[Official] E3 Sony Discussion

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Sony got away with it in the last few years.

Hardly, the media slammed Sony last year for showing CGI of MAG and GoW3. So did most of you guys. They were showing announcements for titles far off in the future. CGI is underwhelming, it's nice to know something is coming but showing off a brand new game like MAG with CGI is like.... great, we know nothing really.

That's the one thing they have in their favour going into this E3 after MS' show, pretty much all the exclusive games they'll show will either have hands on gameplay time, or will be trailers of in-game footage. Unless something is brand spanking new, everything will have real time footage, even Trico if it's there as the leaked internal video from a year ago was even real time.

[Ricardo Gil]

Hardly, the media slammed Sony last year for showing CGI of MAG and GoW3. So did most of you guys. They were showing announcements for titles far off in the future. CGI is underwhelming, it's nice to know something is coming but showing off a brand new game like MAG with CGI is like.... great, we know nothing really.

That's the one thing they have in their favour going into this E3 after MS' show, pretty much all the exclusive games they'll show will either have hands on gameplay time, or will be trailers of in-game footage. Unless something is brand spanking new, everything will have real time footage, even Trico if it's there as the leaked internal video from a year ago was even real time.

Yeah, but the hardcore Sony fans were all drooling over vaporware. MS has a product that works, now. (I'm talking about Natal, btw)

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Yeah, but the hardcore Sony fans were all drooling over vaporware. MS has a product that works, now. (I'm talking about Natal, btw)

How were MAG and GoW3 vaporware? :blink: I'm pretty sure you're going to see them in a few hours.

People are drooling over the Crackdown 2 CGI trailer, do you see me calling that vaporware? No, because that's silly. A CGI trailer is an indication something is coming, but that's all it is, which is why it's quite underwhelming when you want to see what the game looks like. The games shown off in this fashion are just too early to be shown in-game, that is all.

Natal works but it's still very early in development, there's no release date on it, I'm not the one arguing about that though others are. I'm talking strictly about showing off CGI for your exclusives vs being able to show off real game play.

[Bhav]

Yeah, but the hardcore Sony fans were all drooling over vaporware.

What?! I'd like a list of this vaporware please...

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Rumour mill full speed ahead,

This just in from a Sony representative after yesterday's showcase of events by Microsoft, Sony is rumored to be prepping up quite a line up for their presentation. The rep claims that at least three new Ip's shall be present for the PlayStation platform and these would include an exclusive game from R* studios, Kojima's Project S and something big from Square centering around the Kingdom Hearts Universe. This is barring of course all the luscious bunch of first party games that are going to bring the show floor to a halt, which will make this year's edition of E3 the best and most prized for the company. All these bits of speculation will be confirmed at Sony's E3 conference which goes live today.

Source: http://www.skoar.com/news/admin/rumorsony-....html?Itemid=46

Unknown website, vague sources, 95% likely as a load of bull, but one can dream about KH3... :cry: I just know it's destined for the Wii but....

[BGM]

after yesterday, sony need to pull something massive out of the bag..

[Omar Hussain]

Just out of interest, these rumours about the new slimline PS3, how solid do you think they are? I was planning on getting my brother a PS3 in the summer holidays, but would it be worth waiting? or is it so far away from becoming a reality in the shops that theres no point waiting?

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

More motion sensing incoming? ....

Sony unveiling new motion-sensing controller tonight?

E3'09: Format-holder's E3 press conference will detail new Wiimote-like device, say insiders

Sony will unveil its own competitor to the Wii Remote controller at its E3 conference this evening, according to our sources.

Allegedly the format-holder has already briefed developers on the device.

The new controller has been described to us as being a wand-like device for the PS3.

It's an all the more pertinent point of interest given Microsoft's Project Natal camera, announced yesterday - that controller uses a 3D camera a no other peripheral for player-based motion-capture.

However we won't know for certain if it's rumour or real until the Sony press conference, which takes place later today at 19:00 (UK time).

http://www.mcvuk.com/news/34538/Sony-unvei...troller-tonight

Just out of interest, these rumours about the new slimline PS3, how solid do you think they are? I was planning on getting my brother a PS3 in the summer holidays, but would it be worth waiting? or is it so far away from becoming a reality in the shops that theres no point waiting?

Pretty much looking certain now, however all sources say no E3 unveil, it's going to be later in the year.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

Natal works but it's still very early in development, there's no release date on it, I'm not the one arguing about that though others are. I'm talking strictly about showing off CGI for your exclusives vs being able to show off real game play.

Natal has clearly been in development for at least 2 years. The patent Allard signed was issued in 2007. Work would have been going on even before that.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Natal has clearly been in development for at least 2 years. The patent Allard signed was issued in 2007. Work would have been going on even before that.

I mean in terms of software.

They said in the conference itself dev kits are just hitting developers now.

