Phil Gates Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Originally posted by Charlie Brown The problem with evolution is that those that support it are extremists who a few hundred years ago would have argued just as strongly that the Earth is flat. The fact remains that there is NOT ONE example of evolution from something like bacteria to say a cat, dog, bird or human. Now evolutionists will all but go into a fit to denounce the alternative view of creationism and why ... is it that they do not want to face the reality that there is a God ? If evolution is real then prove it. The TRUTH is evolution is not real. There are no missing links found because they don't exist, but try and tell that to a EVOLUTIONIST FUNDAMENTALIST ! ... A challenge to every evoltuonist out there ... if you are right then post a link to a site that PROVES you are right. If all you can do is flame then you simply prove my point that you are are evolutionist fundamentalists ! Prove that evolution is real ! Don't just believe ... always question ! are you retarded or are you one of those extreme southern babtist people? why do you think that chimpanzes are so closely related to us? on amino acid difference. do you actually think there was an adam and eve and all that horse ****? i do not think there is a god whatsoever. nor do i think that i will go to hell if i don't beleive it. do you think i'm scared of that or something? i don't beleive in jesus either. i'm sure alot of extremist or whatever will reply 100 times trying to criticize me. i won't stop you from beleive whatever, but i won't agree with it. is there any proof that jesus is the son of god? no. just some book some guy wrote. and what ever happened with jesus coming in 2000? did he get stuck in traffic or something? :roll: if there is a god, then i want him to come to my house this saturday and blaze up with me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOS482 Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Originally posted by JimF Actually Shroud of Turin is not fake. It's real. The dating test they did was a total fraud. Plus carbon dating mathod is not accurate at all. No, it is a fake. Plus Carbon 14 dating is accurate, but only up to around 50,000 years. Beyond this they use different methods now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Borg77 Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Originally posted by Elduderino Hehe, the Turin shroud kinda reminds me of the sort of thing that appears on students bed sheets. They don't wash it for a year and leave their print on the sheet. Borg77, oxygen is the one thing that is killing us. Free radicals, from incomplete respiration or metablising are a large reason we do not live for very long. So the more oxygen, the less likely you are to live longer. http://intelegen.com/nutrients/free_radica...and_aging_1.htm The heart of any creature is, unfortunately, limited to a set number of beats. This is why animals as small as a shrew live very short lives, their hearts beat a a very high rate. This is true of any creature on this planet, their lives are limited by the number of heart beats. Carbon dating isn't generally used in criminal cases, as human remains of a certain age are left to archeolegists. Your free radical idea has two main components. They are (a) endogenous and (b) exogenous. The first one (endogenous) has four main components which are mentioned in the article. The second main component is exogenous where the main cause of that is air pollution or however much toxicity is in the air. (1) The second main source doesn't apply to Noah's time due to the fresh air free from air pollution, water pollution, etc... (i.e. near to none toxicity in the air at that time). (1) Free Radicals (oxidants) can be counter balanced with a good diet of fruits, grains, and vegetables. As there was more water and oxygen at the time of Noah, these three main edible foods would of been higher in quality then they would be now. The deep green vegetable has a high concentration of anti-oxidants which help counter balance the free radicals. Also, Vitamin A, B, and C can be found in vegetables and fruits which were plentify during the time of Noah. (1)(2) People back in Noah's day probably had a different genetic structure which is similar to ours but just allowed them to live that long. I mean they probably had a slower division of cells which in essence made them live longer. A telomere which is the cappings at the ends of each chromosome can be used to tell how long a person lives. The shorter the telomere the older you are. The longer the telomere is the younger you look. Noah and his family with slower cell divisions probably kept their telomere's shrinking at a lower rate then what we have today which is at a higher rate. (3) The causes of a slower rate of shortening of the telomere was from a better environment at the time and a better diet then we have today. Why do you think people are getting diseases at younger age today then a hundred years ago? Because of bad diet habits, quality of the air, and stresss. Noah was outside most of the day when he was building the ark or doing his daily chores. The point here is he was out in the sun more then you and I combined. The sunlight reduces a chemical called cyclic ASP (normally produced in the body) which relieves stress and or anxiety. So you and I shut in working in buildings most of the day (whenever we're not on vacation) lose this precious and free resource to relieve our stress which is a major factor towards disease development. I could go on but I will not. References: 1.)Oxygen Free Radicals and Aging 2.)The ABC's Of Healthy Living 3.) Living for 900 years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 NOS482: I guess the fact that you just said the Shroud is a fake makes it official. You totally convinced me. I'm renouncing my Christian faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOS482 Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Originally posted by JimF NOS482: I guess the fact that you just said the Shroud is a fake makes it official. You totally convinced me. I'm renouncing my Christian faith. Get real. All of the credible research shows that it is indeed a fake, a very well done fake, but still a fake. It first appeared during a time in Europe when faking religious icons was a common practice. They could get large sums of money from the gullible. You really should read the history of how that shroud was "discovered". It would leave no doubt that it is indeed a fake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOS482 Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Originally posted by Borg77 It has been shown that the average lifespan during the Roman Empire was around 28 to 30 years. They found this out by digging up graveyards from the era and examining the bodies there. Also, from the start of the 20th century to now the average lifespan has gone up from around 42-47 years to around 74-80 years and it is expected that a person born now could look forward to have an average lifespan of around 110 years. The people who lived during the so-called biblical times had the same genetic makeup as people today have. the difference is that we have far better medical and healthcare than they could ever imagine. For the majority of the existence of humanity the average lifespan was around 18 years. It has only been until very recently that we been able to greatly increase this. If you think that we ve too much stress and poor diet now try living back 30,000 to 40,000 years ago when everything was trying to eat you and you were lucky to find anything to eat as well. Life was short, cold, and ugly. It wasn't too much better during the time which Noah was suppose to have lived either. BTW, average is not maximum. That is going up as well. Though it has also been shown that without advanced medical treatment the human body will only live for a possible maximum of around 140 years. This quite good considering that the human body has only evolved to last long enough to reproduce and raise offspring to sexual maturity. This is one reason why our bodies start to fall apart in our 30's to 40's. Plus we really don't start to age until our mid 20's on average. Before this we are growing instead. So, people are living longer and healthier lives than any period in our history. PS I didn't get this from the Internet. I had done the research years ago from actual books and articles on real paper. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 NOS482: There is also a lot of credible scientists who say Shroud is not fake, but of course you choose to ignore them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Originally posted by Bant and furthurmore.... how can you argue "well what was before the big bang?" well wheres gods mommy? i want their whole friggin family tree. mr and misses god, aunty god, uncle god, what did god evolve from? higher power monkeys?!! or has god just always been there? Actually, God is infinite. That is to say, he cannot be put into a temporal context or a spacial context, because He is outside of both. As an infinite being, he has no sense of "cause and effect" or "before and after" he just is. And if something had "created" God, then He wouldn't be God, because God is considered to be the ultimate creator. Renee Descartes did an excelent job of "proving" God's existance in a series of philosophical texts, or Meditations. They were written from a non-religious standpoint, and aren't filled with a bunch of "just because" type statements. I suggest you read it if the thought "God couldn't have been created because whoever created Him would be God" sounds confusing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faction Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 You guys are constantly flaming, Charlie was just showing you his opinion, and hes very much right. if you have any commen sence of logics, evolution cannot be true, and although i believe in god, the same thing accounts- there is no fact, so god cannot 100% real. BELIEVE what you like. In my eyes, there is no way [as charlie said] and eye can just form, you can see certain elements forming, but an eye? hell no, elements and atoms dont combine and form eyes, or legs. god or not, evolution is literally NOT true, is it plausible, maybe, but there is no evidence, and therefor no fact. The biggest thing is, is that most people that believe in evolutionarism or whatever, look at it from a scientific viewpoint, and say "oh well in science god cant be real", well the same goes for evolution, if you look at it from a scientific viewpoint- it cant be real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
=NickJ= Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Apologies faction, but its not Charlie's argument against Evolution we're flaming, its the fact that he and JimF are not content keeping it to the one thread, they seem to need four to do it, its starting to spam the board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faction Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Yes i understand, but it seems most of you are flaming him for his OPINION- FORUMS ARE FOR OPINION. The other thread has been closed. Just try to keep it clean- everyone has different opinions, dont get mad at them for theirs [as stupid as it may be] 1) You refuse to believe that both might exist together. In your minds, it must be one or the other. It's as if you think God is all powerful, but he's not powerful enough to create evolution. Are you really calling your god weak? Very true. they probably DO exist together.. Seeing how differnt animals etc adapt to there environment- [biology]- than its plausible that they can evolve to the environment. But there is no way an animal just suddenly evolutionized out of the blue. Now i believe in both. wow. what one thread can do to you :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshie Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 You're all so narrow-minded. There are two things that I just can't figure out about you people: 1) You refuse to believe that both might exist together. In your minds, it must be one or the other. It's as if you think God is all powerful, but he's not powerful enough to create evolution. Are you really calling your god weak? 2) Absolutely none of you are proving or disproving anything at all. Yet you continue on, and on, and on, and on. Have you ever wondered if maybe all of you are wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brown Posted April 18, 2002 Author Share Posted April 18, 2002 Originally posted by Nick_Jones Apologies faction, but its not Charlie's argument against Evolution we're flaming, its the fact that he and JimF are not content keeping it to the one thread, they seem to need four to do it, its starting to spam the board. What you are really doing is EVERYTHING but answering the question ... you obviously can't handle the truth ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h71y6 Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Regardless of how profound you think the discussion is, faction, it is not necessary to have three threads opened by the same people on the same topic. Yes forums are for opinions. And like how everyone flamed them for their opinions, they flame equally as much. These threads are asking for flames because of the nature of it. Is it not enough to have one thread for it? There's a word for these... 'troll'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDQuiksilver Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 What more proof could you possibly want? I mean come on.. you ask us "nonblievers" to proove our points, yet you turn around and say "God is real because the bible says so." This is the largest characteristic I've noticed in every religious nutcase. Hypocrisy. Why do they do it? Their closed minds are so cluttered with Bible this and Bible that.. they have no idea of what it's like to think outside the box. They think they're the only "right people" on this damn planet. Opinion? I think not. It's okay for a kid to wear a "WWJD" shirt to school, but a kid cannot wear a Marijuana shirt to school. Drugs kill you? Well, doesn't say anything for religion considering how many religions used sacrificial ways? Quite a few if I remember right. How dare somebody else try to view the world in a different way? Nobody should be different. That's the impression a lot of us get from the religious type. Especially when they want everybody to be happy, however they turn around and discriminate against musical tastes and other various things. Again, more hypocrisy. Also, they turn around and push this "cells cannot exist" or whatever they hell they're trying to say about science. Show me this magical happening that we just appeared on this Earth in one second. Show me that this world was created by God. Hell, I see no physical or visual proof. That's why I definately believe in evolution. Atleast after going through courses such as Chemistry and Biology, I can see how things FORM and FUNCTION. Even with the inventions of more powerful microscops, we can SEE cells and eventually we will be able to get to the atomic level where we can see in total detail. What I can't understand is why they cannot let people live how they want to live. They're constantly trying to shove their views down other peoples throats. Talk about an annoyance. Like I said, they want everybody to be just like them because they're the "chosen people" and nobody should be different. The way religion is taught today is complete nonsense. Ministers raping little boys? Wow, makes me want to become religious! *sarcasm* I can continue and will choose to do so if anyone wants to. IM me or email me if you want to as well. I love these kind of conversations, however, we cannot continue them unless the biased mods don't close it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brown Posted April 18, 2002 Author Share Posted April 18, 2002 Originally posted by Faction You guys are constantly flaming, Charlie was just showing you his opinion, and hes very much right. if you have any commen sence of logics, evolution cannot be true, and although i believe in god, the same thing accounts- there is no fact, so god cannot 100% real. BELIEVE what you like. In my eyes, there is no way [as charlie said] and eye can just form, you can see certain elements forming, but an eye? hell no, elements and atoms dont combine and form eyes, or legs. god or not, evolution is literally NOT true, is it plausible, maybe, but there is no evidence, and therefor no fact. The biggest thing is, is that most people that believe in evolutionarism or whatever, look at it from a scientific viewpoint, and say "oh well in science god cant be real", well the same goes for evolution, if you look at it from a scientific viewpoint- it cant be real. What we are up against here is the same ignorance people had when they were convinced that the Earth was flat. It didn't matter that the horizon never disappeared *coz the Earth is round* because they were SO convinced by what they thought was the truth. The fact remains that Evolution requires far greater faith than faith in God. chrisjohn316 http://home.iprimus.com.au/chrisjohn316/ch...n316/index.html You will note that for ALL the arguments FOR evolution, there is not ONE example ! Not ONE ! I have a Christian perspective of why people are so blinded but I won't go into that now. People have a hard enough time trying to understand the physical reality around them without commenting on the spiritual. ... and for all those that think I am wrong ... go read what I have written, if you have the courage, and then THINK about it ! The truth is plain to see, but people don't want the truth ! They can't handle it ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AciD420TyMe Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 The person that started this subject sayed there was no missing link but they have found what scientist cal lthe missing link. It wasnt in africa as alot f people thought tho it was in asia. watch the discovery channel they have shows about it atleats once a month. I personaly dont realy believe in god thats my belief i i have alot of friends that do and sometimes we talk about it, but i never try 2 get anyone 2 believe the way i do. Anyways everyone just beleive what u want. but make educated decision there seems 2 be a shortage of smart people in the world laitly. I say that cuz i livei n a tourist town anyone that has ever lived in a tourist town will understand y i sayed that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDQuiksilver Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Originally posted by Charlie Brown What we are up against here is the same ignorance people had when they were convinced that the Earth was flat. It didn't matter that the horizon never disappeared *coz the Earth is round* because they were SO convinced by what they thought was the truth. The fact remains that Evolution requires far greater faith than faith in God. chrisjohn316 http://home.iprimus.com.au/chrisjohn316/ch...n316/index.html You will note that for ALL are arguments FOR evolution, there is not ONE example ! Not ONE ! I have a Christian perspective of why people are so blinded but I won't go into that now. People have a hard enough time trying to understand the physical reality around them without commenting on the spiritual. ... and for all those that think I am wrong ... go read what I have read, if you have the courage, and then THINK about it ! The truth is plain to see, but people don't want the truth ! They can't handle it ! Ignorance such as this boys and girls is why 99.9% of this world decides to fight. When you get these religious followers going onto forums, calling you up, or talking to you at school 24/7.. it gets to be an annoyance. I believe Charlie is the one that cannot view other people's thoughts in his own mind, so he does what "God" tells him to do... "call them cowards, they are nothing." In a general sense, that what Charlie is getting at. Where's the physical and visual proof of God Charlie, huh? Show me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h71y6 Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 charlie, i have read your opinions many times already. And i have never once flamed you. Now that you have made you opinion clear so many times in the last two days, can you please cease repeating yourself? I think once is enough for opinions, really.We can read you know. And please don't insult anyone else who doesn't share your view by calling them blind etc. Your behavior so far has as much to blame as the people who flamed you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanctified Veteran Posted April 18, 2002 Veteran Share Posted April 18, 2002 Originally posted by Charlie Brown What we are up against here is the same ignorance people had when they were convinced that the Earth was flat. It didn't matter that the horizon never disappeared *coz the Earth is round* because they were SO convinced by what they thought was the truth. The fact remains that Evolution requires far greater faith than faith in God. chrisjohn316 http://home.iprimus.com.au/chrisjohn316/ch...n316/index.html You will note that for ALL are arguments FOR evolution, there is not ONE example ! Not ONE ! I have a Christian perspective of why people are so blinded but I won't go into that now. People have a hard enough time trying to understand the physical reality around them without commenting on the spiritual. ... and for all those that think I am wrong ... go read what I have read, if you have the courage, and then THINK about it ! The truth is plain to see, but people don't want the truth ! They can't handle it ! And how you know that you KNOW the truth? because you say so? because you?ve reading some biased lirerature for years? you?re such a fanatist who cant accept pther points or arguments ... I dont want this crap in neowin, this is not about freedom of speech, its about this f*cking guy who want to start a real war here because he?s so biased and blinded to respect other opinions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDQuiksilver Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brown Posted April 18, 2002 Author Share Posted April 18, 2002 There is not ONE example .... not ONE for evolution from start to say a cat, dog, bird or human. It's a lie ... it is ALL a lie ! Why has no one cited one example of evolution ? The truth is you CAN'T ! And why ??? Because it is a LIE but you WON'T admit it ! Face up to the truth ! THINK ABOUT IT ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOS482 Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Originally posted by JimF NOS482: There is also a lot of credible scientists who say Shroud is not fake, but of course you choose to ignore them. Define credible. I wouldn't call the ICR credible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDQuiksilver Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Um LoL.. wake up... you just keep repeating the "It's a LIE" statement over and over.. where's your proof buddy? I'm still waiting. Don't make me wait so long I evolve! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshie Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Ya, and you haven't posted any examples that prove the existence of your God. The only thing you are posting is childish temper tantrums about how you're right, you're right, you're right, and everybody else is wrong. More than anything though, you're saying that your God isn't all-powerful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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