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Thinking of buying Canon EOS 7D - need advice!

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Green_Eye    49

As an aspiring, amateur movie maker I am looking to buy my first DSLR Camera( Canon EOS 7D ) and really need help in making the right choice, I just need something with good functionality in relation to price also in regards to the camera itself it would be very important for me to find a camera that films well in low light conditions/night. I have had a look around and found this offer on eBay - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Canon-EOS-7D-Body-kit-EF-S-18-135mm-Free-UV-Filter-/160653237710?pt=UK_CamerasPhoto_DigitalCameras_DigitalCameras_JN&hash=item2567adddce

I have seen some test footage with the 7D and overall it seems to cover everything I need at a price that seems reasonable to me, however I would like to know if theres maybe a better camera out there at a better price or if anyone has had any experience with the camera and would like to go over some pro's and cons any help would be appreciated and if you have any questions ask away!

Thanks in advance!

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crazzy88ss    65

When buying something like this, don't focus on just the camera. Look at the SYSTEM you're buying into. Does the system have the right lenses, lights, microphones, accessories, etc that you need to accomplish your goals.

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Vice    1,593

To echo crazzy88's statements really look at the ecosystem. The lens mount especially as they can get expensive fast but if it's compatible with a mount that has been around a long time you can save some money by buying them used.

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Green_Eye    49

When buying something like this, don't focus on just the camera. Look at the SYSTEM you're buying into. Does the system have the right lenses, lights, microphones, accessories, etc that you need to accomplish your goals.

To echo crazzy88's statements really look at the ecosystem. The lens mount especially as they can get expensive fast but if it's compatible with a mount that has been around a long time you can save some money by buying them used.

You are both absolutely right however I am pretty much a complete newbie to all this so I was hoping you guys could help me understand what I need to get started, I think whats there (in the ebay link) is enough for me to get started but I do not know much about Canon cameras and lenses.

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crazzy88ss    65

I guess more info would be helpful.

You want to be able to shoot in low light.. anything else? What focal lengths will you need? Any lighting? etc

Regarding that ebay link... the kit lens is crap. I guess it might be OK for video, but if you want to do low light, you really need better lenses that have larger apertures (in increasing size/cost: F2.8, F2.0, F1.8, F1.4 and F1.2).

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Green_Eye    49

I guess more info would be helpful.

You want to be able to shoot in low light.. anything else? What focal lengths will you need? Any lighting? etc

Regarding that ebay link... the kit lens is crap. I guess it might be OK for video, but if you want to do low light, you really need better lenses that have larger apertures (in increasing size/cost: F2.8, F2.0, F1.8, F1.4 and F1.2).

Basically I have about 2 college years of Film Studies under my belt but all we had is some very basic Video Cameras to work with and this is my first DSLR Camera I have a lot to learn about the camera and photography and I guess I am asking if this is the right camera and lens kit for a begginer? Is this jumping in the deep end or is this something I can work with? I am looking to be doing mostly short films, music videos and a lot of just shooting for the hell of it. It would be very important for me to have the ability to shoot in low light conditions as a lot of my movie ideas are based on scenes that will have to be shot at night. Are certain lenses better for night time shooting or are they all roughly the same?

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crazzy88ss    65

I think 7D will be fine. Pick up a 50mm f1.8 or f1.4 lens, though. The F1.8 is like $80, so you can't go wrong w/ it. This will get more light into your camera for the low light scenes you need to do.

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HawkMan    5,232

Have you considered if a dslr is really the correct tool for the job as opposed to a high end/semi pro hd camera ?

If you're going to use it to shoot die, then you're also going to need to buy a shoulder rig for it as well to do a proper job, and maybe one of those steady boy like balance rigs. Both of those costs a lot, and a decent dslr cobined with a "good" shoulder rig would probably run you as much as a proper semi pro hd camera, which is generally better suited for the job anyway.

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Mouettus    108

I am a 7D owner...

... no AF while using the video mode!!!!

just sayin...

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Green_Eye    49

Have you considered if a dslr is really the correct tool for the job as opposed to a high end/semi pro hd camera ?

If you're going to use it to shoot die, then you're also going to need to buy a shoulder rig for it as well to do a proper job, and maybe one of those steady boy like balance rigs. Both of those costs a lot, and a decent dslr cobined with a "good" shoulder rig would probably run you as much as a proper semi pro hd camera, which is generally better suited for the job anyway.

I am open to the possibility of trying to find an alternative like you suggest, my budget for now is ?1100 so as a beginner camera it seems that the 7D is best for my budget but if I could find an alternative(type of camera - not dslr) that's cheaper and has better functionality for my needs then I'm all for it :)

crazy88ss - Thanks for the advice I will look into the lens you suggested.

mouettus - By AF I assume you mean Auto Focus? what are your thoughts on the camera as a whole? is it generally a pain in the ass to work with or is it still worth the purchase?

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HawkMan    5,232

Basically without built in AF it's going to be a nightmare to work with. Even with AF you'll want a shoulder rig to do good shots, without AF it's an absolute necessity. And those a expensive. The good ones as much as the camera.

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Argote    73

The 5D Mk II is the reference camera for the aspiring videographer, however the 5D Mk III should be out soon-ish... Also, the Canon system is the most developed for shooting video (especially with the 5D family) in regards to accessories and such.

You could also try a Sony SLT which should give you Phase Detect AF during video (something no other camera can do), however, the system is not nearly as developed yet for video (in regards to accessories) though it seems to be picking up steam.

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Green_Eye    49

Basically without built in AF it's going to be a nightmare to work with. Even with AF you'll want a shoulder rig to do good shots, without AF it's an absolute necessity. And those a expensive. The good ones as much as the camera.

Yeah the lack of AF is a big blow, does canon sell the shoulder rigs or do they just make them compatible with whats already out there on the market?

The 5D Mk II is the reference camera for the aspiring videographer, however the 5D Mk III should be out soon-ish... Also, the Canon system is the most developed for shooting video (especially with the 5D family) in regards to accessories and such.

You could also try a Sony SLT which should give you Phase Detect AF during video (something no other camera can do), however, the system is not nearly as developed yet for video (in regards to accessories) though it seems to be picking up steam.

Thank you I will look into both of your suggestions (Y)

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+Mirumir    5,636

My philosophy is that all-in-one solutions will give mediocre results.

Maybe one day there will be a device that will offer both video and photo capabilities without any compromises, but, the reality today is that there are trade-offs.

The number one problem with DSLR video is that cameras aren't designed for pro-longed video recording. Use it all day long and it will most likely overheat and shutdown. Then there's also an issue with the sound as the AF and/or shutter add a background noise. This is just a couple of points to consider. You can work around these obstacles by limiting your video recording time and using a microphone unless you don't need the sound at all.

The 7D is great, but the 60D offers a much better usability because of the rotatable LCD for a lesser price. You can use the savings to get additional accessories or a better/additional lens.

Speaking of the lens, while I absolutely love the primes for still photos, the fact of life is that zooms are pretty much a must for video recording unless you are planning on doing something special that doesn't need zoom. Conventional video recording without zoom will be a nightmare.

So, there's sort of a conflict of interests with your request. On one hand, you need good low-light performance, on the other hand, you presumably need zoom for video.

Therefore, if I were you, I'd get the 60D with two lenses: a zoom and a prime - probably a nifty-fifty (canon 50mm f/1.8 II) and a canon 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 or a sigma 24-70mm f/2.4 - and that's just for starters. A tripod would be the next item on my list.

Cheers!

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Glassed Silver    940

My philosophy is that all-in-one solutions will give mediocre results.

Maybe one day there will be a device that will offer both video and photo capabilities without any compromises, but, the reality today is that there are trade-offs.

The number one problem with DSLR video is that cameras aren't designed for pro-longed video recording. Use it all day long and it will most likely overheat and shutdown. Then there's also an issue with the sound as the AF and/or shutter add a background noise. This is just a couple of points to consider. You can work around these obstacles by limiting your video recording time and using a microphone unless you don't need the sound at all.

The 7D is great, but the 60D offers a much better usability because of the rotatable LCD for a lesser price. You can use the savings to get additional accessories or a better/additional lens.

Speaking of the lens, while I absolutely love the primes for still photos, the fact of life is that zooms are pretty much a must for video recording unless you are planning on doing something special that doesn't need zoom. Conventional video recording without zoom will be a nightmare.

So, there's sort of a conflict of interests with your request. On one hand, you need good low-light performance, on the other hand, you presumably need zoom for video.

Therefore, if I were you, I'd get the 60D with two lenses: a zoom and a prime - probably a nifty-fifty (canon 50mm f/1.8 II) and a canon 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 or a sigma 24-70mm f/2.4 - and that's just for starters. A tripod would be the next item on my list.

Cheers!

This so much.

Took the words out of my mouth! :p

Glassed Silver:mac

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Green_Eye    49

My philosophy is that all-in-one solutions will give mediocre results.

Maybe one day there will be a device that will offer both video and photo capabilities without any compromises, but, the reality today is that there are trade-offs.

The number one problem with DSLR video is that cameras aren't designed for pro-longed video recording. Use it all day long and it will most likely overheat and shutdown. Then there's also an issue with the sound as the AF and/or shutter add a background noise. This is just a couple of points to consider. You can work around these obstacles by limiting your video recording time and using a microphone unless you don't need the sound at all.

The 7D is great, but the 60D offers a much better usability because of the rotatable LCD for a lesser price. You can use the savings to get additional accessories or a better/additional lens.

Speaking of the lens, while I absolutely love the primes for still photos, the fact of life is that zooms are pretty much a must for video recording unless you are planning on doing something special that doesn't need zoom. Conventional video recording without zoom will be a nightmare.

So, there's sort of a conflict of interests with your request. On one hand, you need good low-light performance, on the other hand, you presumably need zoom for video.

Therefore, if I were you, I'd get the 60D with two lenses: a zoom and a prime - probably a nifty-fifty (canon 50mm f/1.8 II) and a canon 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 or a sigma 24-70mm f/2.4 - and that's just for starters. A tripod would be the next item on my list.

Cheers!

Thank you very much for the advice and appologies on the late reply, been mad busy with work. Anyway upon doing further research I have decided to take your advice on the 60D because it makes the most sense. I was looking at someting like this - http://www.ebay.co.u...=item1e65db3802 but I am not sure if this is the best offer out there?

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Argote    73

If you're gonna get a 60D, you might as well get a nicer lens than the 18-55 IS II, I'd even recommend a 600D and a nicer lens over it any day.

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Green_Eye    49

If you're gonna get a 60D, you might as well get a nicer lens than the 18-55 IS II, I'd even recommend a 600D and a nicer lens over it any day.

Could you please elaborate on this? What advantages or differences there are in spec, price etc

Besides I was planning on buying a better lens like a month down the line from now this lens wont be used for long only I get to grips with the camera and settings etc

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deactivated170812    11

In terms of features there really isn't much difference between the two. See comparison chart on dpreview: http://www.dpreview.com/products/compare/side-by-side?products=canon_eos600d&products=canon_eos60d

You just have to decide if weather sealing and additional screen is what you need.

It's almost always better to buy a cheaper body and invest rest of the money towards a better lens. 18-55 is nice, but you quickly start noticing its weaknesses.

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Argote    73

Could you please elaborate on this? What advantages or differences there are in spec, price etc

Besides I was planning on buying a better lens like a month down the line from now this lens wont be used for long only I get to grips with the camera and settings etc

Well, the quality of the lens is the biggest factor in the resulting image quality of a photo taken with a DSLR (unless you go into really high ISOs, then again the 60D and 600D as pretty even in this regard). An 18-55 is a decent lens but there are much better options on the market that cover that zoom range. A Canon 15-85, a Tamron 17-50 or some other lens will probably provide substantially better IQ. The money saved could be used to purchase more things such as a 50/1.4 or any other nice prime/macro/telephoto or a flash.

If you're willing to spend for those things on top of the 60D then yeah, go for it. Otherwise get a 600D and spend the difference in glass/light.

Another thing to consider is that bodies usually lose their value over time while lenses rarely do (unless you damage them). The money spent on lenses now will probably serve you even down the road in a couple of years when you get a new body.

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+Mirumir    5,636

Thank you very much for the advice and appologies on the late reply, been mad busy with work. Anyway upon doing further research I have decided to take your advice on the 60D because it makes the most sense. I was looking at someting like this - http://www.ebay.co.u...=item1e65db3802 but I am not sure if this is the best offer out there?

You are most welcome, dude!

I wouldn't get a kit lens - it's a waste of money and time cause of a hassle to sell it when no one wants it, so it'll just collect dust or you'll throw it away.

It's best to just grab the body and a proper lens you want.

18-135 is a nice economy upgrade from kit 18-55 lens; and 18-135 is especially useful for DSLR video because of it's wide focal length.

As for the differences between 60D and 600D, they mostly stem from usability.

600D is smaller, lighter, boasts a swivel LCD just like 60D - these are all good points in favour of DSRL video (although it may overheat more), but since you are serious about learning photography too, 600D is inferior because its manual controls are lame.

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Green_Eye    49

Well, the quality of the lens is the biggest factor in the resulting image quality of a photo taken with a DSLR (unless you go into really high ISOs, then again the 60D and 600D as pretty even in this regard). An 18-55 is a decent lens but there are much better options on the market that cover that zoom range. A Canon 15-85, a Tamron 17-50 or some other lens will probably provide substantially better IQ. The money saved could be used to purchase more things such as a 50/1.4 or any other nice prime/macro/telephoto or a flash.

If you're willing to spend for those things on top of the 60D then yeah, go for it. Otherwise get a 600D and spend the difference in glass/light.

Another thing to consider is that bodies usually lose their value over time while lenses rarely do (unless you damage them). The money spent on lenses now will probably serve you even down the road in a couple of years when you get a new body.

Yeah I mean I already decided to go for the 60D over the 7D for the same reason so it should not be much of a problem getting a hold of a decent lens with the money I save from buying the 60D. Thank you for the reply nonetheless :)

You are most welcome, dude!

I wouldn't get a kit lens - it's a waste of money and time cause of a hassle to sell it when no one wants it, so it'll just collect dust or you'll throw it away.

It's best to just grab the body and a proper lens you want.

18-135 is a nice economy upgrade from kit 18-55 lens; and 18-135 is especially useful for DSLR video because of it's wide focal length.

As for the differences between 60D and 600D, they mostly stem from usability.

600D is smaller, lighter, boasts a swivel LCD just like 60D - these are all good points in favour of DSRL video (although it may overheat more), but since you are serious about learning photography too, 600D is inferior because its manual controls are lame.

Right on! Well that settles it i will be buying the body alone along with the 18-135 and one of the others you recommended in a previous post (the canon 50mm f/1.8 II I think it was)

Out of those two lenses will I be getting good performance in low light conditions or will another more specific lens be required?

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Argote    73

I don't know if the Canon 18-135 is Image Stabilized, but that is pretty important for your main-use lens.

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Green_Eye    49

I don't know if the Canon 18-135 is Image Stabilized, but that is pretty important for your main-use lens.

I am not sure but I will make check if it has it before I buy. Also I think it was you who suggested the Sigma lens which will be the next one I buy when I get a little extra cash in the next couple of months. I have so much yet to learn(about the cameras) I am scared and excited at the same time!

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