The tech itself will most definitely been in development for a few years, they showed it working. You don't knock up tech like that in 6 months.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

Ah ok, understand you now.

[Ricardo Gil]

How were MAG and GoW3 vaporware? :blink: I'm pretty sure you're going to see them in a few hours.

People are drooling over the Crackdown 2 CGI trailer, do you see me calling that vaporware? No, because that's silly. A CGI trailer is an indication something is coming, but that's all it is, which is why it's quite underwhelming when you want to see what the game looks like. The games shown off in this fashion are just too early to be shown in-game, that is all.

Natal works but it's still very early in development, there's no release date on it, I'm not the one arguing about that though others are. I'm talking strictly about showing off CGI for your exclusives vs being able to show off real game play.

LOL Audio, you just said

CGI is underwhelming, it's nice to know something is coming but showing off a brand new game like MAG with CGI is like.... great, we know nothing really.

For me, a CGI for a new, just announced game IS vaporware. You don't know if it exists or not.

The Crackdown trailer was the same thing. I don't have an idea of how far along the game is... it's just CGI. Same thing for SC. I hate purely CGI trailers. In game is where it's at for me.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

LOL Audio, you just said

For me, a CGI for a new, just announced game IS vaporware. You don't know if it exists or not.

The Crackdown trailer was the same thing. I don't have an idea of how far along the game is... it's just CGI. Same thing for SC. I hate purely CGI trailers. In game is where it's at for me.

I'm sorry but that's where you're going off the road.

The developers were clearly working on MAG/GoW3 and Crackdown 2 when the CGI trailers were shown, the projects and development are not vaporware. The issue is they are at a stage in development where they don't want to show the game off as the reasonable, understanding of the development process gamers we have clearly wouldn't just start the "OMG THIS GAME LOOKS LIKE CRAP, NO BUY" chants for a title most likely a year+ off.

You know what gamers are like, they judge insanely early footage like it's a 1:1 representation of the final product. Developers and publishers are walking on a knife edge when they show footage of something in development. Gamers demand to see footage of things early, then completely trash it like it's the final product, it's funny at times.

Most devs tend to work on the nitty gritty coding and stuff before they polish the hell out the graphics engine/textures/lighting/etc, which is all 80% of the gamers care about when they see the project, especially if it's an exclusive.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

I have to say, I don't remember anyone slating the GoW3 trailer last year, infact all I remember was a lot of excitment. I honestly can't remember the reaction to MAG though :s

For once the pieces are falling into place for Sony though and the timing has worked out great for them. Having all these games on show will be just what they need for the second half of this year.

[Ricardo Gil]

I'm sorry but that's where you're going off the road.

The developers were clearly working on MAG/GoW3 and Crackdown 2 when the CGI trailers were shown, the projects and development are not vaporware.

Yes, but how far along were they? Were they far ahead enough to come out for sure? I know I can be sure that GoW3 will come out, but a new game like MAG was just vaporware for me back when it was announced, that's all I'm saying.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Yes, but how far along were they? Were they far ahead enough to come out for sure? I know I can be sure that GoW3 will come out, but a new game like MAG was just vaporware for me back when it was announced, that's all I'm saying.

Probably fairly far along. The amount of work involved in a project before public showing is probably more than you think.

As I said the issue of showing it off comes from that of how do your graphics/animations/lighting look.

Your showing off what, a 30 second clip if lucky (if it's a new game)? I'm sorry but in the media if you're working under that kind of time frame you're going to have to make the good first impression and for better or worse that comes from graphics/animations/lighting in this industry. You can give an indication of what gameplay will be like, but you give that indication from genre anyway, if it's an FPS people will relate to previous FPS games, etc. No one can seriously judge gameplay from a 30 second clip.

They walked on stage and said MAG would be 256 players - Regardless of what anyone says if that works lag free it's an achievement, but such a claim is stone walled with how does the game look, bet it looks like a PS1 game, 256 players wont work, etc. This is ALL before anyone knew how the game would really work, again, we're such an assuming generation of gamers, there's little reservation to wait and see.

If you don't show game play footage you underwhelm, but if you do show game play footage even if your game is ages away you have to somehow show it off like it's the final product or chances are it will get slated.

A lot of thought has to go into these unveils of new games, which is why you end up with CGI/Target renders and everything else, developers playing it safe as not to get their project trashed before they can show it off in a more deserving state. You could say keep it under wraps till then, but we the gamers are constantly demanding information on new games, they just do their best to tell us as early as they can.

Look at the L4D 2 topic, as strange as it is for Valve to release a sequel so early (you've gotta understand some moans), 90% of that topic has written the game off before even seeing ANY game play....

Edited June 2, 2009 by Audioboxer

[Ricardo Gil]

Probably fairly far along. The amount of work involved in a project before public showing is probably more than you think.

As I said the issue of showing it off comes from that of how do your graphics/animations/lighting look.

Your showing off what, a 30 second clip if lucky (if it's a new game)?

There's an easy solution for that. Don't announce it/show it. Do it only when you're ready.

[AbandonedTrolley]

Wonder if they will ever set a release date for the EyePet too?

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

There's an easy solution for that. Don't announce it/show it. Do it only when you're ready.

Did you read my whole post?

You could say keep it under wraps till then, but we the gamers are constantly demanding information on new games, they just do their best to tell us as early as they can.

The gamers force this behaviour.

If MS don't announce Crackdown 2 and L4D 2 at their conference, it's a console war in the media/online of MS don't have enough exclusives. If Sony don't show the GoW3 teaser CGI, GoW3 now isn't coming till 2012, might as well be on PS4, PS3 is going to fail as none of it's previous big hitters have been shown yet... etc.

Gamers and journalists make wild assumptions all the time, a lot of the time it's just a case of developers/publishers wanting to wait till nearer release, nothing to do with vaporware, games not releasing till 2012, but that view forces some by the hand to show.

Look at the Halo Reach unveiling, that didn't even really have a CGI trailer, it's complete fan service for the gamers to give them something.

E3 is a large gaming stage, the amount of pressure and expectation from these companies is outrageous. It's almost as if one E3 determines the whole console war, which it doesn't, but everyone acts like it does, media and gamers alike, so developers are left with very little choice in some cases. They're called on to unveil the large projects early and in return need to do that through safer methods at times.

Look at the comments on this board "company x better packup their bags and not even show". As a joke okay, but really, really? That's just stupid, everyone has a fair timeslot to show off some good things for their console, no one needs to pack any bags. This goes back to the pressure and expectations of E3, which directly ties to companies needing to show things very early. It's a comment born out of the depths of console wars, every gamer should be excited for E3 as an event and wanting to see what everyone brings to the gaming realm. Especially multi-platform gamers.

We're lucky to have such a large event dedicated to us, and thank god it seems to be returning to what it used to be, it's been poor as a show the last few years.

Edited June 2, 2009 by Audioboxer

[bob_c_b]

There's an easy solution for that. Don't announce it/show it. Do it only when you're ready.

So by this standard we should not have seen Natal or Milo yesterday (which I actually agree with), let alone Crackdown 2? Using your example, it was wrong for Sony to use hype for future products to carry it's E3 show the last couple years, so it's wrong for MS to do it as well.

Don't confuse what I am saying, Natal and Milo might both be awesome, but show them to me in a game that will A) reach retail soon and B) isn't aimed at the Wii crowd and they become relevant. Otherwise they are the same gimmicky rubbish that is on the Wii.

If all goes as rumored Sony will have a year of tangible software to show off, so this should be a good show.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

Oh I really hope Sony announce this new motion controller so you can eat your words Bob.

We all may as well give up and wait for you to give us your approval on what's relevant or not. Hell, why aren't you running the show at MS/Sony/Nintendo?

[Pheee]

I miss the conferences where they announce something that goes live right away, like when Microsoft announced Doom for XBLA and it was available to download that night. Alot of the things shown so far are coming Fall 2009 or Spring 2010, I know there is slow down of games before summer (Madden '10 starts the releases). But so far like Natal, no release date, so it might be something we see in 1 year or so, which does give time for other companies to also get something out.

On topic of CGI, These also shown sometimes really early to give their target on what the game will look like, but in 99% of cases, this will mean that the project has started, but there is nothing to show, so maybe not even a complete level.

I just remember Motorstorm devs did their trailer, and they worked hard to get it to look like the CGI trailer they took to Sony.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

I just remember Motorstorm devs did their trailer, and they worked hard to get it to look like the CGI trailer they took to Sony.

Probably more so the guys at Guerilla :laugh:

The amount of abuse they took for that CGI trailer was off the scale, you can bet they sweated blood to get Killzone 2 looking like it does :p

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

@Pheee, That's why I'm holding out for Battlefield 1943 releasing this week or next. If they are giving away codes at the show, then that means it's ready and live waiting to launch.

Unless it's just preload codes like betas/demos.

And yeah I think AB is right, you mean Killzone. Motorstorm was nowhere near the CGI trailer :laugh:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lo1Dkd8-QlU.swf

[bob_c_b]

Oh I really hope Sony announce this new motion controller so you can eat your words Bob.

We all may as well give up and wait for you to give us your approval on what's relevant or not. Hell, why aren't you running the show at MS/Sony/Nintendo?

LOL, whatever munky, I don't want to see a silly motion controller on the PS3 either and I promise I'll be just as negative about it if they show one today. You want to paint this as bias on my part but Natal is just as gimmicky as motion control on the Wii, I have yet to see a game that makes me want to use it.