Rare Founders Leave Company


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Chris and Tim Stamper, two of Rare Ltd.'s (Goldeneye 007, Perfect Dark and Viva Pinata) three founders have left the studio. While the news surfaces in the wake of disappointing sales figures for Rare's excellent Viva Pinata, Microsoft told 1UP that sluggish Pinata sales had "absolutely" nothing to do with their departure.

"Chris and Tim have helped shape Rare into the world-renowned development studio that is it today and their impact on the videogame industry as a whole is well known. They are simply leaving to pursue other opportunities and we wish them luck in their future endeavors."

The Stampers' exodus comes just four years after Microsoft acquired Rare from Nintendo for $375M. Since that acquisition, Rare has published five games for Microsoft Game Studios. In addition to Pinata, the Rare released Kameo and Perfect Dark Zero at the Xbox 360's launch and shipped Conker: Live & Reloaded and Grabbed By the Ghoulies on the original Xbox. While it seems unlikely that Microsoft has recouped their original investment in Rare, the company maintains that the studio is "the cornerstone of Microsoft Game Studios' broadening strategy."

Microsoft told 1UP that Mark Betteridge, a 19-year-veteran of the Rare team, and Gregg Mayles will succeed the Stampers as Studio Director and Creative Director, respectively.

http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3156140

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So Viva hasn't been selling has it? Thats a suprise to me considering that it was about a month until most stores actually seemed to even have many copies available here in Aus. I mean it wouldnt be hard to get but at the same time the shelves more often or not didnt have copies left on them. Shame, I will be getting it someday but.

But yeah, rare (with maybe the exceptioon of Viva) certainly hasnt felt like the company that brought us the donkey kongs on the SNES + many classics on the N64. I really hope the new banjo kazooie game is a return to form in the platformer genre.

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So Viva hasn't been selling has it?

Well it seems it only sold around 42,000 units in November (USA). It was #100 on the list:

http://www.vgcharts.org/usamonthly.php

But yeah, rare (with maybe the exceptioon of Viva) certainly hasnt felt like the company that brought us the donkey kongs on the SNES + many classics on the N64. I really hope the new banjo kazooie game is a return to form in the platformer genre.

I agree, Rare use to be an AAA developer, but now they're pretty average compared to most others. Which is a shame because they brought us some of the best games around on SNES/N64.

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I agree, Rare use to be an AAA developer, but now they're pretty average compared to most others. Which is a shame because they brought us some of the best games around on SNES/N64.

I blame MS. It's the same reason Oddworld Inhabitants dropped MGS as publisher for EA. :no:

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Well it seems it only sold around 42,000 units in November (USA). It was #100 on the list:
Ouch. I think this game got lost in the crowd that was Gears of War and Vagas. I mean like the IGN review said its a game that deserves attention but all MS's attention was aimed at GOW which would have sold like hotcakes anyway. If the figures don't improve it could be a missed chance for MS to crack the younger market as it certainly was their primary hope at drawing younger crowds. In the US there may have been some advertising but really the advertising campaign for this game in Aus was non existant (as with pretty much anything Xbox related that isnt GOW actually)
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I'm not surprised this game sold horribly (Viva Pinata).. The marketing for it has been ridiculous.

The same just isn't for kids. Yes it has a cutesy "Kid" look but the game is too complex and requires too much resource handling for a little kid to handle (I'm not saying there aren't kids who could master this game, certainly there are but the vast majority is what I'm talking about).

Yet from a marketing angle, that's exactly who they are targeting, with the Fox CG show (definitely made for kids) and the advertising thus far (which in Canada there hasn't been much of).

The truth is, it's a game for adults who have kids. If you have a kid, you can play it with them, enjoy the adult themes of it (here's a few examples, the fact that you can feed animals to eachother, the "romancing" which often includes the pinata's dancing to music that came straight out of a porno, after romancing two pinata's and gaining a 3rd you can romance that pinata with it's OWN parents thus incest lol). But obviously to a kid any of this wouldn't register and only the adult would "Get it".

Anyway, I'm babbling, but you get the drift.. The game's failure isn't the game itself (it's excellent), but rather the marketing.. It was almost as if they had no idea what the game truly was and who it should be marketed to.

Edited by MadFerIt2006
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I'm not surprised this game sold horribly (Viva Pinata).. The marketing for it has been ridiculous.

The same just isn't for kids. Yes it has a cutesy "Kid" look but the game is too complex and requires too much resource handling for a little kid to handle (I'm not saying there aren't kids who could master this game, certainly there are but the vast majority is what I'm talking about).

Yet from a marketing angle, that's exactly who they are targeting, with the Fox CG show (definitely made for kids) and the advertising thus far (which in Canada there hasn't been much of).

The truth is, it's a game for adults who have kids. If you have a kid, you can play it with them, enjoy the adult themes of it (here's a few examples, the fact that you can feed animals to eachother, the "romancing" which often includes the pinata's dancing to music that came straight out of a porno, after romancing two pinata's and gaining a 3rd you can romance that pinata with it's OWN parents thus incest lol). But obviously to a kid any of this wouldn't register and only the adult would "Get it".

Anyway, I'm babbling, but you get the drift.. The game's failure isn't the game itself (it's excellent), but rather the marketing.. It was almost as if they had no idea what the game truly was and who it should be marketed to.

Yup...I really wish this game was marketed better.... I had no intentions of picking it up until I read a few posts here about how I should give it a shot(spartanx/giga i think)... it just happened to be on sale at BestBuy for $29.99... since then I have played a good amount of it and really glad I picked it up...

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Yup...I really wish this game was marketed better.... I had no intentions of picking it up until I read a few posts here about how I should give it a shot(spartanx/giga i think)... it just happened to be on sale at BestBuy for $29.99... since then I have played a good amount of it and really glad I picked it up...

My feelings exactly. My 6-year-old son chose it when we were at Blockbuster to rent something. I started playing it and was totally engrossed. When he tried he needed a lot of help from me to get past the basic garden.

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Donkey Kong Country and Goldeneye really rocked.

I always felt that if they could just release goldeneye with the same game balance, better graphics and live multiplayer, they could really sell some games.

That makes me wonder, if wii's virtual console releases goldeneye, does Rare make money from that? :)

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well didnt Nintendo own Rare at the time, a 51% stake in them or something? I guess it would depend on the terms they had with Nintendo.

The Stamper brothers had a 51% stake in Rare, and Nintendo had the other 49%, I think. After the Stampers sold their 51% to Microsoft, Nintendo then sold their 49%. I think because of this, all the trademarks to the characters that Nintendo didn't create (like Donkey Kong) are retained by Rare.

According to Wikipedia though, Activision has the James Bond video game license, so it's possible that Goldeneye could be a VC title, but no other Rare titles will be on it.

I wonder what the Stampers' "other opportunities" are.

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I remember in the days of the speccy, the Stampers set up the great "Ultimate - play the game" in the crappy little town of Ashby. They had the best and most polished games for the speccy and c64. I remember going to Ashby as a kid to visit me grandparents and always went past their offices and wanted to get them to sign my copy of Sabre Wulf and Knightlore but the buggers were never in. :(

I would have imagined they would have had greater success than they did.

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Please don't make Goldeneye for the 360. My memories of Perfect Dark were already ruined by Perfect Dark: Zero. It wasn't a bad game by any means, it just wasn't a good one. It settled for mediocrity. I don't want a Goldeneye title that does that.

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I blame MS. It's the same reason Oddworld Inhabitants dropped MGS as publisher for EA. :no:

Yeah, I think alot of the changes that went into PDZ were because of MS. Changing her to a yank to make her appeal to MS's American target audience. Not that that makes any sense, since PD did plenty well and it was an English character.

And apparently MS was trying to screw with GoW as well, so I dunno, its highly possible they don't have a clue.

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Yeah, I think alot of the changes that went into PDZ were because of MS. Changing her to a yank to make her appeal to MS's American target audience. Not that that makes any sense, since PD did plenty well and it was an English character.

And that changes gameplay...why? I think most of the mediocrity of PDZ can be blamed solely on Rare, as well as any other games that've been subpar. Rare started fading before they left Nintendo for Microsoft. I think Viva Pi?ata actually shows that Microsoft is giving Rare some life again.

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And that changes gameplay...why?

Because PD had this very dark, serious tone to it, and now along comes this little red headed chick trying to make it all a much brighter experience. I'd also blame the little arrows on the ground on MS as well, since they were hoping PDZ would be their hit launch title, and figured they'd make it playable by noobs as well.

But yeah, true, some things were just aweful like.. the story.. if there was a story which I doubt could be blamed on MS.

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I blame MS. It's the same reason Oddworld Inhabitants dropped MGS as publisher for EA. :no:

Not totally. Viva Pinata was an excellent game--it deserved more than 42,000 sales. It was just shrouded by GoW, Madden, and Rainbow Six. I could imagine that's partly why the two left.

Edited by Giga
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I do not blame Microsoft for Zero's medicority at all. If anything, why would Microsoft have wanted those changes to Perfect Dark? It didn't help with their audience, as the original style of Perfect Dark (more dark and serious) probably would have hit that target better. I think the anime styling and gameplay changes were Rare's choice and not Microsoft's. They knew they couldn't make it like the original with a lot of the talent having left to Free Radical (and another company that I can't remember the name of), so they had to try something different.

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I'm not surprised this game sold horribly (Viva Pinata).. The marketing for it has been ridiculous.

The same just isn't for kids. Yes it has a cutesy "Kid" look but the game is too complex and requires too much resource handling for a little kid to handle (I'm not saying there aren't kids who could master this game, certainly there are but the vast majority is what I'm talking about).

Yet from a marketing angle, that's exactly who they are targeting, with the Fox CG show (definitely made for kids) and the advertising thus far (which in Canada there hasn't been much of).

QFT.

I personally haven't seen one bit of advertising for the game, but I'm sure they'd be aiming for kids. They really messed this one up. It's too hard for kids and looks too kiddie for most other people to even consider. Even though I really like the game, I'm not surprised at its numbers.

I think word of mouth will increase sales, but MS really didn't do its job.

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And that changes gameplay...why?

I get his point. If you bought the delux version of GOW... on the 'making of' video there was this constant insistence from the MS rep to 'drop the chainsaw' due to the internal ***head MS focus groups etc not liking it because it was perceived as 'too violent'. The developers stuck to their guns and it stayed.

Sure it wouldn't have impacted the gameplay too much removing it, but then it wouldn't have been the same game. I just can't imagine GOW without that chainsaw.

These small little changes can make a big difference. Knocking off all the interesting little variations and you end up with a bland product.

Accountants, marketting (!)'s and focus groups are good at that and MS's corporate culture seems to have all those in spades and then some.

They should just butt out altogether and let the developers do their thing.

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You guys do realize that MGS is more involved in the games it publishes than they let see. At the end of the day your owner is your boss and he makes all business decisions. I mean look at Bungie, do you really think they wanted their game ported to Vista ? A comic and then a serial comic ? an RTS game ? Hell Microsoft even went as far as to try and get a "mobile portal" bases on Halo.

Lastly let me ask you a question, do you think Rare even wanted to develop Viva Pinata ?

Also remember this company was bought for much more than Bungie was.

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