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Virtual Machine Recommendation

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adrynalyne    12,320
1 hour ago, Mindovermaster said:

Maybe it was for an earlier version, I dunno. /shrug

I wasn't talking about the guest. I was talking about the host. But now that Adrynalyne corrected me, this now is not important...

—I edited just before you quoted me to point out I was taking about guests. It doesn’t run on Windows 7 as a host, correct.  

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PGHammer    1,496
On 6/29/2019 at 5:33 PM, sc302 said:

That was vmware workstation.  That is a defunct/discontinued product. 

 

Esx/esxi is a Linux/Unix based hypervisor os which needs to get directly installed on the hardware...this would replace the windows install. Esx/esxi is managed by a browser based GUI interface. I hope that makes it a bit clearer for you. 

Actually, it has been replaced by VMWare Professional/VMWare Player (I'm referring to VMWare Workstation).  However, you WOULD want ESXi instead - because you need a bare-metal hypervisor.  One of the quibbles of PDCs (as a role) is that they can't run Hyper-V. (Notice that I said *role* - it isn't that they couldn't physically do it - BDCs can, after all.)  Your only other option is to virtualize both PDC and BDC (neither is physical hardware) - then you can use any version of Windows to host the domain controllers themselves - and even manage them.

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Danielx64    604
On 6/30/2019 at 7:33 AM, sc302 said:

That was vmware workstation.  That is a defunct/discontinued product. 

Is vmware workstation being discontinued now? You mean vmware server?

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sc302    1,740

I don’t follow the workstation product that closely.  In 2016, vmware cut all devs, 800 or so jobs, for the workstation product.  I would have thought it would have died shortly there after or the following year.  There are still people talking about the product being discontinued due to the lack of support people are getting for the product.  They have been targeting data centers for a long time, I can’t imagine workstation being a money maker for them. 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.theregister.co.uk/AMP/2016/01/27/vmware_fusion_and_workstation_development_team_fired/

 

6 hours ago, Danielx64 said:

Is vmware workstation being discontinued now? You mean vmware server?

 

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patseguin    1,319

I installed VMWare Player today and put Windows 7 on it. Runs really well. I installed the dongle driver and am going to see what happens tomorrow when I plug in the dongle. I think I just need to figure out what will happen. The server will detect it but not recognize it because I didn't install a driver on the server. I'm hoping the VM will just recognize it and I can run my embroidery machine networking software.

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patseguin    1,319

So, let me see if I understand better. Exsi is actually an operating system that would place my Server 2019 install. This would then act as a host for whatever VM's I want like Windows 7 for the embroidery machine software and also WIndows Server 2019. Is that correct? I doubt I will go that route since everything is working well now and I don't want to mess anything up. I'd just like to understand it better.

 

On a side note, we run FIlemaker Server which hosts databases that run our whole business. We've run it for many years on a Windows 2008 server and even before that on NT Server. ALways ran perfectly. Now, on this new server it runs extremely slow. I'm talking several minutes just to get to login and then long 2 minutes delays when switch tabs (databases). FIlemaker apparently uses Bonjour for workstations to communicate with the server. IS there anything you guys can think of that would be causing this to be super slow on my new server? My software people had to give me a special file opener that "It puts the IP address of the server in the opener file so the workstation can connect straight to the OnSite databases. So Bonjour isn't used to search the network to find the hosted databases."

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SoCalRox    246
Posted (edited)

Others will explain better, but basically, ESXi is an operating system which runs VMs for you. Very efficient, very close to the hardware. Run all your VMs on this machine (or a bunch of them, at least) and let it handle device arbitration, resource sharing, etc. Think of it as the industrial strength version of the desktop products like VMWare Workstation (it isn’t, but it will help you understand easier if you look at it that way.) It’s a remarkable product, and there is a free version with certain limitations (I don’t know what they are offhand.) I’ve used a number of VMs served on it and the performance is great. I had a client company that ran EVERYTHING on VMWare servers and the performance was actually better than the desktops they replaced.  It made backing up end user data a breeze. All office stuff (except SQL Server) ran on these VMs and on various servers with the VMs. The programming staff I was part of (not desktop, alas, but old ugly green screen stuff) actually ran on fairly minimal machines, and the response was STILL great.

Aside: VMWare Workstation and VMWare Fusion is alive and well. I run both as well as Workstation Player and receive updates from time to time. I don’t know what was behind the layoffs years ago but it did not signal the end of the products.

 

Added: I see BudMan (and others) advising ESXi. I’ve learned that BudMan is one of the best resources here and always give extra weight to his suggestions and comments.

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patseguin    1,319
2 hours ago, SoCalRox said:

Others will explain better, but basically, ESXi is an operating system which runs VMs for you. Very efficient, very close to the hardware. Run all your VMs on this machine (or a bunch of them, at least) and let it handle device arbitration, resource sharing, etc. Think of it as the industrial strength version of the desktop products like VMWare Workstation (it isn’t, but it will help you understand easier if you look at it that way.) It’s a remarkable product, and there is a free version with certain limitations (I don’t know what they are offhand.) I’ve used a number of VMs served on it and the performance is great. I had a client company that ran EVERYTHING on VMWare servers and the performance was actually better than the desktops they replaced.  It made backing up end user data a breeze. All office stuff (except SQL Server) ran on these VMs and on various servers with the VMs. The programming staff I was part of (not desktop, alas, but old ugly green screen stuff) actually ran on fairly minimal machines, and the response was STILL great.

Aside: VMWare Workstation and VMWare Fusion is alive and well. I run both as well as Workstation Player and receive updates from time to time. I don’t know what was behind the layoffs years ago but it did not signal the end of the products.

 

Added: I see BudMan (and others) advising ESXi. I’ve learned that BudMan is one of the best resources here and always give extra weight to his suggestions and comments.

Yep, budman is great. His knowledge far exceeds mine, so it goes over my head sometimes.

 

Thanks for your insights.

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sc302    1,740
8 hours ago, patseguin said:

So, let me see if I understand better. Exsi is actually an operating system that would place my Server 2019 install. This would then act as a host for whatever VM's I want like Windows 7 for the embroidery machine software and also WIndows Server 2019. Is that correct? I doubt I will go that route since everything is working well now and I don't want to mess anything up. I'd just like to understand it better.

 

Yes this is a correct statement. It is a *nix based os that allows you to create vms.  The host interface is very basic in that you can only assign the networking for the management interface or restart the management interface. 

 

You have to use the management ip or host name in a browser of a computer on the network to be able to fully manage it and set up guest operating systems.  

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patseguin    1,319
4 hours ago, sc302 said:

Yes this is a correct statement. It is a *nix based os that allows you to create vms.  The host interface is very basic in that you can only assign the networking for the management interface or restart the management interface. 

 

You have to use the management ip or host name in a browser of a computer on the network to be able to fully manage it and set up guest operating systems.  

How do I get a USB dongle to recognize in the VM? The whole reason I'm doing this is because they say there is no dongle driver for Windows Server 2019. I installed the dongle driver in the VM and plug in the dongle, but the software on the VM doesn't see it. Presumably because the host machine doesn't have a driver? Is there a way to make the VM see the dongle? I'm using VMWare PLayer.

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Brandon H    3,112

if you have an extra HDD/SSD around you could try popping out the current install and install ESXI to the spare drive to see if that setup truly will work for the USB Dongle since it sounds like you may be out of luck with VMWare Player.

 

That way you retain the install on the main HDD/SSD if ESXI ends up not working like you need :)

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sc302    1,740
49 minutes ago, patseguin said:

How do I get a USB dongle to recognize in the VM? The whole reason I'm doing this is because they say there is no dongle driver for Windows Server 2019. I installed the dongle driver in the VM and plug in the dongle, but the software on the VM doesn't see it. Presumably because the host machine doesn't have a driver? Is there a way to make the VM see the dongle? I'm using VMWare PLayer.

In esxi, I would add a USB controller to the guest, then add the usb key off of the server (needs to have the usb controller first to see the pass through usb key).  That is how I have my usb keys working on my servers.  

 

 

1.jpg

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patseguin    1,319
13 hours ago, sc302 said:

In esxi, I would add a USB controller to the guest, then add the usb key off of the server (needs to have the usb controller first to see the pass through usb key).  That is how I have my usb keys working on my servers.  

 

 

1.jpg

Can I do something similar with VMWare Player, or is it too basic for that?

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sc302    1,740

Not familiar with that product.  You are going to have to play with it. 

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+BudMan    3,544
29 minutes ago, patseguin said:

VMWare Player

You understand that is not "legal" for you to use in a business/commercial context..

 

https://www.vmware.com/products/player/faqs.html

Can I still use VMware Workstation Player for free?

VMware Workstation Player is free for personal non-commercial use (business and non profit use is considered commercial use)

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patseguin    1,319
5 hours ago, BudMan said:

You understand that is not "legal" for you to use in a business/commercial context..

 

https://www.vmware.com/products/player/faqs.html

Can I still use VMware Workstation Player for free?

VMware Workstation Player is free for personal non-commercial use (business and non profit use is considered commercial use)

Yes. I am making sure it's going to work for my application and then buy it.

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Mindovermaster    2,391
19 minutes ago, patseguin said:

Yes. I am making sure it's going to work for my application and then buy it.

IIRC, the workstation version has more options than the player version. (been a few years...)

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patseguin    1,319
20 hours ago, theefool said:

Thanks! My software guy also recommended the digi product as it's been tested and works. It's $250 though which seems steep for a USB hub. I might just be better off upgrading to a version that fully supports Server 2019 and abandon the whole VM idea.

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Gotenks98    550
On 6/30/2019 at 11:12 AM, fusi0n said:

This isn't a bad video.. I only spot checked it, but seems to be good,

 

Thanks for posting this video. I never knew ESXI was free so I never bothered with it on my vm setups. I might have to build a new machine just for this. How responsive is the hypervisor for this?

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sc302    1,740
2 minutes ago, Gotenks98 said:

Thanks for posting this video. I never knew ESXI was free so I never bothered with it on my vm setups. I might have to build a new machine just for this. How responsive is the hypervisor for this?

Probably the most responsive hypervisor out there.  It is pretty much the standard for virtualization. 

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+fusi0n    2,069
5 hours ago, Gotenks98 said:

Thanks for posting this video. I never knew ESXI was free so I never bothered with it on my vm setups. I might have to build a new machine just for this. How responsive is the hypervisor for this?

Very. It's the same as regular ESXi, with the exception of exposing VMWare's APIs. Those are needed if you plan on running VMs between multiple host and backups. 

 

For my home lab, I run three ESXi servers (free) and the VHDs are running on a QNAP. If a host goes down, I can manually move them to another host. If you have the paid version, they would migrate automatically with VMotion. 

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