At least 17 dead in Florida school shooting, law enforcement says


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"He was a troubled kid" ... People "not surprised" it was him.

 

This wasn't a failure to identify someone who needed help, but rather a failure to help someone who clearly needed it. We can speculate endlessly when we look at people like the Vegas shooter, but for someone who had known issues, I think we need a better procedure for how we handle these people, whether they're a child or adult.

 

1 hour ago, warwagon said:

Exactly!! A good majority of the kids are diagnosed as ADHD and thrown on drugs which turns them into zombies. When I was in high school in 1995-1998 I had never even heard of ADHD now everyone has it. My friend has a kid who has "ADHD", the kid also pounds on the sweet and sugar too. This same friend has horrible parenting skills and because of that, the child is a little monster.

 

<snip>

 

My mouth almost dropped to the floor, I couldn't believe what I had just witnessed

Parents today don't want to discipline their kids. They don't want to feed them the right foods. The right foods are hidden among "healthy" snacks anyway that are loaded with sugar. Thus, kids are hyper, have weight issues, issues paying attention or listening... and we're supposed to love everyone the way they are because god forbid anyone have a "problem". Oh, and remember to be mad at everyone else for the content their kid watches on their iPad because they're too lazy to parent. It's truly sad. I see people spending more quality time with a damn dog than their own kids...

 

Ugh, gets me angry just thinking about it. 

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7 minutes ago, ncoday said:

**sigh** I really wish you folks would stop trying to blame the object and anyone else who owns one responsibly. 

 

Answer me this then, why do we protect our politicians with guns, even at the state & county levels, but not the children?

There were TWO armed security guards at the school.

 

If only there were THREE, this tragedy have been prevented /s

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3 minutes ago, FloatingFatMan said:

1. I have not blamed the object. I blame the person wielding said object, and the society which loves owning said object and does nothing to prevent the mentally ill from getting hold of them.

2. Maybe you people love your politicians more than your kids? 

You have armed guards at your schools?

 

I know you have armed guards protecting the Queen and I am sure the PM also has armed guards.

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Just now, ncoday said:

You have armed guards at your schools?

 

I know you have armed guards protecting the Queen and I am sure the PM also has armed guards.

There were TWO armed security guards at the school.

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27973572_10211368221502681_8798711435800518858_n.thumb.jpg.1517d4e14ef7c5bf38f3f2a38920c5fa.jpg

 

Oh this was on the tool truck last week, one of techs at the old shop I used to work at sent it to me. Buy any of the tools bellow and enter a chance to win a shotgun! Not a gun culture? 

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10 minutes ago, ncoday said:

You have armed guards at your schools?

 

I know you have armed guards protecting the Queen and I am sure the PM also has armed guards.

Armed guards at schools?  No we don't, nor do we need them.  In my 48 years of life, there has only ever been ONE school shooting, in Scotland back in 1996.

 

Of course our leaders have armed guards; not having so would be monumentally stupid, but it has absolutely nothing to do with crime rates or whatever else you might try to imagine.  Name one country which DOESN'T have armed guards around its leadership.

 

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Wow, some people sound like Chelsea Handler.   Placing fault aside here, thoughts goes out to those affected by this.  I have lots of nieces and nephews and really hope nothing like this happens to them.   Cant even imagine what the families are going thru..

 

Also, the gun thread is this way  ------>

 

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We have been unable to control the dangerous lunatics among us, so some seek to disarm them but not to incarcerate them. This is just plain STUPID! Such people WILL obtain weapons, legal or not, as they are so determined they will not stop trying until they succeed. The issue is NOT gun banning, which will NEVER work, but the quick and certain psychiatric evaluation of people that are reported as potentially dangerous, as this guy was. Also, the presence of ARMED GUARDS in schools would assure that when some nutcase opens fire he will quickly be stopped. Are we to ban all knives because of the recent slashing attacks? MENTALLY ILL people are the problem - not the weapons they will use if their illness goes untreated. 
 

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17 hours ago, warwagon said:

I want to know is, what has changed in the last 20 years that has created such evil demented individuals who wish to carry out such horrible shootings, Bad Parenting?

 

16 hours ago, Xenon said:

Ok, i'm not a gun guy. But why is it always the AR-15? Is it easy to mod to make it fully automatic? Or are there just so many of them? 

Since the last few shootings involving AR-15s I keep seeing memes and such about banning it etc. But back to what warwagon said... what has changed? We've had guns for hundreds of years in this country (Ok, maybe the wild west was bad... or maybe that's just the movies...). AR-15s specifically have been around since the 1960s I believe. Mass shootings at schools etc are a much more recent occurrence. Basic logic forces me to conclude it's not the weapon being available, but a serious problem with some people in our society, or maybe our society in general. More gun laws are not going to solve this, as it would just be an attempt at controlling a symptom, not a solution to the cause. 

 

A few people said "gun culture"? What does that even mean? I'm from the south and know plenty of people here that own guns, hunt etc, and their kids are taught to handle guns safely and responsibly. That is the gun culture I know. Nobody has gone unhinged and shot a bunch of people because of that.

 

 

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5 minutes ago, Howard Davis said:

We have been unable to control the dangerous lunatics among us, so some seek to disarm them but not to incarcerate them. This is just plain STUPID! Such people WILL obtain weapons, legal or not, as they are so determined they will not stop trying until they succeed. The issue is NOT gun banning, which will NEVER work, but the quick and certain psychiatric evaluation of people that are reported as potentially dangerous, as this guy was. Also, the presence of ARMED GUARDS in schools would assure that when some nutcase opens fire he will quickly be stopped. Are we to ban all knives because of the recent slashing attacks? MENTALLY ILL people are the problem - not the weapons they will use if their illness goes untreated. 
 

I agree, also although there are reports there were armed guards at the school, I would question their skills and integrity. They should have seen this guy coming from a long distance and been able to stop him.

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48 minutes ago, Howard Davis said:

Also, the presence of ARMED GUARDS in schools would assure that when some nutcase opens fire he will quickly be stopped.

There were TWO armed guards at the school.  Didn't they do well? :rolleyes:

 

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47 minutes ago, domboy said:

A few people said "gun culture"? What does that even mean? I'm from the south and know plenty of people here that own guns, hunt etc, and their kids are taught to handle guns safely and responsibly. That is the gun culture I know. Nobody has gone unhinged and shot a bunch of people because of that.

"Gun culture" basically means that guns are an intrinsic part of your culture; inextricably so.  You can buy them in the local hardware store or even a supermarket, you teach your kids to use them, in many cities people can openly walk around armed to the teeth, in others they can carry them concealed.   

 

No other country that has general gun ownership comes even close to the saturation of guns in their society as in the USA. For some of you, if you get a papercut, you leak gun oil not blood... :p

 

Is that the reason why you get so many shootings?  Not wholly.  It's a complex issue that involves many many factors such as mental health and poor control over existing laws, but without the gun culture's pervasiveness, I do not believe you would have anywhere near as many mass shootings as you get.

 

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3 hours ago, DocM said:

 

Yup, and largely because of the progressive-pushed changes made to mental health and privacy laws in the 70's and 80's he couldn't be put on a psychiatric hold. Without that hold he couldn't be denied the right to a gun sales or possession. 

I can't keep track of your political footballs... I thought this was a problem between 2009-2016? Yet we're talking about somethng that happened in the 70s and 80s? 

1 hour ago, techbeck said:

Wow, some people sound like Chelsea Handler.   Placing fault aside here, thoughts goes out to those affected by this.  I have lots of nieces and nephews and really hope nothing like this happens to them.   Cant even imagine what the families are going thru..

 

Also, the gun thread is this way  ------>

 

Stop trying to be a mod? Typical of mass shootings, any gun discussion stifled. 

 

I hardly see how separating this topic into that one accomplishes anything. You honestly can't discuss events that happened yesterday without discussing guns and how to prevent things like this from happening again.

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A parent should never outlive their children.  Looks at these children, they are babies.  Republicans treat children in the same manner a hunter treats any other hunted animal.

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5 minutes ago, Mockingbird said:

All Republicans ever say:

 

thoughts and prayers

 

thoughts and prayers

 

thoughts and prayers

 

thoughts and prayers

 

thoughts and prayers

Yea seems that way

DN_R59cVAAAM-nZ.jpg

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40 minutes ago, shockz said:

Stop trying to be a mod? T

Stop telling me what to do?

 

Need to treat the mental issue with these people or they will find the next easiest thing to get a hold of to do the most damage.  Banning something does not solve the reasons for doing something.

Edited by techbeck
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41 minutes ago, shockz said:

I can't keep track of your political footballs... I thought this was a problem between 2009-2016? Yet we're talking about somethng that happened in the 70s and 80s? 

Because we are still living with the ramifications of those legal changes. Please try to keep up. 

 

Quote

Stop trying to be a mod? Typical of mass shootings, any gun discussion stifled. 

 

I hardly see how separating this topic into that one accomplishes anything. You honestly can't discuss events that happened yesterday without discussing guns and how to prevent things like this from happening again.

Trying to stop things from like this from happening again should be one of the lessons that we learn from them. Mental health is one of the most important things that we need to review in regards to this because so many of the shooters have been shown to be mentally ill. Do you ban cars because of drunk drivers?

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6 minutes ago, DocM said:

Trying to stop things from like this from happening again should be one of the lessons that we learn from them. 

(Y)  Treating the symptoms without developing a cure will never work.  Just prolongs the inevitable.

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4 minutes ago, techbeck said:

(Y)  Treating the symptoms without developing a cure will never work.

In this case the kid has known to have mental health issues, which were obviously insufficient addressed. 

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19 hours ago, warwagon said:

I want to know is, what has changed in the last 20 years that has created such evil demented individuals who wish to carry out such horrible shootings, Bad Parenting?

Seems around the 20-25th anniversary of people saying don't discipline your kids they'll just sort themselves out.

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19 minutes ago, DocM said:

Because we are still living with the ramifications of those legal changes. Please try to keep up. 

 

Trying to stop things from like this from happening again should be one of the lessons that we learn from them. Mental health is one of the most important things that we need to review in regards to this because so many of the shooters have been shown to be mentally ill. Do you ban cars because of drunk drivers?

I’d say the bigger rammificarion was the lax deregulation of laws of assault and other similar weapons in the late 90s into 2000s. Ah the car analogy... because a cars primary function is to either incapacitate or kill. Makes perfect sense for a comparison.

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10 minutes ago, DocM said:

In this case the kid has known to have mental health issues, which were obviously insufficient addressed. 

Obviously.   Just from the kids comments, the guy seemed like a scary person and lots were nervous because of him.  And apparently, he had a lot of weapons.  Why any parent would let an obviously trouble person own that many weapons...I have no idea.

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