Xboxfounder on HD-DVD/Blu-ray for Xbox 360


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+Audioboxer
One of my sources for Microsoft stuff, Xboxfounder has chimed in the comments on Digital Joystick on the developments of HD-DVD/Blu-ray for game systems.

"Spooling bits to the hard drive at first boot is an intentional thing when the game knows that a HD is always in the system. Xbox 1 did it. The reason is to decrease the load time for some of the game content. That's the main advantage of having a HD in every console, and a gameplay optimization that all devs use. Regardless of how long that takes at first boot. If you all go back and read Xbox 1 blogs, you'll see the same types of comments against Xbox 1 too. They don't need the space per se, they have it to use and would be foolish not to. Hard disk spool time is so much less than optical disc drive spool time, resulting in better games."

"On to HD-DVD v Blu-ray. MS opposed Blue Ray because Sony supported it, plain and simple. I was in the room when the decision was made. But they hedged their bets by making the Media player a plug in. They could very quickly have a Blue Ray external plug in just like the HD, if Sony will cooperate."

"Therein lays the rub. MS, one of the worst co's to get info out of to make products compatible, needs Sony to help a competitor do just that - compete with a compatible product that depends on the competitor's intellectual protocol. Sony knows that they cannot justify charging MS a fee that is larger than any other customer. Sony wants to make Blu-Ray ubiquitous so they have shaved down fees as much as possible. So MS must get the same deal as everyone else."

"But Sony wants to control this technology in the gaming space, and prevent success by a competitor in the expansive entertainment markets of this space. Where much of the cash flow for these kinds of products will lie in the coming years from also using gaming consoles as home entertainment media extenders, central to the digital entertainment lifestyle."

"What would you do now if you were Sony? The same thing MS has done over the years. Make the technology intentionally incompatible, withhold information, withhold support for design input to make it compatible, etc."

"We'll see over the next few months. Either MS will come out with a Blu-Ray player, or they will file suit to force Sony to share, in much the same way many others sue MS for the same reasons on Windows compatibility. It will be interesting to watch this unfold."

"Once again, users are caught watching the battle from the sidelines. Unless you make sure you vote with your dollars and put an end to this nonsense by insisting on unified standards across vendors. Kinda like the Blu-Ray fight..."

Source: http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/digital...ives/132216.asp

What do you think? Will Sony help?

"We'll see over the next few months. Either MS will come out with a Blu-Ray player, or they will file suit to force Sony to share, in much the same way many others sue MS for the same reasons on Windows compatibility. It will be interesting to watch this unfold."

Sadly probably true, no doubt another battle going on behind the scenes? No?

Edited by PureLegend
removed duplicate paragraphs
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magik

Microsoft needs permission (read: purchase a license) from BDA, not from Sony. It's not as big of an issue as this article makes it out to be.

Frank Simonis (Blu-ray Disc Association's spokesperson) said: "Of course we have always said that Toshiba and Microsoft, and any other company, is more than welcome to join the Blu-ray Disc Association. We are an open organisation, with an open disc standard. If Toshiba decides to drop HD DVD we would extend the hand of friendship to them, they are always welcome to join,".

"Microsoft could easily put Blu-ray inside the Xbox," said Simonis. "From my understanding Microsoft did an early evaluation and the Xbox has a similar processor to the PS3 so it will be perfectly capable of decoding a Blu-ray disc.

"So technically it could do it. All Microsoft would have to do is acquire a BD licence," he said.

Simonis dismissed the notion that Sony might be uncomfortable with Microsoft joining the Blu-ray camp. Some say that it's unlikely that Sony would want Microsoft to put a Blu-ray drive in the Xbox - because then it would be an even bigger threat to the PS3.

But Simonis said that Sony would not be able to stop such a move.

Source

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+vlsi0n

It will happen. Microsoft has said when the time comes and a winner is declared a External Blu-Ray player can be introduced very easily. I'm expecting it in the not too distant future. :yes:

edits: tired.. grammatical errors.

Edited by vlsi0n
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Neo003

As I said it before, MS can't put BR as an internal drive but will most likely comes out with an add-on like HD-DVD.

