Xbox 360 Maxed out, PS3 isn't


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Has this guy ever heard of Forza 3? I suppose he might be right if he said the 360 is approaching it's limits but to say it's already maxed out is obviously incorrect when we see a game coming out in four months that's clearly doing things that haven't already been done on the console.

There are still a lot of cool games coming out in the next six months (Left 4 Dead 2, Forza 3, Mass Effect 2, Alan Wake, Halo ODST) for the 360 and these games don't HAVE to have better graphics than their predecessors to be hits and sell systems, although it would be nice.

Let's not forget the least graphically capable system is winning the race.

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Alan wake hopefully does not feel like a console port.

Are you a broken record man? Getting really tired of reading the same replies from you over and over.

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If you want my 2 cents MS will be investing more in 1st party studios going forward, either by buying/bringing some young pre-existing dev teams into MS' wings, or by creating some new studios from scratch. I don't think they'll chase after massive studios, that will cost too much, look at EA trying to buy Take 2.
I think that "investing" is the key word here. We're going to see more cases where Microsoft is taking a 49% stake in a development studio instead of buying them out completely. It seems like Bungie has been a success story in this respect, as was Rare when Nintendo was a major investor (but not whole owner), I believe that Rockstar/Take 2 is another example of this but I'm not certain (there is at least a poison pill in that situation where Rockstar doesn't go along if Take 2 gets sold). Being able to keep the key founders of the company in place and doing what they love, and then having an exclusive option to publish their games seems to be the wave of the past that's returning in the present and moving on into the future.

Another big example of something similar is EA Partners, signing exclusive publishing deals with high profile dev houses without necessarily buying them out.

Of course, the risk there is that your partners become someone else's wholly-owned subsidiary.

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I think that "investing" is the key word here. We're going to see more cases where Microsoft is taking a 49% stake in a development studio instead of buying them out completely. It seems like Bungie has been a success story in this respect, as was Rare when Nintendo was a major investor (but not whole owner), I believe that Rockstar/Take 2 is another example of this but I'm not certain (there is at least a poison pill in that situation where Rockstar doesn't go along if Take 2 gets sold). Being able to keep the key founders of the company in place and doing what they love, and then having an exclusive option to publish their games seems to be the wave of the past that's returning in the present and moving on into the future.

Another big example of something similar is EA Partners, signing exclusive publishing deals with high profile dev houses without necessarily buying them out.

Of course, the risk there is that your partners become someone else's wholly-owned subsidiary.

I think that's a viable option but for once I truly think MS are going to become more aggressive at owning their own studios, not %'s in studios, not chucking wads of cash at studios to hold back PS3 ports, etc.

They've become too successful now with the Xbox brand to carry on ignoring developing 1st party, and relying on 3rd party. It's one of things that Sony currently has a 1UP on them regardless of PS3/360 sales or amount of exclusives. Sony have a much larger internal team meaning more true exclusives and games that arguably push hardware limits quicker than 3rd parties can.

MS have had a love/hate relationship with Rare since acquiring them (they've not put out enough AAA games), I think as I outlined above you'll see them focussing on new raw talent and unheard ofs, then nuturing them in preperation for the next Xbox/generation, as opposed to spending big bucks on existing studios.

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Those people just need to get with the program and buy a damn hard drive. I dont know why microsoft even bothered with the non-hard drive systems to begin with. Its stupid and all it has done is limit what the developers can do with the games. They need to come out with a bigger drive that hold multiple terrabytes of data before they start with all the game downloads. Then all you have to do is sign into xbox live to download the rest of the game that way developers dont have to hold back on games.

Multiple terabytes? The biggest HDD out there is only 2 terabytes, so the biggest HDD possible for the 360 is 2 terabytes. I can't imagine how expensive that would be, could you really imagine selling that at retail? They're currently around ?200-?300 at retail, and with Microsoft generally adding even more onto hard drive prices, I could imagine that being around ?350.

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MS have had a love/hate relationship with Rare since acquiring them (they've not put out enough AAA games), I think as I outlined above you'll see them focussing on new raw talent and unheard ofs, then nuturing them in preperation for the next Xbox/generation, as opposed to spending big bucks on existing studios.
Rare's done a lot better on the 360 than they did on Xbox for sure.

I mean, they had two launch games, one of which sold a huge number of units, and the other of which (Kameo) was a great game that just didn't seem to find a market. Then they created the Viva Pinata IP which is clearly going to be an evergreen property for Microsoft, it's just going to come back every year as a Kart Racer or Party Game or whatever they decide they need at the moment. Banjo Nuts & Bolts is a great title (again perhaps looking for a market), and they've done a good job exploiting their older titles on XBLA as well (Jetpack, Banjo 1/2, and Perfect Dark coming up, I can only hope for Jet Force Gemini). And word on the street was that Rare created the entire Avatar system.

They do seem to have pretty much turned things around on the productivity side. It'll be interesting to see what they do a year or two down the road now that Peter Molyneux has become the nominal head of all the European MGS studios.

