Cheaper Blu-ray Coming Your Way

[Coldgunner]

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/cheaper-blu-...news-30438.html

One of the biggest barriers for any solid technology to gain the acceptance of the mainstream consumer is price. Those who have seen Blu-ray movies on a 1080p display know what a leap they are over DVD, but until prices fall below a certain point, consumers won?t buy in.

ZoomBlu-ray-making companies Panasonic, Philips and Sony are currently working with other patent holders to establish a one-stop-shop license, which will cover essential patents for Blu-ray Disc, DVD and CD.

Aiming for an introduction in the middle of this year, the license program will be offered by a new independent licensing company that will be a single point of contact for licensees, greatly reducing the burden on licensed companies that would otherwise have to report to multiple patent pools. The companies involved estimate that royalty rates for Blu-ray Disc products are expected to be at least 40 percent lower than the current cumulative royalty rates for individual Blu-ray Disc, DVD and CD format licenses.

What does that mean for the consumer? Hopefully lower prices. For companies, the new rates for Blu-ray Disc products will be $9.50 for a player and $14.00 for a recorder. The per disc license fees will be $0.11 for a read only disc, $0.12 for a recordable disc and $0.15 for a rewritable disc.

Gerald Rosenthal, CEO of the new license company, (formerly the head of IP at IBM and more recently CEO of Open Invention Network, said "by establishing a new licensing entity that offers a single license for Blu-ray Disc products at attractive rates, I am confident that it will foster the growth of the Blu-ray Disc market and serve the interest of all companies participating in this market, be it as licensee or licensor."

We love our high-definition movies, and we hope to see more affordable Blu-ray product across the board later this year.

[episode]

Too bad they didn't give the old rates instead of just '40% lower'.

$.11 per disc, down from $.22, thats not going to change the pricing structure. (50% lower)

[DaDude]

Actually, I see some good deals right now on BDs at Amazon. So, finding movies for a good price isn't hard. It's the player that's killing me. They're all over $250. Hopefully, one day I could find one for less than $200.

And I can't just buy any Blu-ray player. I have to buy a good one because those cheaper ones tend to have problems playing certain movies.

[+StevoFC MVC]

Hopefully, one day I could find one for less than $200.

And I can't just buy any Blu-ray player. I have to buy a good one because those cheaper ones tend to have problems playing certain movies.

Get a Samsung BDP-1500. It's under $200. Has frequent firmware updates to allow playback of new movies with no problems.

[DaDude]

Get a Samsung BDP-1500. It's under $200. Has frequent firmware updates to allow playback of new movies with no problems.

Yeah, that's what I'm afraid of. I've heard people complaining about playback problems with those players. I have my heart set on the Sony BDP-S350, but that's $300 at Best buy. :|

[Boz]

BDP-350 has no internal decoding of DTS-HD HR or DTS-MA

Edited March 3, 2009 by Boz

[DaDude]

One question. Does the Samsung BDP-1500 do a good job in upconverting DVDs?

[HSoft]

Actually, I see some good deals right now on BDs at Amazon. So, finding movies for a good price isn't hard. It's the player that's killing me. They're all over $250. Hopefully, one day I could find one for less than $200.

Why not just buy a playstation 3? Excellent BR drive and right now you can get $100 off (http://www.us.playstation.com/PSN/Events/Promotions/351?ILC-lps&FTTR=UnchartedPS3System_PSCC_bottomright_event351)

[Zarpraz]

Don't have too much of a problem with the price of burners but the price of media puts me off. It's not a big deal if a DVD fails to burn but it is if a Blue-ray disk fails and 11 cents (about 7p) lower is hardly worth talking about when a BD-R costs about ?10.

[Coldgunner]

Don't have too much of a problem with the price of burners but the price of media puts me off. It's not a big deal if a DVD fails to burn but it is if a Blue-ray disk fails and 11 cents (about 7p) lower is hardly worth talking about when a BD-R costs about ?10.

DVD's weren't much different back in the day, with time and the wider adoption of the format, it will get cheaper.

[Zarpraz]

DVD's weren't much different back in the day, with time and the wider adoption of the format, it will get cheaper.

I know same went for CD's and the burners, I paid over ?200 for my first CD burner. Doesn't alter the fact that media is just too expensive for most, burners aren't too bad as they're a one off cost, and if they're only charging about 7p royalties then TDK etc are taking the mick with their pricing.

[DaDude]

Why not just buy a playstation 3? Excellent BR drive and right now you can get $100 off (http://www.us.playstation.com/PSN/Events/Promotions/351?ILC-lps&FTTR=UnchartedPS3System_PSCC_bottomright_event351)

Two reasons:

1) I don't play video games anymore.

2) $400 is outrageous!!

[Elessar]

Two reasons:

1) I don't play video games anymore.

2) $400 is outrageous!!

