manijak Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 Did anyone else noticed that microsoft.com REJECTING mozilla based browsers (Firefox). ex: Click on some download links from microsoft.com in Firefox and you get answer "Server is buissy try again in a few min.." then paste a same link in IE and everything works :angry: Is that legal?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
User6060 Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 is this for every download link at microsoft? I was just able to download something from Microsoft Download Center on Firefox so maybe firefox is just acting up for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unksi Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 My Firefox downloads without any problems, you must have had just bad luck when connecting there :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clide Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 Downloading a xbox 360 vid just fine in Firefox...Maybe the server was too busy when you tried in Firefox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuBar. Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 I don't think they could do that? Even though mine works which Microsoft allows Firefox protocols, it's not possible that they could block Firefox. However, if your doing a windows update, you need Internet Explorer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KayMan2K Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 it's not possible that they could block Firefox 586080403[/snapback] Sure it is! But they aren't... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toonie Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 Everything works fine for me :huh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neufuse Veteran Posted June 17, 2005 Veteran Share Posted June 17, 2005 Did anyone else noticed that microsoft.com REJECTING mozilla based browsers (Firefox).ex: Click on some download links from microsoft.com in Firefox and you get answer "Server is buissy try again in a few min.." then paste a same link in IE and everything works :angry: Is that legal?? 586080374[/snapback] microsoft isn't blocking anything, works fine for everyone else Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neufuse Veteran Posted June 17, 2005 Veteran Share Posted June 17, 2005 I don't think they could do that? Even though mine works which Microsoft allows Firefox protocols, it's not possible that they could block Firefox. However, if your doing a windows update, you need Internet Explorer. 586080403[/snapback] Firefox isn't a protocol... TCP/IP is a protocol which is universal now for communication... Firefox just talks using the HTTP GET/POST commands the same exact way IE does. the only thing they could check to see if it was a certain browser is the host header (i.e. Gecko x.x header) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acezo Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 Did anyone else noticed that microsoft.com REJECTING mozilla based browsers (Firefox).ex: Click on some download links from microsoft.com in Firefox and you get answer "Server is buissy try again in a few min.." then paste a same link in IE and everything works :angry: Is that legal?? 586080374[/snapback] I noticed this a couple weeks ago, multiple times. Sometimes MS links work, sometimes sing DPA1, so that may have something to do with itthey don't, while they always work with IE. It didn't start until I started it. EDIT: For example, THIS LINK never works for me in FF. I always get Sorry, we are unable to show you the page you requested. Please try again later., while it works fine in IE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhangm Supervisor Posted June 17, 2005 Supervisor Share Posted June 17, 2005 (edited) Microsoft blocks Firefox for me. Here's the link that Acezo posted (loaded the page in each browser within 5 seconds of each other): Of course, with a simple change to the User Agent string of Firefox, using an extension to make it identify itself as Internet Explorer, we get: Doesn't seem like there are any rendering issues with Firefox that could be used as an excuse for blocking its user agent string... Seems like Microsoft just doesn't like competition. *cough* Opera incident *cough* Edited June 17, 2005 by Relativity_17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neufuse Veteran Posted June 17, 2005 Veteran Share Posted June 17, 2005 (edited) Microsoft blocks Firefox for me.? Here's the link that Acezo posted (loaded the page in each browser within 5 seconds of each other): Of course, with a simple change to the User Agent string of Firefox, using an extension to make it identify itself as Internet Explorer, we get: Doesn't seem like there are any rendering issues with Firefox that could be used as an excuse for blocking its user agent string...? Seems like Microsoft just doesn't like competition. *cough* Opera incident *cough* 586080608[/snapback] you know why its doing that in deer pack a1 and not in FF1.04? because their user agents are different and MS is not accepting ones it doesn't have on it's "working" list... thats why some of us have it working and others dont FireFox 1.0.4 here works perfectly In DearPack 1 Alphia it doesn't work, because of the host string the strings for both are ff 1.0.4 Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.8) Gecko/20050511 Firefox/1.0.4 dearpack 1 Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8b2) Gecko/20050531 Firefox/1.0+ the reason this is a problem is because MS picks what version of a page to show based on what USER AGENT string it recieves... if it doesnt know what the agent is refering to then it gives an error... Edited June 17, 2005 by neufuse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acezo Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 the reason this is a problem is because MS picks what version of a page to show based on what USER AGENT string it recieves... if it doesnt know what the agent is refering to then it gives an error... 