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tablet with one USB port issues with HUB on boot

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neufuse    3,349

I have a cheap tablet that only has one micro USB port on it.

 

I need to do a reinstall of windows, and the instructions for it of course say use a hub to get keyboard, mouse and USB storage access...

 

I put a hub on a micro to USB female adapter, then put the keyboard mouse and windows 10 installer on a USB flash drive.

 

Problem is when the system boots, the USB hub doesn't seem to turn on until after bios is done.. plug a keyboard into the usb port directly it comes on instantly (led's turn on) when its in the HUB I get to the windows logo form windows booting before the keyboard LED's come on...

 

same with the flash storage drive... plug it into the hub, never sees it to get it to show up on the boot menu... when plugged right in it will show up on the bios boot menu (accessible by holding the volume down button when booting)... problem is now I have no keyboard so can't do anything...

 

are there any settings in a normal bios that would cause this? the OEM says it should work, but something seems off setting wise

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Mindovermaster    1,524

You have a Hub that just uses USB power, or one that uses an electrical powered? That might be your issue.

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neufuse    3,349
Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, Mindovermaster said:

You have a Hub that just uses USB power, or one that uses an electrical powered? That might be your issue.

I've tried both, powered and not powered.. same issue... devices on the USB hub initialize well after the UEFI boot screen goes away...

 

Oddest part is I've restored this system once before with no problems, but that was a year ago...

 

they are USB3.0 hubs, the tablet port is USB 2.0 but that shouldn't make a difference as I've done this in the past on this device with these same hubs

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+warwagon    12,137

Yep, Midovermaster is right, i'd go for a USB powered HUB.

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neufuse    3,349
1 minute ago, warwagon said:

Yep, Midovermaster is right, i'd go for a USB powered HUB.

no difference between powered and not powered, only time I'm getting a difference is plugged into a hub or directly into the one port with the device... 

 

In hub it takes about 5 seconds for the keyboard LED's to come on... straight into the device... keyboard comes on instantly same result powered hub or not

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+warwagon    12,137

Is it on a reboot or on a power on this happens? If its only on power on, I would turn on the tablet with just the keyboard plugged in, then mash the boot menu button or the bios settings button. Once you get the boot process stopped. Plug the hub back in with everything connected, then restart the tablet. Good luck!

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Mindovermaster    1,524
51 minutes ago, warwagon said:

Is it on a reboot or on a power on this happens? If its only on power on, I would turn on the tablet with just the keyboard plugged in, then mash the boot menu button or the bios settings button. Once you get the boot process stopped. Plug the hub back in with everything connected, then restart the tablet. Good luck!

I'm with WarWagon. It could be that it is too many devices to scan at once. That's what takes so long.

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neufuse    3,349
Posted (edited)
44 minutes ago, Mindovermaster said:

I'm with WarWagon. It could be that it is too many devices to scan at once. That's what takes so long.

doesn't matter how many devices are in the hub, 1 or 3 same speed.

 

Doesnt matter if its a reboot or hard off and on, same amount of time.

 

rebooting also causes the hub to reset even when it's powered, thus taking about 5 seconds to initialize...

 

I know this worked in the past, until a bios / uefi firmware update and now it's like a setting changed.....

 

and to make it more annoying the BIOS config (or UEFI config, what ever we are calling it today) has 3 USB pages of config settings and one of them literary has 52 line items that can be changed ugh

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sc302    1,570

you need a different hub then.  

 

may want to call the manufacturer up to see what make/model hub they tested with when they came up with these instructions and get that one.

 

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Brandon H    2,095
1 hour ago, sc302 said:

you need a different hub then.  

 

may want to call the manufacturer up to see what make/model hub they tested with when they came up with these instructions and get that one.

 

yeah sounds to me like your hub doesn't use the generic drivers so it can't be properly detected until windows finishes loading.

 

another dock would probably work. also check the OEM site of the tablet; sometimes they provide an OTG cable with multiple usb ports for this very use. I know Dell does as I used to have a 7" Win 8 tablet of theirs.

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neufuse    3,349
Posted (edited)

nope no luck with other hubs... same result..... this has to be a bios setting... ironical there is one setting that says USB delay with values of Auto, 1, 2, 3,4,5 seconds it's set to auto... changing it to 1 doesn't do anything either...

 

these same hubs on a desktop come on instantly with boot at the OEM logo screen

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sc302    1,570

many years ago it was required that I use this specific usb hub for compatibility and it did make a difference...the install would only be certified if I used this specific one.  This is why I suggest talking to the manufacturer and getting the exact model that they tested with, not assuming all are made the same or trying multiple random ones coming up with the same results.

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Brandon H    2,095
8 minutes ago, neufuse said:

nope no luck with other hubs... same result..... this has to be a bios setting... ironical there is one setting that says USB delay with values of Auto, 1, 2, 3,4,5 seconds it's set to auto... changing it to 1 doesn't do anything either...

 

these same hubs on a desktop come on instantly with boot at the OEM logo screen

have you tried resetting BIOS?

 

what happens if you use a standard OTG cable that has just the one port?

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Brandon H    2,095
6 minutes ago, sc302 said:

many years ago it was required that I use this specific usb hub for compatibility and it did make a difference...the install would only be certified if I used this specific one.  This is why I suggest talking to the manufacturer and getting the exact model that they tested with, not assuming all are made the same or trying multiple random ones coming up with the same results.

this is the reason i say check the OEM site for their OTG cable. I mentioned I had a Dell earlier, they used a custom PIN layout in their tablet's usb port so ONLY their OTG cable would work.

 

could be a similar situation with your tablet but I'm not 100% on this as then the hub wouldn't work within windows either.

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+goretsky    919

Hello,

 

If you go into the UEFI (BIOS) settings, is there an option of "USB Legacy Compatibility" (or something with a similar name)?  If so, try enabling it and see if that makes any difference.

 

Regards,

 

Aryeh Goretsky

 

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+DevTech    1,252

Since it is a Windows tablet, you just need to plug the USB boot device into the USB socket.

 

The "Windows Menu Button" and the sound volume UP/DOWN will act as navigation buttons during the BIOS boot phase. 

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neufuse    3,349

after some stupid conversations with the OEM... which they where of zero help, I just started trying different BIOS settings...

 

to get it initialize a USB hub at BIOS boot you have to turn off Fast boot 

 

that's it....

 

why? who knows... it will initialize a USB device on its own but not a HUB when fast boot is enabled

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Mindovermaster    1,524
Posted (edited)

There has to be more people that used "said hub" than the OEM... Why not look around? I guess you Googled?

 

Edit: You never gave us your tablet brand or model #...

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Brandon H    2,095
18 minutes ago, neufuse said:

after some stupid conversations with the OEM... which they where of zero help, I just started trying different BIOS settings...

 

to get it initialize a USB hub at BIOS boot you have to turn off Fast boot 

 

that's it....

 

why? who knows... it will initialize a USB device on its own but not a HUB when fast boot is enabled

in a way it makes sense but that just says they have the fast boot badly configured/setup on the board...

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Circaflex    3,428
1 hour ago, neufuse said:

after some stupid conversations with the OEM... which they where of zero help, I just started trying different BIOS settings...

 

to get it initialize a USB hub at BIOS boot you have to turn off Fast boot 

 

that's it....

 

why? who knows... it will initialize a USB device on its own but not a HUB when fast boot is enabled

Good ole fastboot. I like the idea, in theory, but I have seen so many funky issues arise because of this feature being enabled. Glad you got it sorted.

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+goretsky    919

Hello,

 

Fast Boot skips initialization of the USB subsystem in order to speed up booting.

 

Regards,

 

Aryeh Goretsky

 

17 hours ago, neufuse said:

after some stupid conversations with the OEM... which they where of zero help, I just started trying different BIOS settings...

 

to get it initialize a USB hub at BIOS boot you have to turn off Fast boot 

 

that's it....

 

why? who knows... it will initialize a USB device on its own but not a HUB when fast boot is enabled

 

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