Are we still evolving? Cool new video for the doubters of evolution.


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vincent

We need to evolve radiation resistant skin.... seriously

Yea, ions suck..

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the evn show

As regards # 2, we can't, though we don't need it either.

#1 isn't required either: we don't have a good explanation for how gravitation works.

I think you can make a reasonable argument that there is no scientific field that is "fully understood".

The easiest way to distinguish between theory and fact in a scientific sense is to use the analog of observation and explanation.

Facts are the things we observe, theories are the explanation for how or why we observed those things. To continue the example:

It's a fact when you observe a pen fall to the ground. It's a theory that explains gravity pulled it there.

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Rigby

I've never understood how anyone could not believe in evolution, it's a pretty simple and obvious process. For humans however, we've reached a point where not much change is going to happen. With our technology today there is very little stopping anyone from having children nor any advantages for any particular group to have more children than others.

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+Xinok

#1 isn't required either: we don't have a good explanation for how gravitation works.

I think you can make a reasonable argument that there is no scientific field that is "fully understood".

The easiest way to distinguish between theory and fact in a scientific sense is to use the analog of observation and explanation.

Facts are the things we observe, theories are the explanation for how or why we observed those things. To continue the example:

It's a fact when you observe a pen fall to the ground. It's a theory that explains gravity pulled it there.

I think many people don't realize how broad the theory of evolution is. It's an entire field of science, not just a single theory. You can break it up into many smaller parts, for example, studying the evolution of insects or flowers. Evolution encompasses all of this, and unless the entire field of study is complete (which will probably never happen), evolution will always remain a theory.


I don't think civilization has had a significant impact on our rate of evolution. Evolution is defined as "a change in the frequency of an allele within a gene pool". Following that definition, there are other ways in which we are evolving, for example people of different races having children.

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jebus197

I think many people don't realize how broad the theory of evolution is. It's an entire field of science, not just a single theory. You can break it up into many smaller parts, for example, studying the evolution of insects or flowers. Evolution encompasses all of this, and unless the entire field of study is complete (which will probably never happen), evolution will always remain a theory.


I don't think civilization has had a significant impact on our rate of evolution. Evolution is defined as "a change in the frequency of an allele within a gene pool". Following that definition, there are other ways in which we are evolving, for example people of different races having children.

Which is why of course it's nonsense to say humans have stopped evolving, because random mutation will ensure that we always do, no matter what. Random mutation, sexual and natural selection are all different (and arguably separate) facets of evolution. Even if one or more ceased to work, the other/s would still continue.

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Buttus

I have a hard time believing in evolution (i mean going from nothing to us now) is because i think there might be life outside of the earth... and if you believe that the odds of life coming from nothing happened twice, i have a bridge to sell you...

i do think there are small adaptations happening tho...

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jebus197

I have a hard time believing in evolution (i mean going from nothing to us now) is because i think there might be life outside of the earth... and if you believe that the odds of life coming from nothing happened twice, i have a bridge to sell you...

i do think there are small adaptations happening tho...

Life is unlikely. But we live in a universe that is very big, so big that it is beyond the comprehension of even the brightest minds we have produced. Indeed the universe is so big that it can allow for almost any possibility to happen at any time. There is an old axiom in physics that I always find useful to explain this, which is that (given that the universe is so big), if it isn't forbidden [by the laws of physics] then it's compulsory. It's a bit like a more developed version of sods law, which basically says that if it can happen then it will happen.

Therefore as unlikely to have come about by chance as life might seem, the Universe is so big, with so many processes occurring all the time, that it is possible to cut these odds significantly. So big in fact that the odds against it happening not just once, but perhaps 10's of thousands of times are also greatly reduced.

Personally I don't subscribe to the whole alien thing and I don't think a serious scientific discussion is a good place to debate this, but I will say that I am confident enough to know that the universe is so unimaginably vast, that the odds that life can and did come into being entirely by chance, are a lot smaller than you think.

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+Xinok

I have a hard time believing in evolution (i mean going from nothing to us now) is because i think there might be life outside of the earth... and if you believe that the odds of life coming from nothing happened twice, i have a bridge to sell you...

i do think there are small adaptations happening tho...

They've already figured out how to make some of the essential building blocks of life by simulating the conditions of the early earth. Given the right conditions, the atoms naturally arrange themselves to form these molecules.

Plus, given the chaos of the early earth, where entire moon-size bodies would collide into the earth (potentially up to six times), throwing dust miles up into the air and heating the surface to thousands of degrees, there was lots of interesting chemistry going on. So it's not so hard for me to think that a simple molecular structure like DNA could form from this.

350px-DNA_chemical_structure.svg.png

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jebus197

They've already figured out how to make some of the essential building blocks of life by simulating the conditions of the early earth. Given the right conditions, the atoms naturally arrange themselves to form these molecules.

Plus, given the chaos of the early earth, where entire moon-size bodies would collide into the earth (potentially up to six times), throwing dust miles up into the air and heating the surface to thousands of degrees, there was lots of interesting chemistry going on. So it's not so hard for me to think that a simple molecular structure like DNA could form from this.

