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I have no opinion on the topic at hand because I'm staying out of this gen. But man, he bothers me.

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This guy really creeped me out, whats with the black suit and gloves and bright green tie? Also a bunch of toys/action figures/dolls sitting in-front of him?

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This guy really creeped me out, whats with the black suit and gloves and bright green tie? Also a bunch of toys/action figures/dolls sitting in-front of him?

The suit is part of his persona I suppose and the dolls are stuff fans send in. Those dolls are among the mild stuff he receives unlike dragon dildos (yep, that is a thing) and fury porn for example.

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What's important to me about a potential indie based future is the wealth and diversity of games. A full store is a happy store. Sure Jim's point about steam greenlighting is valid but I want a console that can "rival" a PC for the amount of games at my fingertips.

AAA releases cannot provide this, especially with budgets of them closing down studios and resulting in layoffs a few times a year.

I also really wanted to post arse in a topic title and see if it was allowed :p

 

Amen. Being able to load a store and pick through a wealth of relatively low priced, pretty much unheard of indy games in a variety of genres is a must. I spent more on cheap indy games combined that any AAA titles and enjoyed them more too.

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Well we are probably still a generation away from a console that can truly rival a pc in terms of indie games. Not just quantity, but also pricing wise.

PC gaming is far ahead of consoles in areas like indie gaming, digital only marketplaces, and mod support.

We're going in the right direction though :)

First step is to win the devs minds over and get them actually wanting to work on consoles (some of those indie devs are tough cookies with only bad words to say about consoles).

Second step us pricing, but as Jim is praising in the video the PS+ initiative is a good step in that direction. "Free" games.

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Exactly, regardless of the reasons, there are so many out there to pick that the end result is the same. Take all the reasons and put them together to equal one big fail moment. Its a failure of a new launch and the people have spoken.

Spending hours to break down this stuff is a huge waste of time when you don't even need that much time to spell it out.

Yeah, Sony was smart in how they handled pr. They tout gaming as number one while they push forward on the non gaming media side of things behind the scenes. The less they talked about that, at least at the beginning, the better.

MS made a terrible mistake leading with discussion of non gaming media features.

The main difference is only 2fold... A blundered reveal and $100 (I personally think the $100 diff speaks volumes)

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This guy really creeped me out, whats with the black suit and gloves and bright green tie? Also a bunch of toys/action figures/dolls sitting in-front of him?

First thing I thought.

 

This guys opinion is as credited as you and I, it should be taken with a grain of salt. I don't get the indie points though, MS are making every console a dev-kit, that's far and beyond anything else. Sony have just been quick to game and more ready.

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First thing I thought.

 

This guys opinion is as credited as you and I, it should be taken with a grain of salt. I don't get the indie points though, MS are making every console a dev-kit, that's far and beyond anything else. Sony have just been quick to game and more ready.

I have to agree with your second point, I thought MS were praised for the work they had done to try and invite indie game devs? I thought the process was made easier and as pointed above, every XB1 could be a dev kit?

 

As much as that guy annoy's the hell out of me, he does have some valid points. I just don't subscribe to the thought that the XB1 is doing badly at the moment, is the PS4 kicking the XB1's ass in terms of sales, certainly. Does it really mean anything other than that, no, not to me.

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First thing I thought.

 

This guys opinion is as credited as you and I, it should be taken with a grain of salt. I don't get the indie points though, MS are making every console a dev-kit, that's far and beyond anything else. Sony have just been quick to game and more ready.

MS have continually shafted indie games, they continually put them back on the 360 and hid them away and as said in the video, if you wanted to release an indie game you had to jump through hurdles and agree to insane licensing deals.

 

That said I think the jimquisition guy is a bit overly full of himself, he raised some good points but the ego just makes him unlistenable.

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What he meant is that indie games taken alone don't sell systems but when you consider all of them as a single entity then yes they can sell systems. Indie games are one of the reason why PC gaming has made a return and is stronger than ever. Hell it's one of the reason i started to play PC games again. Those indie games on XBox Live were always 15$ while i could get them for 5$ on Steam 2-3 times every year.

 

The thing is indie games generally have very low system reqs, since they're made by people without resources to make AAA graphics(those who claim to be indie devs and still make 50 million + games aren't truly indie as such). As such, most people play indie games on the PC, not because they're not on the console, but because. they're cheaper on the PC and their PC can handle them, even their cheap surfing laptop. 

 

so no, even as a whole they don't really sell systems. 

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MS have continually shafted indie games, they continually put them back on the 360 and hid them away and as said in the video, if you wanted to release an indie game you had to jump through hurdles and agree to insane licensing deals.

 

That said I think the jimquisition guy is a bit overly full of himself, he raised some good points but the ego just makes him unlistenable.

 

And all that has WHAT to do with indie games on the One ? free to develop, free to distribute, any device a dev kit, free dev support from MS, free access to any number of dev seminars. and even if they're not as prominent as the Arcade games, which we don't know yet, arcade devs pay and pay for a license and distribution

 

Using that argument you could just as well argue that "Well Sony was hacked once(twice technically, but the second time was less relevant), so it's a system to avoid".  and even though some people use that argument they're not people to be taken seriously. not as long as Sony can prove they have improved at least, though it is argumentation thatyou should at least use different passwords on Sony's services :)

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And all that has WHAT to do with indie games on the One ? free to develop, free to distribute, any device a dev kit, free dev support from MS, free access to any number of dev seminars. and even if they're not as prominent as the Arcade games, which we don't know yet, arcade devs pay and pay for a license and distribution

 

Using that argument you could just as well argue that "Well Sony was hacked once(twice technically, but the second time was less relevant), so it's a system to avoid".  and even though some people use that argument they're not people to be taken seriously. not as long as Sony can prove they have improved at least, though it is argumentation thatyou should at least use different passwords on Sony's services :)

It's got to do with past history.

If you went to a grocery store and it was revealed they were ripping all their customers off, then they stopped doing that and had the cheapest prices around, majority of people wouldn't go there because of the history. MS used to screw indie devs around, why would people want to get enticed in that when they can see sony used to push them forwards in their previous console and their current console. It's got EVERYTHING to do with it.

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It's got to do with past history.

If you went to a grocery store and it was revealed they were ripping all their customers off, then they stopped doing that and had the cheapest prices around, majority of people wouldn't go there because of the history. MS used to screw indie devs around, why would people want to get enticed in that when they can see sony used to push them forwards in their previous console and their current console. It's got EVERYTHING to do with it.

 

This is partially true...  BUT, a TON of these Indies got their fame from, releasing on the 360.  Don't bite the hand that fed you.  Even if that hand is an iron fist.

 No matter how much it sucked to work with Microsoft (and I'm sure it does suck to partner with them, considering their jump through hoops ways.  You better take the opportunity to do so. Because I'm pretty sure that there is someone who is grinding away and would gladly take the headache to get their game out there to as many people as possible.

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The thing is indie games generally have very low system reqs, since they're made by people without resources to make AAA graphics(those who claim to be indie devs and still make 50 million + games aren't truly indie as such). As such, most people play indie games on the PC, not because they're not on the console, but because. they're cheaper on the PC and their PC can handle them, even their cheap surfing laptop. 

 

so no, even as a whole they don't really sell systems. 

 

You forget people play them because they also WANT to play them. People don't play Rogue Legacy only because their notebook can handle it. They play it cause it's better than 90% of the ""AAA"" titles out there.

 

If you got an handful of indie games the other system doesn't have yes i believe it can make a difference.

 

If you got [time] exclusives like Rogue Legacy, Terraria and such and you got lot of them as a whole it can become a system seller providing you make enough sales and give enough freebies which is part of his point when he talks about PSN+.

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We're going in the right direction though :)

First step is to win the devs minds over and get them actually wanting to work on consoles (some of those indie devs are tough cookies with only bad words to say about consoles).

Second step us pricing, but as Jim is praising in the video the PS+ initiative is a good step in that direction. "Free" games.

Definitely true.

I still wonder about the long term success of so many of these indie games showing up for free with ps+.

I know Sony is paying these developers in order to offer the games this way, but I wonder if that amount is big enough to still encourage developers to make the effort to come to a console. I'd love to know what the numbers are of people actually buying indie games outside of ps+

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That is probably the worst and yet funniest video I have seen this year. He couldn't be anymore pathetic, and yes....clueless.

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MS have continually shafted indie games, they continually put them back on the 360 and hid them away and as said in the video, if you wanted to release an indie game you had to jump through hurdles and agree to insane licensing deals.

 

That said I think the jimquisition guy is a bit overly full of himself, he raised some good points but the ego just makes him unlistenable.

The only policy which I can even think about which may result in this is the parity one. Even with that MS have been working with developers to get around it. For example, Outlast got announced yesterday and is already out on the PS4.

 

With Jonathan Blow and the other indie developers I've seen make public statements, it just seems like they're being childish and throwing their toys out of the pram when MS won't do everything they get asked. I'd love to have more context behind it, but after watching the Indie Documentary which stars Jonathan Blow, he seems like a complete arrogant arse.

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