Windows 7 - 2 PCs don't see each other

[playXray]

I've got two PCs, both running Windows 7 x64 Ultimate Edition. One of these used to have Vista on it, and both PCs networked perfectly so I could share files between them. I then upgraded the Vista PC's HDD and did a clean install of Windows 7 on it. Now I can't get any networking to work between them. I've even tried using that 'Homegroup' thing, but neither computer can see the other's Homegroup. Setting up sharing manually doesn't work, even though both PCs can see my router and my Humax media server on the network - they just can't see each other.

I've been through every troubleshooter I can find and nothing seems to work. All the hardware on both PCs and my network is the same as before with the exception of the HDD on the old Vista PC, which is now an SSD.

[Detection]

Do you have network discovery enabled ?

[playXray]

Yeah, basically the same setup as in your image on both PCs, but mine both have media streamig 'on' as well.

[Detection]

Tried static IPs ?

I'm sure Budman will arrive and save the day soon :)

[playXray]

Ah no I've not tried that. I'll give it a go this evening, though I'd consider this more of a workaround than a solution if it works! Still, fingers crossed :) Thanks for the tip - I'll let you know how I get on.

[+BudMan MVC]

And have you tried the the basic ping of IP yet?

Are they both wired or wireless? Or one each? You could have a simple case of AP isolation - wireless clients can not talk to each other set on your router.

When you say see? You mean the browse list, or can you not resolve name, ie ping by name or net view \\computername

etc..

Network discovery is just the browse list is all, ie is computer browser running or not - can you be the browse master.. It really has nothing to do with anything at all in fire sharing.

post the output of both machines ipconfig /all

and try and ping the other machine by IP, does this work? if does not work look at arp -a, what does it show for the mac of the IP? all zeos? invalid, what?

[playXray]

Thanks for the all the info. Here's what I can answer on the spot: There's one wired (the old Vista one) and one wireless. I couldn't resolve the name via \\RAY and they don't show up in each other's browse list.

I'll try the ping method this evening and report back with the ipconfig data. Thanks.

[Eric Veteran]

Make sure that both machines have the same workgroup name. That's the only thing I can think of right now. :)

[Jason S. Global Moderator]

i dont believe this is definitive, but are the two machines in the same workgroup?

if the two machines are on the same network (subnet) then they should, at the very least, be able to ping each other.

[ndoggfromhell]

Make sure the clocks are set to the same time on both machines.

[ndoggfromhell]

i dont believe this is definitive, but are the two machines in the same workgroup?

if the two machines are on the same network (subnet) then they should, at the very least, be able to ping each other.

I'm pretty sure windows firewall blocks ICMP packets... so ping wouldn't work between two win7 pcs if the firewall is on.

[+BudMan MVC]

"Make sure that both machines have the same workgroup name."

"are the two machines in the same workgroup"

"Make sure the clocks are set to the same time on both machines."

Wrong, Wrong, Wrong - none of this stuff has ANYTHING to do with resolving \\computername or even the being in the browselist

Workgroups are NOTHING more than place holders for the browselist -- you can have every single machine on your network in its own workgroup if you want and they would still be listed. As to the time of the machines?? that could be problem with authing in AD, but has nothing to do with simple name resolution or browse list.

edit:

"I'm pretty sure windows firewall blocks ICMP packets"

Valid point -- yes you need to make sure any firewalls you have running allow for what your trying to do, and yes even a simple ping can be blocked by firewall.. Why you would ever do such a thing I have no idea -- sure makes simple troubleshooting a pain in the ass ;)

Sometimes I forget common sense is not all that common. Yes if your going to PING, make sure your firewall if running one allows for it! DUH!!!

