spacer Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Natal, while cool and impressive, will never be as good or convient as a controller. Games like Devil May Cry, Ninja Gaiden, God of War, etc. would never benefit from these types of control schemes because they would be reduced to random gestures, and at that point you'd be moving just for the sake of moving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George P Global Moderator Posted June 4, 2009 Global Moderator Share Posted June 4, 2009 Natal, while cool and impressive, will never be as good or convient as a controller. Games like Devil May Cry, Ninja Gaiden, God of War, etc. would never benefit from these types of control schemes because they would be reduced to random gestures, and at that point you'd be moving just for the sake of moving. You wouldn't use it for that type of game, I don't get why people bring up these types of examples. Devs aren't idiots, they know that the controller is still needed for those type of button mashing combo filled action games. No one is saying you're going to use something like Natal for those. You use it where it makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacer Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 You wouldn't use it for that type of game, I don't get why people bring up these types of examples. Devs aren't idiots, they know that the controller is still needed for those type of button mashing combo filled action games. No one is saying you're going to use something like Natal for those.You use it where it makes sense. I realize that, but my comments refer to all the "this is going to change everything!" talk that's being spouted when people talk about Natal and the new PS3 motion capture stuff. It's cool, but it has limited uses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+chorpeac MVC Posted June 4, 2009 MVC Share Posted June 4, 2009 I wanna see the NATAL mixed with a pair of 3d glasses, then I'll play COD or any of those FPS on the 360. How about it lazy gamers, YOU HAVE TO GET UP AND BE IN THE ACTION. Yeah!!! I would love that! Until then, I will just keep upgrading my computer until I can get up and pretend to be in the battle for real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawkMan Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Why do people keep saying this. Nintendo can do the same thing. All they have to do is license gestureteks patents. This company has the same exact tech. Its the DEPTH sensor that what really does everything (makes sure that it only tracks you and nothing else). Yes this is cool tech but lets see if microsoft can release it soon and have the software to back it up. Remember nintendos biggest asset is its software not its hardware. PS I own everything microsoft except a 360 ,(not a first person shooter fan) even a microsoft made router. Why do people keep saying that. Seriusly did you even look at the gesturetech videos. it's not even close in quality or fidelity to NATAL. i - t's not able to properly distinguish the user form the enviroment. notice the giant halo around the player. as well as the part it thins is the enviroment and not the player. - Accuracy is not even close. it's jerky and has a very low resolution of the motion detection. - it's only a movement detector, essentially it sees stuff that moves, and guesses what body parts they are. It's not a proper motion capture tool like Natal. - it's depth perception is based solely on sizes, wich is very inaccurate unless you got a known object (like a glowing sphere on a stick). unlike Natal with stereo cameras that's just to start with, and those are just some of the basic differences and improvements of Natal over a basic gesture detector like Gesturetek. Of course the thing is Nintendo and sony can't just buy the base technology from gesturetek and improve it to be the same as Natal, since you can bet you royals that stereo cameras for motion detection and depth perception in a game system. and all varitions of those staments are patented. just like stereo camera Motion capture (what MS does is Motion capture, not motion detection, or motion control). This thing is probably so protected by patents that any hope sony or nintendo has of copying this is out the window. they simply have to go a different route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defiantly Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 All I know is that I'm gonna bust my old fat a$$ trying to play games with this thing. ...can't wait to see the look on my wife's face when she sees me diving behind my couch for cover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spenser.d Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Wow your talking about nintendo here. The one who has been making TONS of money , who has been outselling both microsoft and sony. A company that helped bring back gaming in the 80's. Have you even been to gestureteks website? They have the tech that does exactly what microsofts does. When I mean exact I mean exact. Microsofts camera for the 360 (the other one) was licensed from this company. I wouldnt doubt that the NATAL tech was licensed from this company also. Nintendos strongest asset is their