash out of a highly portable device: makes sense

It's crippled web anyways normally (coming from wap.whatever.com) so that was a HUGE improvement.

Fair game....

But to not include flash on a device AIMED AT BEING A BROWSER ON MY LAP AT HOME.... Thats sooo stupid... I mean... Flash IS on the web, its not a choice, its a certainty. You can't even view YouTube without flash (YET). It's still not fully rolled out to be HTML5.

That being said: Jobs has released a crippled browsing device as a browsing device.. In hopes he can tell consumers and industry what the standards SHOULD be.... Not what they CURRENTLY are, in terms of whats available on the web.

It has been said in comments before, this is strictly a move to increase apps store sales to not lose them to websites....

A fairly-sized SVG file opened on Mobile Safari will cause the entire iPhone OS to clog. HTML5 can be just as resource-intensive as flash... so please Steve, just admit the real reason for not having flash. Lack of flash support will drive flash-based web apps to turn to the iPhone SDK, and that's how they can gather 140,000 apps and a large developer market in such a short time. Such a low move, disqualifies Jobs of making statements about Google. A real shame to see Jobs sink into the moral attitude of Ballmer.

Google's "do no evil" has been put to the test a number of times, and with the exception of some unaddressed privacy concerns, it stands correct.

HTML5 may very well be the future but that doesn't help me NOW. It took how long for flash to become widely used? I don't see this changing overnight. With time? Sure. I am sure that flash will be used as often as shockwave and java on mainstream sites in a while.
(Oh, and you can say sh*t on cable tv, don't know about broadcast. A perfect example of this is the south park movie unedited on comedy central occasionally. They can get away with "Sh*t-faced c*ck-master" and "Listen, you donkey-r*ping sh*t eater". Amusing... lol

humanz. said,
I was about to comment against Steve about this; but the more I think about it the more he's right.

Job's brainwashing in action.

andrewbares said,
Job's brainwashing in action.
More like you joining the anti-apple mob. Flash sucks, its buggy, it crashes and it uses a ridiculous amount of memory. Jobs is absolutely right when he says he doesn't want to support it. Now you can say it runs fine on Windows. Good for you, it runs like **** on all Macs. THATS Adobe's fault for not being able to make a decent version for the platform. If they can't even get their desktop player to work without crashing than why would Apple put it on their mobile devices. I hate Flash I don't want that **** on my iPhone. By excluding it they are forcing people to adopt HTML5 standards much quicker. It'd be different if Flash was a fantastic platform with great stability, but its a steaming pile of **** that sucks even for video streaming (image quality)

And people give Apple **** because their device doesn't do what other devices do. These other devices have for the most part been failures (specifically tablets) So yea, Apple is the moron for not doing things the same way, its obviously a recipe for success :rolleyes:

Apple should put code into OS X to block Flash to make Jobs happy.

And Adobe should pull Photoshop and the rest of the CS from OS X just out of spite (who's lazy now?)

Redestium said,
Apple should put code into OS X to block Flash to make Jobs happy.

And Adobe should pull Photoshop and the rest of the CS from OS X just out of spite (who's lazy now?)


lol 1) When looking at the CS user base, you'll find that a LOT of it is probably on OS X and 2) It's Adobe's laziness that's the problem here anyway. Those idiots can't code a proper version of Flash (or many other apps, really) to save their lives.

Redestium said,
Apple should put code into OS X to block Flash to make Jobs happy.

And Adobe should pull Photoshop and the rest of the CS from OS X just out of spite (who's lazy now?)


Because that would be a good business strategy

Let it be war. That way it's much better for the consumer, and I can't wait to see new products coming out ;-) Hoping that Apple sinks.

Jeez... Thou I own an iphone 3g and have been rather satisfied with it, recently i just want to smash it against Jobs face. His arrogance is just blinding.

i am fully irritated by the lack of flash on my iPhone.

But I was also fully irritated by the lack of a floppy drive on the iMac...

macf13nd said,
i am fully irritated by the lack of flash on my iPhone.

But I was also fully irritated by the lack of a floppy drive on the iMac...

Again, we got mature devices that replace floppy drives.
Where's our alternative for flash/sliverlight?

HTML4, flash, sliverlight are the present and they should be supported.

bestbuy said,

Again, we got mature devices that replace floppy drives.
Where's our alternative for flash/sliverlight?

