CelticWhisper Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 You know how sometimes you get a huge mound of dishes piled up in the kitchen sink, and then something starts to stink, and it takes a long time to realize where the stink is coming from, but eventually you wash every dish and scrub the whole thing out and it takes maybe a day or two, but you're finally fresh and happy again? OK, well, iTunes is a kitchen sink full of crud, and it stinks. Apple? You need to clean that bad boy out. Trust me. We'll all feel better.Listeners of Buzz Out Loud will have heard this rant earlier this week, but I'd like to expand on it a bit here, because iTunes is a program that a lot of people use, and it's turning into a bit of a national nightmare. Let's indulge in just a list, off the top of my head, of the tasks this former jukebox software now has to perform: # It organizes your music and syncs with your iPod # It's a music player # It's a video player, which necessitates that it come bundled with QuickTime # It indexes and delivers both audio and video podcasts # It's a storefront that sells music, TV shows, movies, audiobooks, iPod games, and music videos # It rents movies (and handles the requisite DRM-checking and so forth) # It's cell phone syncing and management software # It's the iPhone/iPod Touch App Store, handling registration, syncing, and sale of those apps # It's a veritable set-top box, syncing content with Apple TV for playback on TV This is one program we're talking about, here. As a result, iTunes 7.7 is a 60.5MB file. Last time I did a fresh install, about a week ago, it took me 30 full minutes to download it, complete a full registration procedure (when all I was after was iPod syncing), get it installed, index my entire universe of music and its entire universe of online content, and get it up and running. When my husband recently bought an iPod Touch, it took him 45 minutes to update iTunes, re-register, and connect the new iPod. On top of that, with so many functions and so many possibilities for bugs, it seems like there's a new iTunes update every week. And every update is mandatory, no matter how old your iPod or how uninterested you are in access to the iPhone App Store or how unlikely it is that you'll ever download or play a QuickTime video via iTunes. It'll keep bugging you until you upgrade, or maybe stop syncing your two-year-old iPod, and when you finally do upgrade, you'll have to restart, because, I assume, iTunes has about as many functions as an operating system and has its tendrils in almost as many system files. Yes, you can get by without iTunes if you just want media playback. I use VLC and I won't load iTunes unless I absolutely have to. (I've had the laptop I just installed it on for almost six months, and I only downloaded the darned thing so I could get at Dr. Horrible's Sing-Along Blog.) And I know there are plenty of alternative apps I can use to manage my iPod. That's not the point. The seamless iTunes integration used to be the best thing about the iPod. And until people (bless you, Joss Whedon, but you're one of them) stop doing "iTunes exclusives," I'm going to need it or some other program for downloading those videos. I shouldn't have to live in fear of loading it, because it takes so long to launch, it's so bloated, and it's almost certain to drop an update grenade in my lap. iTunes has become anathema to Apple's simple and elegant persona, and it's time for a fix. May I suggest, for example, iTunes Lite? Give the iPod masses a slimmed-down version for managing just the device and their music, and give them an online interface for the iTunes Store. Or start carving out features to trim down the program overall. The iPhone does not need to be managed by iTunes. It's a cell phone. Get it a separate sync program that includes the App Store and let it call (pun intended) iTunes for music the way iMovie does. Build a separate media player so we don't have to get QuickTime along with iTunes. I know Apple thinks it's keeping things simple by offering one program with one-stop shopping. But instead, they're creating bloatware that, increasingly, people don't want to use for any shopping. Apple, get out your scrubbing bubbles. It's time to save iTunes. Source I agree. I got my first Mac in 2001 and it had iTunes 1. It was nice software - the best playlist system I'd ever used (lightyears beyond WMP, WinAmp, and Sonique). The visualiser was cool, it had some nice equaliser presets, it was a good CD ripper, and it steadily got better with new features like smart playlists being added in later releases, up to and including iTunes 3. Then came iTunes 4, and with it the iTMS. And everything went to ****. From there it got more and more bloated and slow, added more DRM crap, a bull**** EULA that you had to agree to with EVERY UPDATE, and generally became a top-heavy oaf. I migrated to Cog about 2 years ago and haven't looked back. Does iTunes natively support Vorbis and FLAC yet? I should hope so with all the other crap they cram into it. This coming from a 7-year Mac fan: Apple needs to pare this crap down. Cog + Rockbox for music playing both on- and off-Mac is so dramatically superior to iTunes and the original iPod "OS" that it's not even funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magik Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 I completely agree. It's getting disgustingly bloated. :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Dick Montage Subscriber² Posted August 4, 2008 Subscriber² Share Posted August 4, 2008 Moreover, if Microsoft performed this sort of "bundling" they'd be back in court again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryster Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 +1 Agree Also, can they please fix the Party playlist mode. I don't want the same song being played 3 or 4 tracks apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magik Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 +1 AgreeAlso, can they please fix the Party playlist mode. I don't want the same song being played 3 or 4 tracks apart. There's a slider for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hurmoth Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 Moreover, if Microsoft performed this sort of "bundling" they'd be back in court again! Wait, doesn't Microsoft already do this? Let's see, Vista comes with Windows Photo Gallery, Media Player (of course), Media Center, Windows Mail, Windows Calendar, etc. As long as a Republican is President, Microsoft, nor Apple, has anything to fear with regards to monopolistic tactics. Now, with that being said, I am shocked that the EU hasn't gone after Apple for this sort of thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+jamesyfx Subscriber² Posted August 4, 2008 Subscriber² Share Posted August 4, 2008 I like iTunes because of all it's features. I don't class it as a Media Player. I class it as a Media Manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Dick Montage Subscriber² Posted August 4, 2008 Subscriber² Share Posted August 4, 2008 Wait, doesn't Microsoft already do this? Do Microsoft surrepticiously bundle software with their free downloads? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shakey_snake Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 (edited) Moreover, if Microsoft performed this sort of "bundling" they'd be back in court again! Which is why they currently offer the Zune software, WMP and Media Center. Wait, doesn't Microsoft already do this? Let's see, Vista comes with Windows Photo Gallery, Media Player (of course), Media Center, Windows Mail, Windows Calendar, etc.As long as a Republican is President, Microsoft, nor Apple, has anything to fear with regards to monopolistic tactics. Now, with that being said, I am shocked that the EU hasn't gone after Apple for this sort of thing. You're not really understanding the current problem correctly. This isn't a matter of "bundleware" (where the user is subjected to too many preinstalled applications) it's a matter of "bloatware" (where the user is subjected to too many functions within a single program). iTunes has catastrophically too many functions. Edited August 4, 2008 by shakey_snake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hurmoth Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 Do Microsoft surrepticiously bundle software with their free downloads? Not lately, no, but they have though (i.e. Outlook Express with IE). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
instant.human Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 I like iTunes because of all it's features. I don't class it as a Media Player. I class it as a Media Manager. +1, i have to agree here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Dick Montage Subscriber² Posted August 4, 2008 Subscriber² Share Posted August 4, 2008 Not lately, no, but they have though (i.e. Outlook Express with IE). And see where that landed them ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shakey_snake Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 I like iTunes because of all it's features. I don't class it as a Media Player. I class it as a Media Manager. Realistically, you probably don't use 1/3 of it's entire functionality. Yet you subject yourself to updates, hard drive space lossed, and application launch time of all those functionalities. [edit]WTF, where did my first post go? Server move related? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATLien_0 Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 have to agree that its become a media manager. This is why I stopped using itunes because of all the features that I didnt use. I used to use it as a media player, didnt buy music off of itunes and my old ipod 4g didnt support half the new features. A lite version would be nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViperAFK Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 I agree, at least on windows iTunes honestly is one of the slowest, buggiest, bloated programs I have ever had the displeasure of using. I now use winamp to manage my ipod and am MUCH happier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niels. Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 Do Microsoft surrepticiously bundle software with their free downloads? Technically it does bundle software with it's free updates, but the main difference being, those software updates are strictly optional and are not automatically marked for download (unlike Apple Updater which marks software for download automatically). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+jamesyfx Subscriber² Posted August 4, 2008 Subscriber² Share Posted August 4, 2008 Realistically, you probably don't use 1/3 of it's entire functionality. Yet you subject yourself to updates, hard drive space lossed, and application launch time of all those functionalities. [edit]WTF, where did my first post go? Server move related? Maybe for some people. But for me all the features are essential, and the space lost means nothing to me. I have an iPod Touch, I have a MacBook Pro (So hard drive space and application launch times are irrelevant), and I use QuickTime Pro often. I'd probably moan if any of the features were removed. :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harreh Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 It's a media nightmare! iTunes is a complete joke imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shakey_snake Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 I have a MacBook Pro OK then. I'm largely talking about (and it's reasonable to assume the article is as well) the windows version, which contains quite a bit of functionality that is delegated to other apps on OSX. They have the same name but they are worlds apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikee99 Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 Wait, doesn't Microsoft already do this? Let's see, Vista comes with Windows Photo Gallery, Media Player (of course), Media Center, Windows Mail, Windows Calendar, etc.As long as a Republican is President, Microsoft, nor Apple, has anything to fear with regards to monopolistic tactics. Now, with that being said, I am shocked that the EU hasn't gone after Apple for this sort of thing. Oh, I see. Microsoft is wrong to bundle features with their OS that people acutally want to use. It's not like MS is the only OS maker to do this: Apple does it, as well as any major Linux distribution. So, if it were up to you, you would force MS, Apple, and Linux distros to castrate the features of their OS, and instead provide just a kernel. Screw web-browsing, or media playback, or calender applications, because those features in the OS are "anti-competitive". Even though the inclusion of those features has sparked competition between MS, Apple, and Linux distros (all the while benefiting us, the consumers), including desired features in the OS is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harlem39s Finest Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 itunes is really bad, i pity the fools that use it :pirate: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thealexweb Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 Massively bloated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BilliShere Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 indeed. itunes is slow and extremely buggy. the only reason i use it is because of excellent ipod support. hell the ipod is designed to work with it. but you know what? its been 4 months. and i havent touched itunes. using amarok currently, i find it to be the best multimedia management solution! just amazing! while it doesnt have 100% ipod support: (as in minor stuff like checklist right next to all the songs for things like the sync only selected songs option in itunes), it manages my ipod pretty well. oh and did i mention it runs on linux and is really fast and stable? nice +bonus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1759 Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 You can trash iTunes, QT, Safari, DVD Player, etc if you want to in OSX. But the same can't be said of IE7, WMP 11, or other included Microsoft apps in Windows. That's where MS gets in trouble. iTunes is becoming a dog, it was fine when it was a music app, but Apple has just turned it into a way to bundle features, and keep people locked into a distribution system. I would love to trash QT, but it breaks iTunes and other iLife apps, and I don't need/want MobileMe, other Apple mobile device services running on my Vista machines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hurmoth Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 Oh, I see. Microsoft is wrong to bundle features with their OS that people acutally want to use. It's not like MS is the only OS maker to do this: Apple does it, as well as any major Linux distribution.So, if it were up to you, you would force MS, Apple, and Linux distros to castrate the features of their OS, and instead provide just a kernel. Screw web-browsing, or media playback, or calender applications, because those features in the OS are "anti-competitive". Even though the inclusion of those features has sparked competition between MS, Apple, and Linux distros (all the while benefiting us, the consumers), including desired features in the OS is wrong. :laugh: Wow, you got a lot out of that post that wasn't there. I never said that stuff shouldn't be bundled. But here's the thing, if you don't like what Apple bundles, or Microsoft, etc. bundles then don't use the problem. There's no point in bitching and moaning though. I guess people have to bitch about something now days though. Just like you bitching about my personal opinion, that clearly you didn't understand the point to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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