goji Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 I would love to have the ability to create my own jumplist or shortcuts of frequently used applications to clear up clutter. I know, two separate concepts which clash with what the super actually does. I would activate quick launch and recreate what I had in XP (which was great) however when you set the icons to large to match the large superbar icons, it increase the size of the bar :hmmm: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
profets Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 What always bothered me with it is I have several shortcuts to actual applications on the network, and i'm unable to pin those. before 7, I just used quicklaunch with about shortcuts for about 10 applications that i used daily at work. I was pretty excited with the new superbar in 7, since i can just pin the apps that i'm always using, but theres still several that are on the network and cannot be pinned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qdave Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 I actually dont have a problem with not-pining any app. One thing i would love though is show desktop on the left side, like it was in previous versions of windows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
excalpius Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 Yeah I missed that fact as well, owing to the fact that it's nonsense, unless you have the source? Yeah, 30 years of working with PC users...and no IT person here will challenge this. 8) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
excalpius Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 I actually dont have a problem with not-pining any app. One thing i would love though is show desktop on the left side, like it was in previous versions of windows. Agreed. At least give us a toggle preference/option. It's counterintuitive to put is as far away from "where the action is" on the taskbar. Let's face it, the system tray is no man's land... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
excalpius Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 I would love to have the ability to create my own jumplist or shortcuts of frequently used applications to clear up clutter. I know, two separate concepts which clash with what the super actually does. Yeah, this is why, on all of my Vista and Windows 7 machines, I've replaced the taskbar functionality with a couple of docks, one on the bottom for applications, links, stacks, etc. and one one the left which has large live thumbnails of whatever is running. The system tray functionality is on another dock hidden offscreen, since it's useless until you actually want to make a change or access such things. I assume Stardock (or other dock vendors) will add the jumplist functionality to their icons/shortcuts, so I won't be doing without it for long. AND I still get all the intuitive drag and drop ANYTHING functionality I have come to rely on. It's kind of an Amiga/Mac/PC hybrid, but it works for me better than either the taskbar or superbar...and with no compromises to my workflow - and I'm on this machine 20 hours a day. 8P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-KJ Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 Yeah I missed that fact as well, owing to the fact that it's nonsense, unless you have the source? You need a source for this? Go out there and poll people and you will find many that are clueless. That should be source enough for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calum Veteran Posted June 11, 2009 Veteran Share Posted June 11, 2009 Thats quite a lot of work for something MS should include out of the box. I really don't care for the degree of tunnel vision the superbar has for applications and not content. I agree :) The Start menu allows any content (not just applications), the Desktop allows any content (not just applications)... therefore, why shouldn't the taskbar is the user so wishes? I understand there is a limited amount of space, for some people, on the taskbar -that's why I wouldn't use it for anything other than applications - however, for consistencies sake and the fact that others would use it for websites and things, it should be allowed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gigapixels Veteran Posted June 11, 2009 Veteran Share Posted June 11, 2009 I guess you missed the fact that 99% of Windows users don't know the difference between an Application Shortcut and a URL Shortcut...you know, the same people who think uninstalling a program is deleting the shortcut off of their desktop.This is going to be a HUGE learning curve problem with normal home user upgraders to Windows 7. I know average users very well -- I'm not missing anything. What I said has nothing to do with how the users will react to it, simply what it was meant to be for from the developer's standpoint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
excalpius Posted June 12, 2009 Share Posted June 12, 2009 ... simply what it was meant to be for from the developer's standpoint. Understood. But good and modern software design is about both what the developers intended and how the users will ultimately use it. Calum's post above covers this point EXCELLENTLY. Bravo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kheldorin Posted June 12, 2009 Share Posted June 12, 2009 I agree :)The Start menu allows any content (not just applications), the Desktop allows any content (not just applications)... therefore, why shouldn't the taskbar is the user so wishes? I understand there is a limited amount of space, for some people, on the taskbar -that's why I wouldn't use it for anything other than applications - however, for consistencies sake and the fact that others would use it for websites and things, it should be allowed. You only need consistency when they are supposed to be conceptually similar and serve similar functions. The taskbar is conceptually different from the Desktop and the start menu. And thus it should BE different. That's why they call it the task bar because that's what it specializes in - Applications/tasks. You're not supposed to dump your files and shortcuts there and thus diluting and killing it's main function. You don't need 10 pinned pdf files there when one pdf icon + jumplist would suffice. It's the same for web links and what nots. Speaking of jumplists, if you allow such a behavior the purpose the jumplist would be killed as well. The real test of consistency is to see whether a person NOT used to your configuration would understand wth is going on in your taskbar. And I believe, it is easier to understand if eveyone sticks to the "jumplists for links and taskbar for tasks" philosophy. Understood. But good and modern software design is about both what the developers intended and how the users will ultimately use it.Calum's post above covers this point EXCELLENTLY. Bravo. I don't see how it does. People will clutter and abuse the taskbar just as they have abused the desktop just as they have abused the C: directory just as they have abused the default admin just as they have abused the .... The list goes on and on. I'm not saying that MS should go the Apple route and be minimalistic but it is good to restrict users to good design principles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calum Veteran Posted June 12, 2009 Veteran Share Posted June 12, 2009 (edited) I know average users very well -- I'm not missing anything. What I said has nothing to do with how the users will react to it, simply what it was meant to be for from the developer's standpoint. You only need consistency when they are supposed to be conceptually similar and serve similar functions. The taskbar is conceptually different from the Desktop and the start menu. And thus it should BE different. That's why they call it the task bar because that's what it specializes in - Applications/tasks. You're not supposed to dump your files and shortcuts there and thus diluting and killing it's main function. You don't need 10 pinned pdf files there when one pdf icon + jumplist would suffice. It's the same for web links and what nots. Speaking of jumplists, if you allow such a behavior the purpose the jumplist would be killed as well. The real test of consistency is to see whether a person NOT used to your configuration would understand wth is going on in your taskbar. And I believe, it is easier to understand if eveyone sticks to the "jumplists for links and taskbar for tasks" philosophy. Whilst I understand what the purpose of the taskbar is and why it's called the taskbar, I don't understand why this UI element can't evolve with the times and with user's needs? Why should it always serve the purpose it was developed for, with no room to change? Other elements of the operating system and other programs have evolved to suit users' needs. The taskbar could be renamed and used as a central hub to launch any website or application, after all, websites are applications too. Technically, they are - I'm a developer, so I know. Allowing the user to pin files to the actual taskbar should not be allowed because that is what jumplists are for - you pin files to the jumplist of their respective program; however, pinning websites and programs should be allowed as they are both applications anyway (a website is a web application) and there would be an intuitive way to do this so as not to confuse the average user. If users don't understand, or want to use, this functionality, then they could use the taskbar in the same way they do now. I don't see how it does. People will clutter and abuse the taskbar just as they have abused the desktop just as they have abused the C: directory just as they have abused the default admin just as they have abused the .... The list goes on and on. I'm not saying that MS should go the Apple route and be minimalistic but it is good to restrict users to good design principles. I also hate the way users abuse features by not understanding them, but I don't think this would happen if the user simply was allowed to pin websites as well as applications. Understood. But good and modern software design is about both what the developers intended and how the users will ultimately use it.Calum's post above covers this point EXCELLENTLY. Bravo. Thank you :) I think it makes sense. I originally said files should not be able to be pinned, but, if implemented well, I don't see how this could cause problems either. Edited June 12, 2009 by Calum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Ba'al Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 Whilst I understand what the purpose of the taskbar is and why it's called the taskbar, I don't understand why this UI element can't evolve with the times and with user's needs? Why should it always serve the purpose it was developed for, with no room to change? That's because some developers are that deep within their lofty ideas and concepts, they've completely lost touch with reality and actual usability. They think the way they intended it to work is the only proper way to do it and won't tolerate any other way to do it, even if they may be better. Furthermore, they often forget that the way they think is best to do something can be quite different from the way Joe Average would do things. A good developer shouldn't dictate the average user to only do things the way he thinks it's best. Rather, he should try to feel himself into Joe Average, and the way Joe Average would choose to get things done, and then realise it that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kheldorin Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 Whilst I understand what the purpose of the taskbar is and why it's called the taskbar, I don't understand why this UI element can't evolve with the times and with user's needs? Why should it always serve the purpose it was developed for, with no room to change? Because there is no need to. Since the other UI elements are able to fulfill these needs just as well if not better. You're a developer right? So you know that in a good design a class is supposed to fulfill a specific function. You do not cram every single functionality into a single class. The taskbar could be renamed and used as a central hub to launch any website or application, after all, websites are applications too. Technically, they are - I'm a developer, so I know. Allowing the user to pin files to the actual taskbar should not be allowed because that is what jumplists are for - you pin files to the jumplist of their respective program; however, pinning websites and programs should be allowed as they are both applications anyway (a website is a web application) and there would be an intuitive way to do this so as not to confuse the average user. I was actually responding to the "icon" part of the title topic which meant any sort of link which includes files and so on. So I understand that you want to make a special case just for websites? But not all websites are applications are they? A website at it's most basic level can sometimes be no better than a text file. From the perspective of the OS, a website is not an application. And I guess, this can be anecdotal but in my experience, thinking that a website as an application is not something the average user would typically do. "Does your computer have Neowin?" "Can it run Neowin?" It is something that has an address, somewhere where they visit. Viewing a website as an application is more of for those who thinks that the browser is the OS of the future and they are far far from the average user. If users don't understand, or want to use, this functionality, then they could use the taskbar in the same way they do now.I also hate the way users abuse features by not understanding them, but I don't think this would happen if the user simply was allowed to pin websites as well as applications. But the thing is people don't know that they don't understand. It's like a newbie programmer making every variable public and sacrificing good design choices for convenience. They want to do everything so they want every variable accessible. "OMG! This API programmer is stupid for making this variable inaccessible"" when in fact there is a better way to do what the noob programmer wants to do without having the need to access the variable. Ultimately, I don't understand why is it so hard to use the jumplists for websites. It promotes better workflow. How should the jumplist for a websites look and function like anyway? And don't tell me, there isn't one because then, where is the consistency? Which is why I'm all for the pinning of stuff like the Gmail Notifier because they really are applications based on the web and the taskbar enforces that requirement but definitely not for links to websites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unawave Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 Yes, we can ... Pin folder to taskbar Pin URL to taskbar Pin shared network folder to taskbar Use this "how to" to pin folder to taskbar Replace "path to folder" with: "%SystemDrive%\Program Files\Internet Explorer\iexplore.exe" https://www.neowin.net/ to pin URL to taskbar Replace "path to folder" with UNC path: \\<pc-name>\<shared-folder-name> to pin shared network folder to taskbar See here: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts