Windows 8 RT: Why no love?

[tsupersonic]

I know this is resurrecting a dead thread but I had to comment on this.

 

Can you use any of those things OOTB on Android or iOS, or do you need an app on those platforms as well. BTW the Netflix app on Windows RT also runs on Windows 8, no Silverlight needed.

 

WP and Windows RT app stores are growing, developers go where the money is and if that money is in rival platforms then guess what happens with WP and Windows RT. If you look in the Store then you'll find that many of those "major apps" are starting to appear now.

 

Yes, I agree iTunes is crap but Windows RT doesn't need it unlike the iPad. I guess you don't even own a Tablet running Windows RT otherwise you would know that:

 

1. You can mount phones and tablets on Windows RT to show in Explorer just like you can on Windows, which brings me onto

2. Windows RT devices don't need to connect to a PC as they are essentially an ARM based PC anyway, unlike the iOS and Android toys that require PC connectivity.

 

Windows RT WILL merge with WP at some point, WP8.1 already has some of the APIs implemented, but the full merge of the two won't happen until WP9. Windows RT doesn't need a Gmail app as Gmail support is built into both Outlook 2013 and the built in Mail app. Youtube is also covered with Metrotube. Windows RT doesn't really require apps for Gmail or Youtube when you have full desktop browsing, complete with Flash support built in. Microsoft and Google will only play better when Google wants to, Microsoft apps are already available on Android.

Did you read my comment and the comment of the poster I was responding to? Of course you can't use any of those things OOTB on any OS, that was my whole point. You didn't read the part about Netflix clearly - on a Windows 8 computer (or any Windows desktop OS), you need Silverlight. On Windows RT, you need only the Netflix app. 

 

I'm waiting for bigger apps to still appear on the Windows store...It is no where close to Android or iOS, and you can't deny that.

 

Where did I say that you can't mount phones and tablets on Windows RT? I simply stated I don't like iTunes and like to have the ability to use drag/drop files in Explorer. I'm simply stating I hate software like iTunes to manage my devices. Not seeing how your second point is relevant - you don't have to connect a Android/iOS device much like you don't have to connect a Win. RT device to a computer to use them...You can use cloud services or other mechanisms to transfer files, etc. I have an iPad and don't hook it up to my computer ever, same with my Nexus 7.

 

I don't care whose fault it is - Google v. Microsoft. It makes the consumers lose at the end of the day. I'm not saying it's not possible to get Gmail/Youtube working in Win. RT. I would just prefer first party apps. All of this just leads to Windows 8 RT being a suboptimal experience.

[neo158]

Did you read my comment and the comment of the poster I was responding to? Of course you can't use any of those things OOTB on any OS, that was my whole point. You didn't read the part about Netflix clearly - on a Windows 8 computer (or any Windows desktop OS), you need Silverlight. On Windows RT, you need only the Netflix app. 

 

I'm waiting for bigger apps to still appear on the Windows store...It is no where close to Android or iOS, and you can't deny that.

 

Where did I say that you can't mount phones and tablets on Windows RT? I simply stated I don't like iTunes and like to have the ability to use drag/drop files in Explorer. I'm simply stating I hate software like iTunes to manage my devices. Not seeing how your second point is relevant - you don't have to connect a Android/iOS device much like you don't have to connect a Win. RT device to a computer to use them...You can use cloud services or other mechanisms to transfer files, etc. I have an iPad and don't hook it up to my computer ever, same with my Nexus 7.

 

I don't care whose fault it is - Google v. Microsoft. It makes the consumers lose at the end of the day. I'm not saying it's not possible to get Gmail/Youtube working in Win. RT. I would just prefer first party apps. All of this just leads to Windows 8 RT being a suboptimal experience.

 

You obviously missed the part where I stated that the SAME Netflix app from RT works on Windows 8 i.e. no Silverlight required. You also don't need Silverlight to use Netflix using the Web Browser on Windows RT either.

 

What "bigger apps" are missing, granted the app store isn't as big as iOS and Android but as I said developers go where the money is.

 

That's up to Google, they have no intention of developing apps for Windows or Windows Phone other than a ###### search app for both Windows 8 and WP. Microsoft tried to help by developing a YouTube app for WP and Google decided, ads issue aside, to restrict WP to HTML5 rather than a dedicated app like on iOS and Android. So now I and other WP users have said ###### Google and their BS and have moved to other services instead.

[tsupersonic]

You obviously missed the part where I stated that the SAME Netflix app from RT works on Windows 8 i.e. no Silverlight required. You also don't need Silverlight to use Netflix using the Web Browser on Windows RT either.

 

What "bigger apps" are missing, granted the app store isn't as big as iOS and Android but as I said developers go where the money is.

 

That's up to Google, they have no intention of developing apps for Windows or Windows Phone other than a ###### search app for both Windows 8 and WP. Microsoft tried to help by developing a YouTube app for WP and Google decided, ads issue aside, to restrict WP to HTML5 rather than a dedicated app like on iOS and Android. So now I and other WP users have said ###### Google and their BS and have moved to other services instead.

Ok, fair. The point still is that OS's no matter mobile or desktop really need additional apps for true functionality, whether it be the Silverlight plugin or the Netflix app. I think I posted some samples, not going to reiterate what apps I'd be missing. 

 

That's fine, use what services suit you best. Tying the knot to one company definitely has its advantages, but you can also get royally screwed over. I still blame both companies for screwing over WP customers. It's one reason I can't switch to WP again now. 

[Deihmos]

The RT should be killed off and focus on x64.

[PGHammer]

The RT should be killed off and focus on x64.

Why?  Microsoft is one of the ONLY developers with ANY focus on x64 for non-gaming non-niche software - remember, the bread-and-butter productivity suite (Office) has been x64 since 2010, and an x64 version of Windows itself was STANDARD when Vista went RTM.  (Look at everyone else - other than indie developers, such as the VLC team, who else has an x64 version of their "flagship" software for Windows available today?  How many of Adobe's applications are x64, for example?) For all your complaints about Microsoft, even Microsoft is doing FAR more than anyone else - let alone everyone else.

 

I migrated to x64 at the first opportunity, and specifically with the aforementioned Vista (Ultimate) x64 - how many folks refused to move - not only refused to move to Vista, but even refused to crossgrade to XP64, which was actually given away?

 

RT isn't the problem, any more than ModernUI (as either UX or UI) was the problem with Windows 8 and later - the bigger problem is users finding every reason under the moon - not merely the sun - to not move, even if the reason itself defies not only logic, but common sense.

[neo158]

The RT should be killed off and focus on x64.

That will only happen when Intel has an x64 processor that has the power saving of ARM processors i.e. never!!!!

[Dashel]

 

You are highly generalizing users and how they use their devices. If a device works out of the box, good for you. For me, when I install Windows on a computer, I download and install other software, whether it be from Microsoft or third party apps, much like I would on any tablet (iPad or Android). Out of the box no device is perfect for me (whether it's a computer or tablet or phone).

 

I'm generalizing 'general' users, your specific use case isn't what I'm speaking to.  As such, your post is a perfect example of what I'm talking about when you start conflating your needs with the very basic needs of a user.  (Phone/Email/Texting/Cloud Integration, etc) You didn't answer my question, do people on average have to install more or less software than they used to? 

[DConnell Member]

 

Can you for example, use Netflix out of the box on a Windows 8 device or Windows RT? Nope. You need either Silverlight (desktop) or the Netflix app (Windows RT). Can your run a terminal emulator (PuTTY, JuiceSSH, etc.) out of the box? Can you setup a Cisco VPN out of the box? Can it run Citrix apps out of the box? Does it include media apps that support Chromecast out of the box? Does it include Xbox smartglass out of the box? Can it sync with my smartwatch (Basis app) out of the box? Can I run Steam out of the box? Is there a GoPro integration out of the box? I could keep going about the apps I regularly use..Games are a big part of the tablet experience. If you don't play them, fine, but I do, and so do millions of others. Have you stopped and just thought about how there is a whole freaking industry that is building apps, and how profitable they are? Clearly you haven't put any thought into that. Tablets to me are all about entertainment and the quick check in to work when I'm on call. 

 

 

Actually, you can use Netflix on the Surface RT without the app - I've done it. Went to the web site in the desktop version of IE, started a video, and it played just fine on the TV I had connected with HDMI. So apparently Netflix is no longer dependent on Silverlight. Not to mention built-in support for a lot (though admittedly not all) websites that use Flash. Good luck getting them to run in iOS's browser.

 

Meanwhile I was typing away on the primary screen - how many other tablet OSs support multiple screens? :punk:

 

IIRC the Surface did have Smartglass preinstalled. I might be mistaken, though - I installed a lot of stuff the first couple days I have my SurfRT.

 

So yeah, you can do some of the stuff you mentioned out of the box. And apps do exist for some of the rest - Citrix, terminal emulators. And with the superior keyboard and mouse support of RT, they work better than the iOS and Android ones. It's certainly true of Teamviewer - I'd hate to try to run it on my Galaxy Tab, but it's excellent on the Surface.

 

Is there a Steam client for iOS or Android that runs the games? Without the games working, a Steam client is kind of pointless, don't you think? I just remote into my tower to play those games, BTW.

 

And while I agree that games are an important part of the tablet experience, it's not a deal breaker for me if particular titles aren't available. There's enough games that are available - or even unique to RT - that I can have still have my diversion.

 

IMO for more serious stuff, the apps - either RT versions of the main ones or good substitutes -  are already there. It seems to come down to games, and like i said, I'm not going to base my tablet choice on how many versions of Angry Birds are available for it.

 

You say the good stuff isn't available. Other than particular games, what's missing? Well apart from Google not wanting to share their toys, that is. But Netflix, Kindle, Nook, Facebook - a lot of the big stuff is there.

[PGHammer]

- poor touch support

- No GPS for directions, weather reports, etc (surface)

- no apps (Not even Windows mobile)

- poor battery life

- no app compatibility with x86

- expensive

- no compatibility with windows phone

What is RT? It's not a mobile OS. It is a desktop but cannot run desktop apps??

If windows RT== Windows Phone I would buy it.

Sounds like you want a phablet - a tablet with smartphone features.  It's not that it's impossible; it is that phones (even dumb/feature phones) have long been able to do things that tablets (regardless of OS) have been blocked from.  GPS/geolocation is doable on Windows - in fact, Windows 7 can do it using nothing more than software available for free.  Windows 8+ lets you do it out of the box - via INCLUDED features AND software - you merely have to go wireless (as opposed to wired) - I PERSONALLY did it in the Consumer Preview, and that feature hasn't left since.  However, as soon as it was demonstrated, the screaming began.  "Privacy, privacy, privacy."  Never mind that the feature doesn't work with WIRED connectivity (it also fails with VPNs, by design).  Also, with phablets, you usually can't use wi-fi and keep all the features (that is because the carriers want to keep you shackled to their data plans - name one carrier that will let you VOIP on Skype or Viber with a phablet without using a data plan.  (This is something that the Lumia 2520 or any Surface RT supports out of the box - however, it's the carriers - not Microsoft, or Nokia before Microsoft acquired the Handset group - that has the feature roadblocked.  And I pointed out Viber - which IS supported on Android phablets - is also identically roadblocked.)  GPS/geolocation is possible, but VoIP is not - however, Microsoft is NOT to blame.

 

GPS/geolocation on dumb phones?  Yes - and quite OLD dumbphones at that.  My current "lifeline" dumbphone (I changed MVNOs from Safelink/Tracfone to TotalCall Mobile when my Samsung GSM10 went toes up) comes with a hewer-but-older Samsung a910-style flip-phone using Big Red's network.  I'm quite familiar with the Samsung flip-phones - in fact, I used to HAVE an a910 prepaid from Big Red.  Therefore, going to this phone was like Old Home Week.  Making (and receiving) calls and text-messaging was far easier (entirely due to better connectivity with Big Red's network compared to T-M's network - rather embarrassing, since they share the same tower).

 

Don't blame the manufacturer when it's not their fault.