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Zilos

Whats with the duplicate paragraphs? Tripped me out! Has no one else noticed?

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Jimmy0

MS will release a Blu-Ray addon soon, I think.

Whats with the duplicate paragraphs? Tripped me out! Has no one else noticed?

Yeah I noticed that too! :rofl:

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Guest

Sony dont control Blu-ray... If microsoft wants to include the drive, they will.

Even if sony do decide to be awkward, its not an issue as they are just one of the members of the blu-ray alliance.

Dont see the point in this article...

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Smigit

I see no reason for Sony to oppose this even if it was their choice. The entire reason to push the platform was to become the standard and thus be able to license the technology out to be used. What do they gain by disallowing MS to use it seeing as every unit sold will make them money.

I've said it previously, but I feel that the premium should get a 120GB HD by standard (makes it useful for MS's movie downloading service they want to push and opens up a revenue source since alot of consumers wouldnt likely bother if they had to buy a new HD seperatly) and then put a BluRay player inside the elite (so that the only benefits ared the HD size and colour since HDMI is in premiums now anyway). To cater for older units an external unit should be released.

But I do feel either the elite will get Blu Ray or one of the top 2 xbox versions has to go since the HD difference doesnt make sense to me. Sure its cheaper to do it this way, but from MS's point of view every 20GB hd out there surely is one less customer potentially able to buy movies from them due to the HD being quite limited for that service. I doubt the 120GB cost them THAT much extra to distribute and if they are serious about the online movie distribution it may be the way to go. On the other hand they don't make money from BluRay title sales so put that in a more expensive unit and if people want it so be it.

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Deaf Spacker

Sony can try all they want to be awkward but as everyone else has said Sony doesn't control Blu.

What was the point of this article again? :/

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+Audioboxer

They don't control Blu Ray, but their console has pretty much won the war for it, meaning I think they are fairly highly regarded within the BDA. They are also one of the main companies to push advertisement for Blu Ray, within their console/game sales and adverts on TV/in the real world.

MS went with HD DVD partly to oppose Sony if you want my opinion, it was business move on their rivals, that was all.

All im thinking is Sony will make it hard/awkward for MS to license an addon quickly, to maxmize the length of time the PS3 is the only console with Blu Ray.

MS seem to be that tied up in their download service anyway, I don't even know if they would be that bothered "fighting" to get Blu Ray if it came to it.

Also you guys, if you don't think there is any point to the article, are you not wasting your time replying?

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NJ Louch

Sony and BDA may be in bed together, locked into a 69 position. But if Microsoft come along, wave their willy and drop a $100 on the table, you know the 360 will be getting head ;)

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Deaf Spacker
They don't control Blu Ray, but their console has pretty much won the war for it, meaning I think they are fairly highly regarded within the BDA. They are also one of the main companies to push advertisement for Blu Ray, within their console/game sales and adverts on TV/in the real world.

MS went with HD DVD partly to oppose Sony if you want my opinion, it was business move on their rivals, that was all.

All im thinking is Sony will make it hard/awkward for MS to license and addon quickly, to maxmize the length of time the PS3 is the only console with Blu Ray.

Also you guys, if you don't think there is any point to the article, are you not wasting your time replying?

Sony might not want to make money but I'm pretty sure the rest of the Blu companies do so if Sony make it difficult for Microsoft to release a Blu addon I can see the other companies not being amused.

It is in Sony's best interests if Microsoft can release an addon.

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+Audioboxer
Sony might not want to make money but I'm pretty sure the rest of the Blu companies do so if Sony make it difficult for Microsoft to release a Blu addon I can see the other companies not being amused.

It is in Sony's best interests if Microsoft can release an addon.

Maybe it will promote Blu Ray and be a tinge ironic, but right now I would say that is not true.

Sony are riding on the Blu Ray wave as not only has Blu Ray, the format they push won, their PS3 sales are going up as people are recommending it as the best Blu Ray player.

That may change eventually if standalones come about that are better value, but right now the "whole market" is eyeing up the PS3, even 360 owners who have stayed on the fence till the format war was over. Those on here for example that will buy into the addon definitely coming though, may stay on the fence, regardless of the fact no date/announcements have been made - Just because they don't want to lay out the money for a PS3, and will wait on a 360 addon.

