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Mozilla is superior to Internet Explorer 6.0!


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Let me start by saying I have tried many builds of Mozilla, Netscape and Opera over the years and have always preffered IE until now. As of Mozilla 1.0 (now 1.1b) I believe that Mozilla is far surperior to IE.

1.) Tabbed browsing is more efficient than opening multiple explorer windows. Having 4 or 5 websites fully loaded under tabs a few inches away from your main browser window is so much easier than stacking multinple browsers, having to go to the taskbar, or even using a windowshade app to roll up the windows.

2.) Mozilla is stable. This afternoon, just for fun, I loaded 160 sites into a single browser, tabbed. Mozilla was slow for about 10 minutes (probably more my system limitations than Mozilla), but it accomplished all 160 sites. Without crashing.

3.) Mozilla is easily, fully customizable. It has native skin support. Want to change the splash screen? Drop in your own mozilla.bmp into the main mozilla directory and your finished. Want new browser icons? Install a new set online in 5 seconds. With as many Neowin members into system customization, I'm surprised Mozilla isn't their default browser for this reason alone. Not to mention it works well with Intellimouse drivers, so you can backspace your way through your page history with ease (thanks for the tip BroChaos!)

4.) It supports all commonly used plug-ins. Java, flash, shockwave and more. With the exception of a few MSN Java games I haven't had a single plug in problem. (Mozilla having problems with an MSN site...hmmm. Not to mention the score of open source plug ins like leech get...the best site file leecher I've used.

5.) It's fast. The user decides how much to optimize Mozillas speed and interaction with the OS. Mozilla consistantly loads sites faster the IE6.

6.) It's secure. I've noticed that Mozilla works almost like a firewall in it's ability to screen everything you are looking at (speaking of firewalls, Mozilla works seamlessly with zone alarm now). I have been extremely impressed with how much Mozilla catches when browsing insecure sites.

I have about ten more reasons that I dig Mozilla so much. It's free...go try it out at Mozilla.org. Post what you think of the new build.

I would love to see Neowin artists really get into this browser and start creating skins to match many of the themes we've seen on Neowin!

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5.) It's fast. The user decides how much to optimize Mozillas speed and interaction with the OS. Mozilla consistantly loads sites faster the IE6.

hmm..did I overlook such a feature? how does one go about "optimizing Mozillas speed and interaction with the OS."

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Originally posted by AgEnTsMiTh

Why Mozzila is the best.

It?s a FACT that Mozilla supports more web standards then ANY other web browser. HANDS DOWN.

Fact It follows those compliances better then any other browser.

Any knowledgeable web programmer knows this to be a fact.

If an individual disputes that fact, they do not fit in that category thus does not have an accurate athoritive answer.

Browser Load speeds.. as far as surfing the web is concerned, Mozilla loads pages faster then IE does for proof on this, simply do a google search on this. Microsoft themselves have done benchmarks and in leaked emails stated that they needed to improve there performance of web caching and loading.

As far as application load time, and individual who would make this claim knows nothing about both the windows runtime environment and how explorer is loaded and boot up. Also they have probably have not installed the late beta versions nor the 1.0 release. This release has an optional boot time service that allows Mozilla to be loaded in memory the exact same way explorer is loaded into memory at boot up. This would lead to the exact same application load time as IE. Here is an exercise for those competent enough to take up this task. Remove all runtime components related to IE or use an optional shell that does not load explorer ?If your not educated enough to do this, then your not educated enough to give an authoritive answer to Mozilla abilities". Then I challenge you to record the new boot time vs. the old. Take the time difference from that and record how long Mozilla takes to run. You will see as I have seen that in most cases Mozilla actually runs faster.

Companies in considerable numbers are porting there plug ins to support Mozilla now that it is at 1.0, which is what software houses were waiting for.