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They do seem to have pretty much turned things around on the productivity side. It'll be interesting to see what they do a year or two down the road now that Peter Molyneux has become the nominal head of all the European MGS studios.

Yup, that piece of news was very important and it will change things in the future definitely for the better :)

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MS, as everyone should know by now, moves slow and steady. They could run out and start buying up studios left and right with the cash pile they have, but they're not in any rush atm. Winning away the big name 3rd party exclusives from Sony this gen was, imo, the master plan from the start, and it's working.

Next up they'll take the next step with the ZuneHD and 360 tie-in. If the ZuneHD can play XBLA and XNA community created games so you can take them with you, then it's another master step.

After that, I wouldn't be surprised if MS does add more dev studios to it's first party lineup quick. With Molyneux taking over in Europe, that's the next stage of the fight with Sony. Outside of Japan, the EU is where the playstation is still doing well. So that bit of news just fits into the grand scheme of things going on.

Next year i'm pretty sure we'll hear of more 1st party exclusives outside of Halo and Alan Wake that we know about already. I'd even bet on it.

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MS, as everyone should know by now, moves slow and steady.

I always thought MS is moving at the speed of light compared to Sony and Nintendo.

They are always late to the market, but they move blisteringly fast once they are there, relying on the power of money :D

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I always thought MS is moving at the speed of light compared to Sony and Nintendo.

They are always late to the market, but they move blisteringly fast once they are there, relying on the power of money :D

Well, they move fast in terms of acquiring outside talent to meet their goals. Internalize companies instead of just licensing in a lot of cases. They're still new to hardware though. When they started developing the Xbox, they had to go to their devices division (whose experience was making mice and keyboards) for production advice.

Microsoft also has the long reputation of being a "version 2.0/3.0" company. The first edition is functional, the second edition is massively refined. You see it in the 360 vs the Xbox, you see it in Live 2 vs Live 1 (on the Xbox), you see it in the newer 360s vs the launch units.

Iteration is something they are really good at.

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hmm with 3 cores doing 6 threads how can the 360 be maxed out when equivalent pc's arent? ISnt it just a matter of figuring out how to do thing s in cpu that the video card cant do since it maybe the video card thats maxed out?

I just dont see how the ps3 or the 360 can be maxed out with all the cpu power they both have.

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Microsoft also has the long reputation of being a "version 2.0/3.0" company. The first edition is functional, the second edition is massively refined. You see it in the 360 vs the Xbox, you see it in Live 2 vs Live 1 (on the Xbox), you see it in the newer 360s vs the launch units.

Very true - They definitely also seem to be one of the few companies who actually listens to costumers, especially when it comes to feature requests. Certain other companies seem to care more about pushing their crap rather than focusing on the audience.

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seeing as how these consoles are supposed to last 10 years then i think the xbox will hit a wall with its dvd drive - which mine for some reason wont open anymore :( so i can only play LIVE games and tomb raider!

the ps3 (i have the 80gb one) may also hit a wall, as the storage over 10 years might not be enough! - the hdd that is.

while the blu-ray may have the storage and all, but some games like Bourne want to install stuff on your hdd for some reason!

unlike the older generation you could simply buy another memory card, this generation ppl wont be buying extra hdd's!

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seeing as how these consoles are supposed to last 10 years then i think the xbox will hit a wall with its dvd drive - which mine for some reason wont open anymore :( so i can only play LIVE games and tomb raider!

I agree that this is a potential wall out there, but I think that the digital delivery system that Microsoft is rolling out this fall for retail 360 games is an end run around that. There's also the point that no matter what you've only got 512megs of unified system memory, this is the fundamental issue behind texture pop-in, you have to grapple with only having so much memory, and optimize loading so that it's not obvious to the user when it's happening.

Ironically, PS3 is even more limited in this regard since it has segmented memory. Total is the same, but on 360 you can apportion it however you want, while on the PS3 you only have 256megs of higher speed RAM available to the video unit.

The upper limits of each system are going to be based on how well people offload GPU preparation processes to the SPUs in the PS3 and how well people leverage the ability of the GPU in the 360 to procedurally generate content. They have similar capabilities in that regard, but the approach behind them is fundamentally different.

You should get that drive looked at, BTW. You should be able to eject it manually though. Maybe you've got some crap stuck in it that's preventing it from ejecting normally. Do you get any noise from the drive mechanism if you hit the eject button?

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the ps3 (i have the 80gb one) may also hit a wall, as the storage over 10 years might not be enough! - the hdd that is.

while the blu-ray may have the storage and all, but some games like Bourne want to install stuff on your hdd for some reason!

unlike the older generation you could simply buy another memory card, this generation ppl wont be buying extra hdd's!

you can easily upgrade the ps3 HDD, any notebook hdd you can get an 500gb hdd for 90 dollars, if you want smaller it only gets cheaper

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you can easily upgrade the ps3 HDD, any notebook hdd you can get an 500gb hdd for 90 dollars, if you want smaller it only gets cheaper

yeah thats true, but i meant the average usage.....

@dead_monkey, i think the drive is just dead, it does open sometimes and when it does it takes a while to open fully and then takes a while to close........possibly needs replacing :(

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yeah thats true, but i meant the average usage.....

I think even below average users can manage a philips screw driver and 3 buttons to push. Average users can probably even handle doing a back up of their PS3, instaling the new drive, and restore. At least judging from some of the discussions on the offical PS3 forums about the topic.

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I think even below average users can manage a philips screw driver and 3 buttons to push. Average users can probably even handle doing a back up of their PS3, instaling the new drive, and restore. At least judging from some of the discussions on the offical PS3 forums about the topic.

to be fair this is an IT forum.....

and if that were true half the ppl at pcworld and other stores that have pc repair etc would be out of work!

anyway my point being if it was the ps3: then the HDD will at some point become the problem, as it will limit the user more COMPARED to the xbox360 where the drive would limit users (and developers) more....

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Average users can probably even handle doing a back up of their PS3, instaling the new drive, and restore. At least judging from some of the discussions on the offical PS3 forums about the topic.

Average users don't visit the PS3 forums. Average users struggle to go on-line or even connect a controller.

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Average users don't visit the PS3 forums. Average users struggle to go on-line or even connect a controller.

Wait, what?

"Average" users struggle to use the internet or push a button on a controller?

You understand the term average means the typical user of said product?

I wonder how all these millions of people buying ipods/iphones manage to use itunes or buy digital content if they struggle to go online...

I'm sorry but people who can't go online or turn on a controller aren't average users, they're completely tech and common sense deprived.

I struggle to understand why forum users give absolutely no credit to anyone unless they have thousands of posts on a forum or overclock CPUs/Memory and download windows 7 betas.

Not one person I know in my family/friends would "struggle" to turn on a controller, or "struggle" to use the internet. Some may be slower than others, maybe need to read/experiment a little, but those two things you listed are about as basic as you can get.

Sorry for the rant, but it boggles my mind in todays world how little credit people on forums pour on the masses just because they don't spend hours a day/week on an online forum. There are newbies out there, but theres far more "average" users than you think able to do basic things with the technology they own.

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Wait, what?

"Average" users struggle to use the internet or push a button on a controller?

You understand the term average means the typical user of said product?

I wonder how all these millions of people buying ipods/iphones manage to use itunes or buy digital content if they struggle to go online...

I'm sorry but people who can't go online or turn on a controller aren't average users, they're completely tech and common sense deprived.

I struggle to understand why forum users give absolutely no credit to anyone unless they have thousands of posts on a forum or overclock CPUs/Memory and download windows 7 betas.

Not one person I know in my family/friends would "struggle" to turn on a controller, or "struggle" to use the internet. Some may be slower than others, maybe need to read/experiment a little, but those two things you listed are about as basic as you can get.

Sorry for the rant, but it boggles my mind in todays world how little credit people on forums pour on the masses just because they don't spend hours a day/week on an online forum. There are newbies out there, but theres far more "average" users than you think able to do basic things with the technology they own.

I was talking console related. It's sad, but that's what your average user looks like.

Configuring the PS3 to go online (which is just connecting a cable...) is confusing to many. And there's a lot of people who don't know that the controller requires USB sync in order for it to work. These are the "average" users.

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I was talking console related. It's sad, but that's what your average user looks like.

Configuring the PS3 to go online (which is just connecting a cable...) is confusing to many. And there's a lot of people who don't know that the controller requires USB sync in order for it to work. These are the "average" users.

These consoles come with adequate documentation for the tasks you've listed. The PS3 online is automatic if you tell it to do the settings automatically.

And you're still going to tell me 20+ million PS3/360 owners struggle to use their controller? The PS3 on screen tells you to connect your controller with the USB cable if it needs to be.

People who struggle with the above excessively are not "average users".

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These consoles come with adequate documentation for the tasks you've listed. The PS3 online is automatic if you tell it to do the settings automatically.

And you're still going to tell me 20+ million PS3/360 owners struggle to use their controller? The PS3 on screen tells you to connect your controller with the USB cable if it needs to be.

People who struggle with the above excessively are not "average users".

Well, the truth is I've seen these things happen. These people exist, and they're not just a few.

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Well, the truth is I've seen these things happen. These people exist, and they're not just a few.

Of course they exist, but these people are not average users in context with the simple actions you're talking about.

For someone to seriously struggle to use a gaming controller they most certainly are not an average gamer, they must never have seen, touched or used a games console in their life, let alone a TV remote with buttons.

Setting up the internet may take some a little longer than picking up a controller, but most average users will just read the manual, experiment a little and use what knowledge they have to get a internet cable plugged into their console and plug it into their router...

The basic functionality of almost everything nowadays is plug and play then read on screen/printed instructions if that's viable.

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