Steve Jobs tears into Android on Apple's earnings call

Steve Jobs poked holes in Google's Android operating system during an unusual appearance on a financial call on Monday.

Explaining his appearance was a rare one, Jobs said "I couldn't help dropping by for our first $20+ billion quarter." He went on to rip apart Google's Android strategy, devices and operating system. "Apple activates 275,000 iOS devices per day, sometimes almost 300,000" Jobs said. The Apple CEO confirmed Gartner's report of 10 million iPhone devices in June. Jobs claimed there's no solid data on how many Android handsets shipped per quarter.

Jobs explained Google's claim of being open and Apple being closed is "disingenuous... Android is very fragmented" he suggested. "Many Android OEMs, including the two largest HTC and Motorola, install proprietary user experiences to differentiate themselves." Jobs mentioned Twitter client Tweetdeck and how the developers had to work on more than 100 different versions of Android software on 244 devices. "Many android apps work only on selected Android handsets running select Android versions," said Jobs. "Compare this with iPhone, where there are two versions of the software, the current and the recent predecessor to test against".

Jobs didn't stop there and started on Microsoft's "Plays For Sure" music strategy that ultimately failed. "Open doesn't always win" he said describing Microsoft's system that it was ultimately forced to ditch. "Google's claims are a smokescreen for what is best for customers, integrated or fragmented." Jobs also spoke heavily on the screen size of seven-inch tablets that are currently on the way. "This size isn't sufficient to create great tablet apps, in our opinion. While one could increase the resolution of the display to make up for some of the difference, it is meaningless unless your tablet also includes sandpaper, so that the user can sand down their fingers to around one quarter of their present size." Ouch.

Despite all the strong words, Jobs also confirmed the company had sold 250,000 Apple TVs so far. Apple is set to announce a brand new Macbook Air at a press event on Wednesday. According to reports from Cult Of Mac, the redesigned 13.3-inch MacBook Air will include a bigger battery and more ports but remain thinner and lighter than the current model. Apple sent out press invites last week hinting at a "back to the Mac" theme for the event.

Update: Recording of Steve Job's, below.

Image Credit: Jesus Belzunce (Flickr)

Report a problem with article
Previous Story

Microsoft's Chief Software Architect Ray Ozzie set to step down

Next Story

Android Gingerbread details leak in blurry photo

111 Comments

Commenting is disabled on this article.

Agreed, what is he trying to say? Who cares? Is he just trying to put himself up on a pedalstal again

Who cares what Jobs thinks. If Apple didn't make it, it sucks. We get it. iPhone better than Android. Mac is better than PC. iPod better than all other MP3 players. No Apple = No hanging out with cool kids. Whatever.

Great to see the Android Defence Force at work here. Keep up the fight, guys!

Jobs's points are valid. Fragmentation is an issue, and will remain an issue until Google manages to get the OS back under control.

And to those who say 'but I can root my Android phone!': That's great for you. Really. It's not so great for the 99% Joe Users out there who want to use their phone without having to mess with it in order to remove the crapware added by the carrier though.

Mephistopheles said,
Great to see the Android Defence Force at work here. Keep up the fight, guys!
I think the "Android Defense force" heavily outweighs the iPhone fans on this forum...

"Apple activates 275,000 iOS devices per day"

Does this not include iPhones, iPod Touches and iPads? So, he's comparing more than just phone sale totals, to, well, just phones from others? I'd rather know how many iPhones per other phones are sold (or vice-versa for that matter).

Android Market place does suck though. My wife can't get most the apps I use on the Desire on her Wildfire. Apple will hit this issue though. Like many apps now are easily too slow to run on the 3G.

He sounds so angry about something. So childish as usual. Now he praise Windows on PC as open system?? <-- Something he bashed the hell off. and Windows still win. Android will be the same??

It happened during Mac vs windows. it is happening now with iphone vs android. i think we know what the future will turn out. apple will scramble to survive again 5 years later.

Tear into Android all you want Steve. Fact is I was set to buy 3 iPhone4's to replace our 3G's but I scuttled those plans when the iPhone4 turned out to be such an unmitigated train wreck (I live in an area of marginal AT&T 3G reception so the non-existent antenna issues were a deal breaker). As time goes by and more and more iPhone design flaws surface, I am happier and happier I bailed out. Android is not quite as "polished" (imo dumbed down) but it is more than good enough for me, and I am enjoying the reliabilioty of the Verizon network. So sorry, but case closed. You lose.

Keep opening your mouth, Steve Jobs. Your arrogance is the biggest reason why I will never purchase an Apple product for years to come.

stvnwst said,
Keep opening your mouth, Steve Jobs. Your arrogance is the biggest reason why I will never purchase an Apple product for years to come.

+100 Im on the same boat with you. Funny how does not talk about Windows Phone 7, scared Jobs

stvnwst said,
Keep opening your mouth, Steve Jobs. Your arrogance is the biggest reason why I will never purchase an Apple product for years to come.

+100 same boat with you, funny how he does not mention windows phone 7,ya scared Jobs.

Xypro said,

+100 Im on the same boat with you. Funny how does not talk about Windows Phone 7, scared Jobs


Because there's nothing to talk about there. They don't even have a slice of the market yet.

stvnwst said,
Keep opening your mouth, Steve Jobs. Your arrogance is the biggest reason why I will never purchase an Apple product for years to come.

+1

Open Source is not always the best, eh Steve? Then why is there all that bashing to the Flash platform? It is not Open Source.... but still... Oh well..

Jose_49 said,
Open Source is not always the best, eh Steve? Then why is there all that bashing to the Flash platform? It is not Open Source.... but still... Oh well..
What? You said it yourself. Open source is not always the best... not always being the key part, meaning sometimes it is.

...

Mr aldo said,
What? You said it yourself. Open source is not always the best... not always being the key part, meaning sometimes it is.

...


Oh well

Steve Jobs doesn't think he is the technological Messiah. He is probably not afraid of the competition either. Steve Jobs is Steve Jobs and he "is" the Messiah. Therefore there is absolutely no reason to fear the competition. He is "in it" not above it. It's just a question when the reality might catch up with him. Only then you may come out and criticize him. Otherwise we have to take him seriously, whether we like it or not.

I sometimes wonder if Jobs thinks he's some kind of technological messiah or something.

Sure the iPhone is a decent product, but to bash competition is just petty. Same goes for Google and MS. The more people bash bash bash the less they like to focus on their own products. Just get over yourselves and make your products BETTER.

Generally speaking this is just Jobs' personality. Pretty much every interview with every former Apple exec ever, though generally positive about the company (sometimes very positive), will smile and nod and acknowledge that Steve Jobs "has his quirks", wink wink, and can be quite the "control freak", nudge nudge, and has his own strict, distinct set of principles for the company, regardless of what the shareholders want.

Joshie said,
Generally speaking this is just Jobs' personality. Pretty much every interview with every former Apple exec ever, though generally positive about the company (sometimes very positive), will smile and nod and acknowledge that Steve Jobs "has his quirks", wink wink, and can be quite the "control freak", nudge nudge, and has his own strict, distinct set of principles for the company, regardless of what the shareholders want.

Exactly. It's as if people get surprised over this every time he speaks up, but this is just who Steve Jobs is, and I have always dared saying that this is in part behind Apple's huge success. It's not something that's all too great for publicity, but it's something that empowers themselves as a strong brand so much that it doesn't even matter. Apple aren't doing poorly due to these talks -- quite the contrary.

And it's not because of "reality distortion fields" (in that case, why haven't their competitors raised their own?), but because of Steve Jobs and the men backing him in the top of Apple. Trying to say it's because of stupid customers is always the cheap and clueless way of shrugging off this.

Did he ever use a Desire or a Nexus 1 with Cyanogen?
I don't want to use a device that most people have, with the same lame screen layout; a grid of icons.
I have widgets+icons+shortcuts for tasks & more. I can play mkv videos. I can OC my cpu. Oh & most importantly, I don't have to use Itunes, my device is disk drive capable. Which device is more capable Mr. Jobs?
Anyway, when someone ,who made 4 Billion in profit, attacks the competition that means something...

mr.r9 said,
Did he ever use a Desire or a Nexus 1 with Cyanogen?
I don't want to use a device that most people have, with the same lame screen layout; a grid of icons.
I have widgets+icons+shortcuts for tasks & more. I can play mkv videos. I can OC my cpu. Oh & most importantly, I don't have to use Itunes, my device is disk drive capable. Which device is more capable Mr. Jobs?
Anyway, when someone ,who made 4 Billion in profit, attacks the competition that means something...

+1

I don't think your typical Apple user can unlock an iPhone, let alone root an Android phone.
I rooted my Hero before I had my N1. It's fun as hell. I still enjoy stock 2.2. The App display alone has kept me put.

And yes, most widgets are not only aesthetically appealing but also very useful. OEMs should create widgets rather than shells.

mr.r9 said,
Did he ever use a Desire or a Nexus 1 with Cyanogen?
I don't want to use a device that most people have, with the same lame screen layout; a grid of icons.
I have widgets+icons+shortcuts for tasks & more. I can play mkv videos. I can OC my cpu. Oh & most importantly, I don't have to use Itunes, my device is disk drive capable. Which device is more capable Mr. Jobs?
Anyway, when someone ,who made 4 Billion in profit, attacks the competition that means something...

+1

I don't think your typical Apple user can unlock an iPhone, let alone root an Android phone.
I rooted my Hero before I had my N1. It's fun as hell. I still enjoy stock 2.2. The App display alone has kept me put.

And yes, most widgets are not only aesthetically appealing but also very useful. OEMs should create widgets rather than shells.

"Open doesn't always win over closed"
Yet didn't Apple announce that iOS is going to become an open platform?

