DerkPY Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 I heard that you can't play .wma files on ipods at all, but I was wondering if there was an updated firmware for the mini ipod which has this support? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Dorr Veteran Posted March 22, 2004 Veteran Share Posted March 22, 2004 Nope, there is not. Your only hope is converting them from WMA to another format (though, that would involve a quality loss) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazzla Veteran Posted March 22, 2004 Veteran Share Posted March 22, 2004 Nope. WMA is a no, no on all iPods. Even though the chip is capable of playback, Apple disables it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerkPY Posted March 22, 2004 Author Share Posted March 22, 2004 No second party firmware or anything at all? I thought there was an icon and stuff for WMAs on the ipod somewhere and that it is entirely possible, like you said with the chip etc, so I think it may be planned for the future. Damb, I'm going to have to convert loads of files. :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazzla Veteran Posted March 22, 2004 Veteran Share Posted March 22, 2004 There are .WMA icons within iTunes on the Mac if I recall correctly, but the addition of WMA is up to Apple... Did you get your iPod Mini? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerkPY Posted March 22, 2004 Author Share Posted March 22, 2004 There is a 2 week backlog (I think). So, I ordered (or Ko ordered) 2 last Mon\Tue and they have taken the money from his account. But there not in stock. +5 day delivery! Hmmm... I hope I don't get taxed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazzla Veteran Posted March 22, 2004 Veteran Share Posted March 22, 2004 That's what I'm waiting on seeing, lemme know via PM if I miss it on the forums, or mail me at dazzla@neowin.net if it's full. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fusion Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 Why would they want to support wma when they already have a superior native codec? I am not even sure supporting mp3 format is even smart. Who needs it? If you don't want the tiny extra size and major extra quality that comes with mp4, you can just rip at a much smaller bit rate. I am still so confused as to why people ask for this feature. @Dazzla, I thought you hated the iPod and had issues with the battery life, what is this newfound obsession that you have with it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazzla Veteran Posted March 22, 2004 Veteran Share Posted March 22, 2004 I've never hated it, I love the ipod. Just never been 100% happy with the battery life, still aint but I've got to the point where I don't care any more so I'm just gonna get one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeoMayhem Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 You can try placing a WMA file on an iPod and see if it will play. I did this with a ogg file on a regular iPod, but it didn't work :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krmathis Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 Your only hope is converting them from WMA to another format (though, that would involve a quality loss) You know that wma also has a lossless mode, dont you? :huh: Back to topic. In your case you have to options: * Wait for Apple to add wma support in iPod (Probably never). * Convert the .wma to a supported format (MP3 or AAC). Solaris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerkPY Posted March 22, 2004 Author Share Posted March 22, 2004 Converted. Took 2 hours to do the lot, not bad, I thought it was going to take longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redestium Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 I am not even sure supporting mp3 format is even smart. Who needs it? Damn that'd really be the worst thing they could do considering it IS the most popular format by far due to years of proliferation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboi Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 that would be stupid if apple did that. apple's music store uses aac why in the blue hell would apple do that. it will jus kill their store even tho they dont make any profit off it. i honestly like aac format better then wma. if you want something that supports wma, then i would perfer you getting an iriver. that is my second choice. by the way steve, you rule Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fusion Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 (edited) Damn that'd really be the worst thing they could do considering it IS the most popular format by far due to years of proliferation. I am not sure this is entirely correct. I wouldn't say the mp3 file format has grown at all if that is what you are suggesting. Same yesterday, today and forevermore. It maybe has grown in popularity simply by the sheer amount of time it has been considered a 'standard' in compressed audio. That being said, I do not believe the mp3 format to be popular anymore among iPod owners because 99.9 percent of iPod owners are going to be using iTunes. Now with iTunes, I can think of two scenarios of obtaining music. 1) The iTunes music store has turned out to be pretty popular among iTunes users. Music purchased from the iTunes music store is in m4a format already. 2) Many already have collections of Records, Tapes and CDs. While they might already have some in digital format (mp3) stored on their computer, it would be stupid not to re-rip the content into a newer format. With the advances in tagging and audio quality within codecs the last few years, just by taking 5 minutes to re-rip and album when you want to listen to it can do wonders. I don't know or have ever met one person who wouldn't want their audio quality to sound better without sacrificing space. m4a has long been superior and it has been around forever. However, with more elaborate mathematical algorithms comes the need for more processing power. m4a was for a long time impractical but computers are far past the point where they needed to be to encode AAC sufficiently. I can think of only one reason to support mp3 on the iPod, and that is compatibility with other devices. Many stereo systems cabable of interfacing with Macs and PCs still can only read mp3 files. So if you had AAC on your iPod and mp3 in iTunes, it just creates a world of problems. Better to just stick with the one that will work on everything. That being said, I don't consider the act of having a receiver actually reading audio files off a computer to be a 'popular' exercise. It would seem using a line out is more common. So I guess I can make a small case, albeit small that it is, for Apple to retain mp3 support, I still fail to see any reason at all why they should include wma support. I would go so far to say that Apple has an underlying philosophy of doing things simple. I believe not including wma support has less to do with some psuedo Apple VS MS battle and more with a lack of a need for it. I am convinced that people wanting wma support have not researched enough into why and what they are doing and would benefit from not having support for their format as they would learn more about them and switch to a superior format. And it would also seem re-ripping audio content would take far less time then 'hacking' firmware. It goes without being said, but I'll say it anyway to run away ideas that I am just ignorant of it, but all this has no application to those whos primary method of obtaining music is illegal peer to peer files sharing netwroks such as BitTorrent, FastTrack and Gnuntella. In this case I think it is entirely stupid to expect Apple to cater to your needs. Again, I still would like information on any reason why Apple should include wma support? Edited March 22, 2004 by Fusion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomwarren Veteran Posted March 22, 2004 Veteran Share Posted March 22, 2004 People are "working on it" ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redestium Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 I am not sure this is entirely correct. I wouldn't say the mp3 file format has grown at all if that is what you are suggesting. Same yesterday, today and forevermore. It maybe has grown in popularity simply by the sheer amount of time it has been considered a 'standard' in compressed audio.That being said, I do not believe the mp3 format to be popular anymore among iPod owners because 99.9 percent of iPod owners are going to be using iTunes. Now with iTunes, I can think of two scenarios of obtaining music. 1) The iTunes music store has turned out to be pretty popular among iTunes users. Music purchased from the iTunes music store is in m4a format already. 2) Many already have collections of Records, Tapes and CDs. While they might already have some in digital format (mp3) stored on their computer, it would be stupid not to re-rip the content into a newer format. With the advances in tagging and audio quality within codecs the last few years, just by taking 5 minutes to re-rip and album when you want to listen to it can do wonders. I don't know or have ever met one person who wouldn't want their audio quality to sound better without sacrificing space. m4a has long been superior and it has been around forever. However, with more elaborate mathematical algorithms comes the need for more processing power. m4a was for a long time impractical but computers are far past the point where they needed to be to encode AAC sufficiently. I can think of only one reason to support mp3 on the iPod, and that is compatibility with other devices. Many stereo systems cabable of interfacing with Macs and PCs still can only read mp3 files. So if you had AAC on your iPod and mp3 in iTunes, it just creates a world of problems. Better to just stick with the one that will work on everything. That being said, I don't consider the act of having a receiver actually reading audio files off a computer to be a 'popular' exercise. It would seem using a line out is more common. So I guess I can make a small case, albeit small that it is, for Apple to retain mp3 support, I still fail to see any reason at all why they should include wma support. I would go so far to say that Apple has an underlying philosophy of doing things simple. I believe not including wma support has less to do with some psuedo Apple VS MS battle and more with a lack of a need for it. I am convinced that people wanting wma support have not researched enough into why and what they are doing and would benefit from not having support for their format as they would learn more about them and switch to a superior format. It goes without being said, but I'll say it anyway to run away ideas that I am just ignorant of it, but all this has no application to those whos primary method of obtaining music is illegal peer to peer files sharing netwroks such as BitTorrent, FastTrack and Gnuntella. In this case I think it is entirely stupid to expect Apple to cater to your needs. Again, I still would like information on any reason why Apple should include wma support? I wasn't arguing about WMA support so I don't know why you brought it up. Simply put however, being able to play a varied selection of file types only helps your popularity. Like it or not MP3 isn't going anywhere since it's a comfortable and universal format as you said. By not including support for it on the iPod would most certainly have people look at other Digital Audio Players that would accommodate their shady practices (which is still rampant). I do see a benefit for WMA support though considering if they did add it people could then download from other music services and use it with their iPod (ideally anyway). In addition there are those who made the decision to stick with that format (WMA-for whatever reason) and having a player as slick as the iPod to support their library's would just help the device sell even better and one less thing to fault about it. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the evn show Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 So you propose Apple sell music in AAC as well as say WMA and maybe Ogg/Vorbis (with some sort of DRM bolted on). That sells more music from iTMS because people can play their songs on any portable player. How does Apple sell iPods (the stated goal of iTMS) by selling music files that don't play on the iPod (yet?!) and DO play on the competitions products? People are tempted to see iTMS as a completely separate entity from Apple's other business - like how Napster music service is isolated from the "napster branded" mp3 player (by I4U). iTMS is more like .mac for ipods. You need Apple's hardware to use both .Mac and iTMS to the full extent of their capabilities but the hardware works just fine without either service. They're provided as an optional service to Apple customer NOT as an independent business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bararum Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 i do wish ipod had ogg and flac support though. le sigh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redestium Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 