Windows Vista Ultimate Extras, Less than 3 days and counting

Microsoft has 2 & 1/2 days left until Summer ends and the first day of fall officially starts. and still no word on what or if anything is happening with Ultimate Extras. The Ultimate Extra blog still hasn't been updated since July 2nd when it said it intended to deliver DreamScene and the Language Packs by the end of summer.

"We intend to ship Windows DreamScene and the remaining 20 Language Packs by the end of the summer. We will not ship the last two Extras showcased in January (Windows DreamScene and the remaining 20 Language Packs) until they meet the high quality bar required by our enthusiastic customers—and we believe that we can achieve that bar by the end of this summer".
I don't know about you, but I am beginning to think they won't make it. It's a real shame that a huge corporation fails to keep its Software users up-to-date on whats going on with the development of the extras.

News source: In House

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I think you totally missed the point of my post. You couldn't have been more wrong. Why don't you calm down first mister fan boy and re read it

i didn't buy vista. i won't ever buy an OS because even if i did, i still don't "own" it. system files are locked, you cannot take ownership of them either. microsoft support says there won't be any workarounds in the future for it either. no true ownership of my own files, no reason to purchase it.

Chalk and cheese.

What does having write priviliges over system files have to do with "own"ing an OS. Nothing. Except they both use the word "own" but in slightly different contexts.

You claim system files are locked ownership with no workaround. I would like to consider myself a technical user (I've worked in tech support for quite a few years part-time including extensive work in programming and a fair bit of OS "hacking" etc) and so far I've come across no issues with Vista. Yes, you do need to take control of some system files that you may edit, ooooooooh, ONCE? and that 99% of users never should edit and should be actively protected against viral influences?!?!?

Just Google "system file ownership" (http://www.ocmodshop.com/ocmodshop.aspx?a=851 is the top result) and see if that helps.

Anyway, your post seems to imply you won't by an OS from Microsoft, because they still "own" your files -- at least, that's the only interpretation that would justify why you shouldn't by an OS, yet that isn't true because your computer OWNS your own files, right?!

Microsoft don't supply you with the Vista source code either, does that mean you don't "own" it too?

You claim you won't "ever" buy an OS. I find this hard to believe. Already Microsoft are making pirates lives very difficult. With Product Activation and now WGA, and who knows what more is to come, pirated copies of Windows are heavily disabled.

At the end of the day, I use Vista on both my main machines. It's as stable and rock solid as XP, yet I still have many grievances with it... Mainly the fact that there doesn't APPEAR to be much difference between it and XP and you kind of have to wonder what Microsoft had been tinkering with for those 5+ years.

If you're going to knock Vista, have a good reason -- and don't make sweeping statements like you'll never buy an OS!

I don't generally comment on Neowin stories, but I feel I have to inject my $0.02 here.

I purchased Vista Ultimate not for the extras, but for the ability to have Media Center functionality, along with IIS and RDP capabilities. I could care less about the extras, and in fact knew nothing about them until after installation.

For me vista solved my crashes! I used to get BSOD when using my tv card..updated drivers in xp. Now in vista works well. Havent ever had a program crash. I ve had the odd app not responding but vista seems to be able to fix this better than xp did. im happy. Installed it on my gfs pc, shes happy. I know people who are also happy. People just like to moan about MS i guess..

This is why I didnt get ultimate. At work I have business and on my desktop and laptop I have home premium. Dreamscene is not good enough to get me to upgrade to ultimate.

Server 2008 project is what im sure is holding this up. All to be released about and around the same time are:

Windows 2008
Vista SP1 (based off 2008 Server)
DirectX 10.1
Visual Studio 2008
SQL 2008

Im sure all those teams = alot of people

People sit counting the days for a software release? And a software release that is largely insignificant in the grand scheme of things. Now I know the world has gone barking mad.

I think a large portion of the people that are unhappy with Vista are the non-tech-savvy ones that bought a computer with it pre-installed.

I've noticed alot of the PC OEMs have no clue when it comes to setting up a PC with Vista on it. For instance, a friend of mine bought a Toshiba laptop with Vista on it recently, and that thing CRAWLED. I spent a few hours cleaning out the crap software that Toshiba had installed, and put all the drivers on (Toshiba didn't even bother to install decent drivers for half the hardware), and after I was done, it ran fine.

After experiencing that I can see why people would say they don't like Vista - even though it wasn't the OSes fault at all...

As for my own experience, I've been running Vista dual-boot since last December. At first it was horrible thanks to the lack of driver support for my RAID controller and GPU. It was terribly slow and unstable for anything besides web browsing, but now that software's been updated and the drivers are pretty much complete, it runs very smoothly now. So smoothly, in fact, that last weekend I wiped out my XP install and now I'm running Vista x64 exclusively - and I've not had a single problem since (well, getting the network drivers for my 5 year old printer installed was a bit of a hassle, but I got it eventually).

Rubbish. In my experience, the tech savvy people are hating it, while the donkeys who've purchased a new computer with it on, can't get enough of the thing, and won't admit how bad it is, probably because they've spent upwards of £500 on a new machine.

zoonyx said,
Rubbish. In my experience, the tech savvy people are hating it, while the donkeys who've purchased a new computer with it on, can't get enough of the thing, and won't admit how bad it is, probably because they've spent upwards of £500 on a new machine.

Funny that I've been having debates with people who think they're "tech savvy" but end up trashing Vista over exaggerated/untrue/FUD points. Maybe if more people actually gave it a chance they would have an opinion on it.

Rupert said,

Funny that I've been having debates with people who think they're "tech savvy" but end up trashing Vista over exaggerated/untrue/FUD points. Maybe if more people actually gave it a chance they would have an opinion on it.

+1

I consider myself a very knowledgeable about computers and I work as a PC Technician. I much prefer Vista to XP after getting used to it since Beta 1. I think the majority of issues people have is because they are not giving it a fair chance and expect it to work the exact same way as XP. If you want an operating system the same as XP, then use XP. Don't expect Vista to be a clone of XP.

Rupert said,
Funny that I've been having debates with people who think they're "tech savvy" but end up trashing Vista over exaggerated/untrue/FUD points.


There are a few people like that floating around the Neowin forums. They usually refer to themselves as "Pro" or "Power" users.

You are absolutely right. I am a network tech and on all my computers at home and my computer on my desk at work I am running vista. I get no problems on vista what so ever.

jmc777 said,


There are a few people like that floating around the Neowin forums. They usually refer to themselves as "Pro" or "Power" users.

it makes their E-PENIS BIGGER

Dreamscene is only a gadget for people who like all the bells and whistles, I don't care for it at all - useless resources hog. Looks preety for max half an hour.
I agree with others saying language packs should be free for any Vista, and I STILL wait for my language pack, which wasn't on the updates and hasn't been released yet.

I disagree with people complaining about Vista unstability or programs crashing, or many people unsatisfied with it (Hurmoth), as I've read posts from Poof and GreyWolfSC - I join gladly the pack of satisfied (well with stability and responsiviness NOT with the Ultimate Extras) customers !
My Vista is ROCK SOLID and FAST, running 24/day, uptimes range from 5~20-30 days (because I do update my ATI drivers). The drivers are (now) great (excluding CRAPPY CREATIVE, but I use KX Drivers anyway). ATI and NVIDIA is improving them fast and are now nearly perfect, no differences for me (or it's hardly noticable 1-5 fps difference) on the performance in-game.

I have been using Ultimate since VERY early in beta. I rarely have crashes in anything since the RC2.

As to the extras - meh, not that big a deal since my copy was free from my MSDN Universal subscription.

Wasn't the Hold 'Em game an "extra?" Love that game - more fun when you customize your virtual opponents!

I bet a lot of customers bought Ultimate for the same reason. In all honesty, what else is there in Ultimate that isn't in Home Premium besides the Extras?

EduardValencia said,
Bitlocker
What is a home consumer going to need to use BitLocker for? That's more of a corporate thing, not a home consumer thing.

