• Sign in to Neowin Faster!

    Create an account on Neowin to contribute and support the site.

Sign in to follow this  

Ultra-HD Blu-ray Spec. Released

Recommended Posts

HawkMan    5,232

I asked you to STOP quoting me..  You can NOT read..

 

No wonder people like you can NOT read these days.

 

You can't just tell people to not quote you when you are replying to them

 

You sound like you're crying over not getting the last word in a discussion where it's meaningless. "Waah, don't quote me, I need to have the last word"

 

you could have just not replied. I'm merely replying with facts to your "statements". you don't have to reply to them or read them.

you want to stream 66GB-100GB per movie? unless everyone in entire world gets google fiber, not going to happen.

 

Size of the disk, NOT the size of the movie.

 

Big difference. we already know the new codecs can have a full 8k movie on a regular BD. the new disk format is merely an extended BD format to go along with the new players that needed new decoder hardware for the new codecs, which allows them to add all that stupid extra stuff on the discs. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
HawkMan    5,232

I think you missed his "/s". Those were sarcastic statements, you almost certainly cannot play the new discs on the PS4 and they can hardly hit 1080p so they aren't going to be doing 4k games.

That will be what the next round of consoles target.

The PS4 drive probably can't read the new discs. It IS fast enough though but I doubt they can patch it to read the 66/100GB discs.

Even if they could both the PS4 and Xbox One lack hardware H.265 (HEVC) support. In theory they could write software that runs primarily on the CPU but uses what existing GPU functions they can but that will cause the consoles to run hot/loud just playing back a movie.

Even if they got that far though and the disc was updated and they wrote a software HEVC decoder then the HDMI 1.4 ports on the consoles only support 4k@30fps and not the 60fps this new standard supports.

The best chance of the consoles getting 4k support is not this. It's that they'll support STREAMING 4k@30fps via a software decoder.

 

Wasn't it in the past said that they could upgrade the bluray format with more layers for more data, and that existing players would be able to read newer higher density disks, BUT not use the higher density layers ?

 

Pretty sure that was stated when BD was launched. and that would mean they could release dual BD disks(which would make the extra space make sense) that has both a 1080 version of the movie, and the 4k/UHD version on the layers old BD players can't read. 

 

of course this might have changed, things don't always work out as planned with technology and they may have decided to change other stuff. they could still do double sided disks though, or two discs in the box. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Gotenks98    554

We are at a point now where adding more pixels and such the human eye wont be able to tell the difference. Its not like going from standard definition to HD or Bluray. I would rather they spend more time in trying to get the audio to sound better.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
HawkMan    5,232

We are at a point now where adding more pixels and such the human eye wont be able to tell the difference. Its not like going from standard definition to HD or Bluray. I would rather they spend more time in trying to get the audio to sound better.

 

 

Ummm are you talking about 1080p HD?

 

because while 1080 looks great on my 55 inch, my eyes could certainly spot the difference if it was Super HD. if we where still talking about 32-37 inch, then yeah, sure 1080 would be ok. 

 

When I move to a place I can set up my projector again, and have great 120inch movie screen, I can tell you for sure that I would love a UHD projector and UHD content. cause 1080 pixels are pretty visible. sure you don't notice them when watching a movie or series(the natural blur in the filming) gaming without good AA though is massively noticeable. But having UHD at that screen size, the difference between 1080 and 4k and 8k is like VHS to 1080. 1080 is great, UHD is lifelike. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
+Asmodai    637

Wasn't it in the past said that they could upgrade the bluray format with more layers for more data, and that existing players would be able to read newer higher density disks, BUT not use the higher density layers ?

Blu-Ray has been upgraded. Regular Blu-Ray is 25GB for single layer and 50GB for double layer. The Xbox One and PS4 read the double layer just fine.

BDXL adds a third layer with 100GB total capacity as well as a four layer version with 128GB capacity. I'm pretty sure the Xbox One and PS4 do NOT support that.

Ultra HD Blu-Ray changes the dual layer from 50GB to 66GB and makes a three layer 100GB version. I suspect the Ultra HD Blu-Ray 3 layer is structurally different from the BDXL 3 layer Blu-Ray despite the fact they both have a total capacity of 100GB.

Either way I doubt the Xbox One or PS4 can read 3 layer discs and that's required to conform with the Ultra HD Blu-Ray spec.

Furthermore I doubt the Xbox One and PS4 can read the 33GB layers. Let me be clear though I'm not saying I KNOW for absolute certain it can't because I don't know EXACTLY what drives are in the consoles but since those drives predate the spec I wouldn't bet on it.

MAYBE they can get a firmware update to add support but I don't think so.

Pretty sure that was stated when BD was launched. and that would mean they could release dual BD disks(which would make the extra space make sense) that has both a 1080 version of the movie, and the 4k/UHD version on the layers old BD players can't read. 

of course this might have changed, things don't always work out as planned with technology and they may have decided to change other stuff. they could still do double sided disks though, or two discs in the box.

Maybe they can make dual BD disks. If the PS4 and Xbox One can only read the 1080p version of the data on the disc it doesn't do you any good. I guess if you have a second Ultra HD Blu-Ray player it would make it so you could use the dual disc in both your console (1080p version) and your dedicated player (4k version) but what's the point of that? It will likely cost more to have dual-discs and you'll still have to rebuy your existing library if you want a 4k version which your console would completely ignore.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
+Asmodai    637

We are at a point now where adding more pixels and such the human eye wont be able to tell the difference.

This differs from person to person and even then depends heavily on how big the screen is and how far you sit from it.

I only have a 40" TV and because I live in a townhouse my living room is pretty small. I often sit less than 2 meters from the screen and pretty much always less than 3 and I can tell the difference between 1080p and 4k.

If my living room were bigger though and I sat farther away maybe not. My sister has a 70" TV they picked up on one of those black friday deals and I think pretty much anyone can tell 1080p from 4k unless you're really far away from that.

John Carmack from Oculus just tweeted a while back that he doesn't expect phone screens to go above 4k anytime soon and that's a problem for them.

4k may be overkill for a device you're holding in your hand but when you use the same panels (right now most VR products are using panels originally made for cell phones to keep costs down) and strap it to your face as you do in VR you can still see the pixels since it's so close to your eyes.

Its not like going from standard definition to HD or Bluray.

It's an even bigger jump then going from standard definition to 720p HD or from 720p to 1080. (the i or p doesn't change the pixel count, just if all or half the rows refresh each cycle)

Standard definition (640x480) is 307,200 pixels.

HD (720p) is 921,600 pixels or 3x the pixels of SD.

HD (1080) is 2,073,600 pixels or 2.25x the pixels of 720p.

4k is 4x the pixels of 1080.

Sure though, going straight from SD to 1080 HD is a bigger jump (6.75x)

Going forward the industry has pretty much standardized on 4x jumps. After 4k is 8k which is essentially four 4k screens in a 2x2 grid just like 4k is the same with 1080 screens.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
HawkMan    5,232

Maybe they can make dual BD disks. If the PS4 and Xbox One can only read the 1080p version of the data on the disc it doesn't do you any good. I guess if you have a second Ultra HD Blu-Ray player it would make it so you could use the dual disc in both your console (1080p version) and your dedicated player (4k version) but what's the point of that? It will likely cost more to have dual-discs and you'll still have to rebuy your existing library if you want a 4k version which your console would completely ignore.

 

The point was about BD pricing. if they can make a dual disk with both the 1080 and UHD version, then they will just sell that instead of both 1080 and UHD versions, meaning there will be no price reduction on BD's (I doubt there will be anyway). and it future proofs your purchases. you have a BD players today that plays 1080 content, and you have a 1080 TV with no interest in replacing any of this for the near future, but you know in the future you will buy a new TV and being new, it will be 4k or maybe 8k, or maybe you buy a projector that's UHD. either way, when you get to that point your dual discs are no still there and can play UHD content instead of you having to go and buy all your stuff all over yet again. 

 

so there's several good points in having a dual disc, some of them is the same reason they had dual discs with DVD on one side on some releases a while back(Technically more difficult and being on each side it makes it harder to have a label)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
+Ryster    785

Personally?

Not die, per se, I just don't know anyone physically who has a 3d home cinema system, nor has it really gained any real traction when I've spoken to electronics retailers, (they do push 3d)

UHD on the other hand, it'll become as affordable as 2k systems are now, in time, but then I wonder, am I now going to have to buy a 3rd media for my favourite movies, (over 1000 dvds and blu ray mixed in the last 15 or so years of collecting)

 

Not sure what store's you are frequenting, but every Currys store near me in the UK is stocked full of all manner of TVs and the vast majority of them are 3D capable now. Nowadays when you go out and buy a brand name TV that's 1080p and LED, you almost get 3D by accident.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
President Devil    286

Can i play these new discs on my PS4? /s

 

Does this mean my PS4 will play games at 4k? /s

 

UHD is 4x the resolution of FHD.

 

Nope, no /s needed. The answer will be nope.

 

Such a great future proof console generation huh? /s.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The Evil Overlord    18,442

Not sure what store's you are frequenting, but every Currys store near me in the UK is stocked full of all manner of TVs and the vast majority of them are 3D capable now. Nowadays when you go out and buy a brand name TV that's 1080p and LED, you almost get 3D by accident.

Not sure you read and understood the post you quoted.....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Joni_78    48

Great news. I would be fine with 1080p but it's nice it is 10bit, I hate banding and it really bothers me alot.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
President Devil    286

Haha, that would have been the day.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.