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compl3x    6,252

By that logic Microsoft don't have a successor for the 360 because they haven't said anything about it at all.

Hardly the same. We have enough evidence to know there is going to be a successor. This issue just lingers on and on and makes consumers nervous.

MS can put an always on in their system at the risk of alienating consumers. I just hope Sony is looking at all of this and thinking "Damn, let's not go down that road".

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vcfan    2,337

It's not a win for anyone but publishers. This is how they will kill the used market. It's nothing in it for consumers. Always on? Sure. Required always online? Not at all.

And I love how people like you blow off Internet opinion. These people opinions will be passed on to their friends and family. Which will hopefully result in lack luster sells. No company should be rewarded for being anti-consumer.

Microsoft will learn. If they don't they will fail.

that's why despite the vile comments about EA and this whole online situation by internet tough guys, Sim city is selling really well.

MS can put an always on in their system at the risk of alienating consumers. I just hope Sony is looking at all of this and thinking "Damn, let's not go down that road".

it wont be up to sony. publishers can say, always on, or go pound sand,no games for you.

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+J. X. Maxwell    2,124

Cracking community will soon be a booming business helping legitimate customers.

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HawkMan    5,105

Cracking community will soon be a booming business helping legitimate customers.

considering how hard the last gen was to crack, and the only reason the 360 was even "cracked" was because of an oversight where the DVD was left outside the hypervisor. What do you think the realistic chances of next gen getting cracked is ? They've been getting harder and harder every gen, and this gen was "almost" there.

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Motoko.    435

Hardly the same. We have enough evidence to know there is going to be a successor. This issue just lingers on and on and makes consumers nervous.

MS can put an always on in their system at the risk of alienating consumers. I just hope Sony is looking at all of this and thinking "Damn, let's not go down that road".

I can't help but think Microsoft is trying to be as stuck up as Apple when Steve was alive. Everybody speculated and made all sorts of assertions and nobody got answers until a keynote finally revealed all.

Microsoft somehow with the negative limelight it's receiving from this situation with 'always on' is also getting lots of publicity. I anctipicate when they make their reveal, they will try and amaze everyone with what they're offering with the 720.

I'll add that this negative publicitity can be translated into a good thing later on depending how the company executes its strategy

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+Audioboxer    2,874

it wont be up to sony. publishers can say, always on, or go pound sand,no games for you.

Yeah because in a generation where Square Enix say 3.5m Tomb Raider sales didn't meet expectations, publishers are going to be happy to lose out on millions of sales by abandoning a console completely.

The argument of EA/"other large Publisher" somehow going MS exclusive if always online is required is one of the worst business proposals gamers are suggesting online. Exclusive/timed DLC, yes, full games, you're having a laugh.

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HawkMan    5,105

The thing is EA is large enough that if they have an exclusivity deal with MS because of always online, MS wins. as hated as EA is stated to be, they have the games people want, and they have a lot of them.

The more likely scenario is that always online is part of PSN 2.0 framework. and the majority of PS4 games will be released as always online through the PSN network as well.

on the other hand, since you're so willing to believe all the 360 rumors, what about the rumor that EA and MS has an exclusivity (probably timed, or on limited AAA titles, since some titles are known to be releasing on PS4) deal that's to be revealed on the MS big reveal conference.

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dead.cell    1,911

PS4 requires a connection for it's entire back-catalog of single player games. All games with an incompatible architecture are going to have to be streamed via gaikai.

Which doesn't seem to be a big deal for many of us. I think most of us as consumers were prepared just by the specification leaks alone that the devices wouldn't be backwards compatible, in a logical sense of just being able to insert a disc. By including this by default, it would only serve to drive up costs of the console anyway. Microsoft seems to be opting for a separate attachment that you'd have to pay for, while Sony is going for something that would require only an internet connection. Both sides have their pros and cons, and I suppose the ideal solution would depend on the person anyway.

That said, it would once again come down to personal preference, just like consoles always have.

Your "losing" money to piracy... deal with it.

And they will lose money due to anti-piracy measures if this keeps up. All of this DRM nonsense and waiting in queues just to play a single player game is ridiculous. Pirates are still pirating, and legitimate users are getting hurt by this more than anything.

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+E.worm Jimmy    9,923

No, it doesn't :huh:

don't be silly, it does.

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+Audioboxer    2,874

on the other hand, since you're so willing to believe all the 360 rumors, what about the rumor that EA and MS has an exclusivity (probably timed, or on limited AAA titles, since some titles are known to be releasing on PS4) deal that's to be revealed on the MS big reveal conference.