HTML4, flash, sliverlight are the present and they should be supported.

+1 I totally agree that what we have at present should be supported until HTML5 can mature a bit more and get more support. There isn't enough support for HTML5 yet to say lets not support Flash because of it. He has a lot of other reasons and is just thowing anything out there to try to shut people up. When HTML5 does pick up, than the iPhone will be where it should've been from day one. They're only hurting themselves. I will never tell or let anyone I know or talk to go buy the iPad because it looks cool or is what everyone else is getting. I'll make sure they know about all the other products out there that can do the same and better atm

macf13nd said,
i am fully irritated by the lack of flash on my iPhone.

But I was also fully irritated by the lack of a floppy drive on the iMac...

That's right. I love to emulate System 7 on my modern machines, but in order to read old Mac floppy disks (the 400k and 800k ones) I have to use my old Powerbook (which I find to be much faster and easier to use than Windows XP anyway!).

greatscot said,
I agree with Jobs. If there's anyone on the planet who understands what bullsh*t is its Jobs.

lol Quality !

greatscot said,
I agree with Jobs. If there's anyone on the planet who understands what bullsh*t is its Jobs.

Pity he can't "understand" when he's talking bullsh*t!!

Edited by neo158, Feb 1 2010, 12:52am :

Why should jobs support flash?
Javascript and html5 is the way to go and thanks god for Jobs helping this happen A bit sooner by not supporting flash!

Have none of you expirenced a pc or a netbook crawl due to a simple flash animation on a website?

The browser race is all about faster javascript implementation and support for html5.

That is the future of the web and not flash!

parisp said,
Have none of you expirenced a pc or a netbook crawl due to a simple flash animation on a website?

So many have been complaining to Adobe about this, and they basically ignore them.

parisp said,
Why should jobs support flash?
Javascript and html5 is the way to go and thanks god for Jobs helping this happen A bit sooner by not supporting flash!

Looking forward does not mean you have to ignore the present.


Have none of you expirenced a pc or a netbook crawl due to a simple flash animation on a website?

Can't say that I have.
And if so, there's a simple solution: disable flash and enable it for selected sites through a whitelist.

k7of9 said,

Looking forward does not mean you have to ignore the present.

It kinda does. Ever heard of the "If it's not broken, don't fix it" mentality? Yea, a lot of idiots believe in that. Especially when it comes to Flash, which, IMO, could not be any more broken if it tried anyway.

Edited by Elliott, Jan 31 2010, 3:32pm :

Elliott said,

It kinda does. Ever heard of the "If it's not broken, don't fix it" mentality? Yea, a lot of idiots believe in that. Especially when it comes to Flash, which, IMO, could not be any more broken if it tried anyway.

And a lot of idiots believe in paying a machine at least $499 and not be able to watch hulu!

roadwarrior said,

That's the same kind of attitude that is keeping IE6 alive.

No it's not. IE6 is the "past", not present.
IE6 should go because we've got IE7 and IE8, firefox, chrome, etc, and they all work very well.

Now give me a mature platform that will replace flash/silverlight. Guess what, there's none.

Once HTML5 is mature and widely supported, I'm sure everyone will be fine with iphone not supporting flash/silverlight.

Edited by bestbuy, Jan 31 2010, 4:26pm :

parisp said,
Have none of you expirenced a pc or a netbook crawl due to a simple flash animation on a website?

No, can't say I have, but I am using Hardware Accelerated Flash 10.1 on my Netbook and my PC has more than enough "horsepower" to handle Flash!!!

Edited by neo158, Feb 1 2010, 12:06am :

KathleenVS said,
And who keeps a phone for 4 years?

I keep my phone until it wears out, my last one was replaced at six years old when the screen failed.

KathleenVS said,
And who keeps a phone for 4 years?

I only wish i could... toilets, concrete, anger, bums... these are all things that have prevented this becoming a reality!

olly86 said,

I keep my phone until it wears out, my last one was replaced at six years old when the screen failed.

This should be the attitude of the majority. Phones should be expected to last that long. If more people had this attitude instead of the Must Have attitude (I'm guilty), our landfills wouldn't be filling up so quickly with waist.

Shadrack said,

This should be the attitude of the majority. Phones should be expected to last that long. If more people had this attitude instead of the Must Have attitude (I'm guilty), our landfills wouldn't be filling up so quickly with waist.

Like our pants!

Wouldn't we slow down progress though? Would, for example, Sony Ericsson be releasing a 50MP (don't worry, it's an exaggeration) camera phone, without consumers having a Must Have attitude?

(Also, you meant "waste". It just bothered me slightly, sorry.)

Manish said,
Wouldn't we slow down progress though? Would, for example, Sony Ericsson be releasing a 50MP (don't worry, it's an exaggeration) camera phone, without consumers having a Must Have attitude?

(Also, you meant "waste". It just bothered me slightly, sorry.)

Ah yeah, waste. My bad. You don't have to apologize for correcting my grammar. I thank you for taking the time. I have to write for a living (I know, scary right?) and any criticism helps me perform better.

You are right, we wouldn't be as far as we are now. Some might question whether being this far is really worth what we are doing to the planet.

Edited by Shadrack, Jan 31 2010, 5:55pm :

Flash needs to go. Hoping HTML5 will replace it quickly and replace Silverlight, too. Steve Jobs is VERY successful, not arrogant - big difference. Anyone who would give up an iPhone for a Droid is plain nuts IMHO. (And yes, I've had occasion to use each). The level of discourse in this forum is very low and a number of folks don't seem to know what they are talking about. I find that fairly typical of the PC/Windows/Microsoft crowd. I have to train folks to use Office 2007 - OMG what a piece of crap it is.

KathleenVS said,
Flash needs to go. Hoping HTML5 will replace it quickly and replace Silverlight, too. Steve Jobs is VERY successful, not arrogant - big difference. Anyone who would give up an iPhone for a Droid is plain nuts IMHO. (And yes, I've had occasion to use each). The level of discourse in this forum is very low and a number of folks don't seem to know what they are talking about. I find that fairly typical of the PC/Windows/Microsoft crowd. I have to train folks to use Office 2007 - OMG what a piece of crap it is.

Steve Jobs is both successful and arrogant. You can be both.

What? Going for a droid over an iphone is plain nuts? Please oh master of knowledge explain why that is.

Office 2007 is a piece of crap? Seriously man gtfo. Show me another office suite that is better, oh wait thats right there isn't one. And the ribbon was a dam good innovation.

KathleenVS said,
I find that fairly typical of the PC/Windows/Microsoft crowd. I have to train folks to use Office 2007 - OMG what a piece of crap it is.
Nice stereotyping there. (And, yes, Office 2007 may take a bit of training - that doesn't mean it isn't better.)

Edited by Kirkburn, Jan 31 2010, 2:21pm :

/- Razorfold said,
What? Going for a droid over an iphone is plain nuts? Please oh master of knowledge explain why that is.

Speed (the Droid and the Nexus One both feel slower than an iPhone 3GS), hardware build quality (specifically the Droid; where the **** is my battery cover?), and the underlying platform. The iPhone OS may be "limited" in your eyes, but it's still the platform of choice for developers. It also has a very nice SDK, and Cocoa Touch is a great framework to work with.

/- Razorfold said,

Office 2007 is a piece of crap? Seriously man gtfo. Show me another office suite that is better, oh wait thats right there isn't one. And the ribbon was a dam good innovation.

The ribbon is a PITA. To be fair, most office suites are pretty bad, but I prefer iWork over Office. iWork does a better job, IMO, of giving me the things I need. The ribbon just makes me search all over the place for what I want (because sometimes, I don't want the gigantic button that doesn't mean anything to me; I want the little line-spacing button that I can't seem to find in a few seconds).

Edited by Elliott, Jan 31 2010, 3:47pm :

/- Razorfold said,

Office 2007 is a piece of crap? Seriously man gtfo. Show me another office suite that is better, oh wait thats right there isn't one. And the ribbon was a dam good innovation.

Office 2003 :P

Ribbon Interface sucks ATM. When it is customizable in 2010 it will be better. Right now its crap. Office 2007 is crippleware compared to 2003.

Edited by Shadrack, Jan 31 2010, 3:25pm :

Elliott said,

Speed (the Droid and the Nexus One both feel slower than an iPhone 3GS), hardware build quality (specifically the Droid; where the **** is my battery cover?), and the underlying platform. The iPhone OS may be "limited" in your eyes, but it's still the platform of choice for developers. It also has a very nice SDK, and Cocoa Touch is a great framework to work with.