Hurmoth said,
What is a home consumer going to need to use BitLocker for? That's more of a corporate thing, not a home consumer thing.

The whole point of Ultimate is it's Enterprise + Home Premium. If you're not going to use the Enterprise features, get Home Premium!

Money wasted? They're called Extras because they're a bonus. They were never factored into the cost of Ultimate, and I feel sorry for you if you got Ultimate solely to get the Extras. I got Ultimate so I could have all the features available (and I got it cheap through accommodations, but still).

Although they are definitely not keeping up with what they said they would, it's your own damn fault if you bought Ultimate just for the Extras. They were never supposed to be a sole selling point for Ultimate, just a nice bonus for paying for the top version.

I got my copy of Ultimate for free (legally for attending the UK launch), and I'm still ****ed off at this. Then again I shouldn't be, since the steaming crock of absolute **** isn't installed anyway.

XPMCE with domain hack is the perfect OS for me right now.

The only Ultimate extra Microsoft can offer it's Ultimate customers is a free update to it's next OS.

Poor Microsoft, the richest man on the planet can't put money into his own promises.

People paid for these "promises" on top of it all. Just pathetic Microsoft. But then again, they are experts at stealing from us.

Wow - shocking! Microsoft seems all talk. Vista sucks. I've switched back to XP 64-Bit and I'm very happy with it and with my iMac. XP will most likely be the last OS I buy from Microsoft unless they start making products that people will actually use. All I hear from users is how bad Vista sucks (from the UAC to how bad it crashes because applications, even ones designed for Vista crash on a regular basis).

All you hear from users is how bad Vista sucks? I can say the same about 64bit, or I can say the same about XP before SP2 came out. Don't even get me started about iMacs. Many more are satisfied with the OS as it is than those who aren't. Those who are happy with Vista, however, don't go about pronouncing their satisfaction.

Hurmoth said,
All I hear from users is how bad Vista sucks (from the UAC to how bad it crashes because applications, even ones designed for Vista crash on a regular basis).

I'm not sure where you're getting this information. In checking my "Reliability Monitor" I don't see any of these issues where applications are crashing all the time.

The only 'crashes' I'm receiving on Vista x64 is the Beta TF2 client crashing. Otherwise, over the last month it's been the beta Trillian client that's crashing...

Otherwise, the only 'issue' I've found with Vista is that games don't usually have the same FPS as with other versions of Windows. However, with every release of my NVidia graphics driver... It only seems to get better.

The place I work for, we have several customers who have Vista on their boxes and they have all complained (that's about 10 different people there) and then there's my friends/family who have it and hate it. I know about 50 people total who have it and absolutely hate it, including me. I'm getting my information from people who use it, maybe you're not having problems, but plenty of people are. Normal every day users that I talk to, who aren't into computers don't like it.

Hurmoth said,
The place I work for, we have several customers who have Vista on their boxes and they have all complained (that's about 10 different people there) and then there's my friends/family who have it and hate it. I know about 50 people total who have it and absolutely hate it, including me. I'm getting my information from people who use it, maybe you're not having problems, but plenty of people are. Normal every day users that I talk to, who aren't into computers don't like it.

I'd love to talk to your contacts that hate Vista and have many problems with it. Out of the 100 or so people I've talked to personally about it, only 1 was unhappy, and he was using a bootleg copy, so I didn't care what he thought.

Just throwing this out there; Ever considered it being one of your non-updated or non-vista compatible programs you've installed? Malware that's piled up over the years perhaps?

Interesting. As someone mentioned the fps in games is lower. Except for that Vista works flawlessly here (x64). Never had a program crash.

Tikitiki said,
Just throwing this out there; Ever considered it being one of your non-updated or non-vista compatible programs you've installed? Malware that's piled up over the years perhaps?
Vista has been out for years? Wow, I thought it just came out this year.

And yes, I've thought that it could be one of the apps that I've installed (or my friends, family, co-workers). But even on a fresh install, I still have apps like WMP crash out of no where. I'm pretty sure Microsoft makes WMP, don't they?

