Lulzsec: "It's The Beginning Of The End For Sony"

[optimax]

. Stop fretting so much.

But if he doesn't, who will?? :p

[rajputwarrior]

Sony's Laywers said this

http://www.qj.net/ps3/news/geohot-flees-to-south-america-psn-account-proved.html

You know, they're knee deep in a court case, why on earth would the Sony lawyers not bring up the fact Geohot is going away in the middle of it with outstanding evidence needing handed over?

Hardly some sort of song and dance about escaping the country and using up donations. That you have to thank the internet journalists for. I think people have done far too much headline reading, then taken those headlines to bed at night and dreamt up all these awful unfair weep worthy scenarios dear George must of gone through, and woke up ready to give the finger to the man in the morning.

this was completely debunked by his lawyer proving that he had permission to leave the coutry from the judge as it was planned before the case even started and was completely available to anyone seeking contact with him.

It was reported yesterday that George Hotz "fled" the country in order to escape... a civil case? Sony claimed that the infamous hacker had sabotaged evidence in the case and was using his location outside the US as an excuse to not comply with the court's orders. Ars caught up with Stewart Kellar, one of Hotz' lawyers, who rejected both accusations. Hotz is in South America on a trip he had planned before the lawsuit was filed, and Sony has been given all the components it needs to access his hard drive.

Kellar told Ars that it's impossible to take a vacation from a lawsuit, and Hotz has been in constant contact with his legal team. "The notion that George has fled the country is absurd. George is in South America to see a friend, on a trip he planned before this lawsuit ever began. George has had to make himself available 24/7 for this litigation, which has been quite demanding on him."

Kellar also squashed the idea that Hotz is using donated money to travel. "It should be noted that the donation money George has received is being used exclusively for his legal defense," Kellar explained. "If there are any funds left after the lawsuit, George is planning to donate the money to the EFF."

So did Hotz sabotage any evidence? Kellar says that assessment is way off-base, pointing to the lack of detail in Sony's filing. "SCEA's lawyers are using intentionally ambiguous language so that the public, and the Court, might assume the worst. The 'components' SCEA is talking about are hard drives' controller cards. The neutral [third party examining the drives] subsequently had to explain to SCEA the form and function of hard drive controller cards," Kellar told Ars. "It is a stock part that can be purchased at any electronics hardware store. Those controller cards have since been provided to the neutral so the point is moot."

Hotz himself seems to have been following the coverage, and has released a statement on his website talking about the charges.

Factually, it's true I'm in South America, on a vacation I've had planned and paid for since November. I mean, it is spring break; hacking isn't my life. Rest assured that not a dime of legal defense money would ever go toward something like this. And of course Townsend loves the idea of painting me as an international fugitive. I have been in contact with my lawyers almost every day; I would not let the case suffer. That said, I also won't let this ridiculous lawsuit run my life either. Then the fearmongerers win.

He notes that he will be returning to the United States, since he hears "it's hard to come by the Xperia Play down here."

So Hotz will be back, and this strange and oddly entertaining case will continue. Kellar points out that while this isn't a fight they picked, it's one Hotz and the legal team are more than happy to fight. "You have to remember that Mr. Hotz didn't choose to fight this battle, but now that he has been sued, he has put his heart into fighting this case that has enormous implications for consumers world-wide," Kellar said. "The question of whether a consumer truly 'owns' that system he or she purchased from the store is prevalent in all of this."

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2011/03/fleeing-sabotaged-hard-drives-hotzs-lawyer-responds-to-sony.ars]

sony saying all of that without looking into it was a bit of a stupid move.

[Growled Member]

im not saying that justifies it, it absolutely doesn't. but every action has a reaction, legal or not. what i am saying is people didn't like the way they went after hotz and that seemed to make a lot of smart people out there angry.

I agree. They did the right thing but did it in such a way that upset a lot of people.

[Vice]

Requesting a list of everyone who visited Hotz Blog, Twitter Feed and Youtube channel (IP and Names if the companies had them) was probably the part that broke the camels back and got people the most ****ed off. Sony didn't just sue him or raise an injunction against the release of the code they wanted to know everyone who had even come in to contact with Hotz or any of the sites he posted stuff to. It was like a shotgun approach to micro-surgery.