software development. Wii sports made it big because of its simplicity . Your underestimating nitnendo. Also if microsoft was doing so well they wouldnt be having trouble in japan. Just go look at all the research nintendo did on the wii motion plus. Go read the newest iawata asks. they even did research on what would happen to the sensors if water got onto it. This natal thing shows microsoft rushed it or they would have had a real ready to release product to show off at e3. Microsoft said themselves they have no software for it yet. People are getting way ahead of themselves. It took Microsoft one generation, coming from nothing, to take away the hardcore market, a market that Sony had in it's back pocket. How they're doing in Japan is far less relevant than how they're doing as a whole, and they're doing fantastic. See HawkMan for the gesturetek comments. Also, I'd like to reiterate that Ninty has made no such implications towards creating any kind of controller-less gaming environment, so I don't even know how you can possibly consider that as an argument. I'm not underestimating Ninty - what they've done with the Wii is great and I applaud them. I love the Wii and play it with friends all the time. However if they don't come out with anything particularly new (Motion+ isn't that big of a development), they're going to sink. MS knows what it's doing and Natal is going to be serious competition. I also suppose that Ricochet, Paint, Milo, Burnout Paradise and, quite frankly, the dashboard don't all count as software that supports Natal already. Microsoft has said no such thing about not having software. Quite the opposite, actually - many developers have had their hands on Natal for months, and now all developers can get Natal kits. I'm sorry your precious Ninty is being threatened, but that's how competition works. -Spenser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 I'll see how it goes but I know for racing games using the wii remote SUCKS, I don't think this would be any better... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGeorge Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Natal looks awesome but I'm waiting for some putz, money grabbing company to file a patent infringement lawsuit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawkMan Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 This will clarify some recent discussions surrounding GestureTek in the 3D space. GestureTek is the inventor, pioneer and world leader in video gesture control technology for both 2D and 3D cameras. Our software works with 3DV, Mesa, Prime Sense, Canesta and other 3D depth cameras. For more than 20 years, we have been creating 3D tracking technology and evangelizing video gesture control as the next step in computer human interaction. With more than 4000 public installations worldwide, we have a robust library of video gesture control technologies, applications and patents. GestureTek has licensed these patents and technologies in various ways to a multitude of consumer electronics providers, including for PlayStation, Xbox 360, Hasbro, etc. GestureTek is proud of the trail we’ve blazed in the area of 3D depth tracking and control and our current leading position in the market today. Here’s more on GestureTek’s 3D tracking and control software: http://www.gesturetek.com/3ddepth/introduction.php . Here are some examples of work that GestureTek was showing more than a year ago, before Natal: - Beijing Olympics Flight Simulator http://www.gesturetek.com/3ddepth/business.../3dexplorer.php - Two-Handed Control Driving Demo http://www.gesturetek.com/newscenter/media.php?media=58 - Rock em Sock em Robots http://www.gesturetek.com/3ddepth/introduction.php - Our technology is also being used in a 3D depth sensing interactive digital signage system for Sprint. yes.... your point being.... gesturetek is what powers the PS3 camera motion detection and the old Xbox 360 camera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahhell Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 yes.... your point being....gesturetek is what powers the PS3 camera motion detection and the old Xbox 360 camera I think her point is that she works/shills for the company so she is providing some additional ad-formation to the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maash Posted June 5, 2009 Author Share Posted June 5, 2009 Natal Myths Dispelled http://360.kombo.com/article.php?artid=16580 1. Natal cannot do multiplayer "We appeared on screen as simplified, mutli-jointed stick figure skeletons within silhouettes of our bodies. It clearly saw us as separate people. There would be no problem, he said, for the system to support a game that let us play at the same time and track our movements separately." 2. you can get away with driving Burnout one handed "I guessed that it was reading my hands as a single unit moving in space and that it wouldn't be programmed to know or care if I put one hand behind my back. It did. When I put my hand behind my back and just waved one hand in front of the TV, the Burnout car failed to steer. The Natal needed to see two hands. Maybe it's cooler to drive one-handed, but Natal not letting me do it was impressive in its own way." 3. Natal doesnt work in low light conditions Another thought was that Natal would have to be played in bright light, but the dim illumination of the hotel rooms, barring Molyneux's own Milo demo room, would seem to prove otherwise. 