If you want to find out more on this subject, do a google search on authoritive sites that discuss this. Obviously, many of the postings on this subject have been done so by individuals who have little or no insight of the facts. You can have your questions and or myths dispelled by a brief consideration of the MANY fine points brought out at the Mozilla web site. I encourage everyone to review that information before making any and all statements.

I am not trying to speak down towards anyone or what they think they know but I am trying to encourage people to get real insight into the facts via autoritive web sites who will support what I have posted along with the mozilla site as well.

hear hear! I'm tired of webpages that are poorly coded cos the coder uses the fact that the majority of browser users use IE as standard as an explination for their laziness. Web Page coders should be forced into making sure their webpage is W3C compliant.

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Originally posted by BroChaos

AgentSmith: you're the man :)

what you said is perfect.

Thanks Bro.

Its just the facts that I point out, nothing more nothing less.

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Originally posted by Wickedkitten

hear hear! I'm tired of webpages that are poorly coded cos the coder uses the fact that the majority of browser users use IE as standard as an explination for their laziness. Web Page coders should be forced into making sure their webpage is W3C compliant.

I am with you there. Makes you wonder if there lazy as well. Opps, you said that LOL. I am on the same page with you!!!

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Originally posted by deadzombie

Let me start by saying I have tried many builds of Mozilla, Netscape and Opera over the years and have always preffered IE until now. As of Mozilla 1.0 (now 1.1b) I believe that Mozilla is far surperior to IE.

1.) Tabbed browsing is more efficient than opening multiple explorer windows. Having 4 or 5 websites fully loaded under tabs a few inches away from your main browser window is so much easier than stacking multinple browsers, having to go to the taskbar, or even using a windowshade app to roll up the windows.

2.) Mozilla is stable. This afternoon, just for fun, I loaded 160 sites into a single browser, tabbed. Mozilla was slow for about 10 minutes (probably more my system limitations than Mozilla), but it accomplished all 160 sites. Without crashing.

3.) Mozilla is easily, fully customizable. It has native skin support. Want to change the splash screen? Drop in your own mozilla.bmp into the main mozilla directory and your finished. Want new browser icons? Install a new set online in 5 seconds. With as many Neowin members into system customization, I'm surprised Mozilla isn't their default browser for this reason alone. Not to mention it works well with Intellimouse drivers, so you can backspace your way through your page history with ease (thanks for the tip BroChaos!)

4.) It supports all commonly used plug-ins. Java, flash, shockwave and more. With the exception of a few MSN Java games I haven't had a single plug in problem. (Mozilla having problems with an MSN site...hmmm. Not to mention the score of open source plug ins like leech get...the best site file leecher I've used.

5.) It's fast. The user decides how much to optimize Mozillas speed and interaction with the OS. Mozilla consistantly loads sites faster the IE6.

6.) It's secure. I've noticed that Mozilla works almost like a firewall in it's ability to screen everything you are looking at (speaking of firewalls, Mozilla works seamlessly with zone alarm now). I have been extremely impressed with how much Mozilla catches when browsing insecure sites.

I have about ten more reasons that I dig Mozilla so much. It's free...go try it out at Mozilla.org. Post what you think of the new build.

I would love to see Neowin artists really get into this browser and start creating skins to match many of the themes we've seen on Neowin!

these are useless because the XUL UI is slooooooooooow.

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Originally posted by AgEnTsMiTh

I am with you there. Makes you wonder if there lazy as well. Opps, you said that LOL.I am on the same page with you!!!

I wonder who's rendered the fastest ;)

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Originally posted by AgEnTsMiTh

It?s a FACT that Mozilla supports more web standards then ANY other web browser. HANDS DOWN.

...

Fact It follows those compliances better then any other browser.

Any knowledgeable web programmer knows this to be a fact.

If an individual disputes that fact, they do not fit in that category thus does not have an accurate athoritive answer.

...

Microsoft themselves have done benchmarks and in leaked emails stated that they needed to improve there performance of web caching and loading.

...