[Jason S. Global Moderator]

I'm pretty sure windows firewall blocks ICMP packets... so ping wouldn't work between two win7 pcs if the firewall is on.

probably right - i always turn my windows firewall off immediately :p

[Jason S. Global Moderator]

Wrong, Wrong, Wrong - none of this stuff has ANYTHING to do with resolving \\computername or even the being in the browselist

whoa whoa whoa down boy...easy now.... easy... we all love Budman, but take it easy

[+BudMan MVC]

Down boy?? :blink: For what, pointing out statements that are 100% completely WRONG? Sorry I will not back down from FUD!! I thought maybe we had killed the workgroup nonsense -- but there you go 2 people bringing it back up!

Here you go I found an older picture - I have posted lots of them like this, would have to dig up the old threads. But there is old one I found on my computer showing different workgroup names, all listed with the computers in them, etc..

So let nip that FUD in the Bud!! Workgroups have NOTHING to do with file sharing, and ok it makes it easier and more sense to put all your machines in the same one -- it is NOT a requirement for them to show up on the list. And yet again I will post this because these people posting this FUD need to read them.

http://www.microsoft.com/download/en/details.aspx?displaylang=en&id=5590

Computer Browsing for SOHO Networks with Microsoft Windows

http://www.microsoft.com/download/en/details.aspx?displaylang=en&id=21205

Troubleshooting Computer Browsing on SOHO Networks with Microsoft Windows

So maybe they will stop posting such FUD!!

[ndoggfromhell]

The clock being offset between two machines will cause issues even in a workgroup environment. I can assure you of that. Usually you can see the other computer, but when you try to connect it will prompt you for the username/password for the network share and even if you put the right information in, it will fail to connect.

[+BudMan MVC]

Yeah -- don't think so

Here you go, just changed my desktop to be WAY off in time and date.. There you go still accessing file shares off different box with different time and date.

And even if it was a problem -- it sure is not a problem with simple name resolution.. Which is what the user is saying, not that he could not auth to the machine.

[ndoggfromhell]

http://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/w7itpronetworking/thread/68ffbe2a-09a7-4e29-859c-ca1aaf75dcd1

Its a well documented issue that's been around since the Windows 2000 days. I have that page bookmarked, but i've seen it mentioned plenty of times. I'm almost certain there was a KB article published on it, but I'm far too busy to look for it. If the PC1 has never communicated with PC2 and the clock on either computer is off by an hour or more it WILL NOT authenticate. in OP's original post he mentions homegroups and those require authentication. Hop off your high horse for a second Bud Man and enjoy some humble pie.

[playXray]

Ok so this actually seems to be a problem with my main PC, rather than the other one (that used to have Vista on it). I installed a wireless laser printer on the network and after installation I was given an error message saying that while the printer had been set up on the network correctly, this PC couldn't access it wirelessly. I also turned on the Humax media server again and noticed that the ex-Vista PC could see the media server, whereas the main PC couldn't.

Here's the cmd stuff for my main PC:

Microsoft Windows [Version 6.1.7601]

Copyright © 2009 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

C:\Users\Ray>ipconfig /all

Windows IP Configuration

Host Name . . . . . . . . . . . . : Ray-PC

Primary Dns Suffix . . . . . . . :

Node Type . . . . . . . . . . . . : Hybrid

IP Routing Enabled. . . . . . . . : No

WINS Proxy Enabled. . . . . . . . : No

DNS Suffix Search List. . . . . . : home

Wireless LAN adapter Wireless Network Connection 5:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . : home

Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Linksys WMP600N Wireless-N PCI Adapter with Dual-Band #2

Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 68-7F-74-E2-0C-1D

DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : Yes

Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes

Link-local IPv6 Address . . . . . : fe80::69be:ce94:bd82:1d37%19(Preferred)

IPv4 Address. . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.69(Preferred)

Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0

Lease Obtained. . . . . . . . . . : 26 March 2012 19:38:44

Lease Expires . . . . . . . . . . : 28 March 2012 19:56:14

Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.254

DHCP Server . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.254

DHCPv6 IAID . . . . . . . . . . . : 476610420

DHCPv6 Client DUID. . . . . . . . : 00-01-00-01-16-A0-DB-EC-FF-FF-FF-FF-FF-FF

DNS Servers . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.254

NetBIOS over Tcpip. . . . . . . . : Enabled

Ethernet adapter Bluetooth Network Connection:

Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnected

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :

Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Bluetooth Device (Personal Area Network)

Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-26-83-32-49-25

DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : Yes

Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes

Ethernet adapter Local Area Connection:

Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnected

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :

Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Intel® 82579V Gigabit Network Connection

Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 14-DA-E9-45-FF-CC

DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : Yes

Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes

Tunnel adapter isatap.home:

Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnected

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :

Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Microsoft ISATAP Adapter

Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-00-00-00-00-00-00-E0

DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : No

Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes

Tunnel adapter Reusable ISATAP Interface {14C623EF-3183-4494-97BC-936C2683E10C}:

Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnected

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . : home

Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Microsoft ISATAP Adapter #2

Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-00-00-00-00-00-00-E0

DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : No

Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes

Tunnel adapter Teredo Tunneling Pseudo-Interface:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :

Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Teredo Tunneling Pseudo-Interface

Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-00-00-00-00-00-00-E0

DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : No

Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes

IPv6 Address. . . . . . . . . . . : 2001:0:5ef5:79fd:2cc9:948:3f57:feba(Prefe

rred)

Link-local IPv6 Address . . . . . : fe80::2cc9:948:3f57:feba%12(Preferred)

Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : ::

NetBIOS over Tcpip. . . . . . . . : Disabled

Tunnel adapter isatap.{A0C7AA40-AB61-4793-95B1-32FA2D3F6FAD}:

Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnected

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :

Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Microsoft ISATAP Adapter #3

Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-00-00-00-00-00-00-E0

DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : No

Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes

Tunnel adapter isatap.{704413BF-C6D6-4669-B417-2A63A6616C25}:

Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnected

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :

Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Microsoft ISATAP Adapter #4

Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-00-00-00-00-00-00-E0

DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : No

Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes

C:\Users\Ray>ping 192.168.1.72

Pinging 192.168.1.72 with 32 bytes of data:

Reply from 192.168.1.72: bytes=32 time=4ms TTL=128

Reply from 192.168.1.72: bytes=32 time=2ms TTL=128

Reply from 192.168.1.72: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=128

Reply from 192.168.1.72: bytes=32 time=2ms TTL=128

Ping statistics for 192.168.1.72:

Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),

Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:

Minimum = 1ms, Maximum = 4ms, Average = 2ms

C:\Users\Ray>

Here's the data from the ex-Vista PC:

Microsoft Windows [Version 6.1.7601]

Copyright © 2009 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

C:\Users\GTV>ipconfig

Windows IP Configuration

Ethernet adapter Local Area Connection:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :

Link-local IPv6 Address . . . . . : fe80::a9ad:7836:ac51:1e0e%11

IPv4 Address. . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.72

Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0

Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.254

Tunnel adapter isatap.{47DE9910-41CC-4EC2-A328-60F6AC8ADCA9}:

Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnected

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :

Tunnel adapter Local Area Connection* 9:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :

IPv6 Address. . . . . . . . . . . : 2001:0:5ef5:79fd:3c50:ecb:a97a:9385

Link-local IPv6 Address . . . . . : fe80::3c50:ecb:a97a:9385%13

Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : ::

C:\Users\GTV>ping 192.168.1.69

Pinging 192.168.1.69 with 32 bytes of data:

Reply from 192.168.1.72: Destination host unreachable.

Reply from 192.168.1.72: Destination host unreachable.

Reply from 192.168.1.72: Destination host unreachable.

Reply from 192.168.1.72: Destination host unreachable.

Ping statistics for 192.168.1.69:

Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),

C:\Users\GTV>

I forgot to do the /all command for the ex-Vista PC unfortunately and now my wife is using it so I can't do it again just now. I'll get it as soon as I can later.

[+BudMan MVC]

He is not using homegroups and am not on a high horse, nor am I eating any h pie -- I showed you where there is NO Problem accessing when time is OFF!! What you don't believe a picture.. .Freaking try it yourself then!!

That thread you posted -- how do you know that moron wasnt using a domain.. And then yes I will be the first too tell you that you can have issues with time difference, because your using kerberos, etc..

And he has not even gotten to an AUTH issue -- he is not able to RESOLVE THE NAME!!

But again his issue has NOTHING to do with time being OFF!

"I've even tried using that 'Homegroup' thing, but neither computer can see the other's Homegroup"

Where does that say he got to anything about authing? Or that he is actually using homegroups?

Here lets go over it again... So I have the time on this box to WAY in the future 2014.. I have rebooted said box

Look -- time is WAY and the F!! Off -- I get access denied, I then auth with even a different name than I am logged in with.

Now I have authed, and now I have access -- look at that my time is still way and the F out there.. And working just freaking fine!!

Time has NOTHING to do with authing in a workgroup -- YES it matters in a AD, very much so.. And may have something to do with homegroups. I have not dug that deep into it.. But for 100% positivity has NOTHING to do with finding a netbios name via broadcast, etc.

So who is on some horse -- its sure an the F is not me!! Would you like some hot sauce for the crow your eating??

edit:

Reply from 192.168.1.72: Destination host unreachable.

So you can not ping the .69 wireless box from your .72 wired box. Please post the output of arp -a after you have tried to ping

Also from your .69 please do a net view \\computernameof.72box and then net view \\192.168.1.72 from your 69 box

But you really need to fix the ping problem -- do you have the firewall running on Ray-PC, you need to allow ping for testing. Would really suggest you disable it on your home connection.

[playXray]

Wow. Ok guys, I feel like a bit of a wally. I've reset my router and set both computers to obtain IP addresses automatically (they were static before) and now everything is back to normal!

Thanks for all the help.

[+BudMan MVC]

Well if I had to GUESS, since one was wired and the other was wireless.. And you could not ping the wireless machine from the wired machine I would say yeah there was something funky there.

From your config your .69 box dhcp, you never posted /aa of .72 so can not tell -- but the masks were correct for the same network, etc. So that would not of been an issue.

For all we know with wireless you could of been on the wireless network net door ;) Which would explain your problem as well!

[ndoggfromhell]

Budman: congrats on learning how to screen capture and copy/paste. I remember now why I stopped reading this forum daily and why I'll never offer help to anyone on here again because we have been blessed with the all-knowing and all-powerful Budman who can answer everything. I will pray tonight that I never ever work for someone like you or in a company with an employee like you. You might fix problems faster, but you seem like a truly miserable person and we just flushed a toxic person with the same attitude out of this company. Oh, and I won't be eating crow champ. I'm going to enjoy a nice steak dinner with friends. I will however use the hot sauce, thanks ;-)

[Detection]

Budman: congrats on learning how to screen capture and copy/paste. I remember now why I stopped reading this forum daily and why I'll never offer help to anyone on here again because we have been blessed with the all-knowing and all-powerful Budman who can answer everything. I will pray tonight that I never ever work for someone like you or in a company with an employee like you. You might fix problems faster, but you seem like a truly miserable person and we just flushed a toxic person with the same attitude out of this company. Oh, and I won't be eating crow champ. I'm going to enjoy a nice steak dinner with friends. I will however use the hot sauce, thanks ;-)

wow..

A guy know actually does know what he is talking about....

....and then you

[+BudMan MVC]

It is just amazing -- you actually show someone something, that they can quite easy reproduce in like 2 minutes.. Which shows them they are wrong.. And they still don't accept it.

So the reason you stop reading the forum is because correct info is given, and backed up by examples that anyone could understand. Is that what your saying?

I would be more than happy to see your screen shots of you showing where time makes a difference in resolving of netbios names via broadcast, or where it causes an issue with auth.

Now what I could see being a problem is if the machine where the account sits your trying to auth with being expired. Which would be related to what time the machine has on it. Well then yeah your not going to be able to auth with an expired account ;)

BTW -- you can call it steak, still crow :devil: