Weekend Poll: Would you like to disable the Start Screen on desktop PCs?

Before the Windows 8 Consumer Preview launched we asked you whether you would, if you could, disable the Windows 8 Start Screen, return the use of the Start Menu and go straight to the desktop. Interestingly, before using it properly 32% of you voted that you would like to disable it permanently, with a further 22% saying you would prefer to use the Start Menu and Desktop (while keeping the Start Screen for occasional use).

As far as we can tell there is no way to put back the Start Menu into Windows 8, disappointing more than 50% of you that voted you would prefer to use it. Today we’re putting this poll back to you after using the Consumer Preview and a more final version of the Start Screen, but in a bit more specific fashion.

This time we ask if you would like the option to disable the Start Screen on the desktop (as in, not for touchscreen-based devices) version of Windows 8. A lot of you we’re guessing have tried the Consumer Preview and as far as the comments in the forum go, many have passionate opinions on the Metro Start Screen for desktop users.

Place your votes in the poll below and discuss away in the comments. Have a great weekend everyone!

Poll

Would you like to disable the Start Screen on desktop PCs?

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It is like watching 2 kids fight over who has the coolest hot wheel.

Leave in the option of both. Allow the user to select their interface. I prefer the classic start menu, that is just me, but the option to use one or the other is perfectly acceptable.

Problem solved.

Change for its own sake is never intelligent change. Why change the most fundamental aspect of the computer interface to cater to a remarkably SMALL segment of the user base? Seems that this concept was likely championed by the "vocal minority" which also happens to be getting all the press as "the next big thing" right now. Most users, especially business users, simply CAN'T do their work on a tablet. I fear MS may be making a catastrophic mistake not offering the traditional desktop in W8.

I am so disappointed that MS is doing worse and worse in OS design.
I work with computer, not a tablet. If I need tablet, I will better choose iPad.
Just like the Ribbon in Office, it's actually rubbish.

In all honesty, I don't mind the start screen. The only real disappointment I have is that there wasn't 1001 fart apps to choose from in the store....

it works well for touchscreens and phones, but for myself on my desktop and laptop its a touch cumbersome, but ill persevere on the laptop for now as I will have to support it.
I always found the context sensitive ribbon in office annoying but its working not too badly on explorer windows in all honesty.
For general users the big change isnt too big an issue.

Microsoft removed the Start Menu and the Start Button completely. If I wanted to do all my office work on a tablet, I would have gone and bought myself a new iPad (which I still might do, if I'm forced to choose between a Windows tablet and an iPad). Why can't we just leave the tablet market to Apple and the PC market to Microsoft? Don't get me wrong, I like Windows 8 in general, but what happened to freedom of speech and choices. In Windows XP we had the choice to switch back to the Classic Start Menu and in Windows 7 we have XP Mode.

It looks like in Windows 8, the only choices we have are to tablet or not to tablet. Rizonesoft started a petition to ask Microsoft to at least give us a choice between the interfaces and bring the Start Menu back. Go here: http://www.rizonesoft.com/2012/bring-back-the-start-menu/ for more information about the petition. Please help Rizonesoft accomplish this almost impossible task by signing and sharing this petition.

Well the metro mode is certainly not made for desktop PCs.

I've been using the Consumer Preview since the day they released it and it looks good. And you can do everything you could in W7 - with a few clicks extra.

Going metro mode with dual screens looks retarded. Only the main screen goes into the metro mode. And the magic corners are on the main screen so it's quite hard to "hit" them sometimes since the cursor wants to go over to the second screen.

With the old start menu it was really easy to see which shortcuts were installed by a program, in metro mode not so. In metro mode you can right click and go to all apps, and you'll see what will look like a grouped mess of icons.

I'll keep running W8 and hopefully I can say one day that this really is better than it was before, but I'm not there yet.

Here is what happened when I showed it off to your average Joe this weekend.

They had no idea how to make it past the Welcome Screen. As soon as I did it for them, they liked the Start Screen. As soon as I asked them to use it, they hated it.

They then said, it's nice but who is stupid to compete with Windows at this point? I told them, this is the next version of Windows. They said, oh, I'm not upgrading to that.

So for the majority, they liked looking at it but hated working on it.

If it were me, I wouldn't even want the desktop menu on a laptop. Wish there was a way to only use metro on non-WOA devices. Metro is more functional than the desktop; is easier with a mouse and keyboard.

AWilliams87 said,
If it were me, I wouldn't even want the desktop menu on a laptop. Wish there was a way to only use metro on non-WOA devices. Metro is more functional than the desktop; is easier with a mouse and keyboard.

It is not easier to use for me at least. please explain how it improves productivity for a developer working on a tool like visual studio.

psreloaded said,

It is not easier to use for me at least. please explain how it improves productivity for a developer working on a tool like visual studio.


How would I know how it improves productivity as a software developer? Visual studio doesn't even run in metro.

My point exactly. It dosen't... and thats why there should be an option to disable metro start.

AWilliams87 said,

How would I know how it improves productivity as a software developer? Visual studio doesn't even run in metro.

As somebody once pointed out on this site, the start screen makes sense with the addition of the superbar in Windows 7. You can put all of the shortcuts to your favourite apps with the superbar, so what's the point in having them duplicated in the start menu?

The start screen with additional features is much better

How many on here actually use the start menu in Vista/7 on a day to day basis?
With Windows 7 I almost never used it. All my apps were pinned to the taskbar. All I really used the startmenu for is searching and to shut down, otherwise it was mostly redundant, especially the left pane for apps. Now they should have at least kept the start button on the taskbar and not the charm bar, thats my only real beef. I mean look at OS X and launch pad at least there is a dock icon for it

What Microsoft could do for Windows 8 is move the charm bar to the left and have a sort of mini metro start screen as the new menu.

wv@gt said,
All my apps were pinned to the taskbar.
So you don't have many programs, not really the situation with power users…

wv@gt said,
How many on here actually use the start menu in Vista/7 on a day to day basis?
With Windows 7 I almost never used it. All my apps were pinned to the taskbar. All I really used the startmenu for is searching and to shut down, otherwise it was mostly redundant, especially the left pane for apps. Now they should have at least kept the start button on the taskbar and not the charm bar, thats my only real beef. I mean look at OS X and launch pad at least there is a dock icon for it

What Microsoft could do for Windows 8 is move the charm bar to the left and have a sort of mini metro start screen as the new menu.

I do. Media Centre in ther made it easy to find most recent recordings and also frequent watched shows and a link straight to the TV guide. Many programs in the left pane of start menu (that's called your Recent Programs), have recent files listed there as well. Keeping the taskbar very simple and tidy.

I use the start menu all the time...

ozgeek said,

I do. Media Centre in ther made it easy to find most recent recordings and also frequent watched shows and a link straight to the TV guide. Many programs in the left pane of start menu (that's called your Recent Programs), have recent files listed there as well. Keeping the taskbar very simple and tidy.

17 years it has done exactly what I need, when I need, where I need. Now Microsoft has to go and **** with it. Not happy.

My sister who is pretty bad at computers loved it. She was planning on buying an Ipad 3, but after seeing 8 shes planning on waiting for it. She was telling me the start screen made sense to her. *shrug*

Mercuie said,
My sister who is pretty bad at computers loved it. She was planning on buying an Ipad 3, but after seeing 8 shes planning on waiting for it. She was telling me the start screen made sense to her. *shrug*

Wow, my sister too. I would peg my sister as an Apple fan also.

the metro start screen is only useful for touch. if i put windows8 on my desktop it would be a very incomplete experience without touch screen.

not upgrading to w8 on my laptop

I will be buying a w8 tablet in a hearbeat (first time ever interested in tablets)

Im getting use to it not being there. With the windows button the keyboard it makes things way easier.

The new Start Menu is (1) not cluttered, (2) easy to navigate, (3) easy to customize.
The old start menu is crap on a stick.

_Heracles said,
The new Start Menu is (1) not cluttered, (2) easy to navigate, (3) easy to customize.
The old start menu is crap on a stick.

I agree, but I would go further. Had Metro been what we always knew, then suddenly Microsoft released the desktop/start menu as a replacement, there would be a far bigger outcry from what we see now. The desktop today, believe it or not, is still to complicated for the regular user. I know people my age who still doesn't know how to use it well. With the start menu, you can literally just start typing and search for anything you want. That's far more functional than the desktop was.

AWilliams87 said,

I agree, but I would go further. Had Metro been what we always knew, then suddenly Microsoft released the desktop/start menu as a replacement, there would be a far bigger outcry from what we see now. The desktop today, believe it or not, is still to complicated for the regular user. I know people my age who still doesn't know how to use it well. With the start menu, you can literally just start typing and search for anything you want. That's far more functional than the desktop was.

You can do the same on the Windows 7 start menu too... so that doesn't change...

psreloaded said,

You can do the same on the Windows 7 start menu too... so that doesn't change...


No you absolutely cannot do the same thing with Windows 7. You can only search for installed software in the start menu, but you cannot search for say the control panel, setting/configuration files, apps in the store , or items within apps themselves straight from the start menu. Metro offers far more breadth in search.

Use the new start screen concept on the desktop, at the bottom show all open apps, so basically replace the desktop icons with a start screen. It's always in the background and new windows are on top of it. Makes more sense to me.

Currently Windows 8 is a touch screen designed operating system and desktop has been thrown out the Window.

The only problem I have with the start menu is that when it crashes there's little that can be done to recover the PC, and I mean it. The other thing that needs to be improved is multi drag in the start menu.

Why no button? It makes it really hard to target the start "area" now if you have your main monitor in the middle of two others. I can't just go to the bottom left, or my mouse goes into another monitor. I have to carefully float around the edges. Its really annoying. Also, Why can't I have a clock and tray on all task bars? I would love to have the Metro interface open on my left monitor and my desktop on the middle and heck even another Metro app open on the right monitor. Finally, when I click an icon on a taskbar on Monitor 3, for example, I want that application to appear on 3, not where it was last.

Edit - One more thing, If I open a picture in explorer, why is the default option to open it in the full screen Metro picture viewer. In what crazy world is that a better option than the simple Windows Picture Viewer. Especially when I'm going through a bunch of pictures. I changed it back, but why would that be the default option. It just makes no sense other than to force people into the Metro start at a loss of functionality.

