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Updated Playstation Terms of Service restricts reselling of "Software"

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RageOfFury    335

 

 

7. Resale
7.1. You must not resell either Disc-based Software or Software Downloads, unless expressly authorised by us and, if the publisher is another company, additionally by the publisher.

 

Link to TOS: http://legaldoc.dl.playstation.net/ps3-eula/psn/e/e_tosua_en.html

 

Now by "Software" do they mean games?

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trooper11    1,096

Hmm, that is strange. Games certainly are considered software.

 

It does say that you cant do it with out their permission but haven't they given that permission?

 

I mean what constitutes permission?

 

TOS listings are always confusing.  I cant believe it means what it seems to be implying.  I mean not only would you need Sony's permission for Sony titles, but even if its a third party, you need their permission and Sony's.

 

Maybe this is about retail reselling.

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soniqstylz    1,048

How would one sell downloaded games?

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Aaron Olive    141

Grain of salt people, there is no Playstation.net and it's Pegi Eu stuff.

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trooper11    1,096

How would one sell downloaded games?

 

 

I suppose you could sell the codes for dlc sold that way.

 

Grain of salt people, there is no Playstation.net

 

 

Ah, so its a fake then?  Well that ends that.

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soniqstylz    1,048

Maybe this is about retail reselling.

 

I'd like to think so, but why wouldn't it already be in there for older TOS?

 

Even more odd is that it's legal BY LAW in Europe (where this TOS applies) to resell digital licenses.

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soniqstylz    1,048

Derp, had a look back at the FAQ sony released earlier:

 

http://blog.us.playstation.com/2013/10/30/ps4-the-ultimate-faq-north-america/#sect3

 

 
Does PS4 support used games?

Yes, similar to the PS3 system today, PS4 will not restrict players from playing disc-based used games. When a gamer buys a PS4 disc, they have right to use that copy of the game, so they can trade-in the game at retail, sell it to another person, lend it to a friend, or keep it forever. Furthermore, users will not have to go through activation steps or be charged usage fees when playing used disc-based games on their PS4 system.

Will any PS4 titles use an Online Pass?

First-party titles on PS4 (titles developed by Sony Computer Entertainment) will not use an Online Pass program. When it comes to third-party titles, PlayStation won?t dictate the strategy of publishers concerning Online Pass programs. However, most third parties have phased out the use of Online Pass systems, so they?re unlikely to appear on PS4.

Can PS4 customers lend and borrow games?

Yes, they can lend and borrow disc-based games without restriction.

Can PS4 customers trade and sell games?

Yes, they can trade and sell disc-based games freely.

 

 

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RageOfFury    335

It's a valid PlayStation website. This may only apply to Europe, but it's odd nonetheless.

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dead.cell    1,708

Yeah, take this with a huge grain of salt if anything. It also says that you cannot "broadcast it", which would defeat the whole point of the system's share button.

 

I'd say it'd be worth hitting Sony up for clarity, but overall, I'm pretty sure it's nothing. Maybe if someone tweets it to Yoshida, we can get a clear-cut reply?

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soniqstylz    1,048

nevermind, misread it.

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0nyX    259

I thought SONY would allow used disc-based games. Do i remember wrong?

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trooper11    1,096

I thought SONY would allow used disc-based games. Do i remember wrong?

 

 

No you remember correctly.

 

Maybe this was posted in error and that TOS was actually drawn up a while back, but has now been revised.

 

There have been rumors that Sony had been considering some sort of drm scheme that might have been similar to MS' but changed those plans partially after seeing the reaction to MS' plans.  If that was true at all, maybe this is an old TOS that reflected whatever system they had in mind.

 

Or maybe this is just some sort of typo in the TOS.

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+Audioboxer    2,874

This is in the PS3 TOS as well.

 

PlayStation?3 Game Discs
 
Game software is licensed for home use only on authorised PlayStation?3 systems in Europe, the Middle East, Africa and Oceania only
You may not lease, rent, sublicense, publish, modify, adapt, or translate any portion of the Game Software.
You may not use the Game Software commercially, broadcast it, charge for its use, use it in a public arcade or make other public performance of it without express permission from Sony Computer Entertainment Europe
To the fullest extent permitted by law, you may not reverse engineer, decompile, or disassemble any portion of the Game Software, or create any derivative works, or otherwise attempt to create Game Software source code from its object code.
You may not use any unauthorised, illegal, counterfeit, or modified hardware or software in connection with the Game Software to bypass, disable, or circumvent any encryption, security, or authentication mechanism for the PlayStation?3 system.
You may not resell Game Software unless expressly authorised by Sony Computer Entertainment Europe

 

 

 

4. Software is Licensed
4.1. All Software is licensed, not sold, which means you acquire rights to use the Software, as described in these Terms, but you do not acquire ownership of the Software. If you do not comply with these Terms, we can terminate your Software Licence which means you will no longer have the right to use the Software.
 
7. Resale
7.1. You must not resell either Disc-based Software or Software Downloads, unless expressly authorised by us and, if the publisher is another company, additionally by the publisher.

 

 

 

http://legaldoc.dl.playstation.net/ps3-eula/psn/e/e_tosua_en.html

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firey    3,555

Also, sony already gave permission at E3.   Their thing clearly states unless given express permission, which they already have done.

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+Audioboxer    2,874

Also, sony already gave permission at E3.   Their thing clearly states unless given express permission, which they already have done.

 

And if you need any more proof - https://twitter.com/yosp/status/399616172033069057

 

Best thing to come out of this is being able to read the comments section on the front page of Neowin. The title is the best "Sony to disallow resell or renting of PlayStation games after initially supporting it". Posted like a well researched fact.

 

And for even more giggles, this is on the back of the Motorstorm (and every other EU) PS3 game - Motorstorm was like a launch PS3 games http://i.imgur.com/195kpZB.jpg

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spacer    980

Yeah, this is pretty much a non-issue. It was in the PS3 TOS, and Sony has been crystal clear since E3 to now that you can sell and trade your games.

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trooper11    1,096

Yeah, definitely a non-issue.

 

Move along people.

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BajiRav    2,119

This is in the PS3 TOS as well.

 

 

 

 

 

http://legaldoc.dl.playstation.net/ps3-eula/psn/e/e_tosua_en.html

according to Neobond, those were updated recently too. Those terms were different in last month. He linked to this on front page.

 

This may mean that they were thinking of banning used games but reversed course but the lawyers forgot to update ToS.

 

Or the more likely scenario of them covering the "you don't own, only license" scene - more common with software.

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soniqstylz    1,048

This is in the PS3 TOS as well.

 

 

 

 

 

http://legaldoc.dl.playstation.net/ps3-eula/psn/e/e_tosua_en.html

 

That's the same file.

 

To be honest, what I'm thinking this pertains to is to buy a disc, burn copies and sell those.  It says you cannot resell your game without express permission -- but in the E3 video, E3 presentation, and in the recently released FAQ, they give express permission.

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Atomic Wanderer Chicken    1,584

This whole thread is overruled by Sony's official FAQ!

"Does PS4 support used games?

Yes, similar to the PS3 system today, PS4 will not restrict players from playing disc-based used games. When a gamer buys a PS4 disc, they have right to use that copy of the game, so they can trade-in the game at retail, sell it to another person, lend it to a friend, or keep it forever. Furthermore, users will not have to go through activation steps or be charged usage fees when playing used disc-based games on their PS4 system.

Will any PS4 titles use an Online Pass?

First-party titles on PS4 (titles developed by Sony Computer Entertainment) will not use an Online Pass program. When it comes to third-party titles, PlayStation won?t dictate the strategy of publishers concerning Online Pass programs. However, most third parties have phased out the use of Online Pass systems, so they?re unlikely to appear on PS4.

Can PS4 customers lend and borrow games?

Yes, they can lend and borrow disc-based games without restriction.

Can PS4 customers trade and sell games?

Yes, they can trade and sell disc-based games freely."

http://blog.us.playstation.com/2013/10/30/ps4-the-ultimate-faq-north-america/#sect3

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chrisj1968    1,415

The best thing is, is wait till the release days of each system and see where the dice lay. I'm not on the market nor inclined to purchase any new console. At my age, I'm no longer into being up with the latest and greatest. 

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D. S.    426

It just defines the default situation as "no selling unless authorized", which is seems like it is, at least as far as SONY is concerned, as opposed to "can sell unless specifically prohibited". The publisher part is trickier, but I don't think they would want all of the bad blood that comes with a absolutely no resell situation.

 

And I'm still buying a PS4.

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