Which is better?


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+InsaneNutter

It’s a bit of a catch 22 situation getting your first job in IT, most employers seem to want real world experience, however, how do you get experience if no one will employ you? That is tough one and really frustrated me back when I was trying to get my first IT job.


If you play about with stuff in your free time you will learn, https://www.reddit.com/r/homelab/ is a great subreddit to see what some people are doing at home. Although I don’t think you need to go that extreme, its great to see what others are doing / learning in their free time and is a lot of fun if you have a genuine interest in IT.

 

Something like the A+ should help get you an interview and teach you the basics too. I would not say its required once you have actually got your first job in IT, however depending on the employer it could certainly help get you on the list of people to interview and shows you are willing to learn. Once you have the job its your real-world experience that will count for a lot more.

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Nick H.
6 hours ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

I'm currently a stocker at a grocery store. Why? 

That is not what I asked, but perhaps that is my fault for using the the tense that I did for literary effect. Let me try again:

 

In the future, when you will be working in an IT position, what will that IT position's job title be called? What will be the purpose of that job? And be as specific as you can. Do not just say, "it will be something involving cloud computing."

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RolloofTheNorm
16 hours ago, Nick H. said:

That is not what I asked, but perhaps that is my fault for using the the tense that I did for literary effect. Let me try again:

 

In the future, when you will be working in an IT position, what will that IT position's job title be called? What will be the purpose of that job? And be as specific as you can. Do not just say, "it will be something involving cloud computing."

Since you put it that way the position/job title would be called Cloud Software Engineer or a Cloud Architect. I want to design the software dealing with cloud systems  if that makes sense. Side note: I've been looking into Western Governors University and looking at there IT degree programs they even have it to where you can graduate with a few certs under your belt as well. Other than that I know with me being brand new to IT I probably have to start off with a helpdesk job, but being a cloud developer/ architect is what I mainly want to do, 

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adrynalyne
29 minutes ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

Since you put it that way the position/job title would be called Cloud Software Engineer or a Cloud Architect. I want to design the software dealing with cloud systems  if that makes sense. Side note: I've been looking into Western Governors University and looking at there IT degree programs they even have it to where you can graduate with a few certs under your belt as well. Other than that I know with me being brand new to IT I probably have to start off with a helpdesk job, but being a cloud developer/ architect is what I mainly want to do, 

" I want to design the software dealing with cloud systems  if that makes sense."

 

What does this statement mean to you? Can you give an example of what you mean? Because it sounds like what you are saying you want to do is something other than what you are calling it.

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imachip

Cloud platforms are pretty interesting these days - Software Cloud Engineer / Cloud Architect is good goal.  Usually both these days require a fair bit of programming knowledge (Obviously the former is much more focused on that aspect).

 

Personally I'd pick a platform, either AWS or Azure (I'm an Azure person myself, but that's what my company uses - I'm a Devops Engineer).  Although they often use similar underlying technologies, their implementations on top of them is very specific and you have to learn 'their way' (and the wonderful costs they apply for them). 

 

University is good if you want a rounded coverage of IT but if your specific about what you want to do and have built a fair bit of knowledge already then I'd skip it.  Plus you just pay for the exams.  Knowledge/Certs in the cloud trump qualifications (Unless you're looking to join a big high paid company who typically employee top degree and masters candidates!).  Some certs are important to companies, as they get discounts from the supplier (e.g. Gold certification for MS requires staff to complete certain Exams).

 

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/learn/certifications/  There are lots of paths to choose from here.  Courses are broken down and they have built-in labs.  Sure, they don't cover everything you need to know for an exam but team that up with subscribing to Pluralsight (again just what I use) which helps cover some (but not all of the Exam questions).  I'd start with the pure basics of the platform and see about how you're motivated to learn more (The 'do you find it interesting question') because if not, then it's going to be an uphill struggle.

 

When you sign up on Azure, they give you 12 months access and a bit of free spend for the first month and if you follow the courses, you'll create a 'sandbox' to go through the question and basically that's a free account where you can mess about with anything for 4 hours until it expires.

 

I know occasionally there are seminars/workshops that Microsoft offers and sometimes they throw in a basic exam as a freebee so one to watch out for.

 

Perhaps get some exams under your belt and try to get in as a cloud support engineer, learn that role (that's much easier since you 'live it') and continue you with your certs.  Then try moving up the chain in to a more specific role (Junior Devops) in the company every 2 years or looking outside it for a better role and continue there.

 

Have fun!

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C:Amie
On 12/05/2021 at 16:26, adrynalyne said:

That you think I am a big shot just illustrates my point. I am far from it.  But hey, take the advice or leave it. Get an A+, and conquer the world or something. I heard this same argument when I did tech support in call centers. I never saw it pan out; though Geek Squad may be interested.

 

If certs give you confidence in ability, you are doing it wrong and the cert isn't worth the paper its printed on. Ability and experience give you confidence because you know you can do it and hence have confidence. The notion that certs are there to teach you how to do something is concerning to me. They are to certify what you know, but if they taught you how to do it, I question the value the value personally and professionally.

 

This is my opinion. If someone really wants to go for it, go for it. Its not going to hurt.

I certainly do not disagree with your perspective that certification do not equal competency, nor that they equate to the actual value of hands on experience. With that said, having worked with a lot of young people and people going through a career change; both groups wanting to get started in the industry. Often after periods of time away from education. The idea that they can just sit in front of a computer in an unstructured way and become IT literate isn't something that is applicable to the majority of users. Sure, a few of us can operate like that. A large number of people here on Neowin I am sure. Yet are are the minority of cases. It is part of the process of learning to learn. For a lot of young people and those starting from scractch. That is a scary thing.

A+, N+, MCSE, CCNA do not make you competent IT folk, they don't even make you 'IT folk', but they do demonstrate willingness to learn and, if taken under self-directed, self-funded study. I feel says something about the character of the person sitting on the other side of the table.

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+spikey_richie

Can we get the title changed to "Which IT certificate is most appropriate?"

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RolloofTheNorm
On 14/05/2021 at 21:07, adrynalyne said:

" I want to design the software dealing with cloud systems  if that makes sense."

 

What does this statement mean to you? Can you give an example of what you mean? Because it sounds like what you are saying you want to do is something other than what you are calling it.

Basically I want to do software development specializing in cloud computing. I know I need to brush up on my programming skills and as far as certs go while I was searching IT degrees at Western Governors University. The "good" thing about IT degrees offered at WGU is that there are certs integrated into the degree program itself meaning that not only you'll graduate with a degree, but certs as well.

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Nick H.
On 19/05/2021 at 02:31, RolloofTheNorm said:

Basically I want to do software development specializing in cloud computing. I know I need to brush up on my programming skills and as far as certs go while I was searching IT degrees at Western Governors University. The "good" thing about IT degrees offered at WGU is that there are certs integrated into the degree program itself meaning that not only you'll graduate with a degree, but certs as well.

For what it's worth, Western Governors University probably isn't the only place that offers certifications as well as the degree. If you're looking at it as an option for University because of its location or because of the degree offered then that's fair enough, but other universities will offer certifications with their degree as well.

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RolloofTheNorm
3 minutes ago, Nick H. said:

For what it's worth, Western Governors University probably isn't the only place that offers certifications as well as the degree. If you're looking at it as an option for University because of its location or because of the degree offered then that's fair enough, but other universities will offer certifications with their degree as well.

and what universities are those? cause the ones here where i lived sure don't.

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Nick H.
41 minutes ago, RolloofTheNorm said:

and what universities are those? cause the ones here where i lived sure don't.

Well I don't have all the universities in the world and all their courses in my head! :laugh: You'll have to look around yourself, and even possibly contact them to ask specifically about the possibility. But as an example, I was taking an HND at my university and had an opportunity to get a CCNA certification as part of the course.

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