Silvorgold Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 hope u get rid of the flaming :), like most non flamers here, we're tired sick of all the flaming, if i post a question bout netscape/mozilla, first comment will be a flame of course n i remember posting a joke that i got in an email that was "Canadians VS Americans" as in Joe from canada and Billy Bob from the US, it was funny, even lots of americans agreed but there was ALOT of flaming Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drewster2100 Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 maybe we shold make whoever wishes to join answer the question *are you in away way related to scoobie?* and if he answers yes, then he cant join!:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toxicfume Veteran Posted March 24, 2002 Veteran Share Posted March 24, 2002 i'd agree with (a)..i mean, there is just too much flaming we see, and some people just never learn if they aren't dealt with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CustardFD Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 Just another thought - I've noticed the 'first post' phenominum begining to appear on the news section of this site... Could there be some mechanism to stop this brought in? Like being banned for an entire earth shattering 3 days or something like that? :D Ok, maybe thats a bit harsh, but you get the picture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoL Veteran Posted March 24, 2002 Veteran Share Posted March 24, 2002 I'm in favor of A B is a good option too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlowNeasy Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 I'm in favor of a modified a) First offense, ban for a week. Second offense, ban for 2 weeks. Third offense, ban is permanent. Anyone caught evading a ban is immediately permanently banned. A hall of shame just invites debates. I don't feel a mod necessarily has to justify his actions. We are grownups here (well, some of us are ) and know the rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 Yeah I'd like to see a few more mods on here. Maybe a couple "undercover" mods too who post just like a normal person, but have all the mod's abilities. I like option (a), and maybe one warning with it. You'd have to make a solid standard of when you warn someone and when you don't. No letting people slide because they have a ton of posts and they are popular. It has to be the same for everyone. To keep track of those that have been warned, you could put some kind of mark around their avatar or on the avatar to let people know they have been warned. And maybe make one post to list who has been warned...that may get somewhat long though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kusanagi Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 Originally posted by SlowNeasy I'm in favor of a modified a) First offense, ban for a week. Second offense, ban for 2 weeks. Third offense, ban is permanent. Anyone caught evading a ban is immediately permanently banned. A hall of shame just invites debates. I don't feel a mod necessarily has to justify his actions. We are grownups here (well, some of us are ) and know the rules. I agree with every single word of your post, SlowNeasy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keldyn Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 I like SlowNeasy's idea and i think will go a long way to keep trolls and flamers out of the boards. If we take a harsher stance towards their behavior they may come to realise that the admin are serious and will not tolerate them. By banning them temporarily it gives them time to consider their course whilst giving the community a break for them. If , after the ban is removed they choose to contiune their course of trolling then the ban should be made permanent. Neowin.net is too good a place to be ruined by the actions of a minority don't ya think ? :ermm: You can take on all the moderators you want but ultimately it wil not stop the trolls from posting here. Superflua's idea of placing a mark by their avatar is nice. It will bring to the attention of the community that yes, this person is a troublemaker and to be wary. Hopefully with the added bonus that it will shame the troll into reconsidering their abusive behavior. That is what i think anyhow. Either we take a harsher stance, add more mods or perhaps a combination of both. I am available to moderate anytime also if necessary. ( South Pacific Region ) I would not pass up a chance to help out a community i have come to love. We respect and support whatever course of action you choose guys. Cheers Keldyn:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h71y6 Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 Originally posted by superfula Yeah I'd like to see a few more mods on here. Maybe a couple "undercover" mods too who post just like a normal person, but have all the mod's abilities. I like option (a), and maybe one warning with it. You'd have to make a solid standard of when you warn someone and when you don't. No letting people slide because they have a ton of posts and they are popular. It has to be the same for everyone. To keep track of those that have been warned, you could put some kind of mark around their avatar or on the avatar to let people know they have been warned. And maybe make one post to list who has been warned...that may get somewhat long though. I've got a better idea!! When they are warned, take away their avatar and sigs... let them have the Betty Boo avatar for a week or so! And no sigs. That'll work!!! HEH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tesseract Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 h71y6: I agree; that would take care of the half-page long signatures that are definately not necessary. Keldyn: Well, said. Agreed 100%;) superfula: Nice ideas! I especially agree with the "same rules for everyone," which is the way it should always be, IMO. I may seem to be a "yes man" here, but the ideas I have seen are excellent ideas that would help to discourage trolls and flamers from posting unnecessary comments to this forum, thereby enhancing the spirit and kindness of the Neowin community, the way it was before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiwiNZ Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 I relatively new to Neowin , I was attracted to Neowin by its professionalism and high standards. However I find the "flaming" offensive. I have been an IT Professional for a number of years and it never ceases to amaze me how some in the Industry feel its ok to insult and be very rude about someone on a personal level simply because they believe on product may be better then another. In other words execise freedom of choice. It is a feature that the Industry can well do without. I therefore fully support any moves that may rid the forums of the immature behavior of a minority . Neobond I support your efforts. If you want more Moderators especially in the South Pacific time zone I am prepared to offer my time . Regards KiwiNZ PS Neowin is an awesome site , lets protect it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroChaos Veteran Posted March 24, 2002 Veteran Share Posted March 24, 2002 i agree something needs to be done too. i wish you all the best in figuring something out too. but is it too late? i think it would be more feasible if something like this was implemented in january or so. good luck neobond and redmak. cheers, joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimeRider Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 This is an interesting thread. I think that the idea of trying to limit "flaming" is a good one. But I think that the definition of what constitutes a "flame" is different for different people. Some folks here need to develop a bit thicker skin. Consider that 80% of how we communicate is non verbal, and it's easy to see how some can misunderstand what is being said or typed as it were. Many, if not most of the threads