The ribbon is a PITA. To be fair, most office suites are pretty bad, but I prefer iWork over Office. iWork does a better job, IMO, of giving me the things I need. The ribbon just makes me search all over the place for what I want (because sometimes, I don't want the gigantic button that doesn't mean anything to me; I want the little line-spacing button that I can't seem to find in a few seconds).

Office 2008 for Mac doesn't have the crappy ribbon interface. I like it, but have not ever used iWorks. Office 2010 will at least have a customizable ribbon interface. I'm looking forward to that, actually. The main thing I like about Office 2003 is I CAN have a simplified interface that has exactly what I need to get my job done in Excel and Word. In 2007, its a click-click-click-click fest.

I agree iPad seems to be disappointing at this moment, but DAMN, have the trolls crawled out of their shells as of recently. I dislike Apple's policies regarding a lot of stuff, I think they mostly have great products, even though I personally wouldn't use them, but come on people, take it easy.

Symod said,
I agree iPad seems to be disappointing at this moment, but DAMN, have the trolls crawled out of their shells as of recently. I dislike Apple's policies regarding a lot of stuff, I think they mostly have great products, even though I personally wouldn't use them, but come on people, take it easy.

+1. Apple is just a company trying to sell their products (OMG!). People seem more fired up about this than healthcare. Very sad.

Shadrack said,

+1. Apple is just a company trying to sell their products (OMG!). People seem more fired up about this than healthcare. Very sad.

Seriously... there are so many more issues to deal these days than Apple vs. Microsoft vs. Google vs. Others. When I read these comments here on Neowin, it makes me wanna cry... Are we really to this point?

It's always like this on Neowin. Everytime Apple does (or says) anything, they come out and nerdrage all over the comments and/or forums.

Tom W said,
Google has clearly annoyed Jobs with Android and Google Voice.

Well, with Eric Schmidt sitting on Apple's board at the time that they released both products, I'd be pretty ****ed too.

Tom W said,
Google has clearly annoyed Jobs with Android and Google Voice.

They are taking away the iPhone's thunder. Hell, if given the chance I'd probably swap my iPhone on AT&T for a Nexus One on Verizon (when it is available). I've enjoyed using my iPhone very much, but when my contract is up, you bet I'll be shopping around.

Tom W said,
Google has clearly annoyed Jobs with Android and Google Voice.

Apple was left alone without any serious competition for a couple of years. And, now, when they see some competition, they cry like babies.

zagor said,

Apple was left alone without any serious competition for a couple of years. And, now, when they see some competition, they cry like babies.

You wouldn't cry if you were stabbed in the back by your best friend?

Anyways, they're only saying that they now assume there's some serious competition out there, and they will continue to lead it with A+ updates.

PsykX said,

You wouldn't cry if you were stabbed in the back by your best friend?

Anyways, they're only saying that they now assume there's some serious competition out there, and they will continue to lead it with A+ updates.


It is business...there is no concept like friendship in business. Companies collaborate, they don't hang out and party! And, if they are not happy with the collaboration, they stop!

Tom W said,
Google has clearly annoyed Jobs with Android and Google Voice.

I agree, but I also think he's ****ed off in general as the iPad already has some decent / direct competition to hit at the small market they've targeted.

What's more annoying is that Steve Jobs seems to be acting childish rather than making any real points. I mean, he could've sided with those who are concerned about their privacy and whatnot by commenting on it, to sort of make a statement as to WHY Google's motto is bulls---. But no, it's seems he'd rather just trash talk the competitor without anything to back up his claims. Seems rather... oh, what's the word... lazy?

Tom W said,
Google has clearly annoyed Jobs with Android and Google Voice.

How so? Google acquired Android over a year before the original iPhone announcement. Why should Jobs be annoyed at another company that's been working on a similar product AT THE SAME TIME. As for Voice, it's a completely different product than anything Apple has.

zagor said,

Apple was left alone without any serious competition for a couple of years. And, now, when they see some competition, they cry like babies.

+1

kInG aLeXo said,
I agree with him about Flash, it should simply disappear, HTML5 FTW !
Yeah. I hate Flash too. HTML5 has been on the waiting list for too long.

Jobs reasoning is probably not just for our benefit but a bitter pill worth swallowing I think. Flash needs to die.

WooHoo!!! said,
Jobs reasoning is probably not just for our benefit but a bitter pill worth swallowing I think. Flash needs to die.

I agree. And FWIW I'm not an Apple fanboy. For some reason I felt I had to mention that...

Steve Jobs is an arrogant person who basically thrives on clueless consumers who purchase the overpriced/over hyped products. As long as these consumers exist Apple will exist.

Elven said,
Apple is just digging themselves a hole.

I agree, by making these sort of comments he's going to lose the support of major software manufacturers.

Redestium said,

After all the iPad is magical, lol.

Oh god, I wanted to strangle all those guys in that video.. seriously, how full of bull**** can you get.

primexx said,
It's hard to take any of their proclamations of greatness seriously anymore.

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. And for users who have the mental capacity of a hog poo, the iPad is magical. I think that the stupidest of the stupid iUsers are going to buy an iPad, because the device is so simple that it caters to their even simpler minds.

WooHoo!!! said,
Can't say I disagree Mr Jobs.

Neither do I, but he's a hypocrite. His company is full of the same BS that Google is.

Caleb said,

Neither do I, but he's a hypocrite. His company is full of the same BS that Google is.


lol. No, he's not a hypocrite because he's not saying his company isn't "evil". He's just pointing out the bull**** that Google is spreading around these days.

Elliott said,

lol. No, he's not a hypocrite because he's not saying his company isn't "evil". He's just pointing out the bull**** that Google is spreading around these days.


And what, pray tell, has Google done that would fall under nay classification of "evil"?

Elliott said,

lol. No, he's not a hypocrite because he's not saying his company isn't "evil". He's just pointing out the bull**** that Google is spreading around these days.

yes, please tell us! Apple wants all the companies bow to them and leave them alone without any competition. There is nothing more evil than that for the consumer!
And, I hope google with android and microsoft with the upcoming windows 7 mobile will provide a viable and nice alternative. Because, I am tired of hearing the word "awesome", "amazing", "phenomenal"....

Edited by zagor, Jan 31 2010, 3:28pm :

zagor said,

I am tired of hearing the word "awesome", "amazing", "phenomenal"....

Especially when there's nothing further from the truth, when it comes to the iPad. The iPhone is a cool phone. I like mine. It's not awesome, amazing or phenomenal but it's cool. It does it's job and I still don't think there's anything better out there yet. So Microsoft come out with something better because I don't like Google either lol

Seeing that you can say the word "sh*t" on TV without any censoring should speak in favour of a slight relaxing of the swear filters.

Am indeed looking forward to what Apple comes out with in June! This A+ better be good >:|

Kirkburn said,
Huh? Where? I doubt it.

I've heard the words 'Sod it','P*ss off', 'B*st**d' and 'Bitch' (used in the aggressive form) recently used on British TV before the watershed... doesn't bother i just found it quite amusing (it's the little things you see :P)

Edited by MikeChipshop, Jan 31 2010, 2:59pm : Over active swear filter made this post unreadable! I mean come on, 'Ba*stard is a perfectly acceptable English word!

Mike Chipshop said,
I've heard the words 'Sod it','P*ss off', 'B*st**d' and 'Bitch' (used in the aggressive form) recently used on British TV before the watershed... doesn't bother i just found it quite amusing (it's the little things you see :P)
Heh I did wonder if it was British TV you were referring to - yeah, I think it can be done something like only once and with good reason (within the context of the show).

Kirkburn said,
Heh I did wonder if it was British TV you were referring to - yeah, I think it can be done something like only once and with good reason (within the context of the show).

I'm pretty sure Sh*t is banned though... a couple of months back i heard someone say it on breakfast TV and it annoyed me as the rest of the show was just made up of the presenters apologising over and over for it, overkill!
Although BBC news did accidently air the first 30 seconds of Christian Bales infamous rant... now that was funny!

I think its after 8pm or something in the US, cable networks can get away with saying "****". There was a whole episode of SouthPark that celebrated the lift of the ban by seeing how many times they could say "****" on TV. But I think it is restricted to late night and non-FCC regulated channels (not broadcast over the air waves).

Kirkburn said,
Heh I did wonder if it was British TV you were referring to - yeah, I think it can be done something like only once and with good reason (within the context of the show).

I remember Stephen Fry demonstrating that. He said something like "And I can get away with saying this: ****" and just grinned.

randomevent said,

I prefer my vision of a future without Jobs.

I agree, I think he's overhyped and takes to much credit for himself, I'm sure he doesnt build every Apple creation single handed but he seems to take all the credit from the press and fanboys.

thealexweb said,

I agree, I think he's overhyped and takes to much credit for himself, I'm sure he doesnt build every Apple creation single handed but he seems to take all the credit from the press and fanboys.

How? He always use the word "we" in these circumstances. "We've built the... bla bla bla".

thealexweb said,

I agree, I think he's overhyped and takes to much credit for himself, I'm sure he doesnt build every Apple creation single handed but he seems to take all the credit from the press and fanboys.

Your statement is so ridiculous. You have clearly not worked under someone before. My boss takes credit for the work I do. But do you know what? He also takes the blame when things go wrong too. Thats because he is the head of the company. If you build something with your hands, you don't say "Look at what my hands built" You say look at what "I built with my hands."

Edited by Shadrack, Jan 31 2010, 3:32pm :

nikhil.jain said,
in past I heared Apple working with MS to bring Sliverlight on iPhone & iPod ..!!

Silverlight Video is on the iPhone/iPod T. Not by anything Apple did. A Silverlight server detects the connection to be a mobile device and transcodes the video while it streams.

EddiePwnsYou said,
so what.
censoring is enabled for others but for staff not?

not fair.

bull**** should be censored

Staff obviously have a higher level of trust than users (and quite right too)... looks like this one was a mistake that snuck through.

Anarkii said,

Yah thats double standards... I agree Ed. Title/Post should be edited out :)

Double standards would be letting one group of users at the same level as another group of users do something the former group could not.

I'm sure the title and post will be edited when it is spotted.

EddiePwnsYou said,
so what.
censoring is enabled for others but for staff not?

not fair.

bull**** should be censored

Why? Does the word bother you?

Swearing is censored for users because it's often abused. Whereas staff aren't likely to start screaming obscenities because someone didn't agree with them

EddiePwnsYou said,
so what.
censoring is enabled for others but for staff not?

not fair.

bull**** should be censored

It's the "highlight" of the article, so it would be silly to censor it. That doesn't mean it shouldn't be filtered for general use, and it's nothing to do with being "fair".

Edited by Kirkburn, Jan 31 2010, 1:33pm :

EddiePwnsYou said,
so what.
censoring is enabled for others but for staff not?

not fair.

bull**** should be censored

It's a quote that's part of a story. That would be like reporting on Marie Antoinette and quoting her as saying, "Let them have a nice dinner."

The reason swear words are filtered, staff has mentioned, is that Neowin strives to be a "work-friendly" site. Allowing cuss words would get them blacklisted.

I agree with the posters above that say it should be edited, if Neowin still holds to the prior policy of remaining work-friendly.

However, it is their site. Should they decide today to drop the F-bomb in every article title, it is their choice. ;)

The site isn't a democracy. There are no actual laws. I suggest you just suck it up and continue on with life as best you can.

GreyWolf said,

It's a quote that's part of a story. That would be like reporting on Marie Antoinette and quoting her as saying, "Let them have a nice dinner."


You could've easily put "Bull****", so yea it is hypocrisy, practice what you preach

vincent said,

You could've easily put "Bull****", so yea it is hypocrisy, practice what you preach
You know as well as I do that that will never happen.

nevann said,

Swearing is censored for users because it's often abused. Whereas staff aren't likely to start screaming obscenities because someone didn't agree with them

There's quite a few examples in the forums where that doesn't hold true.

Edited by iamwhoiam, Jan 31 2010, 6:15pm :

.woot! said,
so what.
censoring is enabled for others but for staff not?

not fair.

bull**** should be censored

Just a thought.... but its not actually NeoWin staff, they just repeating what Mr Jobs said...! besides, it's just a word. I personally don't get people that are offended by works as such. There are way more important things in life to get bent out of shape about :)

.woot! said,
so what.
censoring is enabled for others but for staff not?

not fair.

bull**** should be censored


I completely agree with this. It should be censored because members' posts are censored.

Mike Chipshop said,
Steve Jobs attitude is Bull Sh*t!

+1

Apple are being really aggressive and arn't playing fairly. They're always knocking Microsoft and now they've started on Google and Adobe. They are just money grabbing children. They've realised that the only way they can make money is to insult everyone else as much as possible and hope that their fanboys believe them...

Nick Brunt said,

+1

Apple are being really aggressive and arn't playing fairly. They're always knocking Microsoft and now they've started on Google and Adobe. They are just money grabbing children. They've realised that the only way they can make money is to insult everyone else as much as possible and hope that their fanboys believe them...


They can knock on Adobe all they want. Adobe are some lazy, evil ****ers.

Edited by Elliott, Jan 31 2010, 2:00pm :

Nick Brunt said,

+1

Apple are being really aggressive and arn't playing fairly. They're always knocking Microsoft and now they've started on Google and Adobe. They are just money grabbing children. They've realised that the only way they can make money is to insult everyone else as much as possible and hope that their fanboys believe them...

They keep bashing everyone else as if it's them that are making the mistakes but if everyone else is doing fine, how is it that Apple is the only one doing things right???

dogmai said,

They keep bashing everyone else as if it's them that are making the mistakes but if everyone else is doing fine, how is it that Apple is the only one doing things right???


That's the legendary elitist narcissistic snobby attitude of Steve Jobs and the fanboys that hang on his every word while scooping up every Apple product that comes out. They're always right at the remaining 5.99 billion people on the planet are always wrong.

Shame the upcoming iPhone update that is A+ won't be available for the iPhone 1st generation. Way to look after your customers Mr Jobs.

Anarkii said,
Shame the upcoming iPhone update that is A+ won't be available for the iPhone 1st generation. Way to look after your customers Mr Jobs.

that's like saying Microsoft should support all old hardware :/

Tom W said,

that's like saying Microsoft should support all old hardware :/

They should :P But my phone is what... 4? years old? surely all it takes is a software update to keep it relatively new.

Anarkii said,

They should :P But my phone is what... 4? years old? surely all it takes is a software update to keep it relatively new.

Silly isn't it... they expect you to go out and buy a new one when a simple software upgrade would do the job.

Mike Chipshop said,

Silly isn't it... they expect you to go out and buy a new one when a simple software upgrade would do the job.


= money.

Tom W said,

that's like saying Microsoft should support all old hardware :/

You do know that Microsoft has and continues to support and update 1st gen Zunes right? While Apple on the other hand wants you to buy a new iPod yearly

Edited by Lord Moon, Jan 31 2010, 12:53pm : spelling

Mike Chipshop said,

Silly isn't it... they expect you to go out and buy a new one when a simple software upgrade would do the job.

Supplying the update is not the problem, its coded out due to the performance you would get using it on the 1st Gen hardware. Its not a matter of cant do it, its a matter of they wont in order to 1. keep performance on 1st gen acceptable, and yes I agree 2. to continue to drive revenue by selling new phones

Anarkii said,

They should :P But my phone is what... 4? years old? surely all it takes is a software update to keep it relatively new.


It's a phone... Having software updates released for it in the first place is pretty good, considering most other companies (Nokia) only bothered to release minor updates during a smartphones life.

Anarkii said,
Shame the upcoming iPhone update that is A+ won't be available for the iPhone 1st generation. Way to look after your customers Mr Jobs.

No the real shame is that it's still on AT&T.

Anarkii said,

They should :P But my phone is what... 4? years old? surely all it takes is a software update to keep it relatively new.

In most phone cases, 4 years means your on your second phone, and are shopping for you third. Most people buy a new phone whenever they renew their contract, every 2 years.

Anarkii said,
Shame the upcoming iPhone update that is A+ won't be available for the iPhone 1st generation. Way to look after your customers Mr Jobs.

The 1st generation iPhone will not be able to use the up comming update or updates due to hardware issues. 4 years now a days is considered old. In technical terms, any electronic item older than 3 years is considered out dated. It is like asking Microsoft to allow Windows 7 to work on machines which are older.

spenumatsa said,
It is like asking Microsoft to allow Windows 7 to work on machines which are older.
You know, that was a *really* bad example.

Hendrick said,

In most phone cases, 4 years means your on your second phone, and are shopping for you third. Most people buy a new phone whenever they renew their contract, every 2 years.

