Catholic Woman in Secret Ordination


Recommended Posts

By Julian Pettifer

BBC Radio 4's Crossing Continents

_40653872_ordination203_300.jpg

The woman who was "ordained" does not want to be identified

A woman has been ordained as a priest in a secret ceremony in central Europe as an act of defiance against the Roman Catholic Church.

Three years ago, the Vatican moved decisively against an international movement for the ordination of women when it excommunicated the so-called Danube Seven.

Seven women had claimed the status of priests after a form of ordination ceremony held on a boat moored on the river Danube.

Now a similar ceremony has taken place in a private chapel in central Europe.

BBC Radio 4's Crossing Continents Crossing Europe witnessed the event but only on condition the programme does not reveal the exact location or the identity of the young woman.

The unofficial ordination comes just two months after the inauguration of Pope Benedict XVI who is known for his traditional views.

In the case of the Danube Seven, it was Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger - now Pope Benedict - who declared that since the women gave no indication of repentance "for the most serious offence they have committed, they have incurred excommunication".

But his stern admonitions have been ignored. Among those conducting the ordination the BBC witnessed, were women from the Danube Seven who now describe themselves as bishops.

Full story here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/cros...nts/4119254.stm

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If I put an 'M.D.' after my name, am I a physician?

586111756[/snapback]

Did you graduate from medical school or had medical training ? I doubt these people lack the training or willingness to become priests.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wow. That pathetic thing is that, by doing that, they're not only NOT priests now (according to the Catholic law), but they're not even Catholic anymore! Automatic excommunication is in order.

Way to go. :p

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Can you imagine? Our virgin daughters molested by the female priests??? :o

I hope there's video of it... :D "Girls gone Wild, Vatican Editon"

Edited by Samoa
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Can you imagine? Our vigin daughters molested by the female priests??? :o

I hope there's video of it... :D  "Girls gone Wild, Vatican Editon"

586112304[/snapback]

that would be totally hot!

/first class ticket to hell please, no luggage.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

In the case of the Danube Seven, it was Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger - now Pope Benedict - who declared that since the women gave no indication of repentance "for the most serious offence they have committed, they have incurred excommunication".

586111014[/snapback]

This is just ridiculous right there.

Whats more important? Ordaining more priests / ministers so that more can be told of the message that the Church is wishing to promote? Or sticking hard and fast to rules that will just continue the downward spiral of church membership in the western world?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think that it is fine that they are excommunicated. It is their religion, it is based on tradition... Why should they change for anyone? On that note some of the churches practices are very against what I beleive in which is why I don't attend church anymore... But really now, bitch about why they hate gay people, or when they told africans that condoms wouldn't save them from aids. This is not really something to cry about.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think that it is fine that they are excommunicated. It is their religion, it is based on tradition...  Why should they change for anyone? On that note some of the churches practices are very against what I beleive in which is why I don't attend church anymore... But really now, bitch about why they hate gay people, or when they told africans that condoms wouldn't save them from aids. This is not really something to cry about.

586115697[/snapback]

I agree with your first statement, but hten you go on to say that "They" (I assume you mean Catholics) hate gays? Anything to back up that rather strong statement?

Secondly, condoms don't save you from AIDS. There's no "savior" from it. A quick look into basic biology and virus makup would tell you that...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A woman has been ordained as a priest in a secret ceremony in central Europe as an act of defiance against the Roman Catholic Church.

586111014[/snapback]

:huh:

Instantly not valid irregardless of the situation.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Secondly, condoms don't save you from AIDS. There's no "savior" from it.  A quick look into basic biology and virus makup would tell you that...

586117037[/snapback]

So what exactly does a condom do apart from an express ticket to hell

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Secondly, condoms don't save you from AIDS. There's no "savior" from it. A quick look into basic biology and virus makup would tell you that...

Mind backing up that statement? True, condoms won't cure AIDs, but using them prevents becoming infected by the HIV virus. That's because condoms prevent body fluids from mixing together.

HIV doesn't spontaneously happen in gay men, or those who **** God off, no matter what kind of bull people have been fed. HIV is only contracted through direct body fluid contact, i.e. your blood mixing with blood from an HIV+ person, or your semen mixing with the vaginal fluids of an HIV+ woman. Condoms prevent the latter if used correctly.

Taken in another context, condom use can help "save" a population of people from AIDs by inhibiting its spread.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The HIV virus's makup is such that it is small enough to get through the contruction of the condom. I believe the effeectiveness is about 75%. Should people in Africa be informed that there is a 25% risk?

Statistics later....it's late...and this is veering wildly offtopic.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No i worded it wrong man. I went to catholic church more or less every sunday for more than 90 percent of my life. No they don't hate anyone. But they are against homosexuality which in itself just doesn't make sense to me. Because of this a lot of people including myself were led to hate gay people in general. I was taught it was wrong and evil more or less. I grew up and my views changed on that subject. My problem isn't in the statistics. No, condoms aren't a guaranteed saftey from HIV, but what you have to realize is that the church was pushing its agenda on less informed people in africa in regards to birth control which could have ruined more than one life because the aids infected man decided that condoms won't help so he didn't bother with them and had sex with 4 virgins or something to that effect, making the problem worse.

Again I still hold many Catholic values, but I have changed my views too much to really identify with the church which is a bit sad to me.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The HIV virus's makup is such that it is small enough to get through the contruction of the condom. I believe the effeectiveness is about 75%. Should people in Africa be informed that there is a 25% risk?

586117190[/snapback]

Wrong.

?But according to Panorama, the Church is now telling people that condoms do not work. In an interview, one of the Vatican's most senior cardinals Alfonso Lopez Trujillo suggested HIV could even pass through condoms.

?Catherine Hankins, chief scientific advisor to UNAids, condemned the Church's comments.

"It is very unfortunate to have this type of misinformation being broadcast," she told BBC News Online.

"It is a concern. From a technical point of view, the statements are totally incorrect. Latex condoms are impermeable. They do prevent HIV transmission."

The WHO also attacked the Catholic Church's comments.

"Statements like this are quite dangerous, " a spokeswoman told BBC News Online. "We are facing a global pandemic which has already killed more than 20 million people and currently affects around 42 million. There is so much evidence to show that condoms don't let sexually transmitted infections like HIV through. Anyone who says otherwise is just wrong."

The aid agency Christian Aid also attacked the Vatican's attitude.

"Condoms are a straightforward and effective way of preventing HIV transmission and to suggest otherwise is dangerous," said Dr Rachel Baggaley, head of its HIV unit.

That's a lovely myth spread by the Catholic Church in some regions. Certainly, the WHO (.pdf) doesn't agree.

--

Back on topic, it does seem odd that someone would go about ordaining someone to a role in an institution without that institution's consent ? it seems to make about as much sense as me appointing myself as governor of the Moon.

In their defense, however, the Catholic Church has a desperate shortage of priests (especially in 1st-world countries,) which a growing number of members attribute to the church's inflexibility on who qualifies as a priest. While in some areas, the rapid increase in deacons has helped, they still can't perform everything a priest can. (It's not even called a "Mass" if only a deacon is there, but a "Eucharistic Ceremony in the Absence of a Priest.")

Groups such as Call to Action are openly campaigning for reforms in the church such as dropping the required vow of celibacy for priests, allowing women priests, and accepting gays and lesbians, as well as greater roles for the laity.

Still, if you don't truly believe in your religion's position on something, why stay? Just tack a sign on the door, or don't, and move on. No-one's forcing anyone to stay, and no religion has a monopoly on "salvation."

Edited by Palin
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I find it funny that a woman (who is neither a priest nor any longer Catholic according to the church) was the one performing the ordination.

Sort of like an inmate arresting someone.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wrong.

That's a lovely myth spread by the Catholic Church in some regions. Certainly, the WHO (.pdf) doesn't agree.

I'm perfectly willing to turn this into an argument over statistics, but as I'm sure you know, statistics can fit nearly any agenda, depending on how you word them and interpret them.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm perfectly willing to turn this into an argument over statistics, but as I'm sure you know, statistics can fit nearly any agenda, depending on how you word them and interpret them.

586121446[/snapback]

This isn't about statistics ? it's about certain church officials spreading misinformation to advance their own agenda.

Electron microscopes have disproved this idea of "holes" in condom latex, but let's just use common sense. Sure, HIV, or any virus is small, but have you ever thought of how small a sperm cell is? If latex were so permeable as to let viruses through, why would medical professionals bother wearing latex gloves? Abstinence is obviously the best prevention. But condoms help a great deal, and it's been proven. The Straight Dope.

Show us a scientific study detailing a virus passing through a latex condom (even an electric current can't penetrate one) and you can have your argument.

Edited by Palin
Link to comment
Share on other sites

This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.