started here are potentially controversial. The nature of the forum concept lends itself to the debate. A thread is started that might be a question or even just information and there are bound to be diverse opinions. There are those here more concerned with "being right" than "doing right" and whenever a post is contrary to their opinion or their interpretation of the facts, they take it personally. When personalities get involved there are bound to be insults and pointed statements made. There is no way around this. I for one freely admit that I have taken such comments personally at times, perhaps with justification, perhaps not. I have also been accused of flaming, even though it was not my intention to flame anyone, rather to simply state my position. And perhaps even to defend myself from a post that I feel is offensive. My point . . . and I apologize to all for my verbosity . . . is that forums by there very nature lend themselves to human conflict. You should not ban someone, simply because they got into an arguement and the arguement got a little personal. I would think that in that circumstance, the moderator should simply shut the thread down, thus ending the source of conflict. That being said, I also agree that there are those who's sole purpose here lacks any redeeming or constructive purpose. Those people should most likely be banned after suitable notice that their behavior is both unwarranted and unwelcome. I don't think you should adopt any policy about the number of warnings. I have always liked to say that you are married to a policy and simply live with a tendancy. The nature of the violation should decide the nature of the punishment. If you trust your moderators then you stand behind their decisions. If a moderator is being unduly heavy handed, then the BIG BOSS should deal with that. Trust me, if you have a heavy handed moderator, it will come to light. I wish you well in your struggle with this issue, I don't think the answer lies in a new policy however, rather a tendency to put your values into action and by never putting passions before principles. God Speed, -TR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kusanagi Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 Since lots of people are offering their time to help Neowin by being moderator candidates, I might as well sell my own fish (:D): If you need any moderators on the East South America Standard Time (GMT -3), you can count on me... Now, good luck Neobond... best wishes from me! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike11212 Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 I think b would be good And if you need anyone to help on the eastern sea board of the US let me know i can help if ya like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malechai Veteran Posted March 24, 2002 Veteran Share Posted March 24, 2002 In my opinion, the 1 warning idea won't work. if people get a warning, that means that somehow all mods need to know otherwise that same person will get a warning from everyone, effectively screwing up that whole idea. When people get a warning, they'll flame because they know they can get away with it. I say no warning. You flame, you're out. Theres no need to flame in the first place, so a warning shouldn't be necessary. "A" all the way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven P. Administrators Posted March 24, 2002 Author Administrators Share Posted March 24, 2002 TimeRider I agree. I see more people registering to disrupt the forums. so in essence all their posts are flames (or 99.5% of them are) There are also people that are coming from other boards or sites out of jealousy for the popularity of this board for the soul purpose of recruiting or disruption. Flaming only became a problem for some of our long term members after October 2001 (is what I am seeing time and time again) This is the month the Neowin community grew out of proportion. until Oct 2001 we had a tight knit small community, after that it saw a near explosion of registering (remember anon was switched off less than a month ago.. not before) I see people coming from all areas with their own opinions and maybe some people are not happy with the size of the community as it is now. I know I cant follow EVERY post like I used to. Hell maybe someone gave me a car, money or something else in an earlier already scrolled off post. That is how bad it is lol. We see around 1400-1500 forum posts a day on average now :s PS and EDIT: We cannot encourage a marking system. we wont mark peoples sigs or avatars for being a flamer, that is just wrong. We will be victimizing the people and that is as low than them flaming another member. so that cannot work. A warning system is what we have now. although it doesnt work very well, at the moment only people that stand out actually are banned after 2 or 3 warnings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PabUK Veteran Posted March 24, 2002 Veteran Share Posted March 24, 2002 A) is the best on that list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geronimo Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 Is there someway to keep a record of the warning in the backend. So and the mods and user know of the number of warnings. I think one warning for X amount of months would be best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slouch Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 Spyder brings up a very good point. Warning offenders would only work if all of the admins/mods were kept up to date on what each of them does. I suppose that a "warning list" could be kept. While I agree with the idea of warnings for offenders, it would create much more work for all of the admins and mods. They are all working hard enough to provide a site we all love and enjoy. So, no real solutions in this post. Just a few observations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malechai Veteran Posted March 24, 2002 Veteran Share Posted March 24, 2002 Originally posted by superfula Maybe a couple "undercover" mods too who post just like a normal person, but have all the mod's abilities. We have those already ;):paranoid: :paranoid: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underscorebios Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 This is all very subjective, what i consider a flame could be considered by someone else as a "point of view" and some ppl are just more controversial than others, this "one warning and you're out" policy could be an even more controversial subject than the "flame" itself, only leading to more flaming and sense of partiality, ppl should be advised that the nature of their posts is "inflamatory" and asked to calm down in the future and the mods should look and see if the user is complying to this in hope that he/she will be a "better" comunity menber, if they keep at it on a regular basis then i say ban them before thay cause more harm, but do take into account all that he/she as done here at neowin and not just the "bad" parts, like i say this is subjective and you should handle this one case at a time. Also you can't expect that a thread like "My MAC is better than your PC" or "Linux is NOT more safe that windows" wont be controversial and shouldn't treat ppls replies in these kinds of threads harshly although i hope some ppl will learn to live with each other and put aside these "platform wars". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superbeast Posted March 24, 2002 Share Posted March 24, 2002 Agree with A. But a simple disagreement or opinion shouldn't be modded. Leave it to personal attacks or threats towards one or more members. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malechai Veteran Posted March 24, 2002 Veteran Share Posted March 24, 2002 Originally posted by superbeast Leave it to personal attacks or threats towards one or more members. Which is what I consider flaming in the first place, so I'd agree with this statement :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts