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Wanting to learn how to code Windows apps


Question

Coming from a purely PHP / Perl background (and not saying to any high level in any of them!) I am wanting to go towards putting Windows apps together using the MS Studio suite.

Now would my other programming experience help me in either VB or C#?

Which one would be easier for me to kick off learning?

Cheers for any advice!

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Due to your experience with PHP, you could learn Java which has a very similar syntax and therefore, a low learning curve. If you're hell bent on a Microsoft route, you can't go far wrong with C#.net.

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Due to your experience with PHP, you could learn Java which has a very similar syntax and therefore, a low learning curve. If you're hell bent on a Microsoft route, you can't go far wrong with C#.net.

To be honest, when learning Java, syntax is the least complicated part about learning Java. The syntax may be clear for him, but it doesn't mean the learning curve will be low. Learning how to use the rest of the framework is the hard part. This goes for C# as well.

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The real Windows programming is done with Win32 api in C or C++. (and even with Win32 Asm)

All Win32 gurus of > 45 years old use C/Win32 api

C# is mainly used by kids and newsbies (click, click, click), who even don't known what is a Message Loop or a Native api

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The real Windows programming is done with Win32 api in C or C++. (and even with Win32 Asm)

All Win32 gurus of > 45 years old use C/Win32 api

C# is mainly used by kids and newsbies (click, click, click), who even don't known what is a Message Loop or a Native api

Well that puts me somewhere between newbie (which I think I am with windows apps) and a Win32 guru (not quite 45 :))

Will crack on with C# and see what its all about - just grabbing the app from MSDN :)

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The real Windows programming is done with Win32 api in C or C++. (and even with Win32 Asm)

All Win32 gurus of > 45 years old use C/Win32 api

C# is mainly used by kids and newsbies (click, click, click), who even don't known what is a Message Loop or a Native api

I don't think so bud. People who use vb.net or C# are not kids or newbies. Where on earth do you get that from Mr. Big Shot programmer. C# and VB.net can be extremely powerful tools, granted it can not be used in every situation. There is nothing kiddish about it.

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The real Windows programming is done with Win32 api in C or C++. (and even with Win32 Asm)

All Win32 gurus of > 45 years old use C/Win32 api

C# is mainly used by kids and newsbies (click, click, click), who even don't known what is a Message Loop or a Native api

Haha. Right and we should probably be coding in Notepad as well, correct?

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C# is mainly used by kids and newsbies (click, click, click), who even don't known what is a Message Loop or a Native api

Here you will find an embittered aging programmer, who has been left behind as new languages are released. See them in every organisation - with elitist attitudes and set in their ways.

Rock on, old timer; rock on...

Now - on topic: From a PHP background to Windows apps... I would suggest C#. It has a really nice learning curve, greate IDE to develop in, and very easy to find tutorials on.

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The real Windows programming is done with Win32 api in C or C++. (and even with Win32 Asm)

All Win32 gurus of > 45 years old use C/Win32 api

C# is mainly used by kids and newsbies (click, click, click), who even don't known what is a Message Loop or a Native api

Where are you getting your information? Microsoft is writing an operating system in C#.

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Here you will find an embittered aging programmer, who has been left behind as new languages are released. See them in every organisation - with elitist attitudes and set in their ways.

Rock on, old timer; rock on...

Now - on topic: From a PHP background to Windows apps... I would suggest C#. It has a really nice learning curve, greate IDE to develop in, and very easy to find tutorials on.

WIN! :) (But the age reference isn't fair. I'm 40 and I use C# on a daily basis.)

Edited by Colin-uk
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For windows Dev another vote for C#, Microsoft even have a load of downloadable beginner courses to help you get started.

I develop in Delphi and am currently gonna try and move over to C#.

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The real Windows programming is done with Win32 api in C or C++. (and even with Win32 Asm)

All Win32 gurus of > 45 years old use C/Win32 api

C# is mainly used by kids and newsbies (click, click, click), who even don't known what is a Message Loop or a Native api

Win32 hasn't been around for 45 years. Windows 95 is called that for a reason.

Message loop? Basic stuff. It's a loop that processes messages.

Native API? PInvoke. Check.

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Patrick333 does have a point though. While no one writes actual Win32 code in assembly (except for the odd algorithm optimization here and there), native C/C++ is best suited for general applications and has fewer compatibility issues than .NET (such as not requiring a 150MB runtime download).

C#/.NET is best suited for business solutions where you have full control of the environment and don't want to spend weeks just writing the code to make your window resizable. It gives you the ability to deploy safe code faster, and easier maintenance because of decreased code complexity. The downside is a fairly large performance penalty and an incomplete API (meaning you often have to resort to very expensive interop).

Edited by Colin-uk
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I have to agree with Patrick on this one, you will never see a software made by a big company made in C#. Do you really think MS would make Office in C#? or what about photoshop?

Someone mentioned the test OS that MS is making in C#, if they would research it a bit more they would also know that the whole project is also based on a compiler that compiles the code in machine code rather than byte code (aka .net code)

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I have to agree with Patrick on this one, you will never see a software made by a big company made in C#. Do you really think MS would make Office in C#? or what about photoshop?

Someone mentioned the test OS that MS is making in C#, if they would research it a bit more they would also know that the whole project is also based on a compiler that compiles the code in machine code rather than byte code (aka .net code)

Photoshop, and Office would be possible in .Net.

The availability of the .Net platform is what stops comercial apps from using it.

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not only that but there is an application that comes very close to photoshop.

It's called paint.net and it is written in c#.

The reason photoshop will never be written in c# is because it is a multi platform application.

Most ps users are on mac I believe.

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Photoshop, and Office would be possible in .Net.

The availability of the .Net platform is what stops comercial apps from using it.

Indeed, but as Microsoft integrates .NET in new versions of Windows (Vista, 7) it should become mainstream, as DirectX did for games. Remember the time when DirectX was a separate download, and games would prompt you to install it ? Ah, old times. Well I hope one day we say the same thing about .NET.
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Photoshop, and Office would be possible in .Net.

The availability of the .Net platform is what stops comercial apps from using it.

Possible, maybe, but not the greatest of ideas. Photoshop is a very heavy application and now also utilizes the GPU. .NET code is substantially slower, and doing interop for the parts that don't even exist is a real bitch and very costly (have you seen the cost of COM interop?). There is no benefit to be had for Adobe.

Indeed, but as Microsoft integrates .NET in new versions of Windows (Vista, 7) it should become mainstream, as DirectX did for games. Remember the time when DirectX was a separate download, and games would prompt you to install it ? Ah, old times. Well I hope one day we say the same thing about .NET.

Only sort of. When it comes to .NET, people prefer to use the latest and greatest because new features are introduced. In a year or two everyone will be using .NET 4, which won't be shipping with Windows 7 and will be a very large additional download. Maybe the releases should be synched with OS releases, but even then you still have to download new runtimes for older OS versions. Vista already ships with .NET, by the way, but everyone uses 3.5 so you end up having to download that.

Anyway, people seem to think that .NET and managed code is going to take over for native code. It isn't, at least not until the APIs are complete and machines are so ridiculously fast that the performance penalty doesn't matter anymore. Like I've said, they have different uses.

C# is a good place to start to learn modern object-oriented programming, though. There is little reason to consider Visual Basic these days.

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