FloatingFatMan Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 The Middle East in the 1960's was a pretty nice place... Prosperous, relatively peaceful, no one was blowing up bus loads of children or murdering their daughters for looking at a boy they liked... +Gary7, FunkyMike and DocM 3 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gary7 Subscriber² Posted March 22, 2016 Subscriber² Share Posted March 22, 2016 http://www.foxnews.com/ These savages must be stopped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuskd Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 Deeply hurt. Such incidents only inspire more youths to take up jihad. And I see no end to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neufuse Veteran Posted March 22, 2016 Veteran Share Posted March 22, 2016 12 minutes ago, FloatingFatMan said: The Middle East in the 1960's was a pretty nice place... Prosperous, relatively peaceful, no one was blowing up bus loads of children or murdering their daughters for looking at a boy they liked... I wasn't around then, but Iran in the 60's / 70's before the take over seemed like a good place to be, seemed very modern FunkyMike 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatingFatMan Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 Just now, neufuse said: I wasn't around then, but Iran in the 60's / 70's before the take over seemed like a good place to be, seemed very modern The 70's was when it all started to go down the toilet. Funnily enough, around about the same time the UK and US started meddling... Hurmoth and +hedleigh 2 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobscured Vision Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 So, what are we seeing, Class? Theocracy is bad, and Superpowers shouldn't meddle. 12 minutes ago, FloatingFatMan said: The 70's was when it all started to go down the toilet. Funnily enough, around about the same time the UK and US started meddling... The thought of what that implies just about made me hurl ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ichi Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 18 minutes ago, Unobscured Vision said: That's been tried, over and over again. Thirty-some years of trying to reason, negotiate, understand, give latitude, and for what? So we can be laughed at, scorned, and eventually be targeted? Because that's ultimately what ends up happening. The time for talking is done. These aren't "rational, logical, properly reasoning" human beings we're dealing with. Every single one of them wants us, and everything we stand for, destroyed. And it's not the Muslims, or Islam, that I'm referring to. I want to make that clear. It's these Radical, Extremist, Fundamentalist, Jihadist, Terrorist, Daesh, ISIS, ISIL, whatever the blue blazes they want to call themselves nowadays that seem to think they are "the chosen" egomaniacal flubber-whatever. They are the ones who have been doing this crap, in one form or another, for the past forty-odd years, that need to be ended. They didn't just start doing this crap fifteen years ago, folks -- it's been going on since the late sixties when Arafat invented the concept of "Suicide Bombing". Yes, it was ARAFAT who came up with that idea. It all started with him. I'm not saying that we should be talking with terrorists, I'm saying that as long as the potential recruits are unequiped to know better than that ######, the ideas will keep sticking and this will keep happening, no matter how many terrorists we take down. You could carpet bomb the whole of ISIS today and tomorrow you'd still have terrorist cells recruiting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatingFatMan Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Unobscured Vision said: So, what are we seeing, Class? Theocracy is bad, and Superpowers shouldn't meddle. The thought of what that implies just about made me hurl ... It's actually been going on longer, but got noticeable in the 70's. The UK and US are directly responsible for the overthrowing if the Shah in Iran, and its current regime... There's also the US funding of the Mujahadeen in their fight against the Russians in Afghanistan. They later became known as the Taliban... And not to mention the setting up of Israel after WW2... Right in amongst a load of people who don't like Jews. Smart, that... The moral of the story is, don't feed a rabid dog, it can't help but bite you, it's rabid. Buttus, +Gary7 and Unobscured Vision 3 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unobscured Vision Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 1 minute ago, FloatingFatMan said: There's also the US funding of the Mujahadeen in their fight against the Russians in Afghanistan. They later became known as the Taliban... The moral of the story is, don't feed a rabid dog, it can't help but bite you, it's rabid. Oh yeah, I remember all of that very well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatingFatMan Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 3 minutes ago, ichi said: I'm not saying that we should be talking with terrorists, I'm saying that as long as the potential recruits are unequiped to know better than that ######, the ideas will keep sticking and this will keep happening, no matter how many terrorists we take down. Blaming education is just another scapegoat, a false one. A fair few of these lunatics are well educated westerners who converted to Islam and got radicalised. It's not education, it's brainwashing. FunkyMike 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emn1ty Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 5 minutes ago, ichi said: I'm not saying that we should be talking with terrorists, I'm saying that as long as the potential recruits are unequiped to know better than that ######, the ideas will keep sticking and this will keep happening, no matter how many terrorists we take down. You could carpet bomb the whole of ISIS today and tomorrow you'd still have terrorist cells recruiting. Just like how giving everyone vaccines isn't a valid tactic because people still get sick despite that, right? Just because it won't end something in its entirety doesn't mean the course of action is completely invalid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrAwesome23 Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 1 minute ago, FloatingFatMan said: Blaming education is just another scapegoat, a false one. A fair few of these lunatics are well educated westerners who converted to Islam and got radicalised. It's not education, it's brainwashing. Just because you have a education, doesn't mean you are intelligent. How many of us on here have interviewed college graduates, who are complete idiots? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatingFatMan Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 2 minutes ago, DrAwesome23 said: Just because you have a education, doesn't mean you are intelligent. How many of us on here have interviewed college graduates, who are complete idiots? You could be the smartest person alive, but once these buggers get hold of you, and start with their brainwashing techniques, it takes a strong will to resist. Sadly, in my experience, theists tend to be quite susceptible to the words of preachers... Especially converts... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DefyTheOutcome Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 32 minutes ago, Unobscured Vision said: That's been tried, over and over again. Thirty-some years of trying to reason, negotiate, understand, give latitude, and for what? So we can be laughed at, scorned, and eventually be targeted? Because that's ultimately what ends up happening. The time for talking is done. These aren't "rational, logical, properly reasoning" human beings we're dealing with. Every single one of them wants us, and everything we stand for, destroyed. And it's not the Muslims, or Islam, that I'm referring to. I want to make that clear. It's these Radical, Extremist, Fundamentalist, Jihadist, Terrorist, Daesh, ISIS, ISIL, whatever the blue blazes they want to call themselves nowadays that seem to think they are "the chosen" egomaniacal flubber-whatever. They are the ones who have been doing this crap, in one form or another, for the past forty-odd years, that need to be ended. They didn't just start doing this crap fifteen years ago, folks -- it's been going on since the late sixties when Arafat invented the concept of "Suicide Bombing". Yes, it was ARAFAT who came up with that idea. It all started with him. 4 minutes ago, FloatingFatMan said: Blaming education is just another scapegoat, a false one. A fair few of these lunatics are well educated westerners who converted to Islam and got radicalised. It's not education, it's brainwashing. On one hand, the talk is indeed useless with these terrorists. On the other hand, may be they are brainwashed, may be they are willing, It may be by threat, by vengeance, by propaganda, by some sort of twisted values/lies. The fact remains: if the reasons why these people became radicalized are not found, whoever is radicalizing them will continue to benefit from a good supply of easy recruits to go blow themselves up. 28 minutes ago, FloatingFatMan said: The Middle East in the 1960's was a pretty nice place... Prosperous, relatively peaceful, no one was blowing up bus loads of children or murdering their daughters for looking at a boy they liked... Seriously? No war in 1967? No coups in various countries? No assassination in royal families? No autocrats or tyrans? Honor killings existed long before the current days. They were just reported as suicides or nobody did pay attention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatingFatMan Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 Well, nice place comparatively... Everywhere has problems, even in the western world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Red King Subscriber² Posted March 22, 2016 Subscriber² Share Posted March 22, 2016 6 minutes ago, DefyTheOutcome said: The fact remains: if the reasons why these people became radicalized are not found They already hold beliefs that support, at least partially, conservative religious practices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DefyTheOutcome Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 (edited) 1 hour ago, FloatingFatMan said: Well, nice place comparatively... Everywhere has problems, even in the western world. Depends on who and where one were. Before the oïl boom of the late 50's, Saudi Arabia was a rather dull place. Now it is soaking in gold. Palestine was different and much larger in the 60's. Once you scratch the paint, painful memories of the good ol' times come back and blanket statements fell thru. During the 60's, there were political assassinations in the US for example. Spain, France, Ireland and Germany had domestic terrorists from the 60's to the 80's 1 hour ago, _Alexander said: They already hold beliefs that support, at least partially, conservative religious practices. OK and who convinced them and gave them such beliefs? Nobody is born a terrorist, who and how made these people terrorists? This is the root of the problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ichi Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 4 hours ago, FloatingFatMan said: Blaming education is just another scapegoat, a false one. A fair few of these lunatics are well educated westerners who converted to Islam and got radicalised. It's not education, it's brainwashing. Education is not the only factor, but that along with social integration and decent living standards help towards not falling for brainwashing when exposed to it. 4 hours ago, Emn1ty said: Just like how giving everyone vaccines isn't a valid tactic because people still get sick despite that, right? Just because it won't end something in its entirety doesn't mean the course of action is completely invalid. Just like you don't just go to anihilate an infection focus but also vaccinate people so whatever infectious agents remain around are unable to further extend that infection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
techbeck Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 4 hours ago, DrAwesome23 said: Just because you have a education, doesn't mean you are intelligent. How many of us on here have interviewed college graduates, who are complete idiots? Maybe not idiots. They are book learned and mostly lack real world experience. Why when I used to hire people, I didnt look solely on education and in many cases, experience trumped education. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rippleman Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 The oil crash (not actually a crash but an equalization that was a long time due) is the best fight against muslim extremists. Glad the crash happen, the effect will catch up to these guys over the next few years. Slows the spread of religious hate when it isn't financed well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Red King Subscriber² Posted March 22, 2016 Subscriber² Share Posted March 22, 2016 3 hours ago, DefyTheOutcome said: OK and who convinced them and gave them such beliefs? Nobody is born a terrorist, who and how made these people terrorists? This is the root of the problem Various texts such as, but not limited to, the Koran and radicalized/conservative Imams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emn1ty Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 39 minutes ago, ichi said: Just like you don't just go to anihilate an infection focus but also vaccinate people so whatever infectious agents remain around are unable to further extend that infection. That assumes you have a vaccine. And vaccinating against a disease isn't quite the same as vaccinating against terrorist recruitment. But here's another analogy, do we just let people die from cancer because we don't have a cure or do we still perform potentially life threatening operations to remove the cancerous tissue? The problem I have with the whole terrorism discussion is people seem to have an argument against doing anything because no matter what is done... it won't work. You can't attack them, you can't close your borders, you can't ignore them. So what do we do? The idea that we can't retaliate because "there will always be more" is just a clever way to shut down discussion of any real course of action. Yes, there will be more terrorists even if we blow ISIS off the face of the planet. This however does not mean we cannot do so. We wash our cars even though they're going to get dirty again, so why don't we clean the planet of its cancer in the meantime while we find a way to stop it for good (if that's even possible). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 (edited) Asteroid strike anyone? Maybe half a dozen small ones, a few weeks apart, centered on all the right places. Maybe a good job for that asteroid redirect mission NASA wanted to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gary7 Subscriber² Posted March 22, 2016 Subscriber² Share Posted March 22, 2016 The problem is Radical Islamist's and our President will not even say the word. Belgium is one of our Allies, a member of NATO and Obama gave a 51 second speech in Communist Cuba condemning this. DocM and Nogib 2 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morisato Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 (edited) And yet just only a few months ago: Can you hear me now? Idealism vs Reality Also at 1:38 D: Edited March 22, 2016 by Morisato DocM 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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