markwolfe Veteran Posted June 3, 2005 Veteran Share Posted June 3, 2005 (edited) - There is no real proof Firefox or Opera are more secure than IE, other than IE is the most popular so is the most likely to be hacked. 586006549[/snapback] How about taking a look at Secunia's advisories: IE 6.x Firefox 1.x no advisories: Opera 8.x I believe Linux is used more on servers, although MS may slightly outnumber it.586007958[/snapback] According to IDC, Windows and UNIX are tied in server market at 34.4% market share each, with Linux at 10.3%https://www.neowin.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=327095 As for what *I* think makes Firefox or Opera "better", it would be that they are cross-platform, and are supported in Linux (my OS of choice). Edited June 3, 2005 by markjensen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IceDogg Posted June 3, 2005 Share Posted June 3, 2005 I'm going to bite the bullet one of these days and give Linux a try. I've been saying that for a year now, but I will do it.. just a matter of when. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEVER85 Posted June 3, 2005 Share Posted June 3, 2005 I mainly use whatever has the best "feel" to it. I'm sure you all know what I mean. For a browser, I prefer Firefox. I have used IE for about 8 years, and still do on the rare occasion. I've also tried Opera (versions 7 and 8), and while it is quite an impressive browser, I just didn't like the feel of it. Regardless, you can't go wrong with Firefox, or with Opera. If you use IE 6.0 SP2 and practice safe security methods, then all the power to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Xinok Subscriber² Posted June 4, 2005 Subscriber² Share Posted June 4, 2005 - There is no real proof Firefox or Opera are more secure than IE...586006549[/snapback] Alright, I take this back. Its just I know I've heard people say something right along the lines of "you can make Internet Explorer as secure as Firefox or Opera", by setting the security settings correctly. I guess thats what I went by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slimy Posted June 5, 2005 Share Posted June 5, 2005 Are you using Deer Park? Have you applied any speed tweaks?Firefox is just blazing fast compared to IE. 586006450[/snapback] ie is faster for me. the main "difference" is that firefox is said to be more secure, but what it really does is that it's default settings are different from ie's, all of which you change in ie, but which no1 realizes. imho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markwolfe Veteran Posted June 5, 2005 Veteran Share Posted June 5, 2005 the main "difference" is that firefox is said to be more secure, but what it really does is that it's default settings are different from ie's, all of which you change in ie, but which no1 realizes. imho586019164[/snapback] It isn't about "default settings". Take a look through some of the flaws noted in my earlier post:How about taking a look at Secunia's advisories: IE 6.x 586011116[/snapback] I don't see any settings for these first three unpatched items at "Moderately Critical" (or highter) rating: http://secunia.com/advisories/13251/ http://secunia.com/advisories/12304/ http://secunia.com/advisories/11482/ Yes, some items (ActiveX) can be disabled or have their settings altered, but there are plenty of other nasties known to be lurking about in IE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krmathis Posted June 5, 2005 Share Posted June 5, 2005 (edited) what makes firefox or opera better than IE 586006424[/snapback] Some points that imo make Firefox and Opera better than Internet Explorer. 1. Multiplatform (Mac OS X, GNU/Linux, MS Windows, etc...). 2. Speed (Firefox and Opera renders webpages faster than IE). 3. Security (Secunia's advisories: IE 6.x=81, Firefox 1.x=17, Opera 8.x=0 ). 4. Features (Tabbed browsing, popup blocker, extensions, etc...). 5. Frequently updated (Internet Explorer 5.23 is the last one for Mac OS X, dated 06/23/2003). 6. Web standards (Firefox and Opera follow the W3C standards more stricktly than IE). 7. Better CSS2 and PNG support. Edited June 5, 2005 by krmathis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEVER85 Posted June 5, 2005 Share Posted June 5, 2005 Some points that imo make Firefox and Opera better than Internet Explorer.1. Multiplatform (Mac OS X, GNU/Linux, MS Windows, etc...). 2. Speed (Firefox and Opera renders webpages faster than IE). 3. Security (Secunia's advisories: IE 6.x=81, Firefox 1.x=17, Opera 8.x=0 ). 4. Features (Tabbed browsing, popup blocker, extensions, etc...). 5. Frequently updated (Internet Explorer 5.23 is the last one for Mac OS X, dated 06/23/2003). 6. Web standards (Firefox and Opera follow the W3C standards more stricktly than IE). 7. Better CSS2 and PNG support. 586019702[/snapback] :yes: Couldn't have said it any better myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhav Posted June 5, 2005 Share Posted June 5, 2005 Well I have an argument for firefox: Open source AND cross-platform means there's millions more people that can work on it to improve it and make it more convenient. Just take a look at moox builds and bangbang023 builds...and they're just the 2 i know of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makeshift Hammer Posted June 5, 2005 Share Posted June 5, 2005 I like I.E's nasties.......browser crashes make what may be an otherwise linear/dull day pretty exciting :o I like looking at pies too and shouting naughty words at them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slimy Posted June 5, 2005 Share Posted June 5, 2005 It isn't about "default settings". Take a look through some of the flaws noted in my earlier post:I don't see any settings for these first three unpatched items at "Moderately Critical" (or highter) rating: http://secunia.com/advisories/13251/ http://secunia.com/advisories/12304/ http://secunia.com/advisories/11482/ Yes, some items (ActiveX) can be disabled or have their settings altered, but there are plenty of other nasties known to be lurking about in IE. 586019331[/snapback] i don't deny that. but i can surf the web without having problems using internet explorer so i don't really much care if there is an exploit that happens unders specific circumstances but doesn't happen to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markwolfe Veteran Posted June 6, 2005 Veteran Share Posted June 6, 2005 i don't deny that. but i can surf the web without having problems using internet explorer so i don't really much care if there is an exploit that happens unders specific circumstances but doesn't happen to me. 586020810[/snapback] Not a problem. I have never put down anyone's decision on what browser, OS, CPU or what-not they choose to use. They have selected what works best for them, and that is fine by me. I hope no one took my posts in any other way. :ermm: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Decryptor Veteran Posted June 12, 2005 Veteran Share Posted June 12, 2005 well, Opera and Firefox are cross platform, and have a interest in supporting standards based web design (e.g. semantic XHTML and CSS for layout). both are fast, and more secure than IE oh, and IE's rendering engine (Trident) sucks, whereas Opera's and Firefox's engines don't. (main selling point for me) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbrunt1990 Posted June 12, 2005 Share Posted June 12, 2005 Basically Firefox rules because it has Tabbed browsing which makes browsing faster and easyer when you get used to using it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunafish Posted June 13, 2005 Share Posted June 13, 2005 Basically Firefox rules because it has Tabbed browsing which makes browsing faster and easyer when you get used to using it. 586053314[/snapback] yer right, another fan boy that needs to read the topic i thought there was no trolling allowed in this forum? yet people slag of or try to convert more fan boys. We all know no browser on the internet is more secure than others, they WILL all have security holes, its a fact of human coding knowledge. Also you will find security in IE has made it more secure with SP2, it now asks you if you want to install this activx stuff, or this toolbar and anything else that may try and hijack you. oh and we all know FF stole the lovely little IE warning yellow popup toolbar thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markwolfe Veteran Posted June 13, 2005 Veteran Share Posted June 13, 2005 yer right, another fan boy that needs to read the topici thought there was no trolling allowed in this forum? yet people slag of or try to convert more fan boys. We all know no browser on the internet is more secure than others, they WILL all have security holes, its a fact of human coding knowledge. Also you will find security in IE has made it more secure with SP2, it now asks you if you want to install this activx stuff, or this toolbar and anything else that may try and hijack you. oh and we all know FF stole the lovely little IE warning yellow popup toolbar thing 586058719[/snapback] This is an opinion thread, where the original poster specifically solicited other people's opinions on what they feel makes Firefox or Opera better than IE. The only thing out of place here is your over-reaction to someone giving his opinion. Further more, your statement that "no browser on the internet is more secure than others" is false. All products are not made alike with the same flaws. Some will be more secure than others. In fact, according to Secunia's web site, Opera currently has no known vunerabilities, whereas IE has 20 known vunerabilities that have a maximum rating of Highly Critical (4, on a scale of 0 to 5). Yes, good browsing, firewall and other security habits play a very important part in overall security, but that does not mean that all browsers are equal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakej Posted June 13, 2005 Share Posted June 13, 2005 I know for a fact that Firefox is faster than IE (and can be tweaked to go even faster). People are also paranoid about security, but in reality you're not vulnerable to most attacks if you're browsing sites like Neowin. - WindowsTechie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunafish Posted June 13, 2005 Share Posted June 13, 2005 your comment is wrong because no Browser/software written is secure, nothing in this world is secure, so no need to over-react as you would say. As what i written their is the trust behind coding, no matter what company you go to, they cant claim their software is 100% secure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meehowski Posted June 13, 2005 Share Posted June 13, 2005 Opera 8.01 Version 7631............. .......is my first choice!! I've "tweaked" it to my liking........... Be well.............. Mike P.S.-Deer Park is #2!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markwolfe Veteran Posted June 13, 2005 Veteran Share Posted June 13, 2005 your comment is wrong becauseno Browser/software written is secure, nothing in this world is secure, so no need to over-react as you would say. As what i written their is the trust behind coding, no matter what company you go to, they cant claim their software is 100% secure 586058975[/snapback] Firstly, no one has claimed that any browser is 100% secure. As for your points: Nothing is 100% secure - correct. However, you are drawing the false conclusion that they must all be the same, since none are 100% secure. This is a blatently false conslusion. A browser that is 80% secure is not as secure as one that is 20% secure. I don't know why you have only two categories for browsers: 100% secure (which is non-existent) not 100% secure (and all equal) It just doesn't make sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tobb555 Posted June 13, 2005 Share Posted June 13, 2005 absolutely nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llbbl Posted June 13, 2005 Share Posted June 13, 2005 All you guys touting that Opera 8.0 is so secure because it has NO KNOWN vunerabilities are full of crap because Opera 8.0 was released a week ago! http://www.w3reports.com/index.php?itemid=921 Speed, Security and Simplicity: Opera 8 Web Browser Released TodayE-Mail Print By: Press Release Tuesday June 07 2005, 06:26:40 http://www.w3reports.com Opera Software today launched the highly anticipated new version of its browser, Opera 8 for Windows and Linux. Internet users can now surf the Web faster, safer and I mean come on guys of course Opera 8.0 isn't going to have anything listed for it on Secunia. Take a look at Opera 7.0 released in Dec. 2002 and you will see a different story. It has 33 things listed for 2003-2005. Opera 7 for Windows Beta 1 releasedOpera Debuts the Latest in Browser Technology Oslo, Norway -- Nov. 13, 2002 Opera Software ASA's browser factory today unveiled the new Opera 7 for Windows Beta 1, revamped from the rendering engine and up. http://secunia.com/product/761/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shihchiun Posted June 13, 2005 Share Posted June 13, 2005 I like Firefox over Internet Explorer because... -I rarely have to worry about what websites I visit--viruses don't automatically download, I don't get a ton of popups, etc. -Tabbed browsing--but only with mouse gestures. It's not much better than IE otherwise. -Adblock -All the other extensions I use -How much the interface can be customized -I don't get a bunch of random icons on the toolbar -It doesn't have that freaking annoying clicking sound (yes, I know it can be turned off) -Keyboard shortcuts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megamanXplosion Posted June 14, 2005 Share Posted June 14, 2005 I mean come on guys of course Opera 8.0 isn't going to have anything listed for it on Secunia. Take a look at Opera 7.0 released in Dec. 2002 and you will see a different story. It has 33 things listed for 2003-2005. Opera 8.0 hasn't been officially out for a long time, but it has been under public testing for a long time (which gives people plenty of time to find vulnerabilities.) I've been using Opera 8.0 for months now, and I was using Opera 7.6 before then (which later turned into Opera 8 because of the massive amount of changes.) It's not like exploiters have only had their hands on it for a week, they've probably been trying to crack the security as long as I've been using it. Also, those "33 things" with their last major release have been patched. The issue isn't about how many security problems have been found, it's about how many are left unpatched and how quickly newly-found vulnerabilities are patched. It doesn't matter if there were 33 issues in the past, do they effect us now? Nope. Opera has always been fast at patching security problems. If a new vulnerability would appear, I gaurantee that it would only take a couple of days for them to patch it. In the event that a new vulnerability is found, the problem will be patched within a week and Opera's automatic-update tool will automatically patch itself (it checks for updates once a week.) Firefox has 5 vulnerabilities that are well-known. Firefox was good at patching vulnerabilities as soon as they were found -like Opera- but they have slowed down a LOT lately. Firefox is still inherently more secure than Internet Explorer. Look at the security vulnerabilities for Internet Explorer 6, there are still tons of problems which remain to be fixed. Not only that, but look how long they've been publicly known! Internet Explorer's security is like swiss cheese. And MarkJenson has a good point. You make it sound like there's absolutely no security in any of them. While 100% security is a fallacy, the alternatives to Internet Explorer are more secure. The chances of being exploited using Internet Explorer is much higher than the alternatives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vcv Posted June 14, 2005 Share Posted June 14, 2005 33 vulnerabilities in 2 1/2 years is a slight difference from 18 in half a year. Also, if you want to discuss old versions, look at 0.x which has only been tracked for 1 year :: http://secunia.com/product/3256/ That's right, 30 vulnerabilities in lses than half the time Opera had 33. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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