Windows 9 Concept - A Tablet/Desktop Metro Firefox

[MorganX]

Honestly, I think that is a good view point to have. A lot these guys seem to think they know exactly why something is wrong and (I'm answering their criticism) yet I don't see them offering any explanation to their criticism. And once one person says something negative others will join in easily.

 

Some of the criticism is trite and somewhat vitriolic but sometimes, with design, a person just doesn't like it and it's up to the designer to figure out why. Keep in mind, even those that don't like Modern UI, no one can deny it is minimal, neat, and orderly for the most part. A very busy UI probably seems like a step backwards.

[pmrd]

I beg you please stay away from any design or graphics job. You have no taste. This is simply the ugliest concept i've seen in a long time

[Pulagatha]

You asked for feedback, we gave constructed criticism. If you can't take it, then please leave. We are not here to kiss you and praise your work. You have ruined "Metro" if you think this is what Microsoft is going to turn towards. Too many colors, no flat UI, the buttons are all "old fashioned" Why is the bookmark PANE not able to be hidden? Why are the tabs all icons only, I have multiple videos open if I need to show my class multiple videos. Stop using ad hominem attacks.

 

I presented something. I wanted to see what people would say. I don't think a lot of this criticism is constructive. Microsoft wants to make a unified interface for both Desktop and Metro. I've seen some others do something like this and I wanted to see what it looked like so I put it together. I've had a few nice comments. There are others that don't like it. I keep wanting the criticism to be more constructive than it is.

 

There is a button to hide the bookmarks pane in the top bar.

 

And although I don't have it on here, Firefox could easily have an option to set to icons or titles/icons for tabs.

 

Also, "You have ruined Metro." Ad hominem. I think Metro could be a little bit more diverse. I would have done something different with the icons, but I think in general Metro should borrow more from the desktop.

[Pulagatha]

Some of the criticism is trite and somewhat vitriolic but sometimes, with design, a person just doesn't like it and it's up to the designer to figure out why. Keep in mind, even those that don't like Modern UI, no one can deny it is minimal, neat, and orderly for the most part. A very busy UI probably seems like a step backwards.

 

When it comes to style, I think it's hard to define what someone does or doesn't like about it. I think this is what is going on right now with the agitation with Windows 8. The comments over on Reddit have been lighting up every week for the last month or so, every time someone posts a new headline on the technology forum.

[Pulagatha]

I beg you please stay away from any design or graphics job. You have no taste. This is simply the ugliest concept i've seen in a long time

 

 

What was the last one you saw?

[Dot Matrix]

:x :x :x :x

 

That might just be one of the ugliest things i've seen this week.

Wait a minute. Do Warwagon and I actually agree on something???

[Pulagatha]

:x :x :x :x

 

That might just be one of the ugliest things i've seen this week.

 

I'm happy to disappoint you. Could you imagine if either of us was the authority on beauty?

[pmrd]

I'm happy to disappoint you. Could you imagine if either of us was the authority on beauty?

 

You can be the authority on bad design. You have my vote

[Pulagatha]

You can be the authority on bad design. You have my vote

 

That was a very well constructed comment. Show the forum something you've designed? People will complain no matter what, we're all critical thinkers. The goal is to get the complaining down to the lowest level possible with the smallest complaints. Customization helps. I wish I had chosen flat icons before I put this up. But the criticisms regardless, haven't been that bad.

[GarakObama]

The taskbar looks like Gnome 2

[Roberticus]

"Not having to memorize where all the buttons are" - HOW does a making buttons pull up from a off screen gesture help find a solution to that!?!!!?

 

 

And I've seen that video. Fierce Reductionism. Even if it removes the basic components of the program?!?!? A Program is not a painting. If it was there wouldn't be the word "Interface."

Because you always know that all the apps will have the buttons when swiping from the bottom, and settings when swiping from the right. Imagine the mess if all apps would freely choose to put buttons and settings wherever they wanted.

 

Well since you're using a program in the first place that seems like a moot point. I am more so just not a fan of off screen swiping gestures. I do think Hidden UI should be avoided, if it can be. Especially for the core components of a program.

Take Modern version of Internet Explorer, when I surf on my tablet I want to see the page I'm surfing on. I don't need the web address and back button when I'm reading news and looking at pictures. If I want to go back/forward on the page I just swipe in that direction. It feels natural to me nowadays to swipe up from the bottom if I need to change something.

 

Another example: Bing maps, if I want to change settings (eg. satellite view) then I change that and check the map without borders/additional buttons.

Thing being: Content is the primary focus, not the tools. In the design you showed the tools take the focus away from the content. 

When I'm on my desktop (such as now), I use the desktop like I've always used. I mainly use Startscreen as a "home page" of information (And pinned all my games there, as to not clutter the desktop). Trying to force those two into one thing is in my opinion a bad idea.

Question: Would you want to use your UI on a tablet such as Surface? If Windows 9 would turn into this my usability on Surface would go backwards, not forward.

[Pulagatha]

Because you always know that all the apps will have the buttons when swiping from the bottom, and settings when swiping from the right.

 

Take Modern version of Internet Explorer, when I surf on my tablet I want to see the page I'm surfing on. I don't need the web address and back button when I'm reading news and looking at pictures. If I want to go back/forward on the page I just swipe in that direction. It feels natural to me nowadays to swipe up from the bottom if I need to change something.

 

Another example: Bing maps, if I want to change settings (eg. satellite view) then I change that and check the map without borders/additional buttons.

Thing being: Content is the primary focus, not the tools. In the design you showed the tools take the focus away from the content. 

When I'm on my desktop (such as now), I use the desktop like I've always used. I mainly use Startscreen as a "home page" of information (And pinned all my games there, as to not clutter the desktop). Trying to force those two into one thing is in my opinion a bad idea.

Question: Would you want to use your UI on a tablet such as Surface? If Windows 9 would turn into this my usability on Surface would go backwards, not forward.

 

One of the best posts I've read.

 

"Imagine the mess if all apps would freely choose to put buttons and settings wherever they wanted."

Yes, you have to keep things minimal. I just think Metro went too far with the off screen swiping gestures. I have used other programs where the controls are brought up simply by touching the display area. I still think there should be basic utility buttons on an interface.

 

"Thing being: Content is the primary focus, not the tools."

 

Usage I think should be the primary focus. Content should come second.

 

"I mainly use Startscreen as a "home page" of information"

 

This I think is where the Start Screen could shine. If Microsoft added more functionality to the Start Screen I think it would really take off. RSS Feeds. Toggles. System Information Display. I think people would enjoy the Start Screen very much with these additions.

 

"Question: Would you want to use your UI on a tablet such as Surface? If Windows 9 would turn into this my usability on Surface would go backwards, not forward."

I would use this concept on a tablet, I'd make it a little more minimal though. Change the iconography to something more in line with Metro. Unify the top bar (except for the caption buttons on a desktop, the mobile wouldn't have caption buttons) One of things I've been thinking about as I've posted this is how on the iPhone everything is accessible from the address bar. The address bar that minimizes as you read down, but brings up the controls as you go up. One on screen button that leads to all other functions. There are things I'd still change. On an iPad, I would do the Tabs animation differently. If I were to to this specifically for Metro I would use a icon/ title right aligned headlines for each tab that popped up right under the address bar and outside the content area that would still be sectioned off by a border. I wish there were more borders in Metro.

[Dot Matrix]

Usage I think should be the primary focus. Content should come second.

 

Content should never come second, the whole point of running the application is for the content, not the controls.

 

I don't open up my browser to stare at forward/back buttons or address bars, I run the application because I want to browse the web. I don't open up Paint.net to stare at a plethora of buttons and menus, I open up Paint.net to edit an image. I don't open up Word to stare at a Ribbon, I open up Word because I want to edit a document. Etc...

 

Having unified controls will help increase usage. I can open up any Windows 8 application, and I instantly know where the controls are going to be, and what they are going to do. I can open up any Windows 8 application, and immediately get to work. There's no need to thumb around and figure out what is what, and where it's located. Best of all, they're out of my way until I need them. A quick mouse movement to the upper right corner, and I have my settings. A quick right click in the application, and I have my feature options. 

[Roberticus]

Yes, you have to keep things minimal. I just think Metro went too far with the off screen swiping gestures. I have used other programs where the controls are brought up simply by touching the display area. I still think there should be basic utility buttons on an interface.

The Video apps such as Netflix do that, same principle there as web browser where tools come out when needed. If you have a tiny screen (such as 8" Dell Venue Pro), would you use part of the screen for showing something static or let the content take over the whole screen? As in have buttons show all the time while scrolling down a page?

 

Usage I think should be the primary focus. Content should come second.

Here I have to disagree, as Dot Matrix said the very reason why we use the programs and/or apps is for the content.

Yes it should be easy to access the content and use said content, which in my opinion is already in eg. Modern IE, just takes some time to get used to it. You'll get the hang of it in no time! I for example didn't really like the way the browser worked in windows 8, but they changed the usage in 8.1. Now it is all in the marrow, I don't have to think anymore on the gestures and swiping, it all comes naturally.

**

"This I think is where the Start Screen could shine. If Microsoft added more functionality to the Start Screen I think it would really take off. RSS Feeds. Toggles. System Information Display. I think people would enjoy the Start Screen very much with these additions."

- Haven't checked, but aren't there RSS feed apps that allow you to see the headlines in live tiles? Not using RSS feeds myself so can't comment more on that. System Information Display, what kind of information would you want to see? 

I think people need to stop looking at Start Screen as a Start menu replacement, where the menu was just a menu of programs to start. Rather look at it as Both a launcher and information feed (how many mails, weather forecast etc etc).

For short: Start Screen: first screen you see after you start the device with all information = Good. Start menu: List of programs you start = Bad.

 

"I would use this concept on a tablet, I'd make it a little more minimal though. Change the iconography to something more in line with Metro. Unify the top bar (except for the caption buttons on a desktop, the mobile wouldn't have caption buttons) One of things I've been thinking about as I've posted this is how on the iPhone everything is accessible from the address bar. The address bar that minimizes as you read down, but brings up the controls as you go up. One on screen button that leads to all other functions. There are things I'd still change. On an iPad, I would do the Tabs animation differently. If I were to to this specifically for Metro I would use a icon/ title right aligned headlines for each tab that popped up right under the address bar and outside the content area that would still be sectioned off by a border. I wish there were more borders in Metro."

Then I suggest you work on your design with the information you have right here! Design is all about iteration after iteration until it's good! :)

**Quoting messed up

[Pulagatha]

Having unified controls will help increase usage. I can open up any Windows 8 application, and I instantly know where the controls are going to be, and what they are going to do. I can open up any Windows 8 application, and immediately get to work. There's no need to thumb around and figure out what is what, and where it's located. Best of all, they're out of my way until I need them. A quick mouse movement to the upper right corner, and I have what I need. A quick right click in the application, and I have even more options. 

 

I read the answer to the comment above on another forum just before I came here and read it.

 

Because everyone is not as familiar with these paradigms as you are. This is suppose to be an interface for all people and these design elements you love to rattle on about how people just don't "get it" everyone else isn't familiar with these paradigms. Metro is supposed to be ease of access from Microsoft, but these designs don't make any sense for the intended audience which is anyone who wants a simplified interface in the first place. Hidden UI means you have to look for it in the first place. Horizontal Scrolling is not what ninth/tenths of the internet is using. Another example, which I would love for some one to explain to me, why does a minus button in the lower right corner lead to a main menu in certain Metro programs? Who knows what that is? Someone who has barely used a computer has no reference to these things. These elements would come off as annoying. Also, the Hot Corners. More Hidden UI. It's not about a design aesthetic at this point, it's about them making up stuff as they go along.

 

Style Second. Function First.

 

Usage First. Content Second.

[Brandon Live Veteran]

I posted my concept for merging the Metro and Desktop environments here:

http://brandonlive.com/2014/01/31/what-i-want-metro-desktop-fusion-edition/

[Pulagatha]

 

"I would use this concept on a tablet, I'd make it a little more minimal though. Change the iconography to something more in line with Metro. Unify the top bar (except for the caption buttons on a desktop, the mobile wouldn't have caption buttons) One of things I've been thinking about as I've posted this is how on the iPhone everything is accessible from the address bar. The address bar that minimizes as you read down, but brings up the controls as you go up. One on screen button that leads to all other functions. There are things I'd still change. On an iPad, I would do the Tabs animation differently. If I were to to this specifically for Metro I would use a icon/ title right aligned headlines for each tab that popped up right under the address bar and outside the content area that would still be sectioned off by a border. I wish there were more borders in Metro."

 

Then I suggest you work on your design with the information you have right here! Design is all about iteration after iteration until it's good! :)

**Quoting messed up

 

 

I agree. Technically, I didn't want to show this concept, but something I saw changed my mind. What I really like about this concept is the Task Bar, but I also did the Firefox thing and got curious for some reason.

[Pulagatha]

I posted my concept for merging the Metro and Desktop environments here:

http://brandonlive.com/2014/01/31/what-i-want-metro-desktop-fusion-edition/

 

For me, I just want them to keep that desktop frame window so much.

[Roberticus]

I read the answer to the comment above on another forum just before I came here and read it.

 

Because everyone is not as familiar with these paradigms as you are. This is suppose to be an interface for all people and these design elements you love to rattle on about how people just don't "get it" everyone else isn't familiar with these paradigms. Metro is supposed to be ease of access from Microsoft, but these designs don't make any sense for the intended audience which is anyone who wants a simplified interface in the first place. Hidden UI means you have to look for it in the first place. Horizontal Scrolling is not what ninth/tenths of the internet is using. Another example, which I would love for some one to explain to me, why does a minus button in the lower right corner lead to a main menu in certain Metro programs? Who knows what that is? Someone who has barely used a computer has no reference to these things. These elements would come off as annoying. Also, the Hot Corners. More Hidden UI. It's not about a design aesthetic at this point, it's about them making up stuff as they go along.

 

Style Second. Function First.

 

Usage First. Content Second.

Microsofts biggest problem: education. I have friends that didn't like or understand Windows 8, but once I showed them how it's done they said after a few days they wouldn't go back to windows 7. If Microsoft made it clear from the start on what gestures to do and what to swipe, people wouldn't dislike windows 8 so much. Kind of like the intro video in the weather app on where to find stuff.

[Dot Matrix]

I read the answer to the comment above on another forum just before I came here and read it.

 

Because everyone is not as familiar with these paradigms as you are. This is suppose to be an interface for all people and these design elements you love to rattle on about how people just don't "get it" everyone else isn't familiar with these paradigms.

It's an interface for no one. Like I said above, users open up a browser to browse the web, not look at a dozen and some controls, menus, and links. The concept you have here is more than halfway cluttered with controls no one needs on their screen constantly.

 

Metro is supposed to be ease of access from Microsoft, but these designs don't make any sense for the intended audience which is anyone who wants a simplified interface in the first place. Hidden UI means you have to look for it in the first place.

And? In Windows 8, you only have to look for controls once. They're all in the same spot, no matter what app you're using. Once you memorize the hot corners (not hard to do), you're all set.

 

Horizontal Scrolling is not what ninth/tenths of the internet is using.

And?

 

Another example, which I would love for some one to explain to me, why does a minus button in the lower right corner lead to a main menu in certain Metro programs? Who knows what that is?

The "minus button" to which you are referring to zooms the tiles out, it is not the All Apps button. Or are you referring to the "..." element? It's pretty universally known and embedded in user's minds that "..." identifies more options.

 

Someone who has barely used a computer has no reference to these things. These elements would come off as annoying. Also, the Hot Corners. More Hidden UI. It's not about a design aesthetic at this point, it's about them making up stuff as they go along.

Someone who has barely used a computer is going to find everything annoying. You could sit someone in front of Windows 7, and they'll be just as frustrated. For example, guess what they need to do to change the desktop wallpaper? If you guessed 'invoke a hidden menu', you'd be right.

 

Style Second. Function First.

 

Usage First. Content Second.

And again, I disagree. The sole purpose of an application is to display content. Content comes first. Always. Going back to your concept, there's two things my eyes are immediately drawn to, bookmarks and actual web content. I can tell you right now, I'm not in a browser to stare at bookmarks all day. You're limiting usage, by cluttering the screen.

[MorganX]

I posted my concept for merging the Metro and Desktop environments here:

http://brandonlive.com/2014/01/31/what-i-want-metro-desktop-fusion-edition/

 

You just can't get me on board with Windows Modern UI apps. Let's start with pinning to the taskbar and some way to auto-start MUI apps. That may be enough. Windowing MUI apps in lieu of pinning ... just why bother? Just stick with Win32. Will devs scale to a Win32 scalable window and random apect or snap views? A well designed snap view is far superior to a resized Win32 app any day of the week in my book.

[chrisj1968]

Excuse my non graphical abilities but for the installation of Windows 9.. then it installs accordingly. Everyone can be happyand everyone has the OS setup as they use and need. no one needs to feel encroached upon and it installs according to your choice. We desktop users can get their Aero back too maybe.

 

[Dot Matrix]

Excuse my non graphical abilities but for the installation of Windows 9.. then it installs accordingly. Everyone can be happyand everyone has the OS setup as they use and need. no one needs to feel encroached upon and it installs according to your choice. We desktop users can get their Aero back too maybe.

 

And then what? Microsoft has now two individual user sets to keep happy. Now doubling their work, and increasing support (and by extension, costs). That's never going to work to segregate users. I don't know why people keep suggesting this.

 

It's not that hard to select the desktop tile upon wakeup, and it takes less than ten seconds to select desktop at boot if you wish.

[Dot Matrix]

You just can't get me on board with Windows Modern UI apps. Let's start with pinning to the taskbar and some way to auto-start MUI apps. That may be enough. Windowing MUI apps in lieu of pinning ... just why bother? Just stick with Win32. Will devs scale to a Win32 scalable window and random apect or snap views? A well designed snap view is far superior to a resized Win32 app any day of the week in my book.

The only downside to Win32 applications, is they're kludgy, and relay on a plethora of legacy technologies (that need installed separately, creating their own issues) to run. Modern applications don't. They're slim, they clean up fast, and they're more efficient on system performance.

[jasondefaoite]

Sorry, just don't like the UI of the mock up personally. For whatever reason, I get a windows 95/98/2k vibe from it.