Shayla Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 (May-Welby said: 'The concepts of man or woman don't fit me. The simplest solution is not to have any sex identification') A British expat who claims to have no gender is thought to have become the first person to be officially recognised as neither male or female. Norrie May-Welby, 48, was born a man but had a sex change operation in 1990, at the age of 28. After becoming unhappy as a woman, May-Welby decided to become a ?neuter?. The 48-year-old is now officially recognised as a person of no specific gender. May-Welby emigrated to Australia at the age of seven after being born in Paisley, Renfrewshire. Officials there altered the Briton?s birth certificate to include the new no-gender classification after doctors were apparently unable to determine the sex of the expat?s body. May-Welby said: ?The concepts of man or woman don?t fit me. The simplest solution is not to have any sex identification.? The UK?s Gender Trust welcomed the case. A spokesman said: ?Many people like the idea of being genderless.? Source : Telegraph Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acnpt Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 Creepy, reminds me of Gary Glitter. -Vivicidal- 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCordRm Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 I disagree completely. Gender certainly does matter. I would much rather sleep with a real woman that pretends to get off than an ex-man (ooooo, see what I did there?) that really does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mad_onion Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 If it doesn't want to have a sex then it doesn't have to. I don't see why anyone would have a problem with that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solixis Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 If it doesn't want to have a sex then it doesn't have to. I don't see why anyone would have a problem with that I actually LOL'ed when I read that haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InterceptorX Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 So what happens if you get in a bad accident and your penis and testicles get removed? Are you genderless then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 While this naysexual concept is interesting, it is also silly. No matter how butchered, you either have a hole or a pole. What does he have down there that cannot be classed into either category, a swirl? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InterceptorX Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 While this naysexual concept is interesting, it is also silly. No matter how butchered, you either have a hole or a pole. What does he have down there that cannot be classed into either category, a swirl? lol, a swirl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurë Veteran Posted March 16, 2010 Veteran Share Posted March 16, 2010 Seems quite cool to me. Gender has less and less importance as society moves to being more equal. I would like to know how it's even justified for being on a passport since they have a name and photo to identify you with... The criteria for what makes a "real" man or "real" woman can be quite vague, and most people probably have different ideas about this. With so many people in biological and psychological grey areas, it hardly makes sense to insist on the black and white male/female and it certainly isn't fair on those people who don't neatly fit into either category. And there are plenty of people who do not neatly fit into either male or female when you look only at biology (nevermind the hugely complex psychological and social aspects). There are men with extra 'X' chromosomes, and women who are genetically male but didn't respond to testosterone, and people born with both sets of organs, etc etc. I disagree completely. Gender certainly does matter. I would much rather sleep with a real woman that pretends to get off than an ex-man (ooooo, see what I did there?) that really does. Just because something matters to you is no basis to assume that it matters to anyone else. Plenty of people do not care about gender, and your personal requirement that someone be a "real" woman, by whatever set of criteria you hold, before you will deign to sleep with them, should not have any bearing on what another person can do with their body. No one is asking you to sleep with this person, or evaluate them in any sexual way, so quite where that judgement comes from is quite mysterious. I guess it's because that's all females are there for, right, to be your personal sex objects? Hopefully that's not how you really think but it certainly looks that way when your first thought is whether you would have sex with someone. :pinch: Kirkburn 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurë Veteran Posted March 16, 2010 Veteran Share Posted March 16, 2010 So what happens if you get in a bad accident and your penis and testicles get removed? Are you genderless then? Gender is about more than just your biology. A huge component really is just whether you feel male or female, how you dress, act, your name, etc, etc. I don't think losing your genitals would stop you being a man any more than mastectomies and hysterectomies make a woman genderless (though obviously there could be huge psychological consquences for these things). While this naysexual concept is interesting, it is also silly. No matter how butchered, you either have a hole or a pole. What does he have down there that cannot be classed into either category, a swirl? Hardly. If a man has his genitals removed, do they *have* to make a vagina? Of course not. If a woman were to have her reproductive organs and labia removed/sewn up, would she *have* to have a penis put in place? Of course not. You need something to pee out, that is all, and I'm sure you realise women don't urinate via their vagina.. :p Kirkburn 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamrunfc1 Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 It is a pity some commentators here choose to make light of this individuals situation. I am not a moraliser, but: We all have a sexual drive. This is required so that there is population growth/stability. The pleasure of the sex act is the incentive to mate and multiply. Hijack the pleasure aspect of the sexual act and ignore the real purpose, and trouble is guaranteed. Sex as addiction is not joke. Because laying down a rule whereby sex = happiness is a flawed recipe. What happens between one 'satisfying' sexual act and another, between one fix and another. Don't even go there. That is the bad news. The good news is that we are all in this together, struggling throughout life with our sexual demons (keeping in mind always that MONOGAMY IS NOT A FACT OF LIFE and anyone who claims otherwise is a liar, very religious (wow!) or liviing in cuckoo-land. All this is called the Human Condition, no way out, all in the same boat. Many find it difficult to cope with their drives and take to drugs, alcohol, dangerous sexual activities, irresponsible