Last thing Sony want right now is a confirmed Blu Ray addon for the 360, as it could potentially eat into some PS3 sales.

Sony and BDA may be in bed together, locked into a 69 position. But if Microsoft come along, wave their willy and drop a $100 on the table, you know the 360 will be getting head ;)

Yeah money will talk eventually, but right now as you've identified the BDA practically owe their win to the PS3 hands down - Those who think otherwise need a raincheck.

Blu Ray standalone sales were pretty low, not to mention the hardware a mess.

I guess at the end of the day, if Sony/BDA squeeze a wad of cash out of MS, those "potentially lost" PS3 sales won't really matter.

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Deaf Spacker
Maybe it will promote Blu Ray and be a tinge ironic, but right now I would say that is not true.

Sony are riding on the Blu Ray wave as not only has Blu Ray, the format they push won, their PS3 sales are going up as people are recommending it as the best Blu Ray player.

That may change eventually if standalones come about that are better value, but right now the "whole market" is eyeing up the PS3, even 360 owners who have stayed on the fence till the format war was over. Those on here for example that will buy into the addon definitely coming though, may stay on the fence, regardless of the fact no date/announcements have been made - Just because they don't want to lay out the money for a PS3, and will wait on a 360 addon.

Last thing Sony want right now is a confirmed Blu Ray addon for the 360, as it could potentially eat into some PS3 sales.

Yeah money will talk eventually, but right now as you've identified the BDA practically owe their win to the PS3 hands down - Those who think otherwise need a raincheck.

Blu Ray standalone sales were pretty low, not to mention the hardware a mess.

I guess at the end of the day, if Sony/BDA squeeze a wad of cash out of MS, those "potentially lost" PS3 sales won't really matter.

I meant best interests as in they'd get teh monies. Sure they might lose a few sales due to people still being on the fence but I'm sure they money they will earn in the future will make the pain bearable.

I'm personally not interested in the addon, I'm getting a PS3 this Friday ;)

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magik
They don't control Blu Ray, but their console has pretty much won the war for it, meaning I think they are fairly highly regarded within the BDA. They are also one of the main companies to push advertisement for Blu Ray, within their console/game sales and adverts on TV/in the real world.

MS went with HD DVD partly to oppose Sony if you want my opinion, it was business move on their rivals, that was all.

All im thinking is Sony will make it hard/awkward for MS to license an addon quickly, to maxmize the length of time the PS3 is the only console with Blu Ray.

MS seem to be that tied up in their download service anyway, I don't even know if they would be that bothered "fighting" to get Blu Ray if it came to it.

Also you guys, if you don't think there is any point to the article, are you not wasting your time replying?

Sony can't do anything to slow down Microsoft from releasing a Blu-Ray addon, not even in the slightest, because then you're talking about a possible anti-trust/competition lawsuit on Sony's hands.

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Guest
Sony and BDA may be in bed together, locked into a 69 position. But if Microsoft come along, wave their willy and drop a $100 on the table, you know the 360 will be getting head ;)

lol, this post just made my day :D

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Neo003
MS went with HD DVD partly to oppose Sony if you want my opinion, it was business move on their rivals, that was all.

MS went with DVD for 2 reason one being early in the market so by the time your competitor releases their product (PS3) you already have fan base set, and second reason is not to get into the format war.

Just think console?s lifespan is around 5 years and we're already halfway there (in 360?s case anyway), if MS waited for Sony to complete BR drives we wouldn?t even had 360 yet let alone getting as an add-on.

Also remember DVD's aren't going anywhere they will be here for next year or two maybe more. So going BR right away isn't necessary, DVD will be here for a while and there are many people who’re still playing VCR (There’s a town couple of mile from where I live, they still rent Video Cassettes like c:ozy. :o )

Edited by Neo003
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+Audioboxer
MS went with DVD for 2 reason one being early in the market so by the time your competitor releases their product (PS3) you already have fan base set, and second reason is not to get into the format war.

Just think console’s lifespan is around 5 years and we're already halfway there (in 360’s case anyway), if MS waited for Sony to complete BR drives we wouldn’t even had 360 yet let alone getting as an add-on.

Also remember DVD's aren't going anywhere they will be here for next year or two maybe more. So going BR right away isn't necessary, DVD will be here for a while and there are many people who’re still playing VCR (There’s a town couple of mile from where I live, they still rent Video Cassettes like crazy. :o )

I said HD DVD, not DVD :p

MS went with HD DVD partly to oppose Sony if you want my opinion, it was business move on their rivals, that was all.
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tuckeratlarge
As I said it before, MS can't put BR as an internal drive but will most likely comes out with an add-on like HD-DVD.

Why not, the built in DVD drive is just a PC drive and you can get Blu Ray PC drives, they are the same size. So again why not?

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+Audioboxer
Why not, the built in DVD drive is just a PC drive and you can get Blu Ray PC drives, they are the same size. So again why not?

Yeah it would be possible.

I swear to god I would go buy another 360 if it had a silent Blu Ray drive in it, even a silent DVD drive for that matter!

I actually obsess over the noise of my 360 more than I do worrying about it being a pre-falcon.

I'm like that with noise though, for example my PC has rivatuner installed and fans run at 25% all times when not gaming and 40-55% when gaming (gfx fans).

My CPU cooler is a Tuniq Tower so it's silent.

See, im a silence nut :rofl:

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Neo003

Ok people first Blue Ray drive was released on June 06 (I have no idea at what price), 360 was released in Nov '05. Microsoft began production 69 before the release date (hence the RRoD problem with launch day system's). So It is possible to put BR drive in 360 but can't since it was launched with DVD drive and it was little too late for adding a BR drive into 360. Also this isn't a PC where you can just swap drives whenever you want.

And audioboxer I know you said HDDVD, But I was taking about 360's drive which is DVD "NOT" HDDVD. MS released HD-DVD add-on drive in Nov '06 well a year after the system release and almost 6 months after the release of HDDVD players.

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Huleboeren
snip

See, im a silence nut :rofl:

We all are - those that say they are not, are just already deaf :p

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+Audioboxer
Ok people first Blue Ray drive was released on June 06 (I have no idea at what price), 360 was released in Nov '05. Microsoft began production 69 before the release date (hence the RRoD problem with launch day system's). So It is possible to put BR drive in 360 but can't since it was launched with DVD drive and it was little too late for adding a BR drive into 360. Also this isn't a PC where you can just swap drives whenever you want.

And audioboxer I know you said HDDVD, But I was taking about 360's drive which is DVD "NOT" HDDVD. MS released HD-DVD add-on drive in Nov '06 well a year after the system release and almost 6 months after the release of HDDVD players.

Fair enough but I got confused since I have no idea why you went and told me the backstory on why MS used a DVD.

I know why, or at least I share the same ideas as you said, but I wasn't talking about that. I was talking about them backing HD DVD to hinder Sony.

So It is possible to put BR drive in 360 but can't since it was launched with DVD drive and it was little too late for adding a BR drive into 360.

As for interal Blu Ray, it could easily be done on a new model.

Blu Ray drives do read DVDs, you know that right? (meaning 360 games on DVD would work fine)

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Neo003

I am only explaining this because a lot of people now started saying why don't MS just add Blue Ray as an internal drive to 360's newer models. Well then what you?ll have is half batch of 360's with DVD drive and half batch with BR drives, not only it will **** off who has 360's with DVD drives but it would be a nightmare for support.

Newer model that MS came out with don't have anything different from the original once, the only difference is HDD, HDMI. The heat sink is a maintenance issue and they have to change that in order to run the system.

I am only saying is MS can?t come out with another sku with BR drive, it doesn?t make any sense. If they want they can always release BR add-on.

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iconboy

it would be sooo awesome if sony could pull this off and delay/stop M$ from getting their hands on BR. hey, they chose their side and now they are paying for it. they should have stayed neuteral if they didnt want any part of this, but ever 360 hd dvd addon they sold was a slap int he face to the BDA.

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