Sony brought this all on themselves with the way they tried to stop the propagation of their intellectual property. Not only was their litigation completely hopeless and was never ever going to work (see Streisand effect) but they managed to commit PR suicide in the process and ultimately raise the brow of bottom dwellers in basements all around the world who like nothing more than the lulz for taking on a large corporation.

If PS3 gamers are ****ed at anyone it should be Sony they could have prevented all this by keeping their lawyers on a leash. I think in some ways they wanted to make an example out of Geohot. That sure worked out well.

[Subject Delta]

Requesting a list of everyone who visited Hotz Blog, Twitter Feed and Youtube channel (IP and Names if the companies had them) was probably the part that broke the camels back and got people the most ****ed off. Sony didn't just sue him or raise an injunction against the release of the code they wanted to know everyone who had even come in to contact with Hotz or any of the sites he posted stuff to. It was like a shotgun approach to micro-surgery.

Sony brought this all on themselves with the way they tried to stop the propagation of their intellectual property. Not only was their litigation completely hopeless and was never ever going to work (see Streisand effect) but they managed to commit PR suicide in the process and ultimately raise the brow of bottom dwellers in basements all around the world who like nothing more than the lulz for taking on a large corporation.

If PS3 gamers are ****ed at anyone it should be Sony they could have prevented all this by keeping their lawyers on a leash. I think in some ways they wanted to make an example out of Geohot. That sure worked out well.

A better voiced version of what I have been trying to say all along, thank you.

[trag3dy]

Yeah, how dare Sony try to protect it's billion dollars investment(s)!!

[LOC Veteran]

I can't wait to see 10's if not 100's of people go to prison for boring the hell out of me with this overblown Sony bullsh**.

Seriously... This is getting old. If people would stop talking about it and giving them recognition, they would stop...

As a friend of mine said tonight, I hope they all go to a "federal pound you in the ass" prison.

[Subject Delta]

Yeah, how dare Sony try to protect it's billion dollars investment(s)!!

How was demanding the IP addresses of viewers to Geohot's page and YouTube channel protecting their investments exactly?

As a friend of mine said tonight, I hope they all go to a "federal pound you in the ass" prison.

I find it funny that people can advocate this kind of brutality and still act as if they have the moral high ground.

[Vice]

Yeah, how dare Sony try to protect it's billion dollars investment(s)!!

Considering that their version of protection would never have actually protected their IP but instead opened them up to a much greater fiscal risk (having PSN down, giving players PSN+, Games, Identify Theft Services) do you think it was a smart idea or a very poor one to do what they did?

Just to recap, their actions gained them nothing at all. It did not cease the IP from being propagated and it opened them up to yet more fiscal liability.

[Subject Delta]

Considering that their version of protection would never have actually protected their IP but instead opened them up to a much greater fiscal risk (having PSN down, giving players PSN+, Games, Identify Theft Services) do you think it was a smart idea or a very poor one to do what they did?

Just to recap, their actions gained them nothing at all. It did not cease the IP from being propagated and it opened them up to yet more fiscal liability.

Precisely. As long as anonymous torrent sites like The Pirate Bay exist, preventing distribution of custom firmware was always likely to be next to impossible. Forcing hackers underground is actually stupid in itself.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

How was demanding the IP addresses of viewers to Geohot's page and YouTube channel protecting their investments exactly?

To see where they could trial Geohot.

I think you'll find it was a request also, not a demand, but keep using such terminology to make it sound like Sony stepped out of bounds of what is allowed, where we know they didn't. If they request something and legally get it, maybe your rage should be directed at how law works within your country.

The ironic thing is, no doubt half of the world upset about this IP address business download torrents and a whole load of other public internet interactions that display your IP address freely. But of course, an evil company legally obtaining addresses through court, in order to carry out a specific task that was greenlight is of course clearly going to end up worse off for you.

For people with such concerns over the legal obtaining of IP addresses, it seems your rage is not directed enough at those lovely hackers who took information far more delicate than your IP address. An IP address is pretty much useless towards anything of tangible concern.

[Subject Delta]

To see where they could trial Geohot.

I think you'll find it was a request also, not a demand, but keep using such terminology to make it sound like Sony stepped out of bounds of what is allowed, where we know they didn't. If they request something and legally get it, maybe your rage should be directed at how law works within your country.