If you want to find out more on this subject, do a google search on authoritive sites that discuss this. Obviously, many of the postings on this subject have been done so by individuals who have little or no insight of the facts. You can have your questions and or myths dispelled by a brief consideration of the MANY fine points brought out at the Mozilla web site. b>

So.. you talk about facts, without giving sources.

You talk about a list of points brought out by the mozilla web site (very subjected, perhaps?)

You say that webdevelopers who dispute the "fact" that mozilla follows more recommendations aren't knowledgeable webdevelopers.

You reference leaked MS notes without linking examples.

You mention authoritative websites that discuss why "mozilla is better", without naming any.

Are you sure you're not one of the people who blindly shout that "Linux is better than windows, because linux.com says so!"?

Try adding a few sources to your claims next time?

While I agree that Mozilla is a nice browser, I strongly disagree with your statements about Mozilla following more recommendations (the current project i'm working on right now validates just fine as html 4.01 transitional, css2, doesn't use any IE-specific tags / styles, and it doesn't render properly in mozilla 20020713), as well as your claim that it is the best browser.

I'm a web developer (both server-side coding as well as client-side, so a web developer in it's true meaning) since a few years back, and I feel safe to say that I don't have any problems with my backend coding (php, perl, bash) or frontend (html, js, css, bindings & behaviors).

Am I a non-knowledgeable webdeveloper?

Don't I have the right to give "authoritative comments"?

Please support your rantings next tim:):)

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All I can say is that Mozilla SUCKS! Granted, HTML rendering is faster...at the cost of a lagging interface. Trying to import IE favorites is next to impossible unless installing crapzilla...err...Mozilla for the first time. There are a lot of people that love Mozilla...I am not one of them.

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Originally posted by prasanth

these are useless because the XUL UI is slooooooooooow.

Yes its so slow that major companies are now programming using the XUL interface. I suggest you research that comment. Like any programming language your applications are only as good as the coders are. The reasons these companies are writing applications using XUL is because of its speed and effeciency. The one thing that could impact the interface is the theme you use in mozilla if its bloated and uses poorley optomized images. Orielly has a fantastic book out about programming using Mozilla and the XUL language. I suggest anyone who is interested in learning about its effeciency and you want to learn more about XUL programming I highly suggest you get this book.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/059...9793399-5906357

Read this and then get back to me.

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Originally Posted by Jish

All I can say is that Mozilla SUCKS! Granted, HTML rendering is faster...at the cost of a lagging interface. Trying to import IE favorites is next to impossible unless installing crapzilla...err...Mozilla for the first time. There are a lot of people that love Mozilla...I am not one of them.

what a childish remark... crapzilla. Seriously, if any of the people like you had one ounce of maturity (yes, im talking to you the people who are like MAC SUXXORZ and PC ROXXORZ), you would just shut up, and keep your stupid comments and stupid names to your stupid selves. So please, grow up.

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Crapzilla! That's awesome. I'll have to make a Mozilla splash screen that says that tonight!!! ;)

I didn't think this thread would get so much attention. Looks like people are passionate about browsers! Cool!

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Originally posted by okidoki

So.. you talk about facts, without giving sources.

You talk about a list of points brought out by the mozilla web site (very subjected, perhaps?)

You say that webdevelopers who dispute the "fact" that mozilla follows more recommendations aren't knowledgeable webdevelopers.

You reference leaked MS notes without linking examples.

You mention authoritative websites that discuss why "mozilla is better", without naming any.

Are you sure you're not one of the people who blindly shout that "Linux is better than windows, because linux.com says so!"?

Try adding a few sources to your claims next time?

While I agree that Mozilla is a nice browser, I strongly disagree with your statements about Mozilla following more recommendations (the current project i'm working on right now validates just fine as html 4.01 transitional, css2, doesn't use any IE-specific tags / styles, and it doesn't render properly in mozilla 20020713), as well as your claim that it is the best browser.