Its little things like this right now that makes learning this OS very annoying at times. With these fixes and few others, I could appreciate Metro a lot more.

Edited by LightEco, Mar 3 2012, 6:51pm :

I can see the Start Screen taking over when enough developers invest time into it.

I do find myself on the Desktop a lot but that's because I'm missing a non-Metro application to do the same job at the moment.

I've recently used the CP with a mouse and keyboard, and -- honestly -- I adapted to it and these "magic corners" instantly. If the Windows Store was available in the UK, it would be even better.

Personally I like the Consumer Preview, of course it still needs some tweaking but I am quite happy with it and am even using it as my primary OS (did the same with 7 Beta).

Get rid of the Start screen? On the contrary, I want to destroy any last remnant of the Desktop. I HATE, HATE, HATE the old desktop meme. It's for tired, old-school people. I'm already very use to the Metro UI. The quicker developers get their heads out and re-write their apps for this environment, the better.

ScubaDog said,
Get rid of the Start screen? On the contrary, I want to destroy any last remnant of the Desktop. I HATE, HATE, HATE the old desktop meme. It's for tired, old-school people. I'm already very use to the Metro UI. The quicker developers get their heads out and re-write their apps for this environment, the better.

So go and buy a WP 8 phone and play with Facebook all day long an let us do the work on Workstations. And take your HTML WinRT child apps with you.

ScubaDog said,
Get rid of the Start screen? On the contrary, I want to destroy any last remnant of the Desktop. I HATE, HATE, HATE the old desktop meme. It's for tired, old-school people. I'm already very use to the Metro UI. The quicker developers get their heads out and re-write their apps for this environment, the better.

That would destroy MS from the inside out, and that is what we may be watching play out now.

Sasa_RI said,

So go and buy a WP 8 phone and play with Facebook all day long an let us do the work on Workstations. And take your HTML WinRT child apps with you.

I think that the desktop doesnt need to be removed just yet. But maybe in the future. As far as wp8 and using it purely for facebook - that just shows how ignorant you are as well.

Poll option: "I'd just like to default to the desktop."

I'm not sure I understand why you wouldn't want to see a snapshot of your email, IMs, calendar events, the local weather, news feeds, before you go to the desktop.

brianshapiro said,
Poll option: "I'd just like to default to the desktop."

I'm not sure I understand why you wouldn't want to see a snapshot of your email, IMs, calendar events, the local weather, news feeds, before you go to the desktop.

Your comment seems odd, almost as if you will always have the email, IMS, calender, local weather and news feed on the start screen.
YOU CUSTOMIZE what it displays. YOU CUSTOMIZE it to something you find relavent. If you are always playing COD, then pin COD for all i care. If you are always using visual studio (ok?) then pin that!
By all means, YOUR THE USER, DECIDE WHAT YOU WANT TO SEE. mmmkaayyyyyyyyyyy

(its like half the people dont understand what is happening in w8)

auziez said,

Your comment seems odd, almost as if you will always have the email, IMS, calender, local weather and news feed on the start screen.
YOU CUSTOMIZE what it displays. YOU CUSTOMIZE it to something you find relavent. If you are always playing COD, then pin COD for all i care. If you are always using visual studio (ok?) then pin that!
By all means, YOUR THE USER, DECIDE WHAT YOU WANT TO SEE. mmmkaayyyyyyyyyyy

(its like half the people dont understand what is happening in w8)

Exactly my point. Email, IMs, Calendar, etc., were just an example of something most users want to see when they start their computers.

But why would you prefer to go straight to your desktop instead of getting an overview of all your info right away?

Day one I was uncomfortable, day 2 was better, day 3 I got used to it, day 4 I like it. The ease with which I can get around to my programs is stunning.

I'm not sure if it's a good idea to put a further wedge between Windows and the other guys by removing the print button and having us go through the "devices" button to get to print.

There was an element of "standardization" with all computers before. I could usually tell someone say over the phone, "click File Print". Now it will be click lower right corner and then devices and then print.

I went to an MS store yesterday an played around with the Samsung tablet. Aside from obvious graphic glitches it was neat, but I still am not a tablet guy. REally looking forward to the touch screen Ultrabooks.

I actually prefer the multitasking as implemented with the mouse! I can get to my open program with one click as opposed to swiping though a bunch of them.

That's not much of a problem for me. I just understand that metro is for the mass and that ms will keep desktop for power user (and neowin visitor are power user). So I only click Desktop when the metro interface load and I continue from there.

That's not much of a big deal to switch from the start menu to the charm bar. I'll use metro more when it'll get great apps that make good use of cloud, html5 and all those stuff.

Software compatibility is more an issue now, Avira not working properly and the corsair hs1 headset too.

The thing I like about Linux is that it gives you the choice to do anything with it. Chrome OS is Linux. If i can open the terminal I can install an X environment or something like that, I can personalize it in every way I want.

In Windows they didn't even allowed you to change the theme, you had to use third party software for that reason.. and to patch uxtheme.dll as well. In Windows 8 the crap is even bigger - they give you a Start screen, regardless of whether you have a tablet or a desktop computer (with no touch screen).

When Ubuntu went for Unity, all the users went for Linux Mint. When something works, why do you need to remove it? ... or add more useless features that no one will ever use?

No. I'll tell you why, at least from my experience. Quite simply I don't even realize the start button/menu is gone. Right now I'm typing this comment but I'm also watching a radar loop from a metro app on the left side of the screen. Sure I could have two browsers open but this just seems more elegant. I have a dedicated weather app keeping me informed on some nasty weather but I can also do the browsing around that I enjoy.

As others have said, people don't like change. So I say this: tough. It's changing. So you can either stay with Win7 (or XP??) or you can buy an overpriced machine with a fruit for a logo on it. I'm Win8 all the way. Nicely none MS.

Also, MS is depending on developers making apps for the platform. Killing off the metro UI essentially kills off the need. It's not gonna happen.

[quote=laserfloyd said,or you can buy an overpriced machine with a fruit for a logo on it. [/quote]
The more I look at Windows 8 the less overpriced - if any - Macs actually look like…

MFH said,

The more I look at Windows 8 the less overpriced - if any - Macs actually look like…

lol!
Well, i dont think i could ever get that 200000000000% profit margin out of my head.
And btw, apple isnt even spending it - they have 100billion in cash... they are like the biggest Jew out there.

MFH said,

The more I look at Windows 8 the less overpriced - if any - Macs actually look like…

So go buy one and STFU.

auziez said,

Well, i dont think i could ever get that 200000000000% profit margin out of my head.

More like 30%. And hell you get a whole lot of stuff for free (e.g. XCode, whilst VS is a few thousand dollars…)

ahhell said,
So go buy one and STFU.

So the Windows community has reached this state where anyone that doesn't follow Microsoft's lead may leave as their opinion is "just wrong anyway"… (pride goes before a fall…)

BTW: I may switch to OSX or Linux after 2020 (EOL of Win7) if Microsoft continues this Metro-sh*t on desktop…

MFH said,

So the Windows community has reached this state where anyone that doesn't follow Microsoft's lead may leave as their opinion is "just wrong anyway"… (pride goes before a fall…

One does not simply represent the whole Windows community.

For home users who want Facebook and one thing running at a time this is great.

For business users, coders, multi-taskers, minimalists, desktops users, non touch interface users. This will be a total disaster.

The Laughing Man said,
For home users who want Facebook and one thing running at a time this is great.

For business users, coders, multi-taskers, minimalists, desktops users, non touch interface users. This will be a total disaster.

I'm multitasking right now. I'm a coder and a minimalist. I'm a power desktop user and yet I've fully embraced this. /shrug

I think we have to wait and see what can be done with the colour design in the retail and whether third party devs will bring out customisation tools for the icons/colours etc. A nice option would be to have folder icons in the menu to keep things more minimal on the home screen, but in metro style and not leading to the desktop.

As for business use, it's already been mentioned about not including Metro, but we have yet to hear from the horses mouth about this.

Drive pooling is another great feature that not many have mentioned and will be great for small businesses that don't want a server.

The Laughing Man said,
For home users who want Facebook and one thing running at a time this is great.

These people don't need a full OS - the iPad or a WOA-tablet would be enough…

The Laughing Man said,
For home users who want Facebook and one thing running at a time this is great.

For business users, coders, multi-taskers, minimalists, desktops users, non touch interface users. This will be a total disaster.

Really? Nothing I've seen will prevent me from doing what I do, i'm a coder, i'm a desktop user, a non-touch user.

laserfloyd said,

I'm multitasking right now. I'm a coder and a minimalist. I'm a power desktop user and yet I've fully embraced this. /shrug

The others guys comment was the usual opinion it seems. People seem to just blurt out words that come to mind when they think of changing the start screen. Really its childish, but what can you do?

As ive said before... i dont give two nuts for what others think about a picture of a beta. Untill they try it out, their opinions = useless

As of now, i hardly use the start menu. All that i use is on my desktop.

subcld said,
well if you are going to disable metro then stick to windows 7
im going to use metro by default

Are you using it now? If so, are you using Metro IE? If not why?

justmike said,

Are you using it now? If so, are you using Metro IE? If not why?


yes im using windows 8 consumer perview right and and im posting this message using IE metro and if there Is an app I need from desktop i'll use desktop I don't see any problem switching between them if I have to
ie on metro still has some problems for example the screen sometimes goes black for some reason

I really like the new start screen, no need for that silly old start menu

Just keep bringing those app updates though, we really need them

Hey

Please put a toggle button no the task bar if you "want" ( not so much here) to use the start screen. I really like the new task manager ( truley).

Metro needs to die. In a fire. On a plane. With snakes.


Comparing the abortion that is Metro to the Office ribbon? Really? Grasping at straws much? Apples & Oranges.

Anyone who truly thinks Metro deserves to be on the desktop, need their heads checked.

Yep, I do. I love it. Yes it needs some tweaks and apps need to be a lot better and actually have some OPTIONS. But I get the idea enough from them to see great potential. Applications are going to look a ton better.

rpsgc said,
Metro needs to die. In a fire. On a plane. With snakes.


Comparing the abortion that is Metro to the Office ribbon? Really? Grasping at straws much? Apples & Oranges.

Anyone who truly thinks Metro deserves to be on the desktop, need their heads checked.


It's metro OR desktop. Metro isn't on the desktop. Start screen = start button/menu. It's just a lot bigger with a lot more useful info. It's also far and above FASTER than 7. I'll upgrade to 8 the day its available.

b_roca said,
Yep, I do. I love it. Yes it needs some tweaks and apps need to be a lot better and actually have some OPTIONS. But I get the idea enough from them to see great potential. Applications are going to look a ton better.

Most of those OPTIONS may not be added.

I like the new start screen, but I would like to make the desktop come up by default. Also, if there was a button on the task bar that would show the start screen (like the orb shows the start menu), then it would have some familiar functionality. Finally, I would like the option of switching between the start screen and all apps view with the click of an option on the screen.

All the right-click and screen edge functionality for the mouse is fine, but it will not make immediate sense to some people who will view it as a bad user experience. Adding shortcuts as small buttons in an out-of-the-way area of the screen for these functions would make it a better experience (in my opinion, of course).

The reason I think it's much better to land at the home screen is the live tiles. You can see all information in one panel before you go to do what you wanted to do. You want to open a program in the desktop 99% of the time? put the program shortcut in the menu! That's 1 click to get to what you wanted to do.

Perhaps having an option somewhere to either go 'Desktop' or 'Metro' is the best way to go! As for the start menu , I don't think I'll miss it ...

Its annoying and needs changing. THis is way too huge of a change for users who are not windows phone users to accept. Its going to be a huge turn off. If I get this OS for home use that ugly metro is going to be the first thing I change. Its bad enough they forced it on xbox users too.

Gotenks98 said,
Its annoying and needs changing. THis is way too huge of a change for users who are not windows phone users to accept. Its going to be a huge turn off. If I get this OS for home use that ugly metro is going to be the first thing I change. Its bad enough they forced it on xbox users too.

Its not just us windows phone users that find it difficult to accept. The metro interface in Win8 CP is somewhat the same in terms of the look the start screen with its live tiles, but that's about all that is the same.

Unless Microsoft decide to release Windows 8 mice with a dedicated application back, windows button etc then its going to feel very weird trying to emulate the windows phone experience on the PC. Sure we have keyboards with the start button etc but its not the save feel you get from using a windows phone. The Win8 CP version feels very disjointed and detached from the user at times, and at best you're sat there looking at the tiles on the start screen wishing it did actually work with all the existing windows applications as metro apps.... maybe after a few years we'll see the majority of the common windows apps have metro counter parts.

We need a number of the bigger software titles that people use regularly to step up and make a metro version of their software.

I'd love to see at least these as metro apps:

VLC, Freemake video converter, Steam, Office, utorrent, mirc, photoshop elements (or gimpshop)

Because its metro we're not limited to our usual desktop apps we could very well have dedicated fully featured apps for things like facebook, ebay, amazon etc.
If anyone's wondering why not use a webpage of them, check out
what telerik did for Facebook. If this kind of app went metro, then we've all be quite pleased with the quality if nothing else lol. http://www.telerik.com/products/fdeck.aspx

Gotenks98 said,
Its annoying and needs changing. THis is way too huge of a change for users who are not windows phone users to accept. Its going to be a huge turn off. If I get this OS for home use that ugly metro is going to be the first thing I change. Its bad enough they forced it on xbox users too.

I think the last two updates on the xbox were metro. The newest one is by far the most functional Xbox 360 UI released to date.
I remember the first UI, it was basically a booklet... bland and boring. Now its very catchy, easy and intuitive to use.

I assume by how you wrote your comment that you dont even have an xbox 360 OR a windows phone. This makes me think that you are just against change! like Syria's leaders perhaps? (lol)

Tell you what... why dont you try it, then come back? looking at pictures and videos does not do justice.

I wouldn't mind having the option, but personally I don't miss the start menu.

With that said, I think MS has some work to do as far as making the two environments work together better.

Enron said,
I wouldn't mind having the option, but personally I don't miss the start menu.

With that said, I think MS has some work to do as far as making the two environments work together better.

I don't miss the start menu, as I'd normally hit winkey and then type the app and hit enter anyway and I've just continued to do that with win8 metro's start screen... but I do miss being able to flick the mouse into the top left (99% of the time) or top right of the screen and double click to close a maximized window, Now, I just get thrown into a flip-match-attack of desktop vs open metro apps or the charms blocking and getting in the way of things.

Its made the existing desktop experience a little worse for wear and the lack of metro apps that let you do anything other then cut a rope is a little daunting to say the least.

sagum said,

I don't miss the start menu, as I'd normally hit winkey and then type the app and hit enter anyway and I've just continued to do that with win8 metro's start screen... but I do miss being able to flick the mouse into the top left (99% of the time) or top right of the screen and double click to close a maximized window, Now, I just get thrown into a flip-match-attack of desktop vs open metro apps or the charms blocking and getting in the way of things.

Its made the existing desktop experience a little worse for wear and the lack of metro apps that let you do anything other then cut a rope is a little daunting to say the least.

You can still throw the mouse to the top right and hit the X button, the charms bar doesn't get in the way of that.

The constant whining is getting annoying. Why not come up with constructive criticisms and submit them to Microsoft. It's a ****ing preview for a reason.

ahhell said,
The constant whining is getting annoying. Why not come up with constructive criticisms and submit them to Microsoft.

Every time someone criticizes Metro, it's considered trolling… (at least that's the feeling I get at neowin at the moment…)
BTW: Microsoft is only looking for bug reports, just like with the last few betas they don't care for suggestions that change the functionality of the product…

ahhell said,
The constant whining is getting annoying. Why not come up with constructive criticisms and submit them to Microsoft. It's a ****ing preview for a reason.

Yeah, like Microsoft would ever ditch Metro.

/facepalm

It's not about ditching Metro, it's about offering solutions to issues within it. Like maybe having pinned apps to either sides of the screen with your desktop in the middle, which would work nicely on larger screens. or maybe having halfsize apps so you can have 4 pinned, 1 in each corner.

ahhell said,
The constant whining is getting annoying. Why not come up with constructive criticisms and submit them to Microsoft. It's a ****ing preview for a reason.

Done.

On Neowin for the trolling.

MFH said,

Every time someone criticizes Metro, it's considered trolling… (at least that's the feeling I get at neowin at the moment…)
BTW: Microsoft is only looking for bug reports, just like with the last few betas they don't care for suggestions that change the functionality of the product…

Many of these people just say the exact opposite of what they are actually thinking for fun. So is there a word for that? Something like troll mirror? IRL we have expressions, on here we do not. That is just another part of the growing Idiocracy (like how things look almost exactly like the nurses monitor in the movie). Many people end up typing in that exact attitude "Oh well, it is what it is." They are weak.

Edited by justmike, Mar 3 2012, 4:14pm :

MFH said,

just like with the last few betas they don't care for suggestions that change the functionality of the product…

What..
The..
Hell..

Cøi said,

What..
The..
Hell..


Maybe you need a little history lesson then. Microsoft doesn't care for requests on functionality, they only do these betas for bug fixing and publicity… - it's been that for ages…

justmike said,

Many of these people just say the exact opposite of what they are actually thinking for fun.


I don't, I still think Metro has no place on desktop (been using the CP since release…)

MFH said,

Maybe you need a little history lesson then. Microsoft doesn't care for requests on functionality, they only do these betas for bug fixing and publicity… - it's been that for ages…

No fight intended but do you have proof for that? I'm pretty sure Windows 7 is the best example of the them listening to public..

There is an option for those of you who hate Windows 8 and CBA to get used to it.....

Stick with Windows 7!!!!!

neo158 said,
There is an option for those of you who hate Windows 8 and CBA to get used to it.....

Stick with Windows 7!!!!!

Or like quite a few business users XP !!!!

Depicus said,

Or like quite a few business users XP !!!!


Although most businesses should be upgrading to Windows 7 by now anyway.

neo158 said,
There is an option for those of you who hate Windows 8 and CBA to get used to it.....

Stick with Windows 7!!!!!


Yeah, a nice solution. Hope a lot of people do that. Microsoft will only react to outside feedback if their money flow runs dry…

neo158 said,
There is an option for those of you who hate Windows 8 and CBA to get used to it.....

Stick with Windows 7!!!!!

I think that should be the slogan for the advertising campaign.

neo158 said,
There is an option for those of you who hate Windows 8 and CBA to get used to it.....

Stick with Windows 7!!!!!

But only until you need a new PC, then get a MAC?

The Start screen and the entire Metro interface on desktops and notebooks makes brilliant sense. I love it, and I hope there is no option for it to be disabled.

Totally agree. The same people hated the XP menu and kept it Win98 style.
People moan about it taking you away from what you were doing but the thing you were doing is looking for a program and this way is equally as quick regardless of it being fullscreen. I love it and can see its enormous potential.

After only a few days use I'm totally used to it.

My only problem is currently the apps are very basic but they're good enough to give you the idea.

hotdog963al said,
...Wow...

If you think about why I said that, you will probably understand. It's for similar reasons as to why Facebook won't be making Timeline optional for people, and for similar reasons as to why most companies don't provide each of their products with more than one user interface.

Callum said,

If you think about why I said that, you will probably understand. It's for similar reasons as to why Facebook won't be making Timeline optional for people, and for similar reasons as to why most companies don't provide each of their products with more than one user interface.

But Windows 8 Does have two user Interfaces. Metro and classic desktop.. you're not making any sense...

Callum said,
The Start screen and the entire Metro interface on desktops and notebooks makes brilliant sense.

In what way does it make sense not being able to have more than one app fully visible and the other one partially at the same time? This isn't 1997 anymore, some people do in fact have screens larger than 15-inch. I'd like to be able to utilize that space.

Callum said,

If you think about why I said that, you will probably understand. It's for similar reasons as to why Facebook won't be making Timeline optional for people, and for similar reasons as to why most companies don't provide each of their products with more than one user interface.

Yeah, but Facebook is a free service, and I've thrown thousands Microsoft's way.

And Metro is brilliant, I'll give you that, but only on touch centric devices with smaller screens, and the XBox. That's my opinion at least.

.Neo said,

In what way does it make sense not being able to have more than one app fully visible and the other one partially at the same time? This isn't 1997 anymore, some people do in fact have screens larger than 15-inch. I'd like to be able to utilize that space.

It makes perfect sense because one can only interact with one app at any one time. Windows 8 makes it very easy and quick to switch to other open apps/windows, so having more than one and a half on one screen at any one time would be pointless, and it would lead to the horrible workflow and window management seen in Windows 7 and previous versions.

Fubar said,

But Windows 8 Does have two user Interfaces. Metro and classic desktop.. you're not making any sense...


No, I'm making perfect sense if you understand what I'm saying (which you clearly don't). I was clearly referring to two user interfaces that do the same thing. In Windows 8, the Metro experience and the Desktop experience are two user interfaces, but they both achieve different tasks and results.

Callum said,

It makes perfect sense because one can only interact with one app at any one time.

That's complete and utter nonsense what you're saying right there. I can't even count the number of times I have multiple windows of multiple apps open at the same because I need more than one source of info available to me, especially during work and studies: Typing in one app while looking at another. Windows 8's Metro makes it next to impossible to do this without undertaking an action to flip between windows. I've been using OS X Lion for the past year so I know extremely well what full-screen apps with multi-touch gestures on the desktop are like. While it can be useful at times, it isn't always.

.Neo said,

That's complete and utter nonsense what you're saying right there. I can't even count the number of times I have multiple windows of multiple apps open at the same because I need more than one source of info available to me, especially during work and studies: Typing in one app while looking at another. Windows 8's Metro makes it next to impossible to do this without undertaking an action to flip between windows. I've been using OS X Lion for the past year so I know extremely well what full-screen apps with multi-touch gestures on the desktop are like. While it can be useful at times, it isn't always.

The Metro experience allows for two apps/windows on one screen at any one time, not just one app/window. You should not discount the second app because even though it is a "half" as you call it, it is still big enough to provide enough information.

When I mentioned interacting, I meant actually interacting. As I pointed out in a thread in the forums about half an hour ago, our biology ensures we're only able to interact with one app at any one time, but we can of course still look at and watch another source of information, which is why the Metro experience accounts for this: We're able to have the one app in view that we can interact with and the other app that we'll be looking at or watching.

Having more than those two apps open on one screen at any one time provides no benefit because our eyes can only look at once source of information at any one time.

As I've mentioned, Windows 8 allows for incredibly fast app switching, so switching to another app would be just like moving our eyes to look at another app or window.

Callum said,

The Metro experience allows for two apps/windows on one screen at any one time, not just one app/window. You should not discount the second app because even though it is a "half" as you call it, it is still big enough to provide enough information.

I've tried it, and the space most definitely isn't enough to show all information. Not to mention the fact there's no need whatsoever for most applications to take up the better part of my 27-inch screen. On large screens it gives a feeling of being "locked in" and the amount of space sitting there idle doing nothing of importance is just a waste.

Callum said,
Having more than those two apps open on one screen at any one time provides no benefit because our eyes can only look at once source of information at any one time.

There are countless times where I have Pages, Safari and iChat open at the same and constantly quickly glance between those three windows. Having to constantly switch (doesn't matter how fast it can) can be a pain.

Callum said,
As I've mentioned, Windows 8 allows for incredibly fast app switching, so switching to another app would be just like moving our eyes to look at another app or window.

It isn't any quicker compared to OS X Lion's switching so I know what the difference is during daily operations. I stand by my point that being locked into a near-full-screen environment isn't always preferable.

.Neo said,

In what way does it make sense not being able to have more than one app fully visible and the other one partially at the same time? This isn't 1997 anymore, some people do in fact have screens larger than 15-inch. I'd like to be able to utilize that space.

Last time I checked, human beings can only work on one task at a time. Something about only having two hands and one brain. And, when I say one task at a time, I'm talking about physically doing it.

For example, one can't write an email while also entering figures in Excel. You have to go from Excel, write your email, then click back into Excel once you're finished.

So, having multiple windows onscreen simultaneously does what again? Unless, the app is giving real-time info like say a stock ticker, it's just a dead app until YOU the user interact with it.

In the case of the Start Screen many apps will not be "dead". They'll have real-time info. Wanna keep track of the ten stocks your into in the market, and see the scores for games you can't watch on tv? Start Screen. Wanna read an email excerpt w/o actually going into your email, AND read the latest news headlines? Start Screen.

The possibilities are endless. We'll soon see an app that can play live video from it's tile and I'm sure many other incredible things.

For kicks, last night I had 11 apps open, including desktop, in the Metro environment just to see if multitasking was any slower than previous versions of Windows. Guess what I found out? Nope. It's just as fast to click/cycle thru apps, which I need to use at any given time, as it was before.

And, incorporating the "at-a-glance" nature of the Start Screen, in some cases it's faster as some tasks are eliminated altogether e.g. the aforementioned checking email.

All and all, I'd say this is a pretty good start. Rough around the edges, sure. But, if you honestly sit down and go through your normal paces, I think that the majority of you'll will find that it doesn't hamper you from doing what you've done in the past and in many cases it's actually quite a bit better.

tl;dr Itsa' nice!

Callum said,

The Metro experience allows for two apps/windows on one screen at any one time, not just one app/window. You should not discount the second app because even though it is a "half" as you call it, it is still big enough to provide enough information.

Half? It's 300px in width, that's just laughable…

Wyn6 said,

Last time I checked, human beings can only work on one task at a time.

So you're incapable of multi-tasking, is that really our bright new future? Just cause you can't multitask, we have to sacrifice the UI for those that actually can…

MFH said,

So you're incapable of multi-tasking, is that really our bright new future? Just cause you can't multitask, we have to sacrifice the UI for those that actually can…

So you didn't read the rest of this user's comment then? If you had read the rest of his comment, you would have understood what he meant by that. I'd like to see you entering figures into an Excel spreadsheet while simultaneously writing an email. You know this cannot be done. Instead, you'd be writing the email and then entering the figures into the Excel spreadsheet; either that or doing a bit of one task then doing a bit of the other.

Callum said,
You know this cannot be done. Instead, you'd be writing the email and then entering the figures into the Excel spreadsheet; either that or doing a bit of one task then doing a bit of the other.

How about:
1. reading a bug report in outlook
2. checking code in VS at the same time
3. thinking about solution
4. writing bugfix

Note how 1, 2 and 3 ( xor 4) are done at the same time…
As you will definitely ask yourself: yes, that's pretty common and an oversimplification on what is going on in software development…

Just 'cause you can't input data into applications simultaneously doesn't mean you can't take input from several simultaneously…

Edited by MFH, Mar 4 2012, 1:34am :

MFH said,

How about:
1. reading a bug report in outlook
2. checking code in VS at the same time
3. thinking about solution
4. writing bugfix

Note how 1, 2 and 3 ( xor 4) are done at the same time…
As you will definitely ask yourself: yes, that's pretty common and an oversimplification on what is going on in software development…


Reading the bug report requires one window on the screen, checking the code in Visual Studio at the same time requires another window on screen, thinking about the solution requires no more windows on screen, and writing the bug fix requires that same Visual Studio window that is already on screen from when you checked the code. That's two windows, which is something the Metro experience allows for brilliantly (the bug report email would be the smaller window that is docked on the screen).

Just to point out, by the way, those steps are not actually done at the same time; they're done in order of how you posted them. You read the bug report first, then you check the code, then you think about it, then you write the bug fix. It's the limitation our biology ensured of us. The only one that's possibly done in tandem with another task is thinking about the solution, as our brain allows for thinking while we're typing and performing other tasks.

Callum said,

thinking about the solution requires no more windows on screen

Only, if it's a simple program without any external dependencies (e.g. configs, binary files, custom files that have a proprietary format,…), alas really seldomly…

Callum said,

Just to point out, by the way, those steps are not actually done at the same time; they're done in order of how you posted them.

In reality: they are actually interleaved as you start thinking about the solution as soon start reading the bug report… As bug reports may be extremely complicated (e.g. supplemented by a "minidumpt") you actually need the bug report all the time next to the IDE…

I agree. I usually have Visual Studio, bug tracking software, browser, SVN log, email client, and a console open at all times.

While it is true that I can only work on 1 thing at any one time, I spend very little time between each application. I'm always shifting my attention between these programs very quickly. Think:

email client -> bug tracker -> svn log -> bug tracker -> email client -> svn log -> browser -> vs -> etc.

And having all the windows are staticly placed, I can very quickly shift my eyes to the relevant window and back to where I need to be.

Think of it like this: With Win7, I may have a messy desk, but I know exactly where everything is. This is and has been my workflow, and has enabled me to be very good at what I do. Enough so to be paid.

People can call me irrational or inefficient or "not keeping up with the times" as much as they want.

You can even bring in the world's leading brain specialists to tell me how MY brain works, and how I don't need all the clutter.

But here is the bottom line:
I do my job, and I do my job well with Windows 7's UI. Having used Windows 8 DP and CP, I have yet been able to reached the same level of performance, productivity and concentration (switching to the start screen gets VERY distracting when you do that 2-3 times every few minutes, and is discussed in GUI Bloopers 2.0 by Jeff Johnson) that I was able to achieve with Windows 7.

However, I'll continue using Win8 CP. It was called a preview for exactly that reason. And if I'm unable to improve my workflow by the time it retails, I'll stick with Windows 7. All the bells and whistles in the world ain't worth jack if I end up being less productive. In the end, I will pick and pay for the product that is best for me, the rest of you will do the same.

And should the worst were to happen, and I'm forced to use Windows 8, then I shall seriously consider if my employer, and even if the entire IT and software development industry, is right for me.

That is my 2c, without calling anyone with a dissenting opinion "Dumb".

Wyn6 said,
Last time I checked, human beings can only work on one task at a time.

You don't seem to understand what I'm saying. I'm looking at information from Safari, iChat and Mail all the time while typing in Pages. On Windows 8 I can't do that anymore without constantly flipping between apps while I have more than enough screen estate keep those apps open at the same time. It's a matter of having to frequently execute an extra command instead of simply redirecting my eyes for a second or two. It's disruptive, tedious and the reason why I rarely use OS X Lion's full-screen feature.

Edited by .Neo, Mar 4 2012, 2:50pm :

In my opinion the current implantation of Metro has no place whatsoever being on a non-touch screen device. And before all the Metro evangelists start with me: Yes, I've tried it for an extended period of time.

GUNNER said,
Just another Windows "ME" this will fail also.

You could also say it is a necessary step in changing direction. Maybe it is like Vista but that was also a big step towards getting Windows 7.

b_roca said,

You could also say it is a necessary step in changing direction. Maybe it is like Vista but that was also a big step towards getting Windows 7.


ME was no step i any necessary direction…

GUNNER said,
Just another Windows "ME" this will fail also.

May the Divines hear you. I want this piece of fail (Metro, ugh) to crash and burn. Crash. And. Burn.

GUNNER said,
Just another Windows "ME" this will fail also.

Don't even begin to compare this with ME. It was the derpy cousin of 95/98. This isn't even remotely like that. If you're going to make false comparisons you need to at least outline WHY it's like ME. You just don't like it and that's just your opinion.

laserfloyd said,

If you're going to make false comparisons you need to at least outline WHY it's like ME. You just don't like it and that's just your opinion.

I think its pretty obvious what he means.

I have used XP, Vista and 7 from day one, and loved all of them, but I just can't get excited about in 8.

MFH said,

ME was no step i any necessary direction…

Exactly, I don't think most of these people were using ME. ME had a half and half design problem, that was half protected system files, and half that were not as in 98. We now have a Double issue, two internet explorers that function (or lack of function) in two differing ways.

you guys complain about windows 7 task bar... aslo windows xp task bar... even office that made everything easy. why not use the c_preview or beta to get use to it an enjoy it than crying like a baby all the time.

benalvino said,
you guys complain about windows 7 task bar... aslo windows xp task bar... even office that made everything easy. why not use the c_preview or beta to get use to it an enjoy it than crying like a baby all the time.

+1

benalvino said,
why not use the c_preview or beta to get use to it an enjoy it than crying like a baby all the time.

So you whine about people who whine.

GG.

One question I have not seen yet is. How will this "new start menu" come into play with multiple monitor setups? I can't imagine one massive start menu on one screen and blank nothing on the other. I run 5 monitors, this cant be good especially for multitasking.

b_roca said,
On the other screen is the desktop.

And I'm still not wasting even one of my 30" monitors on what is a HUGE waste of screen real estate even on a lower resolution monitor.

so open the desktop on that one as well.


for what ever reason people seam to forget you can still use the desktop for most things.

Not disable entirely, but I'd like to have the Start Orb and Start Menu back in the bottom-left corner with the option to access the Start Screen via the Charms bar.

The Start Screen is definitely a retrograde step, but I think the other improvements to Windows 8 will still justify the upgrade. As it stands, the Start Screen interrupts my workflow by taking over the entire screen and makes it more difficult to quickly search for settings (unless I remember to press 'Win+W' instead of just the Windows key), not to mention access the shutdown menu, but I'm not sure any of these annoyances are necessarily dealbreakers.

I think the Start button should be added back, simply because there was no need to remove it. Effectively it is there already but is just invisible, so I don't really see what they're trying to accomplish by removing it.

But Microsoft can't simply add back the Start menu functionality, as it runs completely counter to what they're trying to achieve. You can still quickly access any apps by typing to search, while if you're looking to access a program it's easier if they're all on screen and are easier to click on. I don't understand what you'd be trying to do at the same time, as it's not like you can read a webpage at the same time as reading entries in the Start menu. It just seems like a poor excuse for not liking it because it's different.

theyarecomingforyou said,
You can still quickly access any apps by typing to search, while if you're looking to access a program it's easier if they're all on screen and are easier to click on. I don't understand what you'd be trying to do at the same time, as it's not like you can read a webpage at the same time as reading entries in the Start menu. It just seems like a poor excuse for not liking it because it's different.

For example, in Windows 7 or Windows Vista, I can press the Windows key, type cmd and press enter while continuing to read something else on the screen (this of course only works when I know what the top result will be in advance, but that is true most of the time). I'll acknowledge that the full-screen Start Screen may be a superior interface for searching for files due to the increased number of results displayed, but that's not how I use the Windows Vista/7 Start Menu search. I can't think of when my Start Menu searches return more than a couple of results (I disable file search), and taking over the entire screen for that makes little sense.

theyarecomingforyou said,
I think the Start button should be added back, simply because there was no need to remove it. Effectively it is there already but is just invisible, so I don't really see what they're trying to accomplish by removing it.

But Microsoft can't simply add back the Start menu functionality, as it runs completely counter to what they're trying to achieve. You can still quickly access any apps by typing to search, while if you're looking to access a program it's easier if they're all on screen and are easier to click on. I don't understand what you'd be trying to do at the same time, as it's not like you can read a webpage at the same time as reading entries in the Start menu. It just seems like a poor excuse for not liking it because it's different.

Exactly, I installed a 3rd party Win7 start orb inside Win8, and many things do not show at all. People would be just as mad about all of that when they see it. lol

I know that menu systems will be made, and even used in the corporate world if things remain this way. The problem is that it will make them angry, at a time that many are still upgrading systems, and may be looking for alternatives. I should have bought that apple stock.

Edited by justmike, Mar 3 2012, 4:32pm :

Quppa said,

For example, in Windows 7 or Windows Vista, I can press the Windows key, type cmd and press enter while continuing to read something else on the screen (this of course only works when I know what the top result will be in advance, but that is true most of the time). I'll acknowledge that the full-screen Start Screen may be a superior interface for searching for files due to the increased number of results displayed, but that's not how I use the Windows Vista/7 Start Menu search. I can't think of when my Start Menu searches return more than a couple of results (I disable file search), and taking over the entire screen for that makes little sense.

Pressing start and typing cmd then pressing enter takes less than one second. I don't buy this argument. Who even does that? Presses the start menu launches another program while still reading something on another window.

mrp04 said,

Pressing start and typing cmd then pressing enter takes less than one second. I don't buy this argument. Who even does that? Presses the start menu launches another program while still reading something on another window.


I do. Constantly…

mrp04 said,
Pressing start and typing cmd then pressing enter takes less than one second. I don't buy this argument. Who even does that? Presses the start menu launches another program while still reading something on another window.

Well, I do, and that's what's important to me.

Certainly launching programs by searching in the Start Menu or Start Screen takes a very small amount of time, but with the latter there's a strong sense of being taken out of one environment and being placed into another (and then back again), which makes everything feel very disjointed. As I wrote in my original post, I don't think this will stop me upgrading to Windows 8, but it's still a step backwards in my mind.

hotdog963al said,
Why can't we have both?

the start screen is both your desktop where you have apps on the desktop and also a start screen period... there is no need to take it down. you have another desktop you can customise with icons on it as well.

hotdog963al said,
I presume you aren't a power user then, if you think that start screen will suffice as a desktop, lmao.

I really like the idea of having a metro screen for the no so advanced users as I would save a lot of hassle when there are a lot of apps that just give access to the documents all from the same place without the user having to go through drives and what not... however, metro does need the apps to allow them to do it, as such at the moment there aren't any apps that make metro worth using.

Even as a power user, I'd still use metro IF the vast majority of apps that I use are in metro. Alas they aren't yet and even for some basic tasks such as copy and paste doesn't work properly yet, there are no guild lines or default dialog boxes for thing like File Open/selection apart from the examples in the Win8 SDK so it might be that Metro becomes a total mess eventually that is more confusing then the 'power user's' desktop. if every app does it their own way.

hotdog963al said,
I presume you aren't a power user then, if you think that start screen will suffice as a desktop, lmao.

I'm a poweruser and it's just fine. I can stay on the 'desktop' as long as I want and code/design as long as I want. Then when I'm just casually computing I can use my metro apps. There aren't many apps right now but I'm assuming some great productive ones are in the works. So the poweruser argument to me is just people complaining to complain. /shrug

hotdog963al said,
You seem to be forgetting that the start screen takes up the ENTIRE SCREEN.

So what? It shows more results per page, it's better.

Anthonyd said,
People voting for "start menu" are either dumb or have no clue about what they are talking about since the new start screen has the same capabilities (enhanced of course) + more features.

Still, I would like to default to the desktop, here is why : http://social.technet.microsof...fcd-4e1a-ad31-8278b81acd8b/


Glad you told me I was dumb, maybe I was too dumb to figure out that I was dumb until you told me, duuuuhhhhhhhhhhhhhh *drool*

Anthonyd said,

So what? It shows more results per page, it's better.
I like to press the windows key, start typing the application I want, hit enter, then bam it's there. I can still see all the windows I have open across my screen whilst I'm doing this. How the heck can a spaced-out, full screen menu be better to use?
I can appreciate it being used on tablets, or by casual users, but it's absolutely backwards for people who currently fly around their system.

hotdog963al said,
You seem to be forgetting that the start screen takes up the ENTIRE SCREEN.
Which isn't a problem considering that it is only used to launch programs. And the visual layout of the Metro start screen actually makes locating newly installed programs much easier, as they appear at the end - you no longer have to try to remember the name of the app, which can be especially confusing when they insert the company name into.

hotdog963al said,
I like to press the windows key, start typing the application I want, hit enter, then bam it's there. I can still see all the windows I have open across my screen whilst I'm doing this. How the heck can a spaced-out, full screen menu be better to use?
I can appreciate it being used on tablets, or by casual users, but it's absolutely backwards for people who currently fly around their system.

Your eyes are focused on the start menu/screen, no need to show others windows/apps at the same time.

The start screen has live tile, separated search for apps/settings/file (so it's faster & more accurate), it brings more result per page, it allows you to manually group & sort applications and so on.
The old start menu is gone, thanks god is was annoying !

Also, don't forget to check out the menu who appears by right clicking on the bottom-left corner for administrative tasks.

Anthonyd said,
People voting for "start menu" are either dumb or have no clue about what they are talking about

So... people are dumb because they don't like dumb features and dumb changes.

Got it.

hotdog963al said,
I suppose Microsoft are changing Windows to suit people like you now, so I guess I should probably switch to Linux full-time. Welp.

Nice to see that you didn't read what I wrote, you should definitively switch to win 3.1, aka linux!

Anthonyd said,

Your eyes are focused on the start menu/screen, no need to show others windows/apps at the same time.

The start screen has live tile, separated search for apps/settings/file (so it's faster & more accurate), it brings more result per page, it allows you to manually group & sort applications and so on.
The old start menu is gone, thanks god is was annoying !

Also, don't forget to check out the menu who appears by right clicking on the bottom-left corner for administrative tasks.

That is the thing. I don't WANT to look at THAT MUCH information. The start screen presents too much information. The apps I need most - the taskbar pins and the MFU list on the start menu more often than not suffices. Apps needing to notify me of something - the few icons I keep visible in the notification area is enough. For everything else, start menu search works fine. I DONT want an entire screenful of results - just give me a couple of highly relevant hits. I asked the computer to search so that I don't have to. Now it is giving me a huge list and forcing me to do its task.

Switching to the full screen start menu when working on something else is damn irritating. Sure, I may not look at any window when the start menu is open. But I opened it to get to a program or document. I don't want those flashy live tiles DISTRACTING me either.

It depends on the installs, I installed some of the software we use here, and files and folders are showing up everywhere starting with the same names.

I really hope Metro on a PC is completely safe from Viruses. If a choice few abilities were disabled in Metro, we may be stuck without that one big "app" that everyone is using the most.

I also do not believe that even 5% of the people that voted for it are using the Metro IE at this moment. Why is that? If it's because "It's not done yet, it's a beta", then maybe they should have waited?

soumyasch said,

That is the thing. I don't WANT to look at THAT MUCH information. The start screen presents too much information. The apps I need most - the taskbar pins and the MFU list on the start menu more often than not suffices. Apps needing to notify me of something - the few icons I keep visible in the notification area is enough. For everything else, start menu search works fine. I DONT want an entire screenful of results - just give me a couple of highly relevant hits. I asked the computer to search so that I don't have to. Now it is giving me a huge list and forcing me to do its task.

Switching to the full screen start menu when working on something else is damn irritating. Sure, I may not look at any window when the start menu is open. But I opened it to get to a program or document. I don't want those flashy live tiles DISTRACTING me either.


Type in the name of the app you want to start, and it works just the same way as the old start menu, it's just presented in a fullscreen interface...

Lamp Post said,

Type in the name of the app you want to start, and it works just the same way as the old start menu, it's just presented in a fullscreen interface...

I know it works the same way (Btw, it doesn't. It takes a few more keystrokes to reach control panel options, for example, but thats just nitpicking). I just don't like the new presentation. Things are all over the place. On a small screen like a phone or tablet it might be fine. But on a bigger screen you have to read around the entire screen.

soumyasch said,

I know it works the same way (Btw, it doesn't. It takes a few more keystrokes to reach control panel options, for example, but thats just nitpicking). I just don't like the new presentation. Things are all over the place. On a small screen like a phone or tablet it might be fine. But on a bigger screen you have to read around the entire screen.


If you create your application group correctly, it's fine.
And it doesn't takes more keystroke to reach the control panel, it's even on the "applications" list instead of "settings".

How many row of tiles you got?

Anthonyd said,

If you create your application group correctly, it's fine.
And it doesn't takes more keystroke to reach the control panel, it's even on the "applications" list instead of "settings".

How many row of tiles you got?

Does not matter. I DONT WANT to look at those big colorful things. I DONT WANT to know what information they are communicating to me. I DONT WANT to browse what apps I have. I DONT WANT to create groups or anything. I DONT WANT to see the list of apps even. I DONT WANT any tile. I know what apps I have, I will search for them. Just give me a couple of results in a corner or at max a small section in the side of the screen. I am working on my system, don't distract me with a screen full of fluff I don't want. The tiled interface is good when I am browsing for stuff - like going through my pictures collection, music or even files. But as an app/document launching mechanism, it does not make the cut for me.

And yeah, for control panel settings, it requires lot more work (that includes keystrokes, mouse moves AND moving your eye around to read info off the screen) in the start screen than in the menu. Try it. With non exact matches.

soumyasch said,

That is the thing. I don't WANT to look at THAT MUCH information. The start screen presents too much information. The apps I need most - the taskbar pins and the MFU list on the start menu more often than not suffices. Apps needing to notify me of something - the few icons I keep visible in the notification area is enough. For everything else, start menu search works fine. I DONT want an entire screenful of results - just give me a couple of highly relevant hits. I asked the computer to search so that I don't have to. Now it is giving me a huge list and forcing me to do its task.

Switching to the full screen start menu when working on something else is damn irritating. Sure, I may not look at any window when the start menu is open. But I opened it to get to a program or document. I don't want those flashy live tiles DISTRACTING me either.

Here's my issue with the old Start Menu. Other than clicking Start, hovering over/clicking All Programs then scrolling through to a folder, clicking that, and then.... so on and son, search was not as efficient as it could've been. Much better than previous iterations but not as robust as say... Windows 8.

You would type something in and if you didn't get a hit in those first few results, you click "More Results" and then you'd have to scroll, sometimes endlessly depending on what you're looking for, through all of THOSE results.

Windows 8 is infinitely more accurate, and faster, filtering your choices. Now, sometimes you're gonna have a lotta files with same keywords and scrolling is inevitable. But, I find this to be better.

Given the same keywords for the same program, I can best anyone using Windows 7's Start Menu in searching or simply finding an app.

soumyasch said,
Does not matter. I DONT WANT I DONT WANTI DONT WANT I DONT WANT I DONT WANT. I DONT WANT

You are just scared of things when they change, right? You have something more accurate and more powerfull in hands but "YOU DONT WANT", guess I was right at the beginning by saying that you're dumb

soumyasch said,

And yeah, for control panel settings, it requires lot more work (that includes keystrokes, mouse moves AND moving your eye around to read info off the screen) in the start screen than in the menu. Try it. With non exact matches.

No it doesn't, I tried and you can type "control" + enter, and you are starting the control panel.

hotdog963al said,
I like to press the windows key, start typing the application I want, hit enter, then bam it's there. I can still see all the windows I have open across my screen whilst I'm doing this. How the heck can a spaced-out, full screen menu be better to use?
I can appreciate it being used on tablets, or by casual users, but it's absolutely backwards for people who currently fly around their system.

The start screen is open for a second or two while you're typing and pressing enter. What's it matter if you can't see the rest of your windows for those 1-2 seconds?
The only issue I have with the new start menu is the separate of programs, settings, and file search results.

mrp04 said,
The start screen is open for a second or two while you're typing and pressing enter. What's it matter if you can't see the rest of your windows for those 1-2 seconds?
The only issue I have with the new start menu is the separate of programs, settings, and file search results.

Why does it bother you? There are new shortcut to search directly for apps/settings/file, learn them, it's a new Windows, there are new stuff to learn.

Anthonyd said,

Why does it bother you? There are new shortcut to search directly for apps/settings/file, learn them, it's a new Windows, there are new stuff to learn.

Because there was no reason to separate them. It was super fast the way it was. If there was some advantage to separating them then go ahead, but all this does it separate them for no reason at all.

mrp04 said,
Because there was no reason to separate them. It was super fast the way it was. If there was some advantage to separating them then go ahead, but all this does it separate them for no reason at all.

No, it was slow, confusing & annoying (I want to search for file, why are you showing me apps?), even with indexer turned on.

hotdog963al said,
I like to press the windows key, start typing the application I want, hit enter, then bam it's there. I can still see all the windows I have open across my screen whilst I'm doing this. How the heck can a spaced-out, full screen menu be better to use?
I can appreciate it being used on tablets, or by casual users, but it's absolutely backwards for people who currently fly around their system.

Yes, because while you're focusing on the start menu search box typing you search query into the box, you are paying full attention to all the other windows open on your screen at the same time. /s Get real dude. Saying you can't see the other windows while you are busy launching another window is just a flimsy argument, and you know it.

I agree that they shouldn't have separated the search for apps, settings and files though. Having results for all three presented to choose from was more efficient and I don't really see a reason to split them. Unless of course they couldn't figure out how to merge all three into the new metro design, in which case they're just lazy Nope, should be merged like before. But show apps at the top, so you can launch an app just by pressing enter. If you want a setting or a file, then click on the result instead.

Anthonyd said,

No, it was slow, confusing & annoying (I want to search for file, why are you showing me apps?), even with indexer turned on.

It's not slow on any of my computers nor was it confusing. It separated the three with headers, but they were all visible at once. Search results display no faster on 8 than they did on 7. If you want to look for files, just look under the files section for the file you want.

TCLN Ryster said,

Yes, because while you're focusing on the start menu search box typing you search query into the box, you are paying full attention to all the other windows open on your screen at the same time. /s Get real dude. Saying you can't see the other windows while you are busy launching another window is just a flimsy argument, and you know it.

I agree that they shouldn't have separated the search for apps, settings and files though. Having results for all three presented to choose from was more efficient and I don't really see a reason to split them. Unless of course they couldn't figure out how to merge all three into the new metro design, in which case they're just lazy Nope, should be merged like before. But show apps at the top, so you can launch an app just by pressing enter. If you want a setting or a file, then click on the result instead.

They definitely should be merged, with a little header denoting what each section contains, just like it is done in 7.

hotdog963al said,
You seem to be forgetting that the start screen takes up the ENTIRE SCREEN.
That is open for only a few seconds really is that the biggest problem you have with metro, something that is going to bother you for less than a minute a day?

evilsushi said,
That is open for only a few seconds really is that the biggest problem you have with metro, something that is going to bother you for less than a minute a day?

The time it is open is not the problem. But the fact that it shoves the entire list of tiles up your face, distracting you from whatever you were doing. The distraction is the problem.

Anthonyd said,
People voting for "start menu" are either dumb or have no clue about what they are talking about since the new start screen has the same capabilities (enhanced of course) + more features.

