Technique Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 I'm looking at buying a 6TB internal HDD as i currently have 1x 1TB & 1x 2TB drives taking up 2 slots in my PC and i'm thinking i could double that in capacity and half the occupied bays. After doing some reading on them the past week or so i get the impression that they can be a bit flaky in terms of reliability? 3TB (not that i'm interested in one) & 6TB aren't the best in terms of reliability but 4TB is kind of like the sweet spot. But i prefer to chat with real people rather than swallowing articles, so what's the opinion from you guys? From what i've read i would ideally prefer the WD Black 6TB but it's just the price that bothers me. Alternatively Seagate IronWolf, Seagate BarraCuda and Seagate SkyHawk are cheaper, although i'm not sure if there's any major difference between the three other than £20. Sticking with WD is the Blue drive, though this is 5400rpm so i'd rather not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim K Global Moderator Posted January 19, 2019 Global Moderator Share Posted January 19, 2019 No ... just no (w/ respect to 3 and 6TB being more/less reliable than other capacities). What is the intended purpose of the 6TB drive? Black drives are awesome, btw (+5 year warranty). Xenon 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technique Posted January 19, 2019 Author Share Posted January 19, 2019 Well i did think that (replying to your "no"). As i was digging deeper it seemed to be like x-amount (small number) in y-amount (absolutely massive number) which made these 'failures' kind of like, big deal, the chances are slim. I just wanted some real-person feedback first though. Regards the intended purpose, a large chunk, if not all, will be blu-ray ripping. That, DVDs, my music library as i get more & more in to this whole Plex thing. The few blu rays i've ripped already have taken a large portion of my 2TB drive remaining space. The original idea was to have a section of the drive for that (movie & music library) and another partition for storage for day-to-day files like pictures i may save off the internet, documents etc, but as i think about it the 6TB may be better being solely dedicated to being where i store all my movies and music, the existing 2TB drive being where i store my documents, pictures etc and the 1TB being put in a drawer somewhere for 'just-in-case' purposes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim K Global Moderator Posted January 19, 2019 Global Moderator Share Posted January 19, 2019 OK, I was just going to say that for media a 5400 RPM is just fine ... like a Red or whatever (three year warranty). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technique Posted January 19, 2019 Author Share Posted January 19, 2019 49 minutes ago, Jim K said: OK, I was just going to say that for media a 5400 RPM is just fine ... like a Red or whatever (three year warranty). I like speed though What would you suggest the black is better for then? To be honest i don't use the storage drives a whole hell of a lot. I'll save music/videos/photos/documents there sure but i'm not constantly writing & reading from there. I don't do any intensive video editing for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim K Global Moderator Posted January 19, 2019 Global Moderator Share Posted January 19, 2019 Blacks are arguably the better of the consumer grade HDDs. Though, once again, you could probably save some bucks and get a slower HDD (5400) if all you're doing is storing media. I have Reds in my HTPC ... they run cooler and use less power and I doubt you could tell a difference (for media) between them and a Black. I have a Black in my desktop ... but I have a few applications and some older games on it so the speed difference is more noticeable. Then again, if money isn't of concern ... Blacks are the way to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tal Greywolf Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 4 minutes ago, Technique said: I like speed though What would you suggest the black is better for then? To be honest i don't use the storage drives a whole hell of a lot. I'll save music/videos/photos/documents there sure but i'm not constantly writing & reading from there. I don't do any intensive video editing for example. I personally have 3 Seagate IronWolf 6TB drives in my system. I've had them running for at least the last 2 years, and they've not had a single hiccup during that time. But that's just me and the way I tend to work my system... Jim K 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mindovermaster Moderator Posted January 19, 2019 Moderator Share Posted January 19, 2019 (edited) nvm... Edited January 19, 2019 by Mindovermaster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technique Posted January 19, 2019 Author Share Posted January 19, 2019 39 minutes ago, Jim K said: Blacks are arguably the better of the consumer grade HDDs. Though, once again, you could probably save some bucks and get a slower HDD (5400) if all you're doing is storing media. I have Reds in my HTPC ... they run cooler and use less power and I doubt you could tell a difference (for media) between them and a Black. I have a Black in my desktop ... but I have a few applications and some older games on it so the speed difference is more noticeable. Then again, if money isn't of concern ... Blacks are the way to go. From doing plenty of Googling i think WD seems to get the split but not overwhelmingly so. Question is red or blue, i'm not so sure yet. 38 minutes ago, Tal Greywolf said: I personally have 3 Seagate IronWolf 6TB drives in my system. I've had them running for at least the last 2 years, and they've not had a single hiccup during that time. But that's just me and the way I tend to work my system... As i'm not a heavy user i don't imagine that i'd have any major issues unless i'm very unlucky. I see more complaints about Seagate though than i do about WD. I actually have a couple Seagates in my PC, a WD and a Samsung and i've had no issues with any. 36 minutes ago, Mindovermaster said: nvm... Awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim K Global Moderator Posted January 19, 2019 Global Moderator Share Posted January 19, 2019 22 minutes ago, Technique said: From doing plenty of Googling i think WD seems to get the split but not overwhelmingly so. Question is red or blue, i'm not so sure yet. As i'm not a heavy user i don't imagine that i'd have any major issues unless i'm very unlucky. I see more complaints about Seagate though than i do about WD. I actually have a couple Seagates in my PC, a WD and a Samsung and i've had no issues with any. Awesome. Between a Blue and a Red ... the Reds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raa Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 We deploy Ironwolf drives at work, and have had 2 failures already. I personally sell and use WD drives, and i'm yet to see a failure. Just my 20c. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikeman25 Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 For what it's worth, just won a Seagate 8tb from a Twitter Contest, Immediately went in external enclosure for backup/storage, Contemplating a WD Black 1-2 TB internal to replace my Toshiba OEM 1tb internal, not that anything wrong with it, just thinking prefer a Black Western Digital 7200 drive for my extra game storage, music folder, documents, pictures, and image off and on to the 8tb drive I feel you can't go wrong though with WD Red (though never used one personally) heck haven't even used a WD black yet, but am getting one for birthday that's for sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mindovermaster Moderator Posted January 20, 2019 Moderator Share Posted January 20, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Technique said: Awesome Was going to clear something, but Jim said it all. So nvm... To say the least, I have both WD and Seagate, and several of them failed anyway (lot of my seagates are old PATA drives anyway...) (One WD actually failed, but that was my fault. Something fell on it and hit the platter...) Edited January 20, 2019 by Mindovermaster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technique Posted January 20, 2019 Author Share Posted January 20, 2019 I don't want to jinx anything but how likely are failures? I've had computers with hard drives since somewhere around 1996-1998 when at least amongst friends my 2.1GB hard drive was considered large. Now ok i've not had 1000s of drives since then but i've had a fair few, both internal and external, 5400, 7200, SSD, SSHD, portable, desktop (ok the desktop isn't really that old). And to date i've never had a failure. But i come here & people seem to have one every other week (ok exaggeration but you get the idea)? What's the deal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+BudMan MVC Posted January 20, 2019 MVC Share Posted January 20, 2019 15 hours ago, Mindovermaster said: several of them failed anyway Thats because all Drives FAIL - ALL of them! Sooner or later every drive made will fail.. I have had some drives last 10 years.. And others that fail while under warranty, So you can RMA them, and then others that have failed just after.. If looking for storage and you need to buy something.. Your best bet is to look for which size is best bang for the buck currently when broken down to $ per GB.. As long as its large enough to meet your current needs.. Buy extra storage that will not be used for years down the road is just wasted $ in the big picture because you paid X $ per GB today, when we all know for fact that its always going to be X-Y for storage down the road.. Look for size and speed that fits your need - better to get longer warranty than not but your going to pay for 5 years more than 3 or 1, etc. Looking at the current 3TB seagate I have in my PC, its been on for 4 year and 106 days.. So I would say I have gotten my money out of it.. It will be the next on my list to replace.. I Hitatchi that is 6 years and 284 days and still going.. Its only a 2TB.. sitting in an old pool I use for moving junk stuff too.. Made up of 2 more 2TB disk... This was part of my old nas, that I still have on.. At some point I will retire the older disks out of that pool and replace with larger ones and I cycle smaller disks out of my active storage, etc. Unless they show signs of failure, etc.. Keeping an eye on the smart info can "HOPEFULLY" give you some forewarning of failure.. Not always but doesn't hurt to keep an eye on it.. The scanner software from stablebit can send you emails/text if things found to be be not so kosher with any of your disks, etc. If your using drives for storage and playback of your media.. 5400 RPM is prob fine - As long as it can sustain the speed need to play your movie or music - why would you need more? If these disks are used for seeking and loading applications you prob want a SSD for that sort of access anyway. Also all my disks are used mostly turned on and stay that way expect for power outages and OS updates, etc. I think its better for mechanical drives to come up, stay at temp.. Vs the constant on off - so you turn on a disk which is a shock from not spinning to spinning at speed. It starts to warm up to its operating temp, and then many users shut them off again, just to do the same thing over again the next day.. That disk that is almost 7 years old only has 90 power cycle count.. The largest disk I have is a WDC 8TB, which I recently got for FREE from reward points with work and doing steps on health thing.. It was an external WD My Book drive that I shucked to put in my NAS... Which allowed me to move data off a SHR I had setup so I could change it to a raid 0 made up of 3x4TB NAS red drives.. Currently I have it just doing backup duty... But as I move more and more of my library to 4K and higher bitrate 1080 my available storage is starting to shrink... I might have to leverage that 8TB drive as library space if I don't do a bunch of clean up, etc. Seagate I believe wants to release a 20TB disk this year, using HAMR.. I believe... So yeah the much larger disks are around the corner. Technique, Jim K and Xenon 3 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mindovermaster Moderator Posted January 20, 2019 Moderator Share Posted January 20, 2019 1 minute ago, BudMan said: Thats because all Drives FAIL - ALL of them! Sooner or later every drive made will fail.. Indeed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tidosho Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 10 minutes ago, Mindovermaster said: Indeed... That's why the best thing to do is use RAID, or buy two drives, one to use, and another to image to, less chance of failure. Expensive, but data recovery is even more so at upwards of £800+. Better to be safe than sorry Drive warranties are great, but just remember they cover ONLY the drive, NOT the data, unless you buy specific data recovery warranty, Seagate offer them with Barracudas, not sure of the others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven P. Administrators Posted January 20, 2019 Administrators Share Posted January 20, 2019 I have one of these https://www.amazon.co.uk/Toshiba-P300-7200RPM-SATA-HDWD130UZSVA/dp/B0151KM6F0 (3TB) and I see they now have a 6TB version, when I bought mine it went up to 4TB they are also 7200rpm, because you said you wanted speed. Anyway from researching online the 3TB was pretty reliable but the downside appeared to be noise, which I don't hear anyway in my Dell XPS case. I never hear it spinning up like I remember from my older drives. If you settle on a drive you should google some reviews so you know what you might be in for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mindovermaster Moderator Posted January 20, 2019 Moderator Share Posted January 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Tidosho said: That's why the best thing to do is use RAID, or buy two drives, one to use, and another to image to, less chance of failure. Expensive, but data recovery is even more so at upwards of £800+. Better to be safe than sorry Drive warranties are great, but just remember they cover ONLY the drive, NOT the data, unless you buy specific data recovery warranty, Seagate offer them with Barracudas, not sure of the others. To quote Budman, RAID is not a backup. To quote him again, you need it in 3 places. On your HDD, the cloud, or important data on a USB drive. Or other means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technique Posted January 20, 2019 Author Share Posted January 20, 2019 1 hour ago, BudMan said: stuff Thanks for the post. Informative read. I'm interested in this cycling you mention. Do you have a lifespan that you assign to all drives out of interest? You mention drives coming up to being replaced. Something in your head tells you it's time to replace them. Obviously if they've failed then they NEED replacing so that's a given but you seem to replace them before they fail (obviously a wise move) so what makes YOU decide when to replace them? Note: I only put you in capitals & bold because really only you can answer that question, even though someone else might try to answer it for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mindovermaster Moderator Posted January 20, 2019 Moderator Share Posted January 20, 2019 6 minutes ago, Technique said: Thanks for the post. Informative read. I'm interested in this cycling you mention. Do you have a lifespan that you assign to all drives out of interest? You mention drives coming up to being replaced. Something in your head tells you it's time to replace them. Obviously if they've failed then they NEED replacing so that's a given but you seem to replace them before they fail (obviously a wise move) so what makes YOU decide when to replace them? Note: I only put you in capitals & bold because really only you can answer that question, even though someone else might try to answer it for you SMART is your best bet to see if the drive is on it's way out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technique Posted January 20, 2019 Author Share Posted January 20, 2019 33 minutes ago, Mindovermaster said: SMART is your best bet to see if the drive is on it's way out. https://www.google.com/search?q=SMART&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adrynalyne Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 14 minutes ago, Technique said: https://www.google.com/search?q=SMART&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b Is that a question or a comment? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S.M.A.R.T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mindovermaster Moderator Posted January 20, 2019 Moderator Share Posted January 20, 2019 58 minutes ago, Technique said: https://www.google.com/search?q=SMART&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b Yeah, SMART dat I integrates into Windows and Linux. Think even CrystlDiak does that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tidosho Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 (edited) I wouldn't touch the 3TB Seagate drives with a bargepole. The flood era ones were dropping like flies, and even that's an understatement, flies have a longer lifespan. I've had 2TB, 4TB and 1TB Seagates in my server, they're still running great. BackBlaze, who did a review of the failure rates in their datacentres, don't use them any more. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ST3000DM001 - The Seagate 3TB even has its own Wiki page, and not for good reasons. Seagate should have just recalled every single one, and shredded them. Sadly there's still people buying them used, from places like CEX in the UK, who are oblivious and stock loads of them, they even admitted to me under a freedom of information request that they get loads of returns of them (the highest rate of all drives they stock), yet still sell them!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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