linux first impressions


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rezza
This is the thread that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend.

Heh yeah it is, zero, but its interesting to see what people think. I like this thread... keep it coming!

(of course now I've said that I've cursed it. Either this will be the last post in it, or it'll degenerate into senseless flaming ;) )

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+M2Ys4U

To everyone who has said linux shouldn't take so getting used to, think of this theoretical flipside:

somebody is brought up on Linux, right from when they first started using a computer, all he has ever heard of "windows" is this alternative OS that he doens't want to bother with yet. He gets to, say, 25 years old, and then decides to use Windows, i'm sure he'll have to spend a fair amount of time getting used to Windows, how to configure it, tweak it, install programs, run programs, chat, surf the web.. everything that it takes a windows convert now to do when they make the switch. they are two very different OSes, and thats the point, they are different. I'm sure if windows and Linux were made to be practually the same, alot of Linux users wouldn't use linux. Linux is linux, windows is windows, mac is mac. I hope we see alot of new, cheap, computers with Linux pre-installed (i know tiny.com does this) on them will surface soon, as this will ultimatly give the user some room to choose which direction they want to go... simple, no fuss windows, mac (which i can't comment on because i havn't used it) or the more complex but more powerful (and probably cheaper) Linux.

Isn't that what linux is largly about? Choice?

If it is, stop trying to cram the hoice down people's throats and let the user choose. Similarly, windows fanboys, stop trying to ruin Linux's useage by saying it's not user-friendly and it should have X feature from Y OS.

Edited by M2Ys4U
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Zerosleep

I dunno man, it seems that the 'linux user' could figure out Windows alot faster than a Windows user could figure out Linux.

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+M2Ys4U

i'm not saying that the difference is identical, and i do think that somebody going from Linux -> Windows ould get acustomed to it faster than the other way, but in the end there will still be the learning curve to get over

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Zerosleep

Yeah like "Reboot? What the hell is that?!".

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rezza
Yeah like "Reboot? What the hell is that?!".

Now don't be nasty, zerosleep, I've seen windows boxes go for days without reboots!

;)

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Djmutik1013
Wait a second, you can code in Windows, I had heard of such a thing, but always assumed it was a myth.

hahaha.

When I saw this I fell on the floor laughing.

You should have used VmWare to emulate the x86 hardware it is much better. Virtual PC for me was very hard to get to work with anything but windows.

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berz

Among our client base are 30,000 plus users, within the context of a few dozen large firms (not to mention the hundreds of users in the small firms we deal with), who view computers as nothing more than an appliance which they use to get their work done. No, they're not "uneducated masses" - in fact, the vast majority have bachelor's level or equivalent degrees, with a good percentage having masters or higher (including phd). They work in diverse industries such as chemical development, pharmaceuticals, healthcare, managerial consulting/optimization, and legal services. Many of these users include the presidents of said companies, along with most of the managerial chains. In one specific company who designs DJ equipment, the engineers were barely Windows proficient ("my yellow outlook icon is gone from the desktop!), yet they had a deep understanding of physics (something I know next to nothing about).

I see variants of this discussion come up everywhere. My other two interests in life are tiny german sports cars and progressive metal - cars and music: both ego-boasting subjects for a lot of men (and some women too, I suppose). Every time my girlfriend drives my car, she remarks that she hates how it drives; mind you, she doesn't claim to know about or appreciate cars in any way - to her, they are utilities that get you from point A to point B. To say that she needs to be "educated" in the theory of German automotive design in order for her to appreciate why my car is better/worse than x, y, or z cars is pretentious, at best. It doesn't make her a better/worse driver if she doesn't know every design decision and component that went into her or my car (actually, she can hold her own very well at the races). Not to say I'm not guilty of my own snobbery, of course - but only within groups of other "educated" German car owners :)

Same deal with music. A lot of mainstream music is easy to sink your teeth into and generally has a mass appeal. A friend of mine, after hearing about two hours' worth of Michael Romeo's guitar work in Symphony X remarked: "it's ok, but I still think Wes Borland is a better guitarist...and so is that Slipknot guy". A part of me wanted to say "!(@!(!@@#(@#*(#@*(#*@##$#$($#($!....HOW CAN YOU SAY THAT?! Romeo has an amazing ability to play virtually every style of guitar known to man with incredible precision and composition abilities....Borland and the Slipknot guys rely on power chords and silly effects pedals". While, I yes, I will still maintain that Michael Romeo (or Tony MacAlpine, or Yngwie, or whoever) can technically run circles around any nu-metal guitarist - some people just want that aggressive, chunky, ugly nu-metal crunch and nothing more. Much like my girlfriend wants to drive and not be encumbered by the history that went into the car she's sitting in...or how the president of a Fortune 500 company can increase corporate profits by the billions and need a whole team of IT professionals to get him logged into his workstation.

Just because you have a great deal of knowledge about something, it doesn't mean that others are inferior if they do not share in the same knowledge. While I believe in objective reality in theory....I still find too much subjectivity in the world - at least in terms of personal preferences. If people just want to click and make something work, leave them be. Getting all political about a platform is just silly.

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markwolfe
i'm not saying that the difference is identical, and i do think that somebody going from Linux -> Windows ould get acustomed to it faster than the other way, but in the end there will still be the learning curve to get over

I agree with you. There are a lot of things that are still easier in Windows. (there are things easier in Linux, too - like keeping everything updated).

However, we must realize that our theoretical Linux user migrating to Windows for the first time will have to deal with security-centered issues. One such concept is setting up an "Administrator" account, and ensuring all user accounts are set with very little priveleges. Installing programs would not be as easy in Windows as most Windows users currently have it.

In other words, setting up a more secure Windows PC will require a Windows user to do things like switch to Administrator to intall a program. I think our theoretical switcher would have a heart attack when he sees what other Windows users have for their day-to-day security permissions - and realize that the worms and virus issues so common in Windows is because of the casual user operating with a crappy security policy.

So, comparing Linux 'easyness' to Windows 'easyness' is very innacurate, unless you compare to a Windows PC setup with the similar permissions as a typical Linux box.

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Zerosleep
Now don't be nasty, zerosleep, I've seen windows boxes go for days without reboots!

;)

Yeah sorry... I know someone that had their windows box up for 9 weeks. So I can't say too much. ;)

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Mike Douglas
Depends what you are measuring when you talk about "Standard". If you're talking about user experience, then I'd say OS X wins. About ubiquity? Windows (desktop versions). Number of applications? Windows. Security? Certainly not Windows. Probably OpenBSD. Overall? Depends on your specific needs.

Can't agree with you about security. SELinux is insanely secure.

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