586080729[/snapback] Figured that was the reason, but didn't test since I don't have the UA switching extension installed (got rid of it since I only used to make Yahoo's sites work with FF, but now they work natively) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neufuse Veteran Posted June 17, 2005 Veteran Share Posted June 17, 2005 Figured that was the reason, but didn't test since I don't have the UA switching extension installed (got rid of it since I only used to make Yahoo's sites work with FF, but now they work natively) 586080809[/snapback] yea.. I really hate when people say MS is blocking a certain browser, when in reality they are just not aware of the new host agent string and haven't updated their sites to recognize it... which was what happened with Opera and now FireFox, it's even happened in the past with IE when version 6 was in beta and their site only recognized 5.5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pc_Madness Posted June 19, 2005 Share Posted June 19, 2005 yea.. I really hate when people say MS is blocking a certain browser, when in reality they are just not aware of the new host agent string 586081058[/snapback] Microsoft have been caught out doing dodgy things to non-ie browsers before, and in this case, I don't see why Microsoft couldn't simply show a page formatted for internet explorer, or atleast show a Message saying that the browser isn't supported. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt T Posted June 19, 2005 Share Posted June 19, 2005 Is that legal?? 586080374[/snapback] (Assuming that Microsoft were blocking Gecko based browsers), of course it's legal; it's Microsoft's website, they have the power to choose who views it and who doesn't - or in this case, they have the power to choose which browsers can access the website and which one's can't. There are other sites out there that don't allow access with IE btw, it's not just Firefox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePast Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 yea.. I really hate when people say MS is blocking a certain browser, when in reality they are just not aware of the new host agent string and haven't updated their sites to recognize it... which was what happened with Opera and now FireFox, it's even happened in the past with IE when version 6 was in beta and their site only recognized 5.5 586081058[/snapback] Then how do you explain this. cNet Microsoft behind $12 million payment to Opera[/b] Published: May 24, 2004, 4:00 AM PDT By Evan Hansen and Paul Festa Staff Writer, CNET News.com Microsoft agreed to pay Norway's Opera Software $12.75 million to head off a threatened lawsuit over code that made some Web pages on MSN look bad in certain versions of Opera's Web browser, CNET News.com has learned. Opera disclosed the payment last week in a terse press release that omitted other details, including the name of the settling party and the nature of the dispute. But a source indicated that the payment came from Microsoft in order to close the books on a clash over obscure interoperability problems. On at least three separate occasions, Opera has accused Microsoft of deliberately breaking interoperability between its MSN Web portal and various versions of the Opera browser--charges that the software giant has repeatedly denied. A Microsoft representative said the company does not comment on rumors. Reached by phone, Opera executives refused to name the company involved in the settlement or describe the nature of the legal claims, citing a confidentiality agreement. "We forwarded a few facts to a big international corporation and settled before we took legal action," Opera Chief Technology Officer Hakon Lie said Tuesday. "This resolves an issue very close to my heart." The deal marks the latest in a string of settlements from Microsoft, which is seeking to simplify its business by clearing up potentially damaging legal claims. In the past year, the company has agreed to pay billions of dollars to wrap up litigation with Sun Microsystems, digital rights management developer InterTrust and Time Warner's Netscape Communications division, among others. While the Opera payment is relatively tiny, it underscores ongoing ripple effects in the browser market that stem from the overwhelming dominance of Microsoft's Internet Explorer. Having used its desktop operating system monopoly to help trounce its primary rival Netscape, Microsoft has effectively abandoned significant browser development efforts. That's left companies with negligible market share such as Opera and Netscape's Mozilla open-source project to lead innovation in the field. For example, IE 6, the latest version of Microsoft's Web browser, released in August 2001, does not yet offer a tool that automatically blocks Web pop-up advertising. Microsoft has promised pop-up blocking as part of a Windows XP upgrade due out later this summer known as SP2. That puts it well behind Opera and others that have offered pop-up blocking for months in response to overwhelming consumer demand. Last year, a member of Microsoft's IE team indicated that the company planned to drop independent development of the browser altogether, opting instead to fold its functions into the next major overhaul of its Windows operating system, a project code-named Longhorn. Since then, however, Microsoft has remained largely silent about its long-range browser development plans. "I'm not sure what their plan is, whether they'll do some upgrades with SP2, wait for Longhorn or break out a separate release," Directions on Microsoft analyst Matt Rosoff said. "Whatever they do, IE is not a major strategic technology for Microsoft anymore...They don't have a huge team working on IE, and there hasn't been a lot of evolution in IE for a couple years." Web authors bow to IE IE's dominance has also created fallout for Web standards, because Microsoft delivers the Web to roughly nine out of every 10 people who use it. Although IE 6 provides good standards support, some Web site developers have decided that it's easier to create sites that work best with versions of IE, rather than use code that works equally well on all standards-compliant browsers. For example, Shutterfly, the online photo store backed by Netscape co-founder Jim Clark, does not support any version of Opera or Mozilla browsers, according to a warning displayed on the site this week. The problem has been a top issue for Web standards advocates for some time, shifting the focus of standards compliance away from browser makers and toward companies behind popular Web authoring tools, such as Macromedia and Adobe Systems. Opera's past complaints with Microsoft included charges that the software giant deliberately sought to undermine the experience of Web surfers using its browser by delivering a different set of instructions to Opera than those sent to IE for rendering Web pages on MSN. The results included misaligned margins and indentations that cut off some words, among other things. Microsoft in 2003 admitted that it had taken steps to detect different types of browsers accessing MSN and sent different Web page layouts to different products. But the company said its efforts were aimed at promoting standards compliance rather than at hurting products that compete with its dominant Internet Explorer browser. Microsoft said it has since stopped the practice. "MSN is committed to providing the best experience we can to all of its consumers, and there is no intent to degrade the consumer experience for any visitors to MSN," a Microsoft representative wrote in an e-mail. "When this issue hit last year, MSN tested Opera's latest browser, determined and made adjustments to ensure all Opera 7 users had a quality experience while visiting MSN." Opera, by contrast, has long contended that Microsoft's alleged maneuvers were intentional and hurt its reputation. MSN's browser lockouts at the time provided incendiary ammunition for Microsoft critics, including anti-Microsoft industry group ProComp, which in 2001 accused Microsoft of unfairly exploiting its massive lead in the browser market to muscle out smaller competitors. "Who else could it be but Microsoft?" ProComp President Mike Pettit said this week, referring to the payment. Pettit cast a jaundiced eye at the transaction, along with other settlements Microsoft has made with rivals that have alleged wrongdoing. "If you really analyze the harm that is inflicted and measure the damages paid, it's a very small dollar amount to Microsoft," Pettit said. "It's just the cost of doing business to them, so they're just going to keep doing it over and over. They pay 5 or 10 cents on the dollar in damages way after the fact, and the net effect of it is to further unbalance the playing field. In the final analysis, they got away with it." These days, Opera is looking to move past the PC to distribute its Web browser on devices such as cell phones and personal digital assistants. As a result, Opera will in the future face less of a threat from Microsoft, Opera director John Patrick said. "People wonder why anyone would get into the browser business," he said. "But this isn't about Microsoft and the PC. It's about every other kind of device, from set-top boxes to cell phones. IE doesn't dominate that. It's a different market...The opportunities are enormous." TrackB And now the only way to get msnbc to display properly is by cloaking Opera's identity entirely using ua.ini AND a script, if you don't you get served a broken page. 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Scorbing Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Use the new Netscape then. It has both Firefox and IE engines built-in and it will automatically detects which site requires which engine and make the page look as it was meant to be. Netscape 8.02 is firefox but with better looks and more features. Try it. You won't be dissapointed. Netscape is getting back on track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquid Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Then how do you explain this.cNet And now the only way to get msnbc to display properly is by cloaking Opera's identity entirely using ua.ini AND a script, if you don't you get served a broken page. 586096804[/snapback] Opera is the biggest bunch of babies, thats how I explain that. If their browser doesn't work on some sites its the sites fault? Reasons like this are why I don't use Opera. Its not free, and its inferior to even IE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gur713 Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 i heard this was because of the b or + (cant remember which one) in the user string like Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8b2) Gecko/20050622 Firefox/1.0+ so if you change it to Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.9) Gecko/20050620 Firefox/1.0.5 it might work cause i think this is just a nightly build thing but not sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePast Posted June 26, 2005 Share Posted June 26, 2005 Opera is the biggest bunch of babies, thats how I explain that. If their browser doesn't work on some sites its the sites fault? Reasons like this are why I don't use Opera. Its not free, and its inferior to even IE. 586099975[/snapback] If msnbc detects Opera I get served a broken page, If I trick msnbc to think that I'm using Firefox I get served a working page in Opera. How the f*** can that be anything but fault on the webmasters side? BTW, IE is not free either, windows cost money and IE is bundled into it, DUH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+M2Ys4U Subscriber¹ Posted June 26, 2005 Subscriber¹ Share Posted June 26, 2005 If msnbc detects Opera I get served a broken page, If I trick msnbc to think that I'm using Firefox I get served a working page in Opera. How the f*** can that be anything but fault on the webmasters side?BTW, IE is not free either, windows cost money and IE is bundled into it, DUH! 586121838[/snapback] You can download it and run in on *nix with WINE. So, you don't need Windows to get IE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supernova_00 Posted June 26, 2005 Share Posted June 26, 2005 just so you all know, microsoft fixed whatever it was that caused it's sites to reject firefox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted June 26, 2005 Share Posted June 26, 2005 Opera is the biggest bunch of babies, thats how I explain that. If their browser doesn't work on some sites its the sites fault? Reasons like this are why I don't use Opera. Its not free, and its inferior to even IE. 586099975[/snapback] and the firefox users don't complain that a site isn't coded properly when it doesn't display right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mulmiz Posted June 29, 2005 Share Posted June 29, 2005 Everything works fine for me too :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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