I'm not sure if I fall into the category of people who are dumb or people who have no clue what they're talking about. Either way, could you help me figure out how to use this feature in the new start menu;

http://i.imgur.com/BITIl.jpg

In case it isn't clear, the feature I'm referring to is the one that allows me to hover over the steam icon and jump directly into a game or into steam settings.

geoken said,

I'm not sure if I fall into the category of people who are dumb or people who have no clue what they're talking about. Either way, could you help me figure out how to use this feature in the new start menu;

http://i.imgur.com/BITIl.jpg

In case it isn't clear, the feature I'm referring to is the one that allows me to hover over the steam icon and jump directly into a game or into steam settings.


This functionality is not in Metro…

geoken said,
I'm not sure if I fall into the category of people who are dumb or people who have no clue what they're talking about. Either way, could you help me figure out how to use this feature in the new start menu;

http://i.imgur.com/BITIl.jpg

In case it isn't clear, the feature I'm referring to is the one that allows me to hover over the steam icon and jump directly into a game or into steam settings.


Jump list are still here if you pin the application on the desktop taskbar. I suggest you to read the W8 blog entry about that.

Anthonyd said,

Jump list are still here if you pin the application on the desktop taskbar. I suggest you to read the W8 blog entry about that.

Jumplists on the taskbar are still there. Jumplists in the start menu/start screen are gone. My question wasn't "do jumplists still exist, in some capacity, somewhere in the OS?". My question was "does the start screen still support jumplists?"

Seeing as how you decided to answer the question by outlining a workaround I guess it's safe to assume the answer is no?

Yes, I want a disable option and a start menu that doesn't occupy 100% of the screen. I don't mind change, but i DO mind change for the WORST.

the issue is, like always, is people who don't like change, and i believe given time, everyone will get used to it and won't give it a second thought on how much they was against it at first. i remember all the hoo haa over the quick launch been removed from windows 7 and it just turned out to be them who hated change.

johnporter29 said,
the issue is, like always, is people who don't like change, and i believe given time, everyone will get used to it and won't give it a second thought on how much they was against it at first. i remember all the hoo haa over the quick launch been removed from windows 7 and it just turned out to be them who hated change.

There's a bit of a difference between removing the quick launch and creating the utter mess they've made with Windows 8.

johnporter29 said,
the issue is, like always, is people who don't like change, and i believe given time, everyone will get used to it and won't give it a second thought on how much they was against it at first. i remember all the hoo haa over the quick launch been removed from windows 7 and it just turned out to be them who hated change.

The difference is you can add Quick Launch back by creating a custom toolbar and pointing it to the QL folder that is still there.

With Windows 8 you cant disable the Start Screen or the Metro crap.

If you allow too much customisation then you diminish brand recognition. You will also have people disable it immediately because of resistance to change, regardless of whether it will actually benefit them. Microsoft took a tough stance with the ribbon in Office 2007 because they did a lot of research and found it to improve productivity.

If you don't like Windows 8 then don't buy it. If enough people do that then Microsoft will inevitably take a different direction with Windows 9. But don't expect Microsoft to back down from the main features of Windows 8.

johnporter29 said,
the issue is, like always, is people who don't like change, and i believe given time, everyone will get used to it and won't give it a second thought on how much they was against it at first. i remember all the hoo haa over the quick launch been removed from windows 7 and it just turned out to be them who hated change.

False. I was one of those that didn't like the Windows 95 Windows Explorer, and I'm still using Total Commander today on my Windows 8 computer. There is a big difference between quick launch, and the entire start menu for most of the users I've had testing Windows 8. Greater choice is almost always better. If we didn't have these choices, most of us would have been using a MAC long ago. I think MS will change something for corporate users, unless they are really wanting to skip Windows 8 for the domains in the business world.

johnporter29 said,
the issue is, like always, is people who don't like change, and i believe given time, everyone will get used to it and won't give it a second thought on how much they was against it at first. i remember all the hoo haa over the quick launch been removed from windows 7 and it just turned out to be them who hated change.

Negative. I'm usually the first to update and embrace new features. I loved the new taskbar in Windows 7 because I felt it was an actual improvement,and I loved everything about Windows 95. I also think Metro on Window Phone 7 is silky smooth and great.

My dislike for the start screen has nothing to do with resisting change, and everything to do with me not liking things that once took up 1/16 to 1/8 of my 24in screen, now taking up the whole darn thing. I also feel like I have two different UI philosophies slapping me in the face and battling it out every time I go from desktop to Metro.

YOU CAN KEEP YOUR HOPE AND CHANGE!

omgben said,

Negative. I'm usually the first to update and embrace new features. I loved the new taskbar in Windows 7 because I felt it was an actual improvement,and I loved everything about Windows 95. I also think Metro on Window Phone 7 is silky smooth and great.

My dislike for the start screen has nothing to do with resisting change, and everything to do with me not liking things that once took up 1/16 to 1/8 of my 24in screen, now taking up the whole darn thing. I also feel like I have two different UI philosophies slapping me in the face and battling it out every time I go from desktop to Metro.

YOU CAN KEEP YOUR HOPE AND CHANGE!


Remember that the start screen disappears again the moment you start an application, so it will take the whole screen for approx. 1-3 seconds while you don't really use the screen for anything else. Unless you have some special use case where you actually need to see the rest of the content on the desktop while opening an application from the start screen/menu?

omgben said,
I also feel like I have two different UI philosophies slapping me in the face and battling it out every time I go from desktop to Metro.

That's the point though. Once the app ecosystem for Metro is in full swing, most average users (and I do mean MOST) will be 100% catered for with Metro apps and will never be troubled with the desktop to metro transition. Only those who regularly use complex legacy apps that are not suited for metro will ever see this transition. Unfortunately, that's also the kind of person who tends to frequent Neowin the most

Personally, I see the desktop now as just a workspace in Windows 8... sort of like an application compatibility platform for legacy apps. I go there now just to use Dreamweaver and Photoshop. All the while having my Metro messaging app docked to the side of the screen.

For those of us that do have to transition, I agree with Lamp Post. The start screen is there for what? a couple of seconds at most? No seconds at all if your apps are pinned. Additionally, anything else I used the start menu for is catered for in other methods. Like WIN+X.

Lets be honest with ourselves for a second. I also have a 24 inch monitor and I almost always run full screen or half screen snapped and this is with visual studio. How many apps do you have on the top level at any one time? I would bet it is less than two with a few others running in the background? While I think the metro snap is a bit limiting (I would prefer a 50/50 snap option) it is by no means going to kill most peoples productivity. My biggest problem with Metro is the loss of the superbar. If they found a suitable replacement for that, made the metro windowing more flexable, and made the new commands work better with multimonitors then I would be happy with metro. True windowing and full screen start menus that are only open for a few seconds is really the smallest problem with metro.

evilsushi said,
How many apps do you have on the top level at any one time?

Obviously this can't be fixed size, but I'd say 3 to 5, with up to 10 on a secondary - partially visible - second level…

The problem is that functionality has been lost. The super handy jumplist features of the start menu are no more. Hovering over the Excel icon and getting a list of my most recent documents or hovering over Steam and being able to jump straight into a specific game without ever entering the steam app is a great feature. As far as I can tell the new start screen offers no way to replicate these.

johnporter29 said,
the issue is, like always, is people who don't like change, and i believe given time, everyone will get used to it and won't give it a second thought on how much they was against it at first. i remember all the hoo haa over the quick launch been removed from windows 7 and it just turned out to be them who hated change.

They won't get used to it because it's not a change. It's a hybrid. Microsoft is scared or doesn't have the technical capacity to truly change. They are hedging their bets at the expense of user productivity. I believe Windows 8 will change before release. Significantly.

They are afraid to release it as Windows for Tablets becuase they are afraid to take on iPad directly and they want to try and reinvigorate PC sales with something new, whether it's needed or not.

Yes and no. Yes, it should be a BUSINESS feature to remove/disable the start screen. For home use, it is fine. For business use, nothing but headaches.

Why do you need a CHOICE? Why make TWO Start menu's? That doens't make any sense. They improved it a lot, made it metro, and that's what the new start screen is like. Get used to it.

Jeeesz.

Jarrichvdv said,
Why do you need a CHOICE? Why make TWO Start menu's? That doens't make any sense. They improved it a lot, made it metro, and that's what the new start screen is like. Get used to it.

Jeeesz.


Why do you need CHOICE? Well, because people like choice. Not everyone uses a computer for the same tasks, and it's nice to CHOOSE how you work, so that it fits your needs the best.

I don't like the start screen, and I don't like all the fullscreen apps.

Jarrichvdv said,
Why do you need a CHOICE? Get used to it.

Jeeesz.

Riiiiiiight... "We have any color you like - as long as it's black." Jeeesz.

Jarrichvdv said,
Why do you need a CHOICE? Why make TWO Start menu's? That doens't make any sense. They improved it a lot, made it metro, and that's what the new start screen is like. Get used to it.

Jeeesz.

Not_sure_if_trolling_or_just_stupid.jpg

Ambroos said,

Why do you need CHOICE? Well, because people like choice. Not everyone uses a computer for the same tasks, and it's nice to CHOOSE how you work, so that it fits your needs the best.

I don't like the start screen, and I don't like all the fullscreen apps.

People have a CHOICE. Buy Windows 8 or don't.. Unless of course they were not planning on buying it anyway, and are just miffed that their next free OS isn't going to be to their liking.

Microsoft is making a product, something different to what has come before rather than the same concepts re-heated or rehashed. If you like it, great. Buy the product. If you don't, then don't. It's really that simple.

The endless useless whining isn't accomplishing anything and just makes the whiners look self-entitled, like Microsoft "owes" them an OS that looks like and works like Windows 7 or something. Even Microsoft is well aware that there are going to be a group of people that don't like the new design. Just as there is a group of people that do like it. And a group in the middle that don't really care either way and will get used to it. Whining about it isn't going to change it now.

Jarrichvdv said,
Why do you need a CHOICE? Why make TWO Start menu's? That doens't make any sense. They improved it a lot, made it metro, and that's what the new start screen is like. Get used to it.

Jeeesz.

there is choice, OSX, now that OSX can be installed on PC, and i game less, i might go that route, and few people i talke already said the same.

windows 8 will go down in history as OS that reduced MS from monopoly like company to smaller player.

not a IT department in any company will switch this this crap

nekrosoft13 said,
not a IT department in any company will switch this this crap

Says you. One person's crap is another person's gold. You have absolutely ZERO idea what IT departments are going to do, so don't preach that you do. I happen to work in an IT department in one of the UK's leading manufacturing companies, and I for one see the potential in Metro when there are sufficient apps on place. 95% of our office users only use web, email and office. They are entirely catered for in Metro, while at the same time gaining all the advantage of said interface like live tiles to show at a glance if they have mail, messages etc.

Then there are the shop floor factory workstations... they would be ideal for metro also as we could do away with keyboard and mouse and just have big touchscreens for them to interact with the corporate systems with.

Add to the the sales force roaming the country generating sales. Metro based laptops or tablets would serve their needs perfectly.

Lastly you've got the customer terminals in our main reception areas. Again, metro apps would serve them perfectly.

So no, don't go preaching that you know what IT departments are going to do, because you have absolutely no idea.

TCLN Ryster said,

Says you. One person's crap is another person's gold. You have absolutely ZERO idea what IT departments are going to do, so don't preach that you do. I happen to work in an IT department in one of the UK's leading manufacturing companies, and I for one see the potential in Metro when there are sufficient apps on place. 95% of our office users only use web, email and office. They are entirely catered for in Metro, while at the same time gaining all the advantage of said interface like live tiles to show at a glance if they have mail, messages etc.

I am an IT Manager in the government sector and I see 0 potential for Metro in it's current state on corporate desktops. Nor do I see the ridiculous back and forth switching that is inevitable being a realistic option. Windows Server 8 will be a great success, why? No Metro. Ultrabooks and Tablets will rock with Metro. Desktops, no. No IT Manager worth his salt will roll it out in any but the smallest.

If you're users use a lot of Office I would say they may deal with lots of files and will be switching back and forth quite a bit. If they barely do anything, it doesn't really matter what you put in front of them. A manufacturing company is probably full of manual laborer who outnumber knowledge workers so they probably don't use their desktops for much more than casual browsing, web apps, and light email. You could put Android Tablets in front of them and they'd probably be fine.

Can't wrap my head around why MS wouldn't give the user the choice to either enable or disable it, Auto Detect a touch screen on install and ask the question, the start screen is a bit of a mish mash when it comes to the desktop, can see why it would be good on a tablet just not a desktop..

Fubar said,
Can't wrap my head around why MS wouldn't give the user the choice to either enable or disable it, Auto Detect a touch screen on install and ask the question, the start screen is a bit of a mish mash when it comes to the desktop, can see why it would be good on a tablet just not a desktop..

+1

Fubar said,
Can't wrap my head around why MS wouldn't give the user the choice to either enable or disable it, Auto Detect a touch screen on install and ask the question, the start screen is a bit of a mish mash when it comes to the desktop, can see why it would be good on a tablet just not a desktop..

It is quite simple. If you let people disable the start screen then developers will ignore the start screen. Think about the ultra moble pcs or tablet pcs. For the most part developers ignored these because they were optional components. Making metro manditory ensure that developers will target metro as it will be on every windows device sold. Not only that it ties in other ecosystems (phone and xbox) and simplifies future development.

Fubar said,
Can't wrap my head around why MS wouldn't give the user the choice to either enable or disable it, A

Because they have said it all along that they now see Desktop as an 'app'. Tile interface is the "new " desktop.

Desktop is now an App for power-users. It's just like any other app. It would be almost like asking Apple to make one particular app, the home screen.

Fubar said,
Can't wrap my head around why MS wouldn't give the user the choice to either enable or disable it, Auto Detect a touch screen on install and ask the question, the start screen is a bit of a mish mash when it comes to the desktop, can see why it would be good on a tablet just not a desktop..

Big Brother Knows Best!!!!!

FMH said,
Because they have said it all along that they now see Desktop as an 'app'.

Here we have the fatal flaw of Windows 8's GUI design…

MFH said,

Here we have the fatal flaw of Windows 8's GUI design…

So, we have somebody with the initials MFH agreeing with somebody with the initials FMH.... coincidence much?

FMH said,

Because they have said it all along that they now see Desktop as an 'app'. Tile interface is the "new " desktop.

Desktop is now an App for power-users. It's just like any other app. It would be almost like asking Apple to make one particular app, the home screen.

they are just trying to push their failure of a GUI metro onto larger group of people, in hopes that they pathetic phone sames might increase

TCLN Ryster said,

So, we have somebody with the initials MFH agreeing with somebody with the initials FMH.... coincidence much?


rofl, no. I've actually complained in the forum quite some time ago as he ripped of my "name".

TCLN Ryster said,

So, we have somebody with the initials MFH agreeing with somebody with the initials FMH.... coincidence much?

Actually, he was disagreeing with me, to be
more accurate.

nekrosoft13 said,

they are just trying to push their failure of a GUI metro onto larger group of people, in hopes that they pathetic phone sames might increase

Timeout. Metro is not a failure and I expect Windows 8 Tablets and Ultrabooks to be Apple's worst nightmare. However, Metro is a FAIL on a desktop PC with a keyboard and mouse without a doubt.

And Windows Phone is superior to all others but is young and lacks some apps. It will continue to grow and is far from a failure.

They should've just 'added' the Metro Start Screen, keeping the Legacy desktop intact.
Regardless of that, I think we'll get used to it. I am liking it

Muhammad Farrukh said,
They should've just 'added' the Metro Start Screen, keeping the Legacy desktop intact.
Regardless of that, I think we'll get used to it. I am liking it

I think the lack of metro apps and games, along with the very poor quality default apps such as Mail and messages at the moment makes it seem very redundant. Not only that, but I'm pretty sure they've not actually used metro on a PC with a mouse so far because everything seems to be double the work, from switching programs on the task bar vs the metro app switch down the side to the scrolling up and down on the mouse wheel make the metro interface slide left and right... yeah feels very normal...

Still, I own a Windows phone and can see the ability that Metro can offer to the PC, or certainly the tablet, but the way they're currently going about it is a real pain. They need to make everyday tasks easier or as easy as using the start menu and classic desktop. At the moment even something as easy and simple as browsing my pictures is more hard work then a simple task in metro. Its certainly not, at least at the moment, what we've been promised of what metro will bring. Its more like a very poor 5 year old's walled garden software gone wrong.

Muhammad Farrukh said,
They should've just 'added' the Metro Start Screen, keeping the Legacy desktop intact.
Regardless of that, I think we'll get used to it. I am liking it

can you still put the search thingy on the taskbar??? you can search for programs that way.

remixedcat said,

can you still put the search thingy on the taskbar??? you can search for programs that way.

There is nothing missing here in Windows 8. Nothing.
But for some people, start menu works better. Thats why I said it

Muhammad Farrukh said,

There is nothing missing here in Windows 8. Nothing.
But for some people, start menu works better. Thats why I said it


Ok. How do you open the recent files of the programs which are not pinned to the taskbar, but to the start screen?

Mohitster said,

Ok. How do you open the recent files of the programs which are not pinned to the taskbar, but to the start screen?

That's up to the application developer, just like it is in Windows 7.

Luis Mazza said,
You may have liked it, but I bet that the 'average Joe' will HATE IT.

every single 'average joe' I showed it to, liked it.
XP user, ME user, Vista user, 7 user, OSX user, 98 user.

Muhammad Farrukh said,

There is nothing missing here in Windows 8. Nothing.
But for some people, start menu works better. Thats why I said it

Agree with You in 100%, some of us just need clear choice, if I want standard menu start i can get it without problem, if I want metro i can use it without problem, I will not spend money on Windows 8 if I will not get standard desktop with menu start, I like optimization overall in Win 8 but without menu start this isn't system for me....

Muhammad Farrukh said,

every single 'average joe' I showed it to, liked it.
XP user, ME user, Vista user, 7 user, OSX user, 98 user.

Everyone likes to see it, but to use it everyday is totally different.
----
ME user??? 98 user? OMG which year are your friends right now?

Muhammad Farrukh said,

every single 'average joe' I showed it to, liked it.
XP user, ME user, Vista user, 7 user, OSX user, 98 user.

i brouth my laptop to work yesterday, showed the windows 8 to maybe 100 people, not a single person said, hey this is great, i like it. few said it would be ok on tablet but on laptop or desktop not a single person liked it.

Muhammad Farrukh said,

There is nothing missing here in Windows 8. Nothing.
But for some people, start menu works better. Thats why I said it

thanks. this is good to know.

GreyWolf said,

That's up to the application developer, just like it is in Windows 7.

Dude, I was talking about opening recent files of the pinned programs of the start screen just like I can open the recent files of the programs pinned to the start menu from the start menu itself! Now, is this functionality present in the start screen today?

Mohitster said,

Dude, I was talking about opening recent files of the pinned programs of the start screen just like I can open the recent files of the programs pinned to the start menu from the start menu itself! Now, is this functionality present in the start screen today?

It actually goes beyond opening just recent files. It can actually provide shortcuts to all kinds of tasks.

For example, the entry for Steam in my start menu has a jumplist that is separated in 2 sections. The first section is recently played games which allows me to jump strait into TF2 without actually navigating through Steam. The second section is labelled tasks and allows gives me shortcuts directly to areas inside the app (like settings or community).

You're totally right that the Metro start menu doesn't offer anything like this. GreyWolf's comment about it being up to the devs is incorrect because the Metro start screen doesn't offer the ability to implement anything like this (unless we're all missing something) so it's impossible for the devs to recreate that functionality in Win 8.

Muhammad Farrukh said,

every single 'average joe' I showed it to, liked it.
XP user, ME user, Vista user, 7 user, OSX user, 98 user.


Showing it and actually using it are two different things completely. I suspect if the average Joe User actually tried to do something like Real Work, I'd give even odds that he'd get frustrated with the interface in a very short time.

Metro should never be allowed on the desktop of a PC system, and should be able to recognize when it's on a PC or notebook as opposed to a smart(hah!) phone or tablet. Leave the flashy stuff where it belongs, and give those of us who expect functionality with our OS what we want.