Hurmoth said,
Vista has been out for years? Wow, I thought it just came out this year.

And yes, I've thought that it could be one of the apps that I've installed (or my friends, family, co-workers). But even on a fresh install, I still have apps like WMP crash out of no where. I'm pretty sure Microsoft makes WMP, don't they?

And what were you doing when it crashed? There's always an explanation

Tikitiki said,
And what were you doing when it crashed? There's always an explanation
I had just logged in from a fresh install. So tell me how that makes sense?

stay with windows XP pro and you have the best version

im a vista ultimate user and i do not expect anything that a full of lies and broken promises for ultimate extras. Besides nothing interesting here in those extras anyways

and we believe that we can achieve that bar by the end of this summer
The key word here is "believe". It never was a promess and beside, no official date mean "when it's done".

What a way to crap on Microsoft for no reason. Where unprofessional journalism looks better,... Well not always!

Pip'

Just because they never promised one extra would move from Beta to Final, doesn't mean they are totally blameless... I mean where are all the other "frequent" extras they led us to believe would be a key selling point of Ultimate?

Face it, Microsoft screwed it's customers.

If they aren't sure they can deliver anything at all by that rough date, they shouldn't go off spouting it in blogs. That'll just end up confusing and annoying their customers, and accounts for poor PR.

Ultimate Extras was just another bullet point for Vista Ultimate. Fortunately I got my copy for $50 bux so I don't feel like i'm missing out on anything. If I had paid full price and that bullet point was a selling feature for me, I'd likely be upset that they haven't delivered anything on it (or even seem to be bothering to try)

I'm not sure why you feel inclined to say "just" another bullet point. When Microsoft has a product comparison sheet and you compare bullet points, any of them could be a quite important factor. If I need a Remote Desktop server, I can't just use Home Premium, but need Business. That's not "just" a bullet point to me, but an important distinction. Just like the Ultimate Extras was an important, unique, distinction for Ultimate beyond its merge of editions.

Raa said,
Source?
Microsoft employee's get a nice discount.

Jugalator said,
I'm not sure why you feel inclined to say "just" another bullet point. When Microsoft has a product comparison sheet and you compare bullet points, any of them could be a quite important factor. If I need a Remote Desktop server, I can't just use Home Premium, but need Business. That's not "just" a bullet point to me, but an important distinction. Just like the Ultimate Extras was an important, unique, distinction for Ultimate beyond its merge of editions.
Yea, I said that if it was a selling feature to me, I'd be upset too.

I don't know about you, but I am beginning to think they won't make its a real shame that a huge corporation fails to keep its Software users up-to-date on whats going on with the development of the extras.

Should read:

I don't know about you, but I am beginning to think they won't make it. It's a real shame that a huge corporation fails to keep its software users up-to-date on what's going on with the development of the extras.

I'm really glad I just went for Premium now as those extras should have been finished and new ones added by now. Pitty Stardock can't release a Deskscapes for those without Ultimate (officaly). I wouldnt mind paying a one off small fee for animated wallpaper.

Why can't they? Isn't it their product to decide what to do with? Or does it require Dreamscene to already be installed and doesn't provide an own implementation?

I am one of the 1% that paid extra for these "extras"

Language pack????????? wtf???

I really regret buying Ultimate now as I could of quite easily just got Premium

I wonder if we are ever going to see more ultimate extras. Won't surprise me one bit if we don't. It's a shame, really.

Lexcyn said,
I wonder if we are ever going to see more ultimate extras. Won't surprise me one bit if we don't. It's a shame, really.


Well SP1 is due out in early 2008
I suppose MS will call that a xtra :mad:

I got Ultimate because I fancied Remote Desktop functions as well as full media functions. Video desktops are nice but that's it.

Language packs should not be ultimate extras, but essential upgrades to the countries needed, and free additions to other countries (eg if you were a French speaking citizen in Russia for example, and wanted Vista in French)

I wonder how many people bought Vista Ultimate because of those "Extras".... My guess is 1% ?

It may be false advertising on MS part if they don't offer anything new during the life of Vista.