Fragmentation is a problem, but I feel it's less about apps being interoperable --however the interoperability problem does exists with older, lower-end models. Just read the app comments on the market-- and more about the new features (Flash support) users are missing out on. For instance, I just helped my friends with their Evo (2.2) and Galaxy S (2.1) phones on Sprint and downloaded any app I wanted to with full functionality. Double Twist, SNESoid, Mini Squadron, Angry Birds, Astro, Google Earth etc., but the Galaxy S couldn't support flash with 2.1.

I've read Google plans to end OEM shells, which would be great because Motoblur, HTC Sense, and Samsung's shell aren't that appealing to me. I own a N1 and love everything about it minus the lack of true multi-touch.

Anyways I'm never buying an Apple product until Steve Jobs is dead. Can't stand the man. I don't need a "Genius" to sell me a product. Why? BECAUSE I'M NOT AN iDiot!!!

while only the bashing is going on, jobs did also say "“right now it's a battle for developers and mindshare, and right now the iPhone and Android are winning that battle.”"

The only thing I would ask...is that Apple seems to be focusing on earnings, earnings, earnings....yes that is what companies do....but they should not let quality slide in some area's of their products which helped them get up there in the first place......

.Kompressor said,
The only thing I would ask...is that Apple seems to be focusing on earnings, earnings, earnings....yes that is what companies do....but they should not let quality slide in some area's of their products which helped them get up there in the first place......

+1

.Kompressor said,
The only thing I would ask...is that Apple seems to be focusing on earnings, earnings, earnings....yes that is what companies do....but they should not let quality slide in some area's of their products which helped them get up there in the first place......

Exactly and what I have been saying for a loooong time. If the iPhone 4 didnt have all the issues it has, they would of seen even higher earnings.

Too bad the iOS platform is losing marketshare to Android then

Worldwide: Feb 2010 it reached its high of 34%. As of Sept 2010, its down to 23%.
North America: Oct 2009 it reached its high of 57%. As of Sept 2010, its down to 38%.

In the mean time, Android has been constantly going up. And if the poll in the forums about your next device are any indication (tech users), Apple is down..Android and WP7 are neck and neck.

Fragmentation is certainly a problem with the Android platform, but lets be honest here...most people will not even know what version their phone is running, or even care about it. If you ask them if they have Froyo, they'll probably point to their fridge...not their phone.

/- Razorfold said,
Too bad the iOS platform is losing marketshare to Android then

Worldwide: Feb 2010 it reached its high of 34%. As of Sept 2010, its down to 23%.
North America: Oct 2009 it reached its high of 57%. As of Sept 2010, its down to 38%.

In the mean time, Android has been constantly going up. Fragmentation is certainly a problem with the Android platform, but lets be honest here...most people will not even know what version their phone is running, or even care about it. If you ask them if they have Froyo, they'll probably point to their fridge...not their phone.

Haha, agreed. I dont see many people at XDA or other androids forums upset about fragmentation.

/- Razorfold said,
Too bad the iOS platform is losing marketshare to Android then

Worldwide: Feb 2010 it reached its high of 34%. As of Sept 2010, its down to 23%.
North America: Oct 2009 it reached its high of 57%. As of Sept 2010, its down to 38%.

In the mean time, Android has been constantly going up. Fragmentation is certainly a problem with the Android platform, but lets be honest here...most people will not even know what version their phone is running, or even care about it. If you ask them if they have Froyo, they'll probably point to their fridge...not their phone.

What I've seen happen, is lots went to iPhone, when those contracts ended, some carried on with iphone, some wanted something new (android), when those ended, some kept with android, some are going back to iphone.

Now with WM7 out, it'll be even more interesting, I can see these numbers shuffling up and down, maybe the iphone will have less marketshare due to it be built by just a single maker rather then multiples like Android and WM7


I think what really screws the iPhone is the plans the carriers give you on it, that puts many people off. I don't know why they do it, is it something to do with the amount Apple demands?

evo_spook said,
Now with WM7 out, it'll be even more interesting, I can see these numbers shuffling up and down, maybe the iphone will have less marketshare due to it be built by just a single maker rather then multiples like Android and WM7

So? Maybe Apple should make multiple devices then, nobody is stopping them apart from their own arrogance.

If you want to go make fun of a competitor, at least be able to back it up. Hell if Jobs would have said this a couple of months ago, he would have all the proof he needs. iOS had massive marketshare, whereas Android didn't..now things are looking the opposite.

Apple did earn billions though so I guess he does have something to be arrogant about.

/- Razorfold said,

So? Maybe Apple should make multiple devices then, nobody is stopping them apart from their own arrogance.

If you want to go make fun of a competitor, at least be able to back it up. Hell if Jobs would have said this a couple of months ago, he would have all the proof he needs. iOS had massive marketshare, whereas Android didn't..now things are looking the opposite.

Apple did earn billions though so I guess he does have something to be arrogant about.

iOS is massive. It's on all the iPod touches and iPads as well, which nearly all of the market share studies don't take into account. With a record quarter of iPhone sales that has nearly double the previous quarter Apple aren't too worried about these market share studies just yet. They'd be happy with 30% of the market for the next 10 years because they make so much money on the hardware

/- Razorfold said,
Too bad the iOS platform is losing marketshare to Android then

Worldwide: Feb 2010 it reached its high of 34%. As of Sept 2010, its down to 23%.
North America: Oct 2009 it reached its high of 57%. As of Sept 2010, its down to 38%.

In the mean time, Android has been constantly going up. And if the poll in the forums about your next device are any indication (tech users), Apple is down..Android and WP7 are neck and neck.

Fragmentation is certainly a problem with the Android platform, but lets be honest here...most people will not even know what version their phone is running, or even care about it. If you ask them if they have Froyo, they'll probably point to their fridge...not their phone.

Is not iOS that is the problem but the exclusivity contract between Apple and ATT.

You have 100s of Android Distributors and 1 for Apple. You do the Math.
The increase of Android's presence was expected as other telcos can not stand by as ATT attracts customers due to its contract with APPLE.
It's a competitive market, and the tables might change slightly once Apple gets it's iphone on Verizon, T-mobile and Sprint.

Euphoria said,

Is not iOS that is the problem but the exclusivity contract between Apple and ATT.

You have 100s of Android Distributors and 1 for Apple. You do the Math.
The increase of Android's presence was expected as other telcos can not stand by as ATT attracts customers due to its contract with APPLE.
It's a competitive market, and the tables might change slightly once Apple gets it's iphone on Verizon, T-mobile and Sprint.


I posted worldwide marketshare, and worldwide the iPhone is mostly sold on every carrier.

/- Razorfold said,

I posted worldwide marketshare, and worldwide the iPhone is mostly sold on every carrier.

Yes with the US being the 3rd largest mobile market with around 290 million users.
With China being 1st and only getting the iPhone at the end of September, and India being 2nd where CDMA is a very popular network and Apple is apparently rumored to work on a CDMA phone that will go to Verizon and other CDMA providers.
So give it some time, and check your facts.
As many other analysts have said and Steve J. only confirmed: Android's biggest problem is its fragmentation, that's the biggest reason that Microsoft is following Apple's business plan when it comes to its mobile os Win Mob 7.

In terms of smartphone users, I don't think the US market is that high.

Yes in terms of number of actual phones, then sure. But I'm talking only smartphone marketshare here. Literally everywhere around the world the iOS is dropping in marketshare, apart from Oceania (NZ and Aust).

Like I said, nobody stopped Apple from going non-exclusive or making multiple phones. Only their arrogance did. So if, like you say, the iOS platform (which includes touch, iPad and iPhones) is losing marketshare in the US due to Android (only Phones) being on multiple carriers..then it's still Apple's fault.

And like I said about fragmentation. The average user doesn't know or even care about it. Most of your applications will work, regardless of what OS version you're running.

And no in India, CDMA isn't "very popular." The top 3 providers in India are GSM. And a good amount of people in India probably won't buying iPhones either. So just because they have 1 billion people doesn't mean each one of those 1 billion people have smartphones. As of right now iOS accounts for only 0.47% in India, with Symbian literally dominating with almost 90%.

So the "Back to the Mac" is just a MacBook Air refresh? I was hoping (but kinda knowing it was pointless) for a whole new Mac. Something to make us think he hasn't shunned computers for his shiny toys instead.

Breach said,
He missed his daily dose again I guess...

Why didn't his call drop?? Afterall he locked the iPhone to a pretty crappy network at best. My c905 can't get signal in most places with AT&T.

Everything he said is pretty valid though. Android is quite fragmented and many phones are running outdated versions of the operating system and many phones are running custom User Interfaces.

Usually in earnings calls they discuss what could be hits to the business money wise. It's not unusual for them to discuss competitors as they have done so before when Jobs wasn't present.

Vice said,
Everything he said is pretty valid though. Android is quite fragmented and many phones are running outdated versions of the operating system and many phones are running custom User Interfaces.

Usually in earnings calls they discuss what could be hits to the business money wise. It's not unusual for them to discuss competitors as they have done so before when Jobs wasn't present.

Custom UI skins are not fragmentation.. so let's get that straight.. they will run the same apps which is the point.


Android is not more fragmented than iPhone.. iPhone now has phones with iPhone 3.0-4.0 and everything in between...

So iOS platform is fragmented too if you look at it that way.. you can't even use all features on 3G phones in OS (multitasking for example) you can with iPhone 4 for example.. So fragmentation is there.

What's great about Android is that this fragmentation seems to be fading away very quickly.. Froyo is now the most adopted Android build among Android phones.. with 2.1 a close second.. With every new release of Android build (right now the major release will be Gingerbread) all phones are released with it.

Fragmentation is not really that bad and is really up to the phone provider to keep up. Quick iteration in builds that brings innovation is what trumps Apple every time. They are so ahead of iOS with functionality that by the time Gingerbread comes out it won't even be comparable. Android will be so ahead of Apple's iOS, it will make it loko like a toy OS.

You will then see everyone switching and releasing Gingerbread phones and tablets. Providers and phone manufacturers didn't have experience before to platforms evolving so fast, so it takes them a while to set things so they can push updates quickly. They are getting better and better though, to the point where we can see all major phones getting a 2.2 update.. With Gingerbread, the updating process should be very quick.

As for Steve Jobs' comments.. He's a douche-bag. He is one of those people who really can't stand when someone does things better than him and then he goes and starts badmouthing and insulting people. That's the way he is.. I've seen many people like him.. Like a little child.

Congrats to them in creating huge profit margins and the ability to sell people proprietary hardware where they are 100% locked into Apple's ecosystem. That's where he did a marvelous job and where I kind of pitty people who got sucked into it.

Living in Steve Jobs' world seems like a fairytale in the beginning, but not long after you realize that you are actually in hell and you can't get out of it without paying a huge price.

Vice said,
Everything he said is pretty valid though. Android is quite fragmented and many phones are running outdated versions of the operating system and many phones are running custom User Interfaces.

Usually in earnings calls they discuss what could be hits to the business money wise. It's not unusual for them to discuss competitors as they have done so before when Jobs wasn't present.

it's not really valid since the fragmenting doesn't matter. There are several varieties of home screens/shells. android basic, SE, HTC, Samsung, third party(ADW that I use) and so on. but they all use the same widgets and the same apps and they pretty much all work and look identical.

And I don't know where he got the 100 versions for 200 devices from. one app will work on all phones whatever shell, and version they use with a few very rare exceptions. The only thing you need to pay attention to is resolution. and that's just a matter of making your app resolution independent, something developers have been doing for years and years.

techbeck said,
Typical Jobs...bash the competition when you feel threatened...

He's right though. I have a HTC Legend which still hasn't received the Froyo update. The Android platform is very much fragmented.

techbeck said,
Typical Jobs...bash the competition when you feel threatened...

You must be frightened all the time then considering the amount of time you spend bashing him :-p

.Neo said,

He's right though. I have a HTC Legend which still hasn't received the Froyo update. The Android platform is very much fragmented.

Jobs needs to worry about putting QUALITY back in to his products and stop bashing anyone who encroaches on "his" territory...

evo_spook said,

You must be frightened all the time then considering the amount of time you spend bashing him :-p

Yea, why would I feel threatened? I dont have anything at stake here.

techbeck said,

Jobs needs to worry about putting QUALITY back in to his products and stop bashing anyone who encroaches on "his" territory...


That doesn't change the fact he has a valid point when it comes to the fragmentation of Android.

.Neo said,

That doesn't change the fact he has a valid point when it comes to the fragmentation of Android.

Which Google is working to address. I also don't know many people in the android community that thinks it is a big deal or is making a big deal about it.

techbeck said,
Which Google is working to address.

That doesn't change how things are currently, so Steve Jobs still has a valid point regarding the matter. The Android platform is very much fragmented and many fairly recent phones are still running outdated versions of the OS with no word on when they will be updated, if at all.
techbeck said,
I also don't know many people in the android community that thinks it is a big deal or is making a big deal about it.

Me, a HTC customer, does think it's a big deal that I have a 2010 phone which is still waiting for an update months after the release of Froyo. Your claim doesn't mean anything to me.

Edited by .Neo, Oct 18 2010, 10:19pm :

.Neo said,

That doesn't change how things are currently, so Steve Jobs still has a valid point regarding the matter.

And did I dispute that?


That you know or don't know many people who have an issue with it means absolutely nothing to me.

And you thinking that fragmentation is a big issue means nothing to me.

techbeck said,
And did I dispute that?

You're claiming that Steve Jobs is bashing the competition when he's simply stating fact.
techbeck said,
And you thinking that fragmentation is a big issue means nothing to me.

Considering the fact even you pointed out that Google is actively working on fixing Android's fragmentation it probably is a fairly big issue, giving the rest of your post very little meaning.

.Neo said,

You're claiming that Steve Jobs is bashing the competition when he's simply stating fact.

Again, did I dispute it?


Considering the fact even you pointed out that Google is actively working on fixing Android's fragmentation it probably is a fairly big issue, giving the rest of your post very little meaning.

Companies work on fixes all the time, doesnt mean its a real big issue. And if it was a major issue, they would be working on it more so.

techbeck said,
Again, did I dispute it?

By saying Steve Jobs is bashing, while he's simply stating how things are, you're giving that impression.
techbeck said,
Companies work on fixes all the time, doesnt mean its a real big issue. And if it was a major issue, they would be working on it more so.

How do you know how actively Google is working on it? They can't make a big change like that over night. With Android's 3.0 tight system requirements and limited customizability they are giving a pretty strong message. So it seems it is a pretty big deal to Google.