behaviour, etc. This person's (genderless) story sounds familiar. He was unhappy as a man (see above). He decided to be a woman, hoping for what exactly? and that didn't work out (be careful what you pray for, it might come to pass.....). So he wanted another change and went for the neutral (sounds like a lesson in Latin syntax, this). He cannot cope with his sexuality, whatever it is so he shops around. So, male, female, neuter. Possibly last stop because there are no other genders. Unless we discover some dead language on clay tablets that had more genders beyond the neutral. Some hope!! So if neutrality does not come up trumps, where does one turn to next? The animal kingdom? They have sex drives too from what I understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCordRm Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 Just because something matters to you is no basis to assume that it matters to anyone else. Plenty of people do not care about gender, and your personal requirement that someone be a "real" woman, by whatever set of criteria you hold, before you will deign to sleep with them, should not have any bearing on what another person can do with their body. No one is asking you to sleep with this person, or evaluate them in any sexual way, so quite where that judgement comes from is quite mysterious. I guess it's because that's all females are there for, right, to be your personal sex objects? Hopefully that's not how you really think but it certainly looks that way when your first thought is whether you would have sex with someone. :pinch: Did I not make it clear I was talking about MY opinion? At what point did you decide I was speaking for everyone? As for "real", I define it as what your were born as. If you were born screwed up, then call a spade a spade. We don't call retards geniuses just to make them feel better about being born retards. And as for women being sexual objects... you're damn right they are. Women get to talk about looking for Mr. Tall, Dark and Handsome, so I get to look for short, busty and born a woman. iamwhoiam 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandor Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 anyone else lolling at the passport mockup? enjoying the totally invalid picture shoop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Growled Member Posted March 17, 2010 Member Share Posted March 17, 2010 That seems very strange to me. What do I know, huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itzwolf Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 Just seems creepy to me. You are what you are born with/as. If you change it you still were born a specific gender male or female, you're just now non authentic and posing as something else. :wacko: While this naysexual concept is interesting, it is also silly. No matter how butchered, you either have a hole or a pole. What does he have down there that cannot be classed into either category, a swirl? I LOL'd hard at this. :rofl: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Montage Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 Officials there altered the Briton?s birth certificate to include the new no-gender classification Whoah... NO! It was born as a male, birth certificate should still show this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soldiers33 Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 how can you be genderless? your either male or female. and by looking at that picture, hes clearly male. stupid idiots just need to die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirkburn Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 how can you be genderless? your either male or female. and by looking at that picture, hes clearly male. stupid idiots just need to die. Your logic astounds me. He looks male, therefore he is. Leading into, this makes him stupid, therefore he must die. Yup, astounding. I would type more, but Laura has basically said it all for me. (Y) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Derf Veteran Posted March 17, 2010 Veteran Share Posted March 17, 2010 Hardly. If a man has his genitals removed, do they *have* to make a vagina? Of course not. If a woman were to have her reproductive organs and labia removed/sewn up, would she *have* to have a penis put in place? Of course not. You need something to pee out, that is all, and I'm sure you realise women don't urinate via their vagina.. :p Protip: Do not make any assumptions as to the knowledge of the opposite sex when dealing with internet forum users. :D -Vivicidal- 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Growled Member Posted March 17, 2010 Member Share Posted March 17, 2010 how can you be genderless? You have to be really weird with a good doctor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacer Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 If you have testicles that produce sperm, you're a male. If you have ovaries that produce eggs, you're a female. If you have both, you're both. If you have neither, you're neither. There are no if's, and's, or but's. Sex change operations do not change your sex. They are just voluntary (and expensive) mutilation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirkburn Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 If you have testicles that produce sperm, you're a male. If you have ovaries that produce eggs, you're a female. If you have both, you're both. If you have neither, you're neither. There are no if's, and's, or but's. Sex change operations do not change your sex. They are just voluntary (and expensive) mutilation. By your own reasoning, yes, they do affect your sex. To take a less obvious example than "I got my testicles removed, thus I'm no longer male", how about "I don't produce sperm". "I lost my ovaries due to illness". Except it's much more complex than that. See this list: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_taxonomy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intrinity1 Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 How can you not have a gender? Isn't it obvious what to look for to tell if it's a guy or a girl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamminium Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 Caster Semenya came to mind: http://www.sportsscientists.com/2009/08/caster-semenya-male-or-female.html (Surprisingly good analysis of the issue). Primary sexual characteristics are what we all have in mind but development can produce ambiguity in which case we will have to accept the person's decision. Likewise, because gender change is now legal, it is possible to retreat to the middle as we, in this case, consider gender an issue of mentality. Positive and negative charges aren't the duet of charge - there's something called "neutral charge". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironsight2000 Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 now just watch all restrooms will have the have a neutral door Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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