Sure if you could link to the reputable sites staking their reputation/their inside sources saying about this EA deal then it might have traction other than gamers speculating on forums.

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HawkMan    5,105

No reputable sites has "staked" their reputation on ANY of the next xbox rumors, so that' argument doesn't hold any water.

https://www.google.no/search?client=opera&q=MS+EA+exclusivity+deal&sourceid=opera&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&channel=suggest

Lets see, in the first hits we have VG247, GameSpot, and a whole bunch of other gaming sites.

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+Audioboxer    2,874

No reputable sites has "staked" their reputation on ANY of the next xbox rumors, so that' argument doesn't hold any water.

Um, if you post articles like this, it goes hand-in-hand with your reputation for rumours. That's like the most obvious part of journalism, especially on highly visited sites. If you post dud rumours people will remember. Any time a rumour is posted you can bet someone will be asking how is this sites credibility for rumours?

Still, the main part of the rebuttal was asking you to provide me EA links for your statement about my judgement on rumours. If you can't do that I have no idea why you're asking me about my judgement in taking notice of a current industry wide rumour vs something that has had no mainstream press attention.

edit: Timed exclusives/DLC I believe in, I already said that. My first mentioning of EA in this topic was to vcfan who is more certain on "no games". That I do not believe at all. Next gen as this gen was will be littered with timed deals, but no 3rd party developer as big as EA is going to go 1 console only.

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HawkMan    5,105

umm the MS EA exclsuivity rumor w was all over the net, it was just earlier than the other ones. but if you look through that link I posted you'll see pretty much every tech site picked up on it. it was also based on 2 anonymous tips. whereas the online required rumor came from ONE anonymous tipster, AND 2+ other anonymous dev tipsters who said they knew NOTHING of any such requirement...

But yeah, lets pretend your choice of what rumors and news to posts and believe in isn't biased....

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Tha Bloo Monkee    591

Worst part is, many of you will moan and complain about how you don't want it to be always-online, yet continue to throw your money at these companies as fast as you can. Demonstrate your unhappiness by not giving companies your hard-earned money if you have issues, otherwise you literally feed the idea.

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Superboy    10

By that logic Microsoft don't have a successor for the 360 because they haven't said anything about it at all.

remember when they wouldn't deny the rumors that windows phone 7.5 wouldn't be able to be upgraded to windows phone 8 even thou when they started the windows phone 7 series they said that it wouldn't be fragmented like android and that you would get upgrades and that was the reason they redesigned the whole windows phone and didn't make windows mobile upgradable to windows phone 7 because they laid the foundation for all the upgrades to be possible. And we all know how that ended going ****Windows Phone 7.5 Didn't get the upgrade**** what a shock and I remember people saying the same thing you said "oh wait they are just rumors they haven't admitted to it, I can't believe how people believe these rumors Microsoft wouldn't do that" yeah right.

Microsoft as of late has become worst than Apple as in "I know what customers want even if they don't know about i. And even if they really didn't want it, oh well they are holding it wrong and deal with it" they don't care about customer anymore.

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ahhell    1,306

At some point in time, the Internet going "down" will be almost impossible but that is no time soon.

Don't put much stake in what CliffyB has to say. He's just a pompous asshat.

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HawkMan    5,105

remember when they wouldn't deny the rumors that windows phone 7.5 wouldn't be able to be upgraded to windows phone 8 even thou when they started the windows phone 7 series they said that it wouldn't be fragmented like android and that you would get upgrades and that was the reason they redesigned the whole windows phone and didn't make windows mobile upgradable to windows phone 7 because they laid the foundation for all the upgrades to be possible. And we all know how that ended going ****Windows Phone 7.5 Didn't get the upgrade**** what a shock and I remember people saying the same thing you said "oh wait they are just rumors they haven't admitted to it, I can't believe how people believe these rumors Microsoft wouldn't do that" yeah right.

Microsoft as of late has become worst than Apple as in "I know what customers want even if they don't know about i. And even if they really didn't want it, oh well they are holding it wrong and deal with it" they don't care about customer anymore.

Actually MS did comment on those rumors, and said they where doing everything they could to make an upgrade possible.

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BajiRav    2,120

Pointless thread is pointless, just gives one more opportunity to usual trolls.