Personally I would have stopped at the interesting chemistry part, but your dramatisation serves to illustrate a point. The earth's climate was also probably quite settled by the time life emerged (although entirely devoid at that point of oxygen), and in fact it took 10's of millions of years before the first molecules that were able to self-organise, eventually 'evolved' into DNA.

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Buttus

i guess it would be on par with taking a 747 apart, putting all the pieces in a pile, and letting a tornado blow through, and having it rebuild the 747...

it's possible i guess....

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jebus197

i guess it would be on par with taking a 747 apart, putting all the pieces in a pile, and letting a tornado blow through, and having it rebuild the 747...

it's possible i guess....

It is possible. It's unlikely. But certainly possible. Our universe is certainly big enough and complex enough to allow it to happen (and as you said perhaps many times over).

Besides which there is a great deal of evidence (of which I would hazard a guess that not many people here are as aware of as they may claim) that this is exactly what did happen.

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+Xinok

i guess it would be on par with taking a 747 apart, putting all the pieces in a pile, and letting a tornado blow through, and having it rebuild the 747...

it's possible i guess....

That's not an accurate analogy. Life didn't go straight from nothing to 747, it took many small incremental steps with each step making life just a little more complex.

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nub

Evolution is still a "theory" for two reasons:

You must not understand what a theory is.

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+Xinok

You must not understand what a theory is.

Okay... care to elaborate?

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Rigby

Okay... care to elaborate?

Gravity is a theory. Do you deny the existence of gravity?

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jebus197

That's not an accurate analogy. Life didn't go straight from nothing to 747, it took many small incremental steps with each step making life just a little more complex.

This is exactly correct, think more of life starting out as a single nut or a screw of a 747 first, then slowly over many millions and billions of years, it evolved into something more complex. In effect life started out quite simply at first and only became more complex much, much later on. (For example it took 10's of millions of years for the first bacteria to emerge from a great many chemical processes, which although they in turn were able to self-organise, were still progressively much simpler than this.) The further back in time we go, the simpler the chemistry of life becomes.

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Solid Knight

If evolution was real, God would have outlined it in the Bible.

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Rigby

If evolution was real, God would have outlined it in the Bible.

:rofl:

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+Xinok

Gravity is a theory. Do you deny the existence of gravity?

You might want to read my previous posts to figure out my stance on evolution. To quote my original post:

Evolution is still a "theory" for two reasons:

1. The forces and mechanisms that drive evolution are still not fully understood.

2. We still do not have the full history of how animals evolved and from which ancestors.

But the simple idea that animals evolve from common ancestors has pretty much been proven, time and time again.

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the evn show

I don't think civilization has had a significant impact on our rate of evolution. Evolution is defined as "a change in the frequency of an allele within a gene pool". Following that definition, there are other ways in which we are evolving, for example people of different races having children.

Depends where you draw your line for "us" and 'society'. If you put it somewhere around 10,000 years ago with the dawn of agricultural society then it has had a significant impact. All large, dispersed, outbred populations evolve more slowly. We're not special in that respect: any geographically dispersed but mobile population is less susceptible to regional selection pressures (ie: if it gets too hot where you live, you can move - lake trouts can't). Large populations are generally more resistant to random mutation or genetic drift: a chance mutation in 1 individual takes a much longer time to transmit to 30% of the population when there are 1 billion mating pairs than when there are only a few hundred. And lastly, outbred populations tend to have a fairly 'healthy' mix of genetic information which gives a better pool of information to 'build' creatures than a more limited set. It also means that recessive traits are less likely to be expressed in individuals.

Our species didn't have these qualities even 15,000 years ago so the impact of selection pressures would have been much more acute.

Of course I'm avoiding the debate between punctuated equilibrium and phyletic gradualism: if evolution follows a pattern closer to Gould's model then it's expected that you'd see traits reasonable constant in the absence of powerful selection pressures.

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trashpickinman

I just finished watching this. Very informative. Its true, as much as others would like to believe, we are not the end game of any sort of creationism or evolution. We're were never designed or programmed to reach this point in our biology. We are just at the point where we understand what is happening to us and every living thing around us.

Offtopic: Redheads, :blush:

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thommcg

i guess it would be on par with taking a 747 apart, putting all the pieces in a pile, and letting a tornado blow through, and having it rebuild the 747...

it's possible i guess....

No... it's nothing whatsoever like that.

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HawkMan

Personally I don't subscribe to the whole alien thing and I don't think a serious scientific discussion is a good place to debate this, but I will say that I am confident enough to know that the universe is so unimaginably vast, that the odds that life can and did come into being entirely by chance, are a lot smaller than you think.

that part is so convoluted and self contradictory I'm not sure what you're trying to say, unless you mean to say that "Are a lot greater than you think".

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jebus197

If evolution was real, God would have outlined it in the Bible.

I'm guessing you must be trolling a little lol. If not, watch the film and read any book by Richard Dawkins, or Stephen J. Gould written in the last 20 years and then come back and comment. The problem with people who take such attitudes seriously however is that they usually don't read, yet still feel able to claim to know everything.

that part is so convoluted and self contradictory I'm not sure what you're trying to say, unless you mean to say that "Are a lot greater than you think".

My grammar is fine my friend, but thanks for the constructive criticism in any case.

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