So you propose Apple sell music in AAC as well as say WMA and maybe Ogg/Vorbis (with some sort of DRM bolted on).That sells more music from iTMS because people can play their songs on any portable player. How does Apple sell iPods (the stated goal of iTMS) by selling music files that don't play on the iPod (yet?!) and DO play on the competitions products? People are tempted to see iTMS as a completely separate entity from Apple's other business - like how Napster music service is isolated from the "napster branded" mp3 player (by I4U). iTMS is more like .mac for ipods. You need Apple's hardware to use both .Mac and iTMS to the full extent of their capabilities but the hardware works just fine without either service. They're provided as an optional service to Apple customer NOT as an independent business. No, all I'm saying is that if they enabled support for other formats on the iPod it would make them more appealing to certain groups of people. Never did I mention anything about the iTMS selling in any other format but aac. By making their portable play lots of different formats wouldn't you agree that it would sell better considering people won't buy it now because of the fact it doesn't? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bararum Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 No, all I'm saying is that if they enabled support for other formats on the iPod it would make them more appealing to certain groups of people. Never did I mention anything about the iTMS selling in any other format but aac. By making their portable play lots of different formats wouldn't you agree that it would sell better considering people won't buy it now because of the fact it doesn't? this makes sense, if i were a pc user now i would think twice before going ipod simply because of the file formats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fusion Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 That right there is the attitude I don't get then. "No I will not buy an iPod because you refuse to support my crappy audio, and even though it is relatively simple to change my audio to higher qulaity at the same size, I want my crappy audio and that's all there is to it damnit." If people are that stubborn about having windows media format, then I don't forsee them as the type of people that would appreciate an iPod. Personally, I want my music to sound good, so I put it in the best format I know of. It just so happens that the iPod supports that format, advocates it in fact, so I am happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the evn show Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 No, all I'm saying is that if they enabled support for other formats on the iPod it would make them more appealing to certain groups of people. Never did I mention anything about the iTMS selling in any other format but aac. By making their portable play lots of different formats wouldn't you agree that it would sell better considering people won't buy it now because of the fact it doesn't? Ah, I miss read you - sorry. I do agree that from a consumer standpoint the ability for the iPod to play multiple formats is a great thing. Being able to play many kinds of format is great from a customer perspective however they lose that "vendor lock in" they have with the AAC+FairPlay system they have now. Unable to play WMA is in some sense a blessing for Apple. As a non-apple customer it's annoying for me to have to re-rip or re-purchase music when I move to an iPod so I'm less likely to buy one. However, as an Apple customer - now that I have a fair sized AAC collection (I don't, but I'm sure some do and more will) - I'm less likely to purchase another MP3 player because my music won't work. That's great for Apple as a business. AAC is the standard for legal online digital music. 70%-90% (denuding on who you trust) of the online music is sold in either Apple's AAC+DRM and a sizable chunk is available in regular old MP3 too (though not usually major label stuff) from other vendors. WMA is a minority player and Apple is using that to their advantage. That's probably not best for the consumer: but we are dealing with a publicly traded company so we were never their #1 priority to begin with. this makes sense, if i were a pc user now i would think twice before going ipod simply because of the file formats. As an iPod owner, iTMS customer, or macintosh owner, or iTunes user I think twice before purchasing a player that doesn't support AAC / AAC+FairPlay. It works both ways, Apple knows this - and apparently thinks they've got it worked out. I'm just glad the company that (so far) dominates the legal digital music scene and has the #1 selling MP3 player (high-end and otherwise) is the one I want to support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MEMO.INC Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 That right there is the attitude I don't get then."No I will not buy an iPod because you refuse to support my crappy audio, and even though it is relatively simple to change my audio to higher qulaity at the same size, I want my crappy audio and that's all there is to it damnit." If people are that stubborn about having windows media format, then I don't forsee them as the type of people that would appreciate an iPod. Personally, I want my music to sound good, so I put it in the best format I know of. It just so happens that the iPod supports that format, advocates it in fact, so I am happy. Are you complete shure that ACC format is that far better than the other formats,I have OGG, MP3, WMA, I have listened to Itunes ACC format and its very good one, but I honestly can't see it like a qualitysuperior format, I think the only superior oneit's the mp3 cause it's pretty much a standar. When I bought my DVD (now sadly broken because of my clumpsy hands) i looked foward for having Wma support , so i didn't have to reencode my wma audio. You are saying thet It's wrong for me to want wma and mp3 support when my dvd is (well was :( ) dvd audio compatible. Those Mini Ipods are pretty cool, and if they could manage to get Wma support it will be an other confirmation that i shoul get one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderRiver Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 You might as well go with Creative. Their upcoming models feature easy Lithion Ion battery removal. We all should be boycotting Apple for having such lousy nice-looking product anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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