I wonder how many people bought Vista Ultimate because of those "Extras".... My guess is 1% ?

My guess is that at least 63% of all statistics is made up on the spot when they aren't backed by facts.

Yes, it could be 1%, but maybe just as likely 15.32% or 26.71% that saw it as a contributing factor when deciding between the editions instead of just going Business or Home Premium, and then it suddenly becomes much more of a problem here.

totally pathetic if u ask me.... they should be hung out and quatered for this kind of blatent marketing F-up.. but whatever.... as long as ppl never hold them accountable.. nothing will be done eh :sleeping:

raskren said,
Are you kidding me?

Kidding about what? You think it's alright for corporations to make blatantly false statements and then just slide off as if nothing is wrong? They basically lied to everyone who bought the Ultimate edition expecting to receive "cutting-edge programs", "innovative services" and "unique publications"? How much of that has turned out to be completely false lies?

stgeorge said,

Kidding about what? You think it's alright for corporations to make blatantly false statements and then just slide off as if nothing is wrong? They basically lied to everyone who bought the Ultimate edition expecting to receive "cutting-edge programs", "innovative services" and "unique publications"? How much of that has turned out to be completely false lies?

Dreamscene and language packs are cutting edge and innovative and worthy of making a fuss?

Methinks somebody's MS-bashing just to be on the bandwagon.

As I've said before, anyone who's bought Ultimate just because of the extras is an idiot. I still stand by that assertion today. Exactly what type of "cutting edge programs" did you expect?

_dandy_ said,
As I've said before, anyone who's bought Ultimate just because of the extras is an idiot. I still stand by that assertion today. Exactly what type of "cutting edge programs" did you expect?

So anybody that bought Vista Ultimate for one of the main advertised features is an idiot? I'm sorry but that is just ridiculous. Microsoft deceived users and people are rightly annoyed. Heck, they release Powertoys for XP and yet they've barely done any better for Ultimate Extra despite hyping it up.

_dandy_ said,

Dreamscene and language packs are cutting edge and innovative and worthy of making a fuss?

Methinks somebody's MS-bashing just to be on the bandwagon.

As I've said before, anyone who's bought Ultimate just because of the extras is an idiot. I still stand by that assertion today. Exactly what type of "cutting edge programs" did you expect?

If you didn't notice, I pulled those terms off the Vista marketing materials. I think people expected Microsoft to keep their commitments. I think anyone who lets companies lie and cheat them are weak pushovers. You are always in control in a company/customer relationship, don't let Microsoft dictate the terms. They should be fined for their deceptive marketing practices (to the tune of a few billion dollars) and only then will they begin to realize that their crooked ways are not acceptable.

You both failed to answer my question.

Remember the Plus pack for 95? For XP? I never for one second deluded myself believing those Ultimate "extras" would turn out be anything more than that pointless crap. The announcement of DreamScene way back when only served to confirmed that.

So I'm gonna ask my question again: Exactly what type of "cutting edge programs" did you expect this time around? Y'know, some *must have* feature that won't work on or won't be backported to any other Vista version?

Seriously...do I have to spell it out? If it's a "must have" feature that's actually useful and nobody can live without it and it makes everybody's job easier, there's no way it's gonna be an exclusive. No way. From the get-go, those Extras could only possibly turn out to be fluff.

> I pulled those terms off the Vista marketing materials

So you've been had. Sounds like that was pretty easy.

> I think anyone who lets companies lie and cheat them are weak pushovers

...and I think you need to understand how marketing works. This is nothing new--for Microsoft, or anybody else. Don't confuse marketing material and press releases with binding legal agreements. No offense, but I'll take a guess--you're still in high school, with a twinkle in your eye and ready to change the world for the better, right?

That and the fact that they have been "hacked" to run on the non-Ultimate flavors makes the Ultimate Extras seem less worth their salt.

Powertoys were created by Microsoft by employees in their free time.
It was never really throughly tested or an officially supported product.

After the big security push Microsoft no longer distributes unofficial employee created products on its website.
So Powertoys are dead.