It does ? That's weird I've had 2 phones in the last 6+ years

Why keep upgrading if its not broken ?
I guess apples quality just isn't good enough if you need to buy 2-3 phones in 4 years lol

Baked said,

It does ? That's weird I've had 2 phones in the last 6+ years

Why keep upgrading if its not broken ?
I guess apples quality just isn't good enough if you need to buy 2-3 phones in 4 years lol

What do you mean "Apple's quality isn't good enough?" Are you referring to hardware or software. Your hardware hasn't broken in 3 years, and Apple was under no obligation to give you free software updates FOR LIFE.

Plus, there's a bunch of FUD going around. The iPhone (2007) and iPhone 3G have the same CPU and GPU. There's no reason to distinguish them based on performance. It's only the iPhone 3GS that has a faster CPU, GPU and more RAM.

Hendrick said,

In most phone cases, 4 years means your on your second phone, and are shopping for you third. Most people buy a new phone whenever they renew their contract, every 2 years.

This. 3 years of updates is more than MS, Google, or BB ever gave their phones (or they did, and the service provider blocked it or were too lazy to release it).

Tom W said,

that's like saying Microsoft should support all old hardware :/

In this case, they should. Microsoft didn't supply the hardware for you. Apple does.

Edited by Amodin, Jan 31 2010, 3:24pm :

Are people honestly surprised at the concept of a business trying to make money? Without the "simple" update to the original iPhone, will it stop working? No. Just like with many product lines of many companies, if you want (different to NEED) the new features, go out and buy the new one. Also, refer to the 2 points of the below post if you're still upset about missing out on the "A+" update.

Vue_Redline said,

Supplying the update is not the problem, its coded out due to the performance you would get using it on the 1st Gen hardware. Its not a matter of cant do it, its a matter of they wont in order to 1. keep performance on 1st gen acceptable, and yes I agree 2. to continue to drive revenue by selling new phones

Lord Moon said,

You do know that Microsoft has and continues to support and update 1st gen Zunes right? While Apple on the other hand wants you to buy a new iPod yearly

My 1st Generation iPod Touch runs the same software as the 3rd generation....so Apple supports me 100%

Anarkii said,
Shame the upcoming iPhone update that is A+ won't be available for the iPhone 1st generation. Way to look after your customers Mr Jobs.

Ya, but when has he ever. Every new firmware update made the iPod 1st Gen slower. Way to screw your customers Jobs.

Anarkii said,

They should :P But my phone is what... 4? years old? surely all it takes is a software update to keep it relatively new.

It's been arguably one of the best supported phones on the market. Nokia don't do major releases like this for their handsets years after release and Windows Mobile only gets them because people get ROMS of other sites. I think even older android phones (which are newer than the iPhone btw) are begining to get to the point where they arent getting updates.

Your phone being four years old makes it a quite old handset. The mobile industry is moving a lot faster than the desktop one so no, you can't expect updates to a device that old.

xfodder said,

yeah because nokia, motorola, palm, always release updates for the phones they release too ...

My Nokia 5800 is only 6 months old and has had two major firmware updates during that time and is a much better phone each time, so I think your argument is rather moot.

Kayle12 said,

My 1st Generation iPod Touch runs the same software as the 3rd generation....so Apple supports me 100%


For now...

Tom W said,

that's like saying Microsoft should support all old hardware :/

Actually, before you go attacking other members, the iphone 1st Gen is 4 years old, while Windows is 20 something, stop comparing apples and oranges.

Tom W said,

that's like saying Microsoft should support all old hardware :/

Windows 7 can be installed on hardware that is 8 years old. The new iPhone OS won't even work on hardware that is less than 3 years old. 'nuff said.

Frank Fontaine said,
The new iPhone OS won't even work on hardware that is less than 3 years old. 'nuff said.

The latest iPhone OS 3.1.2 works on the oldest/first iPhone.

Anarkii said,
Shame the upcoming iPhone update that is A+ won't be available for the iPhone 1st generation. Way to look after your customers Mr Jobs.

Good. Old hardware drags down progress.

xfodder said,
yeah because nokia, motorola, palm, always release updates for the phones they release too ...

Wasn't one of the original iPhone's selling point was that they would constantly offer new features by software updates, hence the justification for the high price? Check the iPhone's first debut video.