.Neo said,

That doesn't change how things are currently, so Steve Jobs still has a valid point regarding the matter. The Android platform is very much fragmented and many fairly recent phones are still running outdated versions of the OS with no word on when they will be updated, if at all.

Me, a HTC customer, does think it's a big deal that I have a 2010 phone which is still waiting for an update months after the release of Froyo. Your claim doesn't mean anything to me.

I have a 2010 phone with 1.6 on it, and the only update on the next 1-2 month timetable is 2.1. and I don't think it's a big deal. 1.6 works just fine. 99% of the apps on the market place works, the ones who don't work are 99% tech demos of stuff noone uses in 2.1/2.2. the very few apps that actually require 2.2 and aren't tech demos, often don't have a valid reason to be 2.1+ only even.

so no, I don't find it a big deal. I think the version number whoring among android users are patently ridiculous. The phone works and it works well with 1.6 or 2.1.

.Neo said,

By saying Steve Jobs is bashing, while he's simply stating how things are, you're giving that impression.

Then I will make sure to be very clear in my replies to you then....

HawkMan said,
so no, I don't find it a big deal. I think the version number whoring among android users are patently ridiculous. The phone works and it works well with 1.6 or 2.1.

Actually when it comes to the Legend HTC screwed things up during the last update, especially when it comes to how sms messages are sorted and SIM card preferences being saved after a phone reboot. So while your phone might work well, the Legend is suffering from a number of issues that supposedly won't be fixed until 2.2.

Next to that I expect a smartphone to be updated in a reasonable time span when a new OS version is introduced. Simple as that.

"Compare this with iPhone, where every handset works the same".
He says that like it's something positive. If the original system is completely abysmal then every iPhone's system is abysmal! We are all humans: we behave differently, we work differently, we think differently, and we have different ideas. You can't force all to use the same idea!

.Neo said,

He's right though. I have a HTC Legend which still hasn't received the Froyo update. The Android platform is very much fragmented.

That's partially true, but it's also the reason of Android's success. Everything happens so fast, the development is fast, strong and stable.

I should add that I've the same phone, I'm as well waiting for the update.

Jobs also mentions the number of apps on each marketplace. Of course iPhone has more apps, it has been around longer! But it's strange that he didn't mention that you need your app to be approved by Apple (and that they ban competitor's products)... I wonder why...?

I hate him - he just doesn't make much sense, when he does... he's just plain wrong!

Edited by Tpiom, Oct 19 2010, 12:30am :

Tpiom said,
Jobs also mentions the number of apps on each marketplace. Of course iPhone has more apps, it has been around longer! But it's strange that he didn't mention that you need your app to be approved by Apple (and that they ban competitor's products)... I wonder why...?

Microsoft went with a similar strategy for Windows Phone 7's app store, so apparently there's something to it. And as long as you play by the rules your app will be accepted. Just look at Opera for the iPhone.
Tpiom said,
That's partially true, but it's also the reason of Android's success. Everything happens so fast, the development is fast, strong and stable.

Considering I still don't have Froyo on my HTC Legend I don't think development is going that fast...

.Neo said,

Considering I still don't have Froyo on my HTC Legend I don't think development is going that fast...

That's HTC's fault. The OS itself (Android) is going fast.
Are you even sure we will get, for Legend? I've heard sources that say no

bdsams said,
Is an earnings call really the place to bash your competition?

Jobs doesnt care...his zealots will follow him to the end of the earth and back.

bdsams said,
Is an earnings call really the place to bash your competition?

I've seen many others, including Google, MS and Motorolla bash the iphone, I don't think many people here had a problem with that, but I think they will with this.

evo_spook said,

I've seen many others, including Google, MS and Motorolla bash the iphone, I don't think many people here had a problem with that, but I think they will with this.

Yea, its called payback...something Apple started. You cannot expect the competition to lay back while Apple is bashing them. Thing is, Apple cannot take the heat....

techbeck said,

Yea, its called payback...something Apple started. You cannot expect the competition to lay back while Apple is bashing them. Thing is, Apple cannot take the heat....

Its payback even when they bash first? ah the twisted thinking of a droidfanboy

evo_spook said,

Its payback even when they bash first? ah the twisted thinking of a droidfanboy

Apple started the whole thing back during the PC vs MAC ads...so yea, APPLE started it first and they continue to do it.

ah, the twisted thinkings of a applefanboy....

techbeck said,

Apple started the whole thing back during the PC vs MAC ads...so yea, APPLE started it first and they continue to do it.

ah, the twisted thinkings of a applefanboy....

The thing is you lot are very free and happy with the terms fanboy and zealot, but look at the rants you go on, why does it bother you so much?

Strange you call me a applefan boy, but unlike the Android crowd, I don't go round bashing the other platforms, maybe its because I'm more mature.

techbeck said,

Jobs doesnt care...his zealots will follow him to the end of the earth and back.


Yeah and Ballmer and fans are sooooo very different... oh wait...

techbeck said,

Yea, its called payback...something Apple started. You cannot expect the competition to lay back while Apple is bashing them. Thing is, Apple cannot take the heat....


$20.34 billion says they can...

evo_spook said,

The thing is you lot are very free and happy with the terms fanboy and zealot, but look at the rants you go on, why does it bother you so much?

Strange you call me a applefan boy, but unlike the Android crowd, I don't go round bashing the other platforms, maybe its because I'm more mature.

If people like you did not single me out, while others are posting the same comments, maybe I will be a little calmer. Its people like you who cannot stand anyone bashing their precious. And if you really paid attention, I posted some good things about Apple...articles...and said some good things about what they were doing.

techbeck said,

I posted some good things about Apple...articles...and said some good things about what they were doing.

and some people think the reality distortion bubble of apple fanboys is bad... he claims this every time he gets called out. Have yet to see a good post from him.

ILikeTobacco said,

and some people think the reality distortion bubble of apple fanboys is bad... he claims this every time he gets called out. Have yet to see a good post from him.

Look at BACKPAGE news. I recently said that Apples recent patent was no big deal. Thats a good thing and I have said many before.

So if you cannot search and cannot read, then thats not my problem.

techbeck said,

Look at BACKPAGE news. I recently said that Apples recent patent was no big deal. Thats a good thing and I have said many before.

So if you cannot search and cannot read, then thats not my problem.

Thats a good thing? ok let me try that... $20.34 billion is not a big deal guys. Am I doing it right?

ILikeTobacco said,

Thats a good thing? ok let me try that... $20.34 billion is not a big deal guys. Am I doing it right?

20 billion turnover

4 billion profit.

It'd be interesting to have a break down of the 16million, how much was spent on manufacturing, research, marketing etc

techbeck said,

Jobs doesnt care...his zealots will follow him to the end of the earth and back.

News flash: CEOs bash the competition.

techbeck said,

Yea, your an idiot. And yes it was a good thing. If you dont accept it as such, then thats your problem.

I also posted this thread but apparently you are to worried about bashing me to do a little research. Typical....

http://www.neowin.net/forum/to...otcake-of-the-21st-century/

So you rehashed news for someone else to turn into an article. Do you think for a second that anyone doubts that you would bash apple on that article once someone wrote it? Nobody believes you so get out of your reality distortion bubble.

Im done responding to your android fanboism.

ILikeTobacco said,

So you rehashed news for someone else to turn into an article. Do you think for a second that anyone doubts that you would bash apple on that article once someone wrote it? Nobody believes you so get out of your reality distortion bubble.

Im done responding to your android fanboism.

Good, then I dont have to listen to your APPLE BS anymore. Get over yourself dude. It was a good article about apple that I posted as I was surprised iPads were selling like they were.. If you dont like it, tuff...I dont really care. And someone else wrote the article that I posted and did I once bash it? No, I dont think so.

You asked for proof that I say and post good things about Apple, so I provided it to you. Do I need to lick Jobs ass in order to get your approval?

techbeck said,

Good, then I dont have to listen to your APPLE BS anymore. Get over yourself dude. It was a good article about apple that I posted as I was surprised iPads were selling like they were.. If you dont like it, tuff...I dont really care. And someone else wrote the article that I posted and did I once bash it? No, I dont think so.

You asked for proof that I say and post good things about Apple, so I provided it to you. Do I need to lick Jobs ass in order to get your approval?

You reposted someone elses article. You didn't say anything good yourself. Noone doubts you were surprised as every Andriod fanboy was. Before iPad came out you were bashing Apple for the failure the iPad would be. After it came out you bashed it and claiming the sales numbers were all falsified. Recently you bashed Apple for giving the miners free stuff. You take anything good from Apple and spin it to be evil.

ILikeTobacco said,

You reposted someone elses article. You didn't say anything good yourself. Noone doubts you were surprised as every Andriod fanboy was. Before iPad came out you were bashing Apple for the failure the iPad would be. After it came out you bashed it and claiming the sales numbers were all falsified. Recently you bashed Apple for giving the miners free stuff. You take anything good from Apple and spin it to be evil.

And I am not the only one saying this but yet, I only get your attention.

And I am soo soo sorry about posting a good article about Apple and not making a glowing comment on how great they are. I thought posting article would be enough. Next time I will give them a thumbs up or a WOOHOO to make you happy. And I post good/bad articles about Android and MS as well and dont make my own comment...but I guess thats ok.

Oh, most articles here are REPOSTS of whats on other sites...so I am not the only one doing it so show the "love" towards others if you are so worried about it.

Edited by techbeck, Oct 18 2010, 10:05pm :

I think you guys should get married

ILikeTobacco said,

So you rehashed news for someone else to turn into an article. Do you think for a second that anyone doubts that you would bash apple on that article once someone wrote it? Nobody believes you so get out of your reality distortion bubble.

Im done responding to your android fanboism.

theh0g said,

Yeah and Ballmer and fans are sooooo very different... oh wait...

Ballmer has fans? Where? Even MS supporters dislike Ballmer, most of the employees at Microsoft dislike Ballmer.

His style compared to Gates which was in flux during the 90s between the two leaders was a major problem at Microsoft, and sadly Ballmer was too business minded to listen to who he should have been listening too.

Gates was about putting technology in people's hands, Ballmer was about making money and this destroyed all the good R&D investments of the 90s that would have kept Microsoft ahead of everyone else. Even now R&D products and concepts are either abandoned, or partially tried and left along the roadside, with another company picking up and fully supporting the concepts and succeeding later on.

Initial return is not how technology gets into people's hands, and although it is good for the initial bottom line, later on when the technology would be hitting the consumer price points they either let go or play catch up on technology they had right 5 or 10 years before others. And this is Ballmer and his choices of some of the team leaders like for Office in the early 90s.

Microsoft had a great mobile device and phone OS dating back to 1997 and 2001, they even had R&D products that for the time made the iPhone look outdated, and instead they dropped this direction because of the costs at the time, and are now getting back into Phone 'concepts' seriously, and it is still based on the same technology they had sitting around since the early 2000 era.

Microsoft abandoned iTunes like stores a couple of times (going back to MSN when it was a service like Compuserve), and then are playing catch up to having a good iTunes and application marketplace - even though they were doing it before Apple and let it go because it wasn't hitting good profits at the time.

Microsoft had Tablet technology locked down, and because it wasn't the 'main' seller because of the price point for tablet screens and computing power in the early 2000s, they let it drift, they let the Office team abandon the tablet UI constructs and integration (In 2003 you could write in word and do wordprocessing in your own handwriting, a feature that was let go in later versions.) If they would have kept Tablet technology a priority, when screens and computing power hit the consumer range around the time Apple cooked up the iPad, Microsoft would have the iPad market completely, as they had a better OS with full voice, touch, and handwriting technology ready and working on the same level of hardware as the iPad that only does touch.

I'm afraid that other things like Surface will completely disappear too, when again it is a technology that doesn't use touch, but camera input technology, and once the consumer price point comes down, will be something other companies will do and own that market as well. Imagine a $500 coffee table that can scan documents, show information and allow multiple users to interact with it - the price point isn't far off and people would use it.

The camera input model also works well in portable devices, imagine an iPad like device that can see your fingers, or pen, or paintbrush or scan a document or a picture. Microsoft has this technology in their labs now, and yet they will probably not do anything with it and let the whole market fall to someone else.

Other products like Media Center should have been the center of people's TVs and entertainment experiences, and instead they only did crazy licensing with it, that made it impossible to put in low end 'AppleTV' type of boxes. Again for the mighty dollar instead of getting the technology in people's hands.

Ballmer is why Microsoft stumbled in the late 90s and early 2000s, and he still hasn't fully learned his lesson with crap like the Kin, etc.

(Didn't mean to sidetrack so much, but Ballmer is really bad for Microsoft as he is a business person with no technical understanding.)

bdsams said,
Is an earnings call really the place to bash your competition?

Addressing the competition is PART OF THE EARNINGS CALL!!!!!!!!

Jesus H Christ, you have to take about your competition when talking about future earnings - do you have the slightest clue about what you're talking about?

evo_spook said,

The thing is you lot are very free and happy with the terms fanboy and zealot, but look at the rants you go on, why does it bother you so much?

Strange you call me a applefan boy, but unlike the Android crowd, I don't go round bashing the other platforms, maybe its because I'm more mature.

If you can't attack the message...

bdsams said,
Is an earnings call really the place to bash your competition?

Why wouldn't it be? Your big shareholders are on the line and the CEO's job is to appease them. Giving yourself pats on the back and downplaying your competitors is common,

techbeck said,

Yea, your an idiot. And yes it was a good thing. If you dont accept it as such, then thats your problem.

I also posted this thread but apparently you are to worried about bashing me to do a little research. Typical....

http://www.neowin.net/forum/to...otcake-of-the-21st-century/

I can see you are getting better with your offensive trolls.
You must have accumulated quite the troll material by now, so you just copy paste your rubbish...

Cheers

evo_spook said,

The thing is you lot are very free and happy with the terms fanboy and zealot, but look at the rants you go on, why does it bother you so much?

Strange you call me a applefan boy, but unlike the Android crowd, I don't go round bashing the other platforms, maybe its because I'm more mature.

I think the term fanboy is well over used. Im a fanboy because i preffer Android over iOS. I realise there are also advantages of iOS over Android etc. I dont bash either, but i do bring constructive discussion on all platforms.

The problem is that there are people out there that shout "FANBOY" and all hell breaks loose. Its why i tend to only post on the odd occasion in those sections of Neowin TBH.

evo_spook said,

The thing is you lot are very free and happy with the terms fanboy and zealot, but look at the rants you go on, why does it bother you so much?

Strange you call me a applefan boy, but unlike the Android crowd, I don't go round bashing the other platforms, maybe its because I'm more mature.

"mature" people do not feed the trolls. just a kind note.