I'm a web developer (both server-side coding as well as client-side, so a web developer in it's true meaning) since a few years back, and I feel safe to say that I don't have any problems with my backend coding (php, perl, bash) or frontend (html, js, css, bindings & behaviors).

Am I a non-knowledgeable webdeveloper?

Don't I have the right to give "authoritative comments"?

Please support your rantings next time :)

Where is your links and or proof to suppport your statements?

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Originally posted by giantsnyy2002

so am i, no issues. I have IE problems on all my pc's. they are all very slow, cept mozilla. I mean they arent very slow as take 5 minutes to load, but things like java and flash is where mozilla definately excels

Install the Java plugin for WinXP from SUN... it goes sooo fast in IE

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Originally posted by AgEnTsMiTh

Where is your links and or proof to suppport your statements?

The only statement i made was that mozilla (gecko, really) doesn't render my current project properly for me, whereas it validates properly through w3c's css & html validators -- hardly anything I need to support, compared to a bunch of supposed leaked memos, "authoritative websites" etc?

the rendering issue gecko is bumping into deals with css relative positioning, and it's somewhat random, as once in a while it'll render properly.

next time you try making smart-ass comments, please read through what you're commenting on, since you just made yourself look like Jish.

What shortminded people like you fail to see is that everything has its own use. Just because some people dislike certain parts of your beloved Mozilla doesn't give you the right to flame / troll.

Lots of people don't like IE -- I agree in some points, but not in others. To me, IE is just the least bad browser out there.

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Originally posted by betax

Install the Java plugin for WinXP from SUN... it goes sooo fast in IE

Ugh.. don't remind me..

That has to be slower than my trusty old 28.8 modem during rush-hour

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Originally posted by okidoki

So.. you talk about facts, without giving sources.

You talk about a list of points brought out by the mozilla web site (very subjected, perhaps?)

You say that webdevelopers who dispute the "fact" that mozilla follows more recommendations aren't knowledgeable webdevelopers.

as per www.webstandards.org

"Mozilla 1.0 is the browser built by the people who build Gecko, the rendering core of modern Netscape browsers, the IBM Web Browser mentioned below, and several others. No browser does a better job of standards compliance, and Mozilla also includes all the usual add-ons like mail, news and chat"

yes webdevelopers that dispute that mozilla follows more recommendations aren't knowledgeable webdevelopers.

You reference leaked MS notes without linking examples.

http://members.tripod.com/~antiMicrosoft/memo.html

this was mentioned on /.

You mention authoritative websites that discuss why "mozilla is better", without naming any.

http://www.salon.com/tech/col/leon/2002/03...l?CP=RDF&DN=310

www.zdnet.com/anchordesk/stories/ story/0,10738,2869497,00.html

www.pcmag.com/article2/0,4149,211,00.asp

just google search, you'll find loads

Are you sure you're not one of the people who blindly shout that "Linux is better than windows, because linux.com says so!"?

Are you sure you're not one of the people who blindly shout that "Windows is better than *nix, because microsoft.com says so!"?

While I agree that Mozilla is a nice browser, I strongly disagree with your statements about Mozilla following more recommendations (the current project i'm working on right now validates just fine as html 4.01 transitional, css2, doesn't use any IE-specific tags / styles, and it doesn't render properly in mozilla 20020713), as well as your claim that it is the best browser.

Have you gone to www.w3.org and validated your code? The browser can only go so far if your code is dodgy.

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Thanks for the sources, really makes the claims a lot more valid :)

Originally posted by Wickedkitten

Are you sure you're not one of the people who blindly shout that "Windows is better than *nix, because microsoft.com says so!"?

Have you gone to www.w3.org and validated your code? The browser can only go so far if your code is dodgy. [/b]

With over a hundred servers in four different locations, all running Linux, as well as two development boxes (one openbsd, one linux 2.4.18-xfs), I can say that I don't go shouting blindly.

Like i said in the post above, everything has its own use.

Right now, I don't feel any *ix is usable as a desktop system (with the exception of os x), but it's getting there.

And yes, it's through the w3c validators it passes

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Originally posted by okidoki

The only statement i made was that mozilla (gecko, really) doesn't render my current project properly for me, whereas it validates properly through w3c's css & html validators -- hardly anything I need to support, compared to a bunch of supposed leaked memos, "authoritative websites" etc?

the rendering issue gecko is bumping into deals with css relative positioning, and it's somewhat random, as once in a while it'll render properly.

next time you try making smart-ass comments, please read through what you're commenting on, since you just made yourself look like Jish.

What shortminded people like you fail to see is that everything has its own use. Just because some people dislike certain parts of your beloved Mozilla doesn't give you the right to flame / troll.

Lots of people don't like IE -- I agree in some points, but not in others. To me, IE is just the least bad browser out there.

I suggest you re read my post, I clearly state to do a google search on any proof you need. As far as rants, I provide facts easily verifiable. Dont start a flame war here I did not attack you or anyone on this thread.

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Originally posted by Mr magoo

WE GOT A NIEVE PERSON ALERT!

REPEAT : SOME ACTUALLY BELIEVES THAT MICROSOFT CAN BE BEATEN!

please... we know things might be better- but what does it mean? IE is there : it works. You ever heard of the philosophy of plain vanilla?

Just like your feet are there and they work. Why would you need a car?

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It wasn't as much of a "give me links because i'm lazy", but rather "give me links because i really hate it when people make claims that might be false" statement, and if it came out wrong, i'm sorry.

like i said though, to me, IE is still the browser of choice.

be it because of bad experiences with early builds of mozilla, or because of the headaches its given me, i don't know

i just use what i like the most, and in this case it's IE

(although I do use both opera, konqueror & mozilla from my dev machines)

just like the various Desktop-under-linux projects, Mozilla is "getting there" (imo), but until it's actually "there", i'll be sticking to ie.. just personal preference

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  1. Mozilla is completely 100% WC3 standards compliant. There's no tags we can all live without like .
  2. Mozilla is free (as in beer) and open (as in source). What do you think is a faster method of debugging... having users submit bug reports and having developers pour over code until they find it and fix it, or having users look at the code, find the bug, and send in the fix to be included in the next build?
  3. You can disable popups, as well as sites resizing/moving/raising or lowering windows/changing the status bar text, and cookies with a few check boxes.
  4. It's skinable (if you're into that)
  5. Importing favorites is easy (despite some other user's claims). Go into IE. Export favorites. Go into Mozilla bookmark manager. Tools > Import.
  6. Built-in forms manager, password manager, download manager, and cookie manager.
  7. Block images from any site w/ 2 clicks. I haven't seen a FastMedia or DoubleClick ad in months.
  8. Tabbed browsing beats a ton of open windows.
  9. An ability I missed when I went from Netscape 4.7x to IE... have it open on a blank page, but still have a page assigned to the HOME button.
  10. A built in mail client, usenet client, IRC client, and HTML editor. Some may consider it bloat, but it's a nice package for an internet newbie.

All I can think of at the moment.

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Mr Magoo,

Your "Microsoft is the best and there isn't anything anyone can do about it" attitude makes me sick. I've heard of brand loyalty, but that's just kissing ass.

-Hatter

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Originally posted by giantsnyy2002

what a childish remark... crapzilla. Seriously, if any of the people like you had one ounce of maturity (yes, im talking to you the people who are like MAC SUXXORZ and PC ROXXORZ), you would just shut up, and keep your stupid comments and stupid names to your stupid selves. So please, grow up.

ROFL! My goodness, I never expected a reply such as this. A reply so far off-topic and far from the truth of my true self. Please, try to keep up while I try to keep this topic on the subject of Mozilla. What I don't understand is that Mozilla was listed as BETA for the longest time. Yet people then called it better the IE. I'll take a integrated browser such as Internet Explorer over Mozilla any day.

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