4. Natal cannot do finger tracking Finally, Totilo also thought that while Project Natal could pick up a wide range of body movements, finer movements (such as those by individual fingers) would not be picked up. And while the demo in use did not provide actual proof of the concept, using a short stick to represent each hand, Tsunoda claimed such detection was actually possible, "though the sensitivity would be different at different distances." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahhell Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Natal Myths Dispelled It's a ****ing prototype. At least you aren't swinging around a dildo like with Sony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George P Global Moderator Posted June 5, 2009 Global Moderator Share Posted June 5, 2009 It's a ****ing prototype.At least you aren't swinging around a dildo like with Sony. His post did well to show how it's not limited like some might have thought. Be it multiplayer or finer finger movements. The hardware can do it, it's up to the software side to do it's job as well now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tatiania Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 I wonder how or if it would work for a person like me? As some of you know already, I'm a quadriplegic and on a ventilator.. basically, I'm paralyzed from the neck down and have a machine supplying me air thru a tube connected to a hole in my throat(just like Superman, Christopher Reeves). Would be sweet if adapted to a PC where I could map certain facial and head movements plus different vocalazations and words to control the PC's OS, games, apps, internet, media, ect. ect. Tatiania Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGlassPrison Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 It's a ****ing prototype.At least you aren't swinging around a dildo like with Sony. Haha I agree Those wands look absolutely ridiculous Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahhell Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 I wonder how or if it would work for a person like me? As some of you know already, I'm a quadriplegic and on a ventilator.. basically, I'm paralyzed from the neck down and have a machine supplying me air thru a tube connected to a hole in my throat(just like Superman, Christopher Reeves).Would be sweet if adapted to a PC where I could map certain facial and head movements plus different vocalazations and words to control the PC's OS, games, apps, internet, media, ect. ect. Tatiania You should contact Microsoft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maash Posted June 6, 2009 Author Share Posted June 6, 2009 I wonder how or if it would work for a person like me? As some of you know already, I'm a quadriplegic and on a ventilator.. basically, I'm paralyzed from the neck down and have a machine supplying me air thru a tube connected to a hole in my throat(just like Superman, Christopher Reeves).Would be sweet if adapted to a PC where I could map certain facial and head movements plus different vocalazations and words to control the PC's OS, games, apps, internet, media, ect. ect. Tatiania I think you should contact MS about that but I really think if Wii was the start of the revolution and natal is the evolution, then the mind reader is the next gen after natal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riz360 Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 Did anyone else find it funny that the unit wasn't shown so it does just look like a bunch of guys in a room focusing really hard on making weird body movements. It's a hoax I tell ya! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George P Global Moderator Posted June 6, 2009 Global Moderator Share Posted June 6, 2009 Did anyone else find it funny that the unit wasn't shown so it does just look like a bunch of guys in a room focusing really hard on making weird body movements.It's a hoax I tell ya! They have shown pics of what the finished unit looks like. But the prototype they're using behind closed doors looks way different I'm sure. Hell, anyone remember what the original PS3 dev units looked like? Nothing like the later hardware. They just don't want to give anything more away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emn1ty Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 Driving games like Burnout would suit this tech well, but how would it work with something like COD4? Think more along the lines of a First Person recreation. The way your head moves in relation to your feet and body would determine where you are positioned behind cover. You could even go so far as to have custom hand-signals, etc. Even force players to utilize such covert methods through proximity voice chat. This kind of thing would work even better for Splinter Cell, seeing as a person would have to ACTUALLY be quiet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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