The ironic thing is, no doubt half of the world upset about this IP address business download torrents and a whole load of other public internet interactions that display your IP address freely. But of course, an evil company legally obtaining addresses through court, in order to carry out a specific task that was greenlight is of course clearly going to end up worse off for you.

For people with such concerns over the legal obtaining of IP addresses, it seems your rage is not directed enough at those lovely hackers who took information far more delicate than your IP address. An IP address is pretty much useless towards anything of tangible concern.

Don't make me laugh, there wouldn't even be any concrete evidence that the people visiting those pages even used Geohot's hacks, I visited his blog and I don't even own a PS3, Sony had no legal need to ask for people's IP addresses.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Don't make me laugh, there wouldn't even be any concrete evidence that the people visiting those pages even used Geohot's hacks, I visited his blog and I don't even own a PS3, Sony had no legal need to ask for people's IP addresses.

For you sadly the court who granted access thought differently from you and that's all that matters (they are the law), not your morality on the matter.

[Vice]

Don't make me laugh, there wouldn't even be any concrete evidence that the people visiting those pages even used Geohot's hacks, I visited his blog and I don't even own a PS3, Sony had no legal need to ask for people's IP addresses.

Agreed. I also visited his pages. I do own a PS3 but I didn't visit his site for hacks I visited them because it was news that I was interested in. Same reason I visited his site when he was making headway with the iPhone hacks and posted about how Microsoft had got in to contact with him about Windows Phone 7. News is news, readers shouldn't be penalised for what they read this isn't 1984.

For you sadly the court who granted access thought differently from you and that's all that matters (they are the law), not your morality on the matter.

Does that make it right? Laws are changed all the time and with good reason. Don't just regurgitate the law as if that makes what they did okay. We as people can have a difference of opinion about what happened and why. And although me and Subject Delta had nothing to do with the attacks we are allowed to express our opinion on an opinion driven forum. mmkay?

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Agreed. I also visited his pages. I do own a PS3 but I didn't visit his site for hacks I visited them because it was news that I was interested in. Same reason I visited his site when he was making headway with the iPhone hacks and posted about how Microsoft had got in to contact with him about Windows Phone 7. News is news, readers shouldn't be penalised for what they read this isn't 1984.

Does that make it right? Laws are changed all the time and with good reason. Don't just regurgitate the law as if that makes what they did okay. We as people can have a difference of opinion about what happened and why. And although me and Subject Delta had nothing to do with the attacks we are allowed to express our opinion on an opinion driven forum. mmkay?

Unfortunately for you, what the law dictates is the closet you can get to a right or wrong conclusion in an argument. Personal feelings and opinions don't really take you anywhere other than a discussion, and this whole topic is far more weighted than simple discussions on forums due to what we're discussing (real life, real people, real rules, real law, etc).

I, and many others, would probably like to ask you how exactly do you feel penalised? What has changed for you since Sony potentially looked at your IP address in a court of law? You do understand your IP address is all over the internet right now, and there's even a chance I even know it (merely from seeing it somewhere).

[Subject Delta]

For you sadly the court who granted access thought differently from you and that's all that matters (they are the law), not your morality on the matter.

Being legally correct doesn't mean that they are making the right decision, I'd eat my own clothing if Sony got anything usable whatsoever from those IP addresses, all they would offer is a rough idea of what countries people tend to be visiting his site from, they would in no way prove anything with regards to use or distribution of his hacks, and your aggressive flailing tells me that you damn well know it.

Agreed. I also visited his pages. I do own a PS3 but I didn't visit his site for hacks I visited them because it was news that I was interested in. Same reason I visited his site when he was making headway with the iPhone hacks and posted about how Microsoft had got in to contact with him about Windows Phone 7. News is news, readers shouldn't be penalised for what they read this isn't 1984.

Likewise, that was all I was interested in

Does that make it right? Laws are changed all the time and with good reason. Don't just regurgitate the law as if that makes what they did okay. We as people can have a difference of opinion about what happened and why. And me and Subject Delta had nothing to do with the attacks we are just expressing our opinion on an opinion driven forum. mmkay?

Given Audioboxer's history, if Sony's CEO molested a child, I think he'd find a way to twist it. I doubt he's likely to offer anything reasonable on this subject. Sony are right, everyone else is wrong and if you don't like it you can f*** off in his eyes

[trag3dy]

Precisely. As long as anonymous torrent sites like The Pirate Bay exist, preventing distribution of custom firmware was always likely to be next to impossible. Forcing hackers underground is actually stupid in itself.

So taking justice into their own hands instead of doing things legally is okay now? No matter how you feel about how Sony handled things what these people did and are planning to do is still illegal. There can be no excuse for supporting them.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Given Audioboxer's history, if Sony's CEO molested a child, I think he'd find a way to twist it. I doubt he's likely to offer anything reasonable on this subject. Sony are right, everyone else is wrong and if you don't like it you can f*** off in his eyes

This kind of idiocy coming from your mouth only helps me and anyone else in this topic create an image of how immature you must be to say such a statement. Why would any "normal" person be thinking of child molestation? Not in any way does this sentence make me look bad, essentially what you're clearly trying to do, it only makes you sound very silly.

[iamawesomewicked]

Being legally correct doesn't mean that they are making the right decision, I'd eat my own clothing if Sony got anything usable whatsoever from those IP addresses, all they would offer is a rough idea of what countries people tend to be visiting his site from, they would in no way prove anything with regards to use or distribution of his hacks, and your aggressive flailing tells me that you damn well know it.

Likewise, that was all I was interested in

Given Audioboxer's history, if Sony's CEO molested a child, I think he'd find a way to twist it. I doubt he's likely to offer anything reasonable on this subject. Sony are right, everyone else is wrong and if you don't like it you can f*** off in his eyes

So now you're comparing what Sony has done so far to protect themselves... with molesting a child... are you ****ing insane? Or were you dropped on your head as a child?

[Subject Delta]

So taking justice into their own hands instead of doing things legally is okay now? No matter how you feel about how Sony handled things what these people did and are planning to do is still illegal. There can be no excuse for supporting them.

Saying that I feel Sony share a portion of the blame is not the same as saying that I agree with the hackers.

This kind of idiocy coming from your mouth only helps me and anyone else in this topic create an image of how immature you must be to say such a statement. Not in any way does this sentence make me look bad, essentially what you're clearly trying to do.

I'm not trying to make you look bad, the statement I made was 100% accurate and that's why you don't like it.

So now you're comparing what Sony has done so far to protect themselves... with molesting a child... are you ****ing insane? Or were you dropped on your head as a child?

No, I was actually making a point about just how much of a Sony apologist Audioboxer is. I'd suggest you read my posts properly before blowing out a load of hot air.

[trag3dy]

Saying that I feel Sony share a portion of the blame is not the same as saying that I agree with the hackers.

I'm not trying to make you look bad, the statement I made was 100% accurate and that's why you don't like it.

No, I was actually making a point about just how much of a Sony apologist Audioboxer is. I'd suggest you read my posts properly before blowing out a load of hot air.

Well I suppose I shouldn't have quoted you specifically, but others are saying Sony deserves what they are getting from these hackers.

[AltecXP]

I can't wait to see 10's if not 100's of people go to prison for boring the hell out of me with this overblown Sony bullsh**.

Seriously... This is getting old. If people would stop talking about it and giving them recognition, they would stop...

Why would we want this to stop? For all I care Sony can go out of business. I hope they start doing it MORE.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Saying that I feel Sony share a portion of the blame is not the same as saying that I agree with the hackers.

I'm not trying to make you look bad, the statement I made was 100% accurate and that's why you don't like it.

No, I was actually making a point about just how much of a Sony apologist Audioboxer is. I'd suggest you read my posts properly before blowing out a load of hot air.

The thing is Subject Delta, it doesn't really matter how much anyone thinks anyone else is an apologist for anyone/anything, bringing child molestation into this topic has not done you any favours. You simply don't try to make a point with such a ridiculous base for your argument and while this will make you happy for the wrong reason, I simply won't be talking to you any more after putting my name in your twisted comparison.

[Growled Member]

Well I suppose I shouldn't have quoted you specifically, but others are saying Sony deserves what they are getting from these hackers.

No, Sony isn't getting what they deserve. No one deserves to be hacked. And yet, their actions did bring this on, deserved or not. I honestly don't care much for Sony the company, just like I don't care for Microsoft the company. Both of them make excellent products, though.

[Amarok]

Lol @ thinking that they'll "end" Sony, that's cute.