Which is better?


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22 minutes ago, adrynalyne said:

Start with Network +. Then look at cloud certs. 
 

I’m not big on certs, honestly. I have several and if my employer didn’t want/need them for MS competencies, I wouldn’t have them. 

what about devops? Can you do software development with a devops cert?

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11 hours ago, adrynalyne said:

Now we know why you aren’t getting an IT job. A+ is worthless. 

I disagree. It may be worthless for a big-shot like yourself, however for someone starting out in their career or who doesn't yet know what area of IT they want to go into. It is a starting point. I see it as doing three things

  1. Exposes you to a fair amount of different aspects of first line IT. Aspects that can be a stepping stone to a career focus or higher learning. Importantly it can help you identify precisely what you do not want to do
  2. Demonstrates that for someone with no direct CS/IT qualifications that they have the mentality and sagacity to self-study for a cert, thus showing a employer looking to fill an entry level position that they might be worth investing in
  3. Can take someone who doesn't have much confidence in themselves or their ability, help to improve their self-image, motivation and confidence while at the same time offering them a fairly gentle introduction to the boiler-plate of most professional IT certifications (i.e. tirelessly dull multi-choice testing systems) - something that they are going to have to get used to if they want to make it a career
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Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, C:Amie said:

I disagree. It may be worthless for a big-shot like yourself, however for someone starting out in their career or who doesn't yet know what area of IT they want to go into. It is a starting point. I see it as doing three things

  1. Exposes you to a fair amount of different aspects of first line IT. Aspects that can be a stepping stone to a career focus or higher learning. Importantly it can help you identify precisely what you do not want to do
  2. Demonstrates that for someone with no direct CS/IT qualifications that they have the mentality and sagacity to self-study for a cert, thus showing a employer looking to fill an entry level position that they might be worth investing in
  3. Can take someone who doesn't have much confidence in themselves or their ability, help to improve their self-image, motivation and confidence while at the same time offering them a fairly gentle introduction to the boiler-plate of most professional IT certifications (i.e. tirelessly dull multi-choice testing systems) - something that they are going to have to get used to if they want to make it a career

That you think I am a big shot just illustrates my point. I am far from it.  But hey, take the advice or leave it. Get an A+, and conquer the world or something. I heard this same argument when I did tech support in call centers. I never saw it pan out; though Geek Squad may be interested.

 

If certs give you confidence in ability, you are doing it wrong and the cert isn't worth the paper its printed on. Ability and experience give you confidence because you know you can do it and hence have confidence. The notion that certs are there to teach you how to do something is concerning to me. They are to certify what you know, but if they taught you how to do it, I question the value the value personally and professionally.

 

This is my opinion. If someone really wants to go for it, go for it. Its not going to hurt.

Edited by adrynalyne
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52 minutes ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

what about devops? Can you do software development with a devops cert?

Can you do software development without it?

 

I am asking you directly.

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1 minute ago, adrynalyne said:

Can you do software development without it?

 

I am asking you directly.

I'm guessing you can.

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Just now, RolloofTheNorm said:

I'm guessing you can.

Thats not what I am asking.

 

Can YOU do software development, without it?  As in, currently?

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1 minute ago, adrynalyne said:

Thats not what I am asking.

 

Can YOU do software development, without it?  As in, currently?

Sure

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Just now, RolloofTheNorm said:

Sure

What languages? Applications? Web? Front end? Back end? Full stack? Mobile?

 

Please explain. 

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1 minute ago, adrynalyne said:

What languages? Applications? Web? Front end? Back end? Full stack? Mobile?

 

Please explain. 

currently the only language i'm learning/know is java since i have no knowledge on any other languages as a beginner. After doing a quick search it seems devops certs are for more experienced professionals so I'll deal with that later. 

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7 minutes ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

currently the only language i'm learning/know is java since i have no knowledge on any other languages as a beginner. After doing a quick search it seems devops certs are for more experienced professionals so I'll deal with that later. 

I think that is a wise decision. 

That goes back to what I was saying. Get certs to show what you know, not learn it.

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Just now, adrynalyne said:

I think that is a wise decision. 

That goes back to what I was saying. Get certs to show what you know, not learn it.

so are you saying it's impossible for me to even get a entry level it cert without it expirience?

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7 minutes ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

so are you saying it's impossible for me to even get a entry level it cert without it expirience?

No, that's not what he is saying. Or at least, it shouldn't be the message to take away.

 

A certification is a bit of paper that says, "I officially know how to do <x>." Now, you can go into a course with 0 knowledge and come out with knowledge and the certification. But the knowledge will be theoretical and focused on best practices. What you will find in the real world is that while the knowledge you have gained from the course is helpful, it won't mean you're ready for every eventuality.

Hands-on experience means that you have the knowledge that has been applied in the real world. It can be better than having a certification but it comes with its own pitfalls. You might know how to do something, but in the process you may have learned how to do it in ways that might be inadvisable in a perfect world (i.e. as far as a certificate would have taught you).

 

Get a certificate. They are viewed and considered as good things by employers. But if you can get real experience, definitely get that where possible.

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25 minutes ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

so are you saying it's impossible for me to even get a entry level it cert without it expirience?

Thats not at all what I said.

 

Not at all.

11 minutes ago, Nick H. said:

No, that's not what he is saying. Or at least, it shouldn't be the message to take away.

 

A certification is a bit of paper that says, "I officially know how to do <x>." Now, you can go into a course with 0 knowledge and come out with knowledge and the certification. But the knowledge will be theoretical and focused on best practices. What you will find in the real world is that while the knowledge you have gained from the course is helpful, it won't mean you're ready for every eventuality.

Hands-on experience means that you have the knowledge that has been applied in the real world. It can be better than having a certification but it comes with its own pitfalls. You might know how to do something, but in the process you may have learned how to do it in ways that might be inadvisable in a perfect world (i.e. as far as a certificate would have taught you).

 

Get a certificate. They are viewed and considered as good things by employers. But if you can get real experience, definitely get that where possible.

Well said!

 

That's what I was trying to say, but may have come across differently.

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On 12/05/2021 at 12:23, adrynalyne said:

Thats not at all what I said.

 

Not at all.

Well said!

 

That's what I was trying to say, but may have come across differently.

Fair enough. So pretty much I need to get a cert in A+ or Security +? or a Cisco Cert? 

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46 minutes ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

Fair enough. So pretty much I need to get a cert in A+ or Security +? or a Cisco Cert? 

🤨

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1 hour ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

Fair enough. So pretty much I need to get a cert in A+ or Security +? or a Cisco Cert? 

133SGq9.gif

 

If I backtrack through the thread, it seems that you're looking to get into software development. Do you have examples of software development that you can use in an interview to show that you know what you are doing?

 

While my advice doesn't apply to all aspects of IT, I started work as an apprentice in IT support and I had no certificates. This evolved into a one year contract. From there I had the experience to get another position which lasted me for about 4 years before my next position. It was only during that position that I was asked to get a certificate while on the contract - it wasn't a prerequisite. That's 5 or 6 years of working without a certificate, all because I could provide previous experience to back myself up with.

 

You don't need a certificate. But if you are going to get a certificate, get it for something related to what you want. I don't know how a Cisco certificate helps you towards software development.

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5 minutes ago, Nick H. said:

133SGq9.gif

 

If I backtrack through the thread, it seems that you're looking to get into software development. Do you have examples of software development that you can use in an interview to show that you know what you are doing?

 

While my advice doesn't apply to all aspects of IT, I started work as an apprentice in IT support and I had no certificates. This evolved into a one year contract. From there I had the experience to get another position which lasted me for about 4 years before my next position. It was only during that position that I was asked to get a certificate while on the contract - it wasn't a prerequisite. That's 5 or 6 years of working without a certificate, all because I could provide previous experience to back myself up with.

 

You don't need a certificate. But if you are going to get a certificate, get it for something related to what you want. I don't know how a Cisco certificate helps you towards software development.

I want to do cloud computing and then devops if that makes sense???

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1 minute ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

I want to do cloud computing and then devops if that makes sense???

It doesn't, because you aren't being specific enough.

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1 minute ago, adrynalyne said:

It doesn't, because you aren't being specific enough.

well as stated before when I say I'm new to this I mean I'm very new to this. That's why I came here to ask what certs should I start off with cause I really have no clue. After doing another quick search it seems that the only cert that includes cloud computing with no prior experience is the CCNA, but still don't know where to start.

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2 hours ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

Fair enough. So pretty much I need to get a cert in A+ or Security +? or a Cisco Cert? 

hmm wasn't half this thread about not needing an A+ cert.

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1 hour ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

I want to do cloud computing and then devops if that makes sense???

 

1 hour ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

well as stated before when I say I'm new to this I mean I'm very new to this. That's why I came here to ask what certs should I start off with cause I really have no clue. After doing another quick search it seems that the only cert that includes cloud computing with no prior experience is the CCNA, but still don't know where to start.

Ok, stop looking at certifications for a moment. You're really getting too confused by all the options around you.

 

20 or 30 years from now, what is your job title? What is it that you do for your job?

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3 hours ago, Nick H. said:

 

Ok, stop looking at certifications for a moment. You're really getting too confused by all the options around you.

 

20 or 30 years from now, what is your job title? What is it that you do for your job?

I'm currently a stocker at a grocery store. Why? 

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15 minutes ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

I'm currently a stocker at a grocery store. Why? 

Oy. You gotta read. 

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1 hour ago, adrynalyne said:

Oy. You gotta read. 

what does that even mean?

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Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

what does that even mean?

 Read what was asked again, carefully.

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