Ever thought about getting back into games? I mean, once the PS3 hits $299, i'm snapping one up ASAP. I want Blu-ray and i want a PS3...so it makes sense to get one of the best Blu-ray players on the market AND get a great gaming machine.

[DaDude]

Ever thought about getting back into games? I mean, once the PS3 hits $299, i'm snapping one up ASAP. I want Blu-ray and i want a PS3...so it makes sense to get one of the best Blu-ray players on the market AND get a great gaming machine.

Well, if PS3 hits $299, then Blu-ray players should go down too. Sorry, but I just don't want to get into games anymore. I like using the time to watch movies and TV shows. That's more fun than throwing my controller out the window because I lost a game.

[Boz]

Why not just buy a playstation 3? Excellent BR drive ...

Contrary to popular belief aside from speed PS3 is simply not that great at Blu-rays. I have done side by side comparison and not only that PS3 can't bitstream/passthrough DTS-HD or MA or TrueHD to reciever but it's picture quality is so so compared to standalones these days. Even though it converts DTS-HD/MA or TrueHD to LPCM and passes that to the receiver and should theoretically be identical to the original track on Blu-ray disc bit for bit in reality it is not so. I hear a significant clarity improvement and fuller sound coming from my standalone going into Denon receiver via audiophile bitstreaming then going from PS3 as LPCM to the same receiver and I have good calibrated system both audio and video. PS3 is far from bad though, but if you are into movies don't play games PS3 is not that of a good deal if you want best possible quality out of your BD movies.

The PQ and AQ even on BD1500 (but I did try Panasonic BD35 and BD50) and it/they are significantly better IMO to PS3. The only advantage PS3 has is the cell processor and handling the loading and Java content but BD1500 is very fast. Almost as fast as DVD players.

The advantage to someone buying PS3 is having also a good media center that allows you to sync it with PS3 Media server or other apps on PC and enjoy much more content over your network as well while still being able to stream HD audio (LPCM). Unlike Xbox 360 for example which is limited in way of audio.

If you just want a great Blu-ray player it's definitely better to go these days for standalone even at $300. Samsung 2500 if you look hard enough could be found for about $280-$300 and offers superb Netflix integration and HQV upscaling chip for DVDs, something that was reserved for DVD players at a higher price then that.

Edited March 3, 2009 by Boz

[goji]

Psh, who need internal decodimg of DTS-MA etc when most people don't have the audio system to play it back on.

If you care then you will already have the rest of the system in place. Additionaly, if the players have MPCM analog outputs, then your set for 100% HD audio.

[+StevoFC MVC]

Yeah, that's what I'm afraid of. I've heard people complaining about playback problems with those players. I have my heart set on the Sony BDP-S350, but that's $300 at Best buy. :|

I only updated the firmware once on my Sammy, right when I got it. It has never had a problem reading any movie I have played on it.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Psh, who need internal decodimg of DTS-MA etc when most people don't have the audio system to play it back on.

If you care then you will already have the rest of the system in place. Additionaly, if the players have MPCM analog outputs, then your set for 100% HD audio.

Yeah one of the reasons I like using my PS3 is it can decode HD audio, and my receiver supports PCM over HDMI, therefore I get HD audio :)

[DaDude]

Ok, I was speaking to a few people I know and they told me that getting Blu-ray on my TV is pointless. They said 32? is too small and it?s only 720p. They said I must have a big TV that?s 1080p in order to experience the full benefit of Blu-ray. Is there any truth to that?

[Coldgunner]

Ok, I was speaking to a few people I know and they told me that getting Blu-ray on my TV is pointless. They said 32? is too small and it?s only 720p. They said I must have a big TV that?s 1080p in order to experience the full benefit of Blu-ray. Is there any truth to that?

No

I got a 26'' and SD vs HD is night and day.

[+StevoFC MVC]

Ok, I was speaking to a few people I know and they told me that getting Blu-ray on my TV is pointless. They said 32? is too small and it?s only 720p. They said I must have a big TV that?s 1080p in order to experience the full benefit of Blu-ray. Is there any truth to that?

lol...don't listen to them ever again, about anything.

[Boz]

Ok, I was speaking to a few people I know and they told me that getting Blu-ray on my TV is pointless. They said 32" is too small and it's only 720p. They said I must have a big TV that's 1080p in order to experience the full benefit of Blu-ray. Is there any truth to that?

Some, depends on your viewing distance. I had a 42" edtv (480p plasma) a while back that was in my office that I was watching with hd footage and it looked better then DVD even though edtv resolution not hd. Considering you have a smaller tv the distance will play a big part. The hd details will play it's part and be visible but if you are closer to tv. If you are 6,7,8 ft away from tv you will not see a significant difference because all those details in 720p will not be visible until you come closer making it indeed pointless to go Blu-ray. It's all about what you see. At 32" and normal viewing distance it will be harder to appreciate the quality as difference becomes so small that it's really pointless for you to upgrade for the money. When you get 40" and above that's when you start seeing a benefit of hd and when you can somewhat justify the price difference.

The fact is your friends are right, with your setup you will not experience blu completely and you will definetely have more bang for buck if you have an already good upscaling DVD player and wait until you get a bigger tv.

The point is from a fairly short distance even on your 32" 720p tv you will see some difference as 720p is roughly double the amount of pixels of SD but whether it's worth your money it's only on you.

Put it this way.. your TV is probably 1280x720. Let's say it is, if you have the ability to hook up your computer to it or a laptop, load it up and set your monitor resolution to match TV. Open a 720x480px photo and set it to full screen. Absorb the impressions and then open a photo that's 1280x720p in full screen. Sit from your normal viewing distance and compare. If you see a big difference you should consider upgrading.

It is important to note that even though computer test will give you some insight it is most likely using very good photos for both. With video footage it's even harder because you can have a terrific DVD transfer and not so superb transfer of the same movie on Blu-ray. This is the case with many Blu-ray catalog titles from what I've experienced. In this case the difference will be even smaller. So you should keep in mind that true comparison will become relevant when you compare 2 solid transfers on both formats.

Here's a chart that should help you out:

You can read this article that will give you more insight into the resolution/size.

http://bfads.net/Television-Buying-Guide-f...ack-Friday-2008

According to the above image, the benefit of a 32" HDTV having 1080p resolution is not noticeable for most people sitting more than 6-feet away from their television set. The benefit of 1080p for a 42" television starts at 8-feet away, a standard viewing distance for most households.

In a year-old CNET article, they come to the conclusion that unless you are sitting really close to your television set, "[it's] almost always very difficult to see any difference [between 720p and 1080p] -- especially from farther than 8 feet away on a 50-inch TV."

This also assumes that you will be playing 1080p content on your television. As a general rule, you shouldn't be paying extra just for 1080p on any television smaller than 42" because the casual user will be perfectly happy with a 720p set.

If you plan on using your television as a PC monitor or playing lots of 1080p programming, you are an exception and should be focusing on the 1080p sets, but I don't think too many people fall into this category.

The same argument applies to SD vs HD footage.

If you are still unsure, you can always get a Blu-ray player and try it out. If you don't like it, return it. You won't lose anything.

Edited March 3, 2009 by Boz

[Boz]

I only updated the firmware once on my Sammy, right when I got it. It has never had a problem reading any movie I have played on it.

Yep same here.. I had problem with Pineapple Express losing audio when I got the first one, upgraded firmware once and everything has been peachy since then.

[kak]

Contrary to popular belief aside from speed PS3 is simply not that great at Blu-rays. I have done side by side comparison and not only that PS3 can't bitstream/passthrough DTS-HD or MA or TrueHD to reciever but it's picture quality is so so compared to standalones these days. Even though it converts DTS-HD/MA or TrueHD to LPCM and passes that to the receiver and should theoretically be identical to the original track on Blu-ray disc bit for bit in reality it is not so. I hear a significant clarity improvement and fuller sound coming from my standalone going into Denon receiver via audiophile bitstreaming then going from PS3 as LPCM to the same receiver and I have good calibrated system both audio and video. PS3 is far from bad though, but if you are into movies don't play games PS3 is not that of a good deal if you want best possible quality out of your BD movies.

I think you're experiencing a placebo effect here. The information at the end of the decoding process, regardless of machine, is exactly the same. My sound system sound excellent with the PS3.

The advantage to someone buying PS3 is having also a good media center that allows you to sync it with PS3 Media server or other apps on PC and enjoy much more content over your network as well while still being able to stream HD audio (LPCM). Unlike Xbox 360 for example which is limited in way of audio.

This cannot be stressed enough. The media center capabilities of the PS3 are amazing. My best friend has a XBOX360 and it is no where near the PS3 in terms of media center capabilities.

If you just want a great Blu-ray player it's definitely better to go these days for standalone even at $300. Samsung 2500 if you look hard enough could be found for about $280-$300 and offers superb Netflix integration and HQV upscaling chip for DVDs, something that was reserved for DVD players at a higher price then that.

Truth.

[Boz]

I think you're experiencing a placebo effect here. The information at the end of the decoding process, regardless of machine, is exactly the same. My sound system sound excellent with the PS3.

Sound with PS3 is very good but the problem is in decoding. PS3 software decoder is most likely inferior to my Denon's decoding thus the difference in generated LPCM stream. The information in LPCM stream should indeed be identical to the master however the decoder is the key. My BD players always passthrough the original track untouched to my reciever for decoding. With PS3 that process is solely relying on PS3s software decoding and sending the final product to the reciever that has nothing else but to play the uncompressed stream. Even on PC you will experience different results using different filters for decoding TrueHD and DTS-MA for example into PCM.

This is what separates a great AVR from another. If everything was the same there would be no reason to charge premium no?