California cops shoot dead 13-year-old boy armed with toy gun


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adrynalyne

They shot the kid 7 times, that is a little extreme.  One shot to the leg or arm would have disabled him and he would possibly be still alive.

 

Source: http://www.katu.com/news/national/California-community-questions-shooting-of-13-year-old-229199271.html

Talk to any police officer who has been involved in a shooting.  They will tell you the adrenaline is pumping hard enough that you will probably keep pulling the trigger even to the point of click, click, click.

 

This is why shoot to wound doesn't work.

 

Ever been in a brawl where you are protecting yourself?  You don't stop at one punch, right?

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Lord Method Man

 

Just shoot: The officer did not pull up and let off a clip of ammunition he clearly gave two verbal warnings before firing at the offender who pointed the weapon in his direction

 

Yes. Simple scenario. Cops order someone to put down their weapon, they refuse to compy and instead point it in their direction. That's when they get shot, end of story.

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+primortal

Did you skip over the rest of the story?

 No, why?

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Lord Method Man

Apparently leg or arm shots don't exist..

 

Correct. They don't. Stop watching TV.

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ashpowell

Talk to any police officer who has been involved in a shooting. They will tell you the adrenaline is pumping hard enough that you will probably keep pulling the trigger even to the point of click, click, click.

This is why shoot to wound doesn't work.

Ever been in a brawl where you are protecting yourself? You don't stop at one punch, right?

If one punch is enough then yes

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+Raze

Apparently leg or arm shots don't exist..

 

Only on TV or in the movies.

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+primortal

Talk to any police officer who has been involved in a shooting.  They will tell you the adrenaline is pumping hard enough that you will probably keep pulling the trigger even to the point of click, click, click.

 

This is why shoot to wound doesn't work.

 

Ever been in a brawl where you are protecting yourself?  You don't stop at one punch, right?

 

Understood, but they weren't event fired upon so they should have been able to take their time and properly handled this.

 

Of course you don't stop at one punch when someone is punching you, as I said above he wasn't even firing shots.

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+Raze

Understood, but they weren't event fired upon so they should have been able to take their time and properly handled this.

 

Of course you don't stop at one punch when someone is punching you, as I said above he wasn't even firing shots.

 

Have you read this thread or just part of it, you'll find your answers if you do.

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adrynalyne

If one punch is enough then yes

You have never been in a real fight, where you fear for your well being then. 

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KingCracker

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

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Zinomian

I think there is an anti-america agenda here from the people of are complaining about this particular scenario.  First, they all assume that we are all "HAPPY" or "OK" with the fact that a 13 year old boy is dead, when in fact, most of us are very sad to see a person die, specially a young man/kid like this one, however, what they all fail to realize, is that we understand why this happen, and do not blame these two police officers for what happen.

 

The facts of this particular case, clearly show that the boy failed to obey the orders of the officers, on top of that, one of the officers felt the kid was raising the barrel of the gun and pointing at them, which forced the officers to shoot.  Have looked at pictures of the toy gun, and to be honest, from 5 to 10 ft you cannot tell quickly that its a toy gun, to me it looked like a real gun.

 

From our sad history with young people and guns, i say the officers acted appropriately, and while sad, this is the way ALL police should react to this particular scenario, who knows, maybe next time, this wont be a toy gun.

 

I do accept that we have a gun problem in America which needs to be addressed so this kind of things do not happen, but that's a whole other conversation, and not relevant to this particular post.

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ashpowell

You have never been in a real fight, where you fear for your well being then.

Okay then. Mma for 4 years but never been in a fight. If one punch is enough to stop your opponent.. You don't carry on attacking them, the only people that do that are scum

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trag3dy

This quote is taken from one of the links up above and I feel it describes the situation well..

 

Some of you need to think about this for a moment.  You are a police office, maybe you have put you life in jeopardy and been shot at in the past.  You see a suspect with his back to you that is carrying what for all purposes was created  to look identical to assault assault weapon so you have no idea the gun is fake.  The suspect has on a hoodie so you have no way of telling what the age of the suspect is or any possible features that might give you a clue of the suspects intent.  You hit your lights and sirens and tell the suspect to drop the weapon multiple times but instead of dropping the weapon he turns around lifting the barrel in your direction.  Hesitating could not only cost your life but your partners and possibly innocent bystanders so do you wait to see what he does next?  No you fire it's the only logical choice and doubtful anyone who was trained like a police office would do anything differently.  I'm sad that a child lost his life for what amounted to a stupid mistake on his part but I don't fault the officer that had to make the decision to fire.

 

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adrynalyne

Okay then. Mma for 4 years but never been in a fight. If one punch is enough to stop your opponent.. You don't carry on attacking them, the only people that do that are scum

Of course you are.

 

Everyone on the Internet is in MMA and makes comments like, Derp, one punch is enough!

 

Even if you were (and I doubt it), a controlled match is not the same thing as a brawl where your life could be on the line.

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Lord Method Man

Okay then. Mma for 4 years but never been in a fight. If one punch is enough to stop your opponent.. You don't carry on attacking them, the only people that do that are scum

 

So you participated in sporting events, you weren't fighting to supress a threat to your life or the lives of others.

 

Its really best you just stop trying to armchair quarterback this situation, you're just making yourself look silly.

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MDboyz

"I'd take the shot to try and dissarm the kid."

At that distance, you are watching too many cowboy movies.

 

"Where was the force from the kid with his toy gun?"

In that split seconds, you can identify it is the real or fake gun?

 

"How you don't see that's wrong is beyond me. That's just how I see things. Everyone is entitled to their opinion on a matter. I can see both sides of the situation, but If I was the cop I would have made a different choice."

Sure, you would be a dead cop, if it was the real AK47.

If you understand the crazy damage that AK47 can do, in that few seconds, I'm sure you will not take any chance when it is pointing to your direction.

 

So because the cop is on $13 an hour should make a difference or not to whether he decides if a boy lives or dies? 

 

I'm wrong in your opinion. In your opinion you don't shoot someone unless you want it to be lethal, if it was me, I'd take the shot to try and dissarm the kid.

 

"LE Training teaches force on force, or else you're doing it wrong" Where was the force from the kid with his toy gun?

"You don't take a knife to a gun fight" - It wasn't a gun fight, it was a 13 year old boy with a toy gun.

Better take the toy guns off kids - Cops only get paid $13 an hour so they can't take the risk if they're real or not and will shoot to kill them.

 

How you don't see that's wrong is beyond me. That's just how I see things. Everyone is entitled to their opinion on a matter. I can see both sides of the situation, but If I was the cop I would have made a different choice.

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Bryan R.

Understood, but they weren't event fired upon so they should have been able to take their time and properly handled this.

 

Of course you don't stop at one punch when someone is punching you, as I said above he wasn't even firing shots.

LOL

 

Cop: "He hasn't fired on me yet so I have time to.... oops I'm dead".

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adrynalyne

"I'd take the shot to try and dissarm the kid."

At that distance, you are watching too many cowboy movies.

 

"Where was the force from the kid with his toy gun?"

In that split seconds, you can identify it is the real or fake gun?

 

"How you don't see that's wrong is beyond me. That's just how I see things. Everyone is entitled to their opinion on a matter. I can see both sides of the situation, but If I was the cop I would have made a different choice."

Sure, you would be a dead cop, if it was the real AK47.

If you understand the crazy damage that AK47 can do, in that few seconds, I'm sure you will not take any chance when it is pointing to your direction.

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TTaeykS1m0

 

 

See the above for why you do not hesitate as a police officer if a gun is not dropped immediately and pointed in your direction.

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Lord Method Man

LOL

 

Cop: "He hasn't fired on me yet so I have time to.... oops I'm dead".

 

The police could have easily dodged the first couple shots (or taken cover behind their car doors which provide excellent protection against centerfire rifle ammunition) before determining how to handle a suspect threatening them with an automatic weapon. I know this because I saw it on TV and that makes me an expert in firearms usage law enforcement procedures.

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Zinomian

The police could have easily dodged the first couple shots (or taken cover behind their car doors which provide excellent protection against centerfire rifle ammunition) before determining how to handle a suspect threatening them with an automatic weapon. I know this because I saw it on TV and that makes me an expert in firearms usage law enforcement procedures.

 

OMG! Please say that you forgot to add the /sarcastic switch at the end of you post.....PLEASE!  :argh: :s :huh: :no: :omg:

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Lord Method Man

OMG! Please say that you forgot to add the /sarcastic switch at the end of you post.....PLEASE!  :argh: :s :huh: :no: :omg:

 

Is it really neccessary?

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HawkMan

Really, guess it depends on the area, but I still think they should have taken a different approach as he was only 13. They should know that 13 year old boys are stubborn. 

 

I'm guessing the buy didn't have a tag floating above his head with his name date of birth and age and such handy information when they pointed their guns at him.

 

So how exactly where they to know he was 13 ?

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HawkMan

Any police unit would. If the OP pic is the one he was carrying it's obvious the red toy marker was removed.

That or it was a BB (.177 caliber ball bearing) or pellet (.177, .22 or .25 caliber lead pellet) spring, gas or air powered gun. These do not have the red toy marker because they can actually injure a person even though not a full firearm.

 

Not like you can't paint the tip of a real gun orange either.

 

We're long past the days when kids or especially teens can be cute and point their toy guns at the cops and go bang and the cop will pretend to die.

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