Which doesn't seem to be a big deal for many of us. I think most of us as consumers were prepared just by the specification leaks alone that the devices wouldn't be backwards compatible, in a logical sense of just being able to insert a disc. By including this by default, it would only serve to drive up costs of the console anyway. Microsoft seems to be opting for a separate attachment that you'd have to pay for, while Sony is going for something that would require only an internet connection. Both sides have their pros and cons, and I suppose the ideal solution would depend on the person anyway.

That said, it would once again come down to personal preference, just like consoles always have.

And they will lose money due to anti-piracy measures if this keeps up. All of this DRM nonsense and waiting in queues just to play a single player game is ridiculous. Pirates are still pirating, and legitimate users are getting hurt by this more than anything.

You say all of that as if there is no DRM on current-gen consoles or PS4.

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vcfan    2,337

Yeah because in a generation where Square Enix say 3.5m Tomb Raider sales didn't meet expectations, publishers are going to be happy to lose out on millions of sales by abandoning a console completely.

The argument of EA/"other large Publisher" somehow going MS exclusive if always online is required is one of the worst business proposals gamers are suggesting online. Exclusive/timed DLC, yes, full games, you're having a laugh.

you're assuming that consoles sales will be 50/50 which won't be the case if Xbox has exclusives. The xbox360 killed the ps3 in software sales this gen, I don't think they would be too worried. Also consider the amount of piracy that would be eliminated compared to the rampant piracy that happened in this Gen.

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Tha Bloo Monkee    591

Also consider the amount of piracy that would be eliminated compared to the rampant piracy that happened in this Gen.

Where are you getting this idea that piracy won't exist in the next generation?

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vcfan    2,337

Where are you getting this idea that piracy won't exist in the next generation?

if an internet connection is always required, put elements of the game server side and you've eliminated piracy as the game cannot be played without server assistance. how are you going to pirate a game if some of the code is stored and executed on a server?

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Skin    299

Yes, it does. :| They (Microsoft) won't address the issue at all. If it was something they had zero intention of doing they would have said so by now. People are judging the system by this rumour before the console has even been announced. Not a good thing for consumers to already be disliking your product.

I wonder if they are quickly and quietly rethinking their always on stance, or trying to find a way that you need to register the game online the first time, then you can play offline, etc. The fact that someone caused a crapstorm and they didn't confirm or deny, but just fire him, speaks LOUD and CLEAR.

We, as consumers are about to be given another opportunity to vote with our wallets. Use this chance wisely.

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HawkMan    5,105

Where are you getting this idea that piracy won't exist in the next generation?

Piracy on consoles have gotten harder and harder for every generations. Last/This generation was almost perfect. MS did a mistake of by oversight putting the DVD drive outside the hypervisor, had the DVD drive been inside the hypervisor "shield" it would have remained un cracked. the PS3 was cracked only because hardware partners leaked keys.

These are issues that can and will be fixed next generation. so what gives you the idea next generation will have piracy ? heck it took years this generation.

The fact that someone caused a crapstorm and they didn't confirm or deny, but just fire him, speaks LOUD and CLEAR.

No, in fact in that case it only says that MS doesn't accept people speaking like jerks in a way that could be construed as official. he wasn't fired for what he said, but how he said it.

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BajiRav    2,120

I wonder if they are quickly and quietly rethinking their always on stance, or trying to find a way that you need to register the game online the first time, then you can play offline, etc. The fact that someone caused a crapstorm and they didn't confirm or deny, but just fire him, speaks LOUD and CLEAR.

We, as consumers are about to be given another opportunity to vote with our wallets. Use this chance wisely.

Yup they are going to quickly rearchitect their entire next gen console software just because somebody leaked news about it. It perfectly makes sense because they have "delayed" the announcement by a whopping month.

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Anthony Tosie    203

I'm having a hard time seeing the next Xbox as requiring a persistent Internet connection. Microsoft isn't a U.S.-only company, and even though it may be possible in the U.S., it wouldn't be possible in many countries where the Xbox sells well.

That said, I don't think it's a good idea even in the U.S. There are too many potential issues. It's not just if a person's Internet connection goes out, it's about what happens when Xbox Live goes down. No, it doesn't go down frequently, but it does go down at times, and yes, it's annoying. It will be even more annoying if you can't even play games when that happens.

But I still don't think Microsoft will do it for yet another reason: It doesn't make sense. It makes sense that it would have major features that require a persistent connection (see: the recent rumor about set-top box integration), but not the entire device. How many household or personal devices require an Internet connection to function? Almost none. I would never buy a PC if it required an Internet connection to function, for instance.

I just don't see it happening. If the idea is DRM, it's a horrible idea. Companies have to stop punishing paying customers for the actions of those who pirate content.

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