Sir Topham Hatt Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 A question we have thought of at work. As automated cars get off the starting line, a suggestion has been made that by 2050, ALL cars will be automated. Does that mean you can drink and drive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mando Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Good Q Topham, I cant quite figure it out, id say yes and no is possible although your not "driving" you are in control of a vehicle, therefore I suspect the answer is no. Just as you can be charged with driving a golf cart while drunk or a bicycle or any other "vehicle" DConnell 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
restroom Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 I would say no. Reason being that whilst vehicles will be automated, they will always have a "manual override" as a safety mechanism, should something happen and the electronics controlling the car go wrong, you will essentially need to take over control, meaning you need to be able to function to take over that control. Danielx64, Mando, Sir Topham Hatt and 1 other 4 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoochieMamma Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Depends if cars in the future will allow manual override, I'm hoping not because humans are the weak link and if you take them out of the equation and have all cars fully autonomous everyone will be a LOT safer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomo Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 I would say eventually you would be able to drink and get in to the car however until there is confidence that the cars are safe and reliable you will still need to be required to take control. Sir Topham Hatt 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick H. Supervisor Posted January 18, 2017 Supervisor Share Posted January 18, 2017 No. You have to remember that the automated functionality of a car comes with the specific warning that it is not a replacement for a driver, it is an aide for a driver. And as others have said, it seems that for now cars will always come with a manual override, and you as a driver would be expected to be able to use that function if the need arose. Danielx64 and philcruicks 2 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slugsie Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 No. If the vehicle has the possibility of human intervention then you need to be in a fit state to drive. If however they don't have that possibility, the answer is still no as you won't be a driver, just a passenger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danielx64 Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 I would say no: just like a plane has autopilot you still need to take control of that plane when something goes wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dipsylalapo Supervisor Posted January 18, 2017 Supervisor Share Posted January 18, 2017 If by 2050, cars were fully automated and there was zero need for human intervention then sure why shouldn't you be able to drink and drive? As suggested by others, this probably has massive caveats. I would imagine a system like in iRobot where the roads/highways are completely closed off and M2M dictates what happens on the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Montage Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 The biggest stumbling block for automated vehicles isn't the tech, that's been sorted for quite some time. It's the legality of it all. Specifically the Geneva Convention, which sets out the lions share of all modern law. There is a clause there that states "The driver of a vehicle must remain in control at all times". It's only recently that some bright spark said "Wait, it doesn't say HUMAN driver, what if driver could also mean software?" Now that's being looked into and pretty much given it will find approval, you are correct in so far as it raises a myriad of legal issues. The current thinking is that the automation is only a tool, akin to brake assist, lane assist and so on - and so you as the (sometimes) driver need to retain the ability to potentially take control. This stems from the idea of a qualified driver with someone on a provisional permit... They qualified driver must also not be drunk, must be able to take control and thus responsibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeChipshop Member Posted January 18, 2017 Member Share Posted January 18, 2017 For the time being I'm going to say no. I'd imagine that the co-driver would have to be fully competent and fully licensed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+John. Subscriber¹ Posted January 18, 2017 Subscriber¹ Share Posted January 18, 2017 For now, absolutely not. Maybe in a few decades Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Montage Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 21 minutes ago, HoochieMamma said: I'm hoping not because humans are the weak link 92% of RTAs are as a result of human error - be it intoxication, weak judgement, poor driving and so on. This sets a REALLY low bar on how good AI driving systems need be. There's currently no comparible data for AI drivers as the RTAs involving them has not populated sufficient data yet - but a suggestion that AI drivers need to be "as good" as humans is insulting, they are already at a stage whereby they are infinitely better. The old query of "You either run over 1 child or 3 pensioners" is often cited. The difference here is that the AI driver won't have to even make that decision. It will react faster, and that's even if it allows itself to get into that situation. The Evil Overlord, HoochieMamma and satukoro 3 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danielx64 Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 4 minutes ago, Nefarious Trigger said: 92% of RTAs are as a result of human error - be it intoxication, weak judgement, poor driving and so on. This sets a REALLY low bar on how good AI driving systems need be. There's currently no comparible data for AI drivers as the RTAs involving them has not populated sufficient data yet - but a suggestion that AI drivers need to be "as good" as humans is insulting, they are already at a stage whereby they are infinitely better. The old query of "You either run over 1 child or 3 pensioners" is often cited. The difference here is that the AI driver won't have to even make that decision. It will react faster, and that's even if it allows itself to get into that situation. Is AI even that good? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dipsylalapo Supervisor Posted January 18, 2017 Supervisor Share Posted January 18, 2017 9 minutes ago, Danielx64 said: Is AI even that good? We just need to implement Forza Driveatar system Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lnmnky Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 There will come a time when there will not be a need for a trained driver to be present. So all people are passengers and could drink and be-driven. At some point, no one will know how to drive anymore and people will laugh at the concept of driving such a stupid, unsafe vehicle manually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Montage Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 18 minutes ago, Danielx64 said: Is AI even that good? "That good" meaning what though? Better at controlling a vehicle safely on the roads? Yes, it has proven itself to be better than the human brain, including what to do in the situation of an unexpected action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Topham Hatt Posted January 18, 2017 Author Share Posted January 18, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Mando said: although your not "driving" you are in control of a vehicle, therefore I suspect the answer is no. Just as you can be charged with driving a golf cart while drunk or a bicycle or any other "vehicle" Are you in control? If you type in the destination and the car drives itself then you're not in control. The original person thought about it that you could send a car to pick someone up rather than driving over to pick them up. I know it'll be a good few years before all this happens properly, but still... an interesting question. I think Lunar Monkey has said it right though. Eventually, we won't need to be trained how to drive because the car will do it for us. Edited January 18, 2017 by Sir Topham Hatt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gary7 Subscriber² Posted January 18, 2017 Subscriber² Share Posted January 18, 2017 No, many states do not permit drinking in an auto by anyone. Open Containers are forbidden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
game_over Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 (edited) It's illegal to sit n the drivers seat if you are under the influence of alcohol, period. Even if the keys are in your pocket. As soon as you show intent, such as opening the drivers seat door, you could be breaking the law. Just as it is illegal to sit in a driving seat if you are not insured/have a licence. Maybe in the future if cars become fully automated you'll be able to sit in the passenger seat under the influence. Dick Montage, exotoxic and The Evil Overlord 3 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
restroom Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 43 minutes ago, Nefarious Trigger said: "That good" meaning what though? Better at controlling a vehicle safely on the roads? Yes, it has proven itself to be better than the human brain, including what to do in the situation of an unexpected action. Hmm, how can they prove that when automated cars have not been on the road that long? I think they need to be on the road for a number of years before they can make that kind of judgment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Montage Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 2 minutes ago, restroom said: Hmm, how can they prove that when automated cars have not been on the road that long? I think they need to be on the road for a number of years before they can make that kind of judgment. Agreed - for populous data. But they have tested using the type of scenarios and the cars have responded quicker and with better skill than humans. They don't panic and skid, for example. restroom 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cork1958 Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 1 hour ago, HoochieMamma said: Depends if cars in the future will allow manual override, I'm hoping not because humans are the weak link and if you take them out of the equation and have all cars fully autonomous everyone will be a LOT safer. Humans are the weak link only because of how many of them are totally stupid and/or doing other things they shouldn't be doing! I hope I NEVER see an automated car on the road!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Montage Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Just now, cork1958 said: Humans are the weak link only because of how many of them are totally stupid and/or doing other things they shouldn't be doing! I hope I NEVER see an automated car on the road!! Not at all. Humans react slower, humans assess situations slower, humans panic - and those are the ones that aren't impared by alcohol, bravado or such. Unless you are 80 - you will see automated cars, and you probably won't even know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hum Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 I drink while